my boyfriend wants to start a family with me and live our lives together, but not marry me

24by7SylviaPlath · 2020-12-04T11:13:31+00:00

Acc to what you have written- You believe in marriage. You want it. He doesn't. Why are you wasting your time!? Period.

Iluvalmonds83 · 2020-12-04T13:40:23+00:00

In essence, OP’s boyfriend is wanting OP to take all the risks (bear children and potentially put herself in a single mother situation) and provide him “wifey and family” benefits without the legal protections provided by marriage.

When OP is giving away free milk, of course her boyfriend isn’t going to go back and buy the cow.

This is why you should never give someone the “wife” experience when they don’t intend to make you one, with legal protections for the family you intend to create with them.

Op, I urge you to reconsider cohabitating and planning a family with a man who is not on the same page as you. Understandably he may not be comfortable with the risk of making a life with another person and what divorce could do to him, but Something to consider is that without marriage, you take on most of the risks instead of an equitable level to him. he could just leave you at any time without many legal repercussions. I believe statistically in the US, only 30-40% of deadbeat dads are successfully made to pay child support, and that amount is often laughable to what is actually needed to raise a child.

When women become mothers, their earning power and career takes a back seat, even in dual income earning families. Marriage ensures your are not taking ALL the risks of creating a family unit, and should divorce happen, both parties are shouldering the fallout.

theabsurdlife · 2020-12-03T19:11:35+00:00

You know the truth deep down, as your post has revealed. Not believing in marriage is an excuse and has always been. He wants his future kids to be married, and that’s very telling. He, very simply, doesn’t want to marry you. He wants all the benefits of marriage but none of the responsibility. There are so many stories of couples out there who have “dated for nine years and he never proposed and says he doesn’t want to get married, then when we broke up he went and married someone else within the year”. It’s not that these type of guys don’t believe in marriage, they just don’t believe in marrying you. They will waste all the best years of your life if you let them. It’s gonna be really hard but you may well have to prepare to break it off. Find yourself a man who will shoulder responsibility and will cherish you, not a man who makes you beg for him to marry you.

I also want to add, “not wanting the government to define you” and “getting married will change our relationship dynamics” are all lame excuses that don’t even make sense. Putting aside the romantic and moral reasons to marry the person you want to spend your life with, getting married provides legal protection (healthcare proxy, inheritance etc) granted only to spouses and family. This isn’t about the government defining you blah blah, this is about loving someone enough to want to protect them under the law. As for his parents, his mother would have been the same with or without marriage. Do you live in a country where you cannot get a divorce?

Environmental_Ad5867 · 2020-12-03T19:28:32+00:00

My heart really goes out to you OP, I’m so sorry you’re going through this. From what you’ve said about him, it’s clear you absolutely adore this man but as hard as it is, loving someone shouldn’t make you to feel this way- this anger, this hurt, resentment, pain. It’ll eat you up inside until there’s nothing left. How can you be a good partner if all that hurt has made you so bitter inside? As painful as it is, take his word for what it is. Take it at face value.

He doesn’t want to marry.

It’s not your job to change a man. All you can do is be the best partner/woman to him and a man worth his salt will recognise how beautiful that is and move mountains for you.

I really don't want to break up with him, I love him, and I believe this is my man for life, I want him to be.

You can’t want him to be something that he isn’t. That’s not how men are. You can encourage and support a man, but you cannot change him. It’s a fool’s trade to think you can.

You’re young, 22. You can rebuild yourself and eventually meet a man who would want to make that commitment and make you his wife. Unfortunately, it may not be this man. My advice is to thank him for all the beautiful memories but you can’t sacrifice yourself waiting for him to (maybe) be the man you want him to be. Consider moving on.

Again, I’m so sorry OP. It’s a terrible situation and I hope you come out from this way stronger with more appreciation of what you deserve as a good woman ❤️

lauraisconfused · 2020-12-04T10:20:57+00:00

I don't really agree with the comments saying "he's not that into you" etc. I mean maybe, I don't know, but that's not necessarily what's going on. You said he's RP, there's a ton of dialogue in the male RP community about how you should never get married and marriage only screws men over. This might be where his feelings are coming from.

To me it sounds you you do want to get married and the resentment will only build overtime. Sorry but I'm not sure how this is going to work unless he has some kind of miraculous change of heart.

AnarchoNAP · 2020-12-03T21:35:05+00:00

If he wants his future children to get married then he doesn't "not believe in" marriage. He either doesn't want to marry you or wants the benefits of committing without committing.

unknownlady3245 · 2020-12-03T19:25:58+00:00

He’s not that into you. Move on or you will waste years of your life with this loser.

VGIrises · 2020-12-03T19:27:50+00:00

My boyfriend subscribed to RP ideology but doesn’t want marriage. Pretty much like your boyfriend, he has a horrible example of marriage from his parents. However, he does want all the benefits of me being his wife. In my situation I told him that’s fine that he doesn’t want marriage, but he’s not getting the benefits of what I believe is what comes with marriage. For example I’m not living with him and I don’t plan to unless we are married.

