This is female privilege. Feminism is blind to it and this is why I need Men's Rights.

2013-09-12T20:53:27+00:00

I saw something similar not too long back.I was in a KFC-knockoff and a group of teenage girls was getting attention from a group of young men. After they'd gone, one of them turned to the guy behind the counter and demanded to know why he hadn't stepped forward and defended them.

"Hang on." I (sorta) remember thinking "You've been treating the guy like crap the whole time you've been here and you expect him to step forward and square up to 4 guys twice his size?"

Epywa · 2013-09-12T20:24:06+00:00

Even though I agree that those guys were total assholes, the part you quoted made me feel really uncomfortable even before I read you quoting it. Women expect white knights (as you call them) to help them in those situations, even though I am not agaisnt helping people, the fact she expects people to fight her battle shows me that this girl in particular (in any other girl who would have tought the same) thinks it is her right to be defended from assholes simply because she's a woman. I can defend myself from bullies and assholes, verbaly and physically, why could'nt she? The answer is simple, women think they're fragile. When those fragile women seek equality, instead of pulling themselves up to men, they try to drag them down. So the day I'll see a girl being bullied and being idle, I won't help. On the other hand, if she tries to defend herself and fail, then I shall help. There's no reason one should help another who doesn't want to help themselves.

avantvernacular · 2013-09-12T21:35:38+00:00

The lesson to take away from this is if you see a man being harassed, you should make a point to do something about it.

Captaincastle · 2013-09-12T23:52:49+00:00

Why would the mrn dismiss valid points as misogynist?

StoicSophist · 2013-09-12T22:04:06+00:00

Before you write this off as the rantings of a misogynist, think about the inherent misandry in this HuffPo article. Men (an unspecific, general 'men') are framed as the oppressors and females as the victims. Men (all men) are labeled as hateful beasts who beset women with their vileness.

Where? No, seriously, where? I just read the article, and men are mentioned exactly twice. And I quote:

Instance #1

Thus far she has primarily focused on the experience of women, but she's open to expanding the project to men who have encountered street harassment based on their gender or sexual orientation as well.

Instance #2

"As the work gained attention, I realized how many different types of people can relate to this and have stories to tell. I've had conversations with men at STWTS related events who wanted to talk about their experiences with street harassment," Fazlalizadeh recounted. "I know it happens, and it's important, and it's something I may take on in the future. Right now though, I want to focus on women -- of varying backgrounds -- to really tackle the ways in which our bodies are sexualized and mistreated in the public space."

Outside those two sentences, men are never mentioned in that article, and all terms referring to perpetrators of street harassment are gender neutral. So I have to ask: did you actually read the article?

isforinsects · 2013-09-14T07:17:30+00:00

So you would have stood up for that woman? Or are you saying that it isn't correct to stand up for that person?

Would you have stood up for a man in that same situation? How often have you seen a man in that situation?

kendalllovett · 2013-10-16T06:02:29+00:00

A woman was literally frightened after being harassed by a bunch of men, and all you got from her story was the fact that she would've liked for someone to take her side? And the HuffPo article didn't say all men were evil and all women were defenseless victims, it was referring to the incidents which sparked it being written- i.e. the street harassment that women- almost EXCLUSIVELY women- have to endure ALL THE TIME. But no, your manfeelings are hurt because nobody is coddling you. You're doing the very same thing you're criticizing women of.

smegnose · 2013-09-12T23:01:39+00:00

Hillarious. Getting someone else to fight your battles before you because you believe yourself too weak to fight for yourself, now that's equality. If you're too terrified to tell a couple assholes who are bothering you in a public place to fuck off, how do you even live?

Remember when Feminism used to be 'we can do it, too'? Seems like nowandays its mostly 'can't someone else (or the government) do it for me?'

Ryhnoceros · 2013-09-13T17:35:09+00:00

Women who behave helplessly are pitied and coddled. Men who behave helplessly are called pussies and stomped on.

Mythandros · 2013-09-13T17:56:16+00:00

Very much agree with you here. And had someone stood up to the men harassing this entitled female, she would have turned on HIM and gone "How dare you presume to try to defend me! Who do you think you are, my father?"

You can't win either way, and so, like a lot of men out there, we just stop trying to help.

This is what feminism has helped create, a culture which is disconnected and divided, instead of simply two parts of the same whole like it should be.

Bainshie_ · 2013-09-12T23:14:11+00:00

Wow seriously MRA has gotten worse with the 'attempting to self victimize'.

She has every right to expect someone to come to her aid when several people are putting her in a bad situation. Not because of female privilege, not because of she is a female, but because she is a human being.