Have you had a real talk with him about how its strange for children to be ok, but not marriage? Children also lock you both in for life, and unlike marriage, you can’t really dissolve children if you do need to separate in the future.

Have you had a real talk about how although he doesn’t think the government should be in your relationship, there are real issues that can arise that you or him would be powerless to resolve without signing a marriage certificate? Especially if children exist.

If you’ve had these conversation with him and you are okay with not being legally married, then that’s fine. Learn to be ok with it. If that means you get a ring and a religious (or not) ceremony to celebrate your lifelong commitment with family and friends without filing paperwork with the state, go for it. Marriage doesn’t have to be about the government but a label of your love.

However if it is really bothering you to not be legally married, you should talk it out with him and work out your feelings with him. A real conversation, not snappy one liners that could be considered said as a joke.

You two have to come up with a real solution together.

null_isomers · 2020-12-04T02:37:44+00:00

That's a deal breaker for me. I just wouldn't want to be with a guy who didn't look forward to marriage with me.

Imagine being in your 30s being introduced as the girlfriend.

Blackhawk2479 · 2020-12-04T17:07:37+00:00

I made an account just to answer you. I do use Reddit to read about topics that improves my life and marriage, I just never comment. Anyways...

If you agree to cohabitate and have babies outside of marriage. You set the standard for future relationships as well. Think ahead, think further ahead.

You live together, you have (however many) kids and then for whatever reasons the relationship fails. Would you enter the dating market again? With higher or lower standards? Will you expect marriage? But you could be in your late 20s or going into your 30s. Should another man marry you? Why now then? Why didn’t you demand it when you’re in your early 20s? And now you might have a couple kids on your hands that you had out of wedlock to complicate your life. You’ll be perceived differently.

I 100% understand the risk men take to marry and if they don’t want the risk, they shouldn’t cherry pick and go full RP: no kids and no cohabitation and no wife privileges.

Think it through girl.

Nandemodekiru · 2020-12-04T01:52:04+00:00

Sigh... sounds like a very serious conversation is in order. If marriage is an absolute must for you, then this must be made known clearly, calmly, and firmly. Prenuptial agreements are a thing, so perhaps a compromise could be made if he’s worried about his own money. Don’t be mad at him, because as you’ve stated, he’s had a very bad experience with his parents.

Say you understand, but if he’s going to constantly be afraid of you turning into his mother, then you’ll always be on edge because it shows a lack of trust in your character. Are you anything like his mother? If you’re not, then ask him to please not project his parents’ relationship into yours, because that’s not being fair to YOU.

As you have made known to him, it’s hypocritical to expect his daughters to get married but not the two of you. What must be known is that children may model their own relationships after their parents. Without setting an example of committed marriage, his daughters are put at risk of becoming single mothers because the men who left them didn’t want to commit. And this is at risk of becoming a generational issue. And you personally don’t want THAT for your children. Actually, one could argue that having children out of wedlock contributed to many societal issues we see today.

And let him know the last part, about how you don’t want to pressure him. You don’t want him to resent you because you forced him. And you WILL NOT force him. But if you ultimately have different goals in life, then it simply can’t be helped, and you don’t want to resent him for not marrying you after you decided to live with him and have his children. Does that make sense?

Again, explain this to him calmly and gently. Ask if a prenup would make him more comfortable. But also emphasize that you want to marry HIM, because you love HIM, and don’t ever want to hurt him like his mother did his father. But if he doesn’t want to marry YOU, then it merely shows that you are NOT THE TYPE OF WOMAN that he wants to marry.

You’ve probably already seen the examples of men stringing along women for years, before dumping them and immediately marrying the next one. Don’t be like those women. But make sure to have this conversation with him, at least for some semblance of closure on the subject.

nyegeza · 2020-12-03T20:38:20+00:00

Red pilled men know that marriage is a rigged game against them that's why they don't want marriage.

Look it from a man perspective, Imagine one day just waking up and your partner says she doesn't love you any more. Serve you with divorce papers and you have pay alimony for the rest of your lives. Would you give in? Obviously, no. With divorces rates being over 50% in the US, with over 80% initiated by women, you realize why men don't want to get married.

andyandy887 · 2020-12-03T20:50:52+00:00

Stumbled on this sub as early 20’s man. I think a large part of his feelings on the subject probably come down to his parents not having a great relationship. Now, I think the way he feels is a bit absurd but if this is the man of your dreams I think it’s worth giving a shot at changing his mind. I’m not sure if you’ve had these discussions about his parents but it might help, sometimes people need assurance that they aren’t their parents and they are capable of something different. His feelings likely have nothing to do with you, but his past experiences with his family. Maybe seek out some counselling? I don’t think his feelings are rational, and you definitely shouldn’t have kids with a man who won’t marry you, but if you really want him to it’s worth trying some therapy or talking more. Also regarding kids, ask him if he really thinks he’s setting these kids up for a healthy marriage if their parents aren’t married. And also tell him that in a lot of ways you would feel “trapped” being a mom with a man who won’t marry her.