Through my life I've been in many unfortunate situations. Situations that have been aided by random HUMANS doing helping me as a random human white male out. Whether the middle aged woman who intervened while I was fighting off 4 people (Long story). The two teenagers who decided to help me carry a very heavy computer I was clearly struggling with. The two women who helped me collect the bag of pennies that broke open. The guy who loaned me a petrol tank when I ran out of gas. The group of people who got my motorbike push started when I got trapped at uni.

And I in return do nice thing back. I help people push cars (Even parking my motorbike to), I stand up for people being harassed, I help old people cross the street, I give away old sleeping bags and food to homeless people.

I expect people to do these things, like this girl expects people to do these things, like I expect myself to do these things. Not because I'm a male, or she's a female, but because we're fucking human, and doing these things is the human thing to do.

Xenoith · 2013-09-13T05:24:36+00:00

But if they were kind to her instead and tried to be friends, they'd also be misogynistic "nice guys" who are trying to trade kindness for sex! Feminism demands we be open with our intentions, they're literally asking for it.

Leastofall · 2013-09-13T06:45:33+00:00

Sorry

On a separate note when I deployed to Iraq we had women who carried a firearm and stood a post. I got my eyebrows tweezed for the first time one day while posted with a gorgeous young woman. I personally think that I looked sexy as a motherfucker and Hadji got hard/wet as fuck every time they saw me.

robotman707 · 2013-09-12T22:17:00+00:00

Chivalry is dead, and feminism killed it

I'm probably going to turn that line into the title of a multiple-page essay at some point ಠ_ಠ

VZPurp · 2013-09-12T22:37:44+00:00

Feminism is not blind to why you need the Men's Rights Movement. They are the reason you need a Men's Rights Movement. They work to gain power at the expense of males. They are a destructive force to men and stable relationships.

They will never look to reason or negotiate with you. They are engaging in a war against men, and have been winning.

deeptimeswimmer · 2013-09-13T04:30:28+00:00

THIS THREAD IS BEING BRIGADED

I think we all know which group is doing it: The one subreddit allowed to brigade at will.

robotman707 · 2013-09-13T00:09:19+00:00

So, if you were accosted on the street by a number of people who were each physically stronger than you, in a public place, you wouldn't expect someone to help you out?

Jesus fuck, man.

rightsbot · 2013-09-12T20:14:17+00:00

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envatted_love · 2013-09-13T11:44:43+00:00

Men (an unspecific, general 'men') are framed as the oppressors and females as the victims. Men (all men) are labeled as hateful beasts who beset women with their vileness. That's not me, and that isn't the majority of men.

Fair enough. But the woman in question never said she wanted help because she was a woman. She may have wanted it because she was weak. A weak man can reasonably hope that someone will step up for him; why can't a weak woman? (Conversely, I wouldn't expect the comment in question to have been written by a strong woman.) The relevant factor is weakness, not sex.

Perhaps you are jumping to conclusions by saying that her expectation of help came from her being a woman.

Pornography_saves_li · 2013-09-12T23:10:30+00:00

Damn Skippy. And good eye, that would blow past the majority of 'mras' here.

DramaDramaLlama · 2013-09-13T05:47:27+00:00

If someone is being harassed by anyone, I think it's basic decency to do something. That includes uncomfortable cat calls, racist remarks, uncomfortable come ons from women to men, or whatever. Say something.

2013-09-13T17:12:37+00:00

Chivalry is dead, and feminism killed it.

There is truth to that. This is also why I no longer open doors or do anything we are "expected" to do for women other than my wife or female family members and friends, and that is just out of love.

The reason why I don't do any of that is because now a days if a guy is nice to you or stands up for you, he just wants to get in your pants.

2013-10-19T11:15:24+00:00

I think the problem here is the fact that you're reading HuffPo.

rg57 · 2013-09-13T05:16:32+00:00

While that is an example of female privilege, which is why you need gender equality (not merely Men's Rights), it's also an example of conservative social rules, which is why you need freedom.

We should not tolerate genuine positive comments about a person's body or expressions of interest in meeting (e.g. name, number) based on sexual interest, being categorized as something any competent adult needs to be saved from.

We should not tolerate prejudice that says that young men who find women attractive are likely going to follow that up with stalking and harming.

Can you imagine how her comment would have been received if she had told us that the men were of one or another minority race?

2013-09-13T16:58:37+00:00

You're reading way too much into one sentence of her statement. She is just making a point that nobody helped her.

She didn't phrase it in such a way as to suggest she was EXPECTING someone to help her. She could have said, "how dare nobody come help me, a defenseless woman?" and made a huge deal of it. She did not.