ItWasBrokenAlready · 2020-12-04T19:19:42+00:00

I would not have bastard children on purpose. Maaaybe If I was in my 40ties, really wanted them, single and decided to do it alone, but then they would have my surname etc. What he's proposing is a bit trashy imho.

aussiedollface2 · 2020-12-05T15:59:12+00:00

Agree with above comments. It’s also a slap in the face to call you wife when you’re not. This is textbook fukboi behaviour and you were right to be upset xo

Brandonxxxi · 2020-12-04T00:05:27+00:00

He’s smart to not wanting to be married, especially when having a background growing up in a broken family. Changing his traumatized views isn’t an option and should not be an option. What do you value more? Do you value having marriage or being with him? You will make a sacrificial choice no matter what.

rft24 · 2020-12-03T21:03:29+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Ivabighairy1 · 2020-12-04T01:51:10+00:00

He’s not RP

rainagainstmyface · 2020-12-04T04:44:30+00:00

IMO It is not marriage to you he has a problem with but marriage to anybody. The consequences of marriage is what he fears.

The courts are biased toward women in the event of divorce. A mans fear of marriage is rational. They can be jailed for non payment of court ordered support. His fear of marriage is actually fear of the police state that grows larger every day.

I have three brothers and I am the youngest and only girl in the family. They are in their twenties and not one considers marriage a safe arrangement. They change girlfriends more often than they change their socks which is partly a hygiene problem. It puts me in a awkward position because I remain cool toward their girlfriends knowing where it always ends up.

Men are increasing becoming risk adverse concerning women.

Even though guys hate talking about any emotions that make them appear weak see if he will honestly talk about his fears concerning marriage.

Make it a point to tell him you don't want to know why he is against marriage so you can convince him otherwise because he will simply try to make an argument you cannot win.

He is in a difficult position because if he admits he is trying to protect himself than it appears he is trying to protect himself from you. It is not you but the state that stands behind you that he is protecting himself from.

TranslatedSky · 2020-12-07T19:12:34+00:00

This is why you make sure you are on the same page early on, not two years later. You feel degraded because he does not trust you and is making all sorts of excuses to not give you the safety you need. Worse, he sounds like he knows you will bend for him.

Let me ask you, why do you have to be the one to trust and take the big risk, when there is no trust and taking the big risk on his end? It’s a double standard and he’s feeding it to you as though it’s the most reasonable thing in the world. By the way, please do not agree to his terms just to “prove” you are trustworthy hoping he will marry you. This is the kind of manipulation young girls miss so often, but will leave you vulnerable.

State what you need from him and be prepared to leave by an ultimatum. You are 22 and still have time to find a man who wants marriage with you and who trusts you like you trust him. If you stay with him, it sounds like he will string you on for a few more years and it’s plausible by the time you exit, you’d need time to heal and try again when you’re not in your prime.

Marmenoire · 2020-12-13T12:50:21+00:00

Why don't you both sit down and discuss your fears. You can then craft a prenup that addresses the legal aspects of the majority of them. You can iron out the consequences of infidelity, how money will be managed as well as future children and their parenting.

It's possible that this process will make him more comfortable with the idea of him marrying. Also he could probably benefit from therapy and how to minimize his mom's effect on his emotional well-being.

Jazzisa · 2020-12-13T18:30:27+00:00

Tbh, I kind of get this idea, and I've seen it before in other men. Look how marriage is often perceived. Look how many jokes there are about 'haha, now you're married, the sex will stop' or 'the old ball & chain'. He seems to think that marriage will suddenly change your dynamics, because of his parents and a lot of media. How many sitcom married couples are there with the stupid husband and the nagging wife, where both seem to resent each other?

A lot of ppl here seem to suggest pressuring him into marriage. I think this is a mistake. I think the best thing to do is to focus on the benefits and help him come around through understanding. Explain to him that while marriage will protect you and make you happy, it won't change your relationship or how you feel about each other.

Also, watch some movies about actual happy married couples, like the Addams Family, or Lily & Marshall from HIMYM. Just slyly suggest those films (NOT couple movies that END in proposals or weddings, actual happy MARRIED couples!). Make comments like :This is how marriage should and can be!!

I agree that you shouldn't start a family with him without getting married if that's what you want. But talk to him about harmful stereotypes and about what could be. There's a lot of harmful RP rhetoric about ALL women wanting to screw you over. Talk to him about it. In a marriage, you are supposed to be a team, be one, and look out for each other's best interests.

milkycocoa-puff · 2020-12-15T03:07:22+00:00

Stand up for what you believe in and walk away. It is not just a “piece of paper” to you. Of course, he has the right to his own beliefs. Just don’t lose sight of what is important to you. You mentioned that this is eating you alive now, imagine how you will feel 10 years in with 2 kids.

Title	my boyfriend wants to start a family with me and live our lives together, but not marry me
Author	tawaya180
Upvotes	29
Comments	92
Date	December 3, 2020 6:56 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/k63l4w/my_boyfriend_wants_to_start_a_family_with_me_and/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/my-boyfriend-wants-to-start-a-family-with-me-and.1193502 https://theredarchive.com/post/1193502

Comments