In these situations, a lot of people, both male and female, have been taught that ignoring a bully is the best way to make them go away. Showing weakness, like retaliating or acting uncomfortable, gives them strength because they WANT you to fight back, to assert yourself; they want you to pay attention to them or acknowledge their presence. If someone else were to say something, it would remind them that they were the ones embarrassing themselves in a public place, and they might shut up. From what this woman says, it seems like she was following the advice I've seen a lot of people give regarding bullies of any stripe. Whether you agree with it or not is up to you.

It is not true that men are never helped in similar situations, but if they're not, it's because we're expected to "man up" and "quit acting like a woman," as if that's a bad thing.

But, personally, I do agree with your closing statements about women as "victims" and men as "oppressors." That shit, obviously, is not okay.

My point is, and I think the reason a lot of people don't take MRAs seriously, is that you let your anger cloud your judgement. You exaggerate and grasp for straws and put words in people's mouths. That's what happening here. If you're angry enough to spin a woman's statement into a rant about "female privilege" then you are gonna look like the boorish, beastly, angry male that Feminists think you are. So be careful. Learn to pick your battles.

iwishicoulddrainout · 2014-01-28T21:08:15+00:00

Oh, you had a minor inconvenience on a subway?

Quit generalizing off of the actions of a few radical feminists and realize that men have always, and will continue to have more privilege than women

JimmyTheIntern · 2013-09-13T05:54:19+00:00

This is why I need the Men's Rights Movement.

Sadly, Men's Rights aren't going to stifle the flood of entitled women. Not one fucking bit.

What you really need is a strong, vocal Anti-Feminism movement.

kundertaker · 2013-09-13T14:52:47+00:00

Men (all men) are labeled as hateful beasts who beset women with their vileness.

This line shows that you attach some shame of sex, most people do.

Feminism didn't kill chivalry, sexual awareness killed chivalry. And women raising more and more boys alone. Chivalry didn't really die, it just changed a little bit.

Female privilege is the fantasy that the most desirable male is someone that is will take care her like a knight but never sleep with her. This art even though it says one thing actually lends it self to this ideal. The idea that women can wear anything provocative that she wants, but then not accept any type of criticism, instead she expects all men to just look and not speak. This is a highly unrealistic way to live in a society. Especially for those that want to sleep with women. Cause sometimes men must have to break the rules to move along the any relationship.

Because there are so many women raising young boys alone, they still exhibit these types of qualities. But, unfortunately for this artist she wants people to believe in her way, without helping women understand how society, and how to get the results that she would like. If she wants women to be treated fairly then she must understand how that works.

What would be the Men's Rights Movement? I would love to know what would fit in there..

andreasvastolorde · 2013-12-05T01:51:05+00:00

You are wrong. What you are seeing is benevolent sexism. What you are referring to (victimization) obviously needs an oppressor. People point at people instead of the systems people are operating under.

You, sir, are doing the same thing.

Let me explain something to you: this woman was not being sexist when looking to men for help. In this situation man is both the aggressor (or beast, if you prefer) and the protector (hero, perhaps?). She did not look to another woman for assistance because -- sexism here -- women cannot possibly protect one another from men.

I will go into something personal now: I am a gentleman, through and through. I am learning to become an even better one and in so doing have begun to notice what is not manly or gentlemanly. There are many things nowadays people consider manly, when in fact they are simply petty childish things no real man should ever do.

A man can be and is many things and a gentleman is a man reaching for his own potential. In doing so we must all explore every facet of manliness. One facet is : the protector. Women are not the only ones with nurturing feelings, that we know. What we little recognize or appreciate is how and why we protect in different ways and how we can respond to our own instincts in a way that is manly and not boyish.

edit: you might want to go to artofmanliness if you want to learn to be a man.

Chris-Gaines · 2013-09-13T07:08:39+00:00

At it's very foundation, feminism is based on the idea that women are weak and helpless, so it follows that feminism would demand protection. There are no known instances in human history of a large population voluntarily being oppressed over a protracted interval. It is necessary to conclude that oppressors must be stronger. Therefore, if women have been oppressed, it must mean they are weaker. Since physical strength is no longer meaningful (men in a sandwich shop are not more suited to dialing a phone to summon police), this means that to believe the feminist dogma that women are oppressed requires believing that women are intellectually weaker and/or weaker in character. If you believe that, then demanding protection by men is a natural conclusion.

Title	This is female privilege. Feminism is blind to it and this is why I need Men's Rights.
Author	robotman707
Upvotes	181
Comments	139
Date	September 12, 2013 8:12 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1m9okn/this_is_female_privilege_feminism_is_blind_to_it/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/this-is-female-privilege-feminism-is-blind-to-it.1164020 https://theredarchive.com/post/1164020

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