Alright, this is cool and all, but, fuck...

Kinre · 2011-03-25T04:20:58+00:00

I believe it's supposed to change and become natural. It's eventually not going to be pick up lines (in fact, pick up lines are usually not recommended here from what I've seen) but rather just showing that you're having fun and in control of the situation. Acting alpha and having fun doesn't mean using canned phrases, the step by step actions and conversations are just to get people started until they can do it on their own.

batshit_lazy · 2011-03-25T11:40:55+00:00

The thing is, the reason you feel fake is because you never thought of this on your own, and how normal it actually is in everyday life. All the tips you read on here (or most of them) are pretty much breakdowns and observations of what the people who are naturally successful at seduction are already doing.

That guy you know that everyone likes and the girls are drooling over? He does this. He probably doesn't know it though, because to him it's all natural. He gets it, but he doesn't think about it.

Before reading all this, you didn't get it. You had some understanding of it, like sensing boundaries and what kind of things you definitely shouldn't say to a girl, but that was most likely about it. Understanding how women think, and gaining all this insight about how to respond, etc. is about as close to cheating as studying for your upcoming math test is. It's not fake at all.

Basically, don't feel bad about this because it is completely natural to do these things. You're just giving it some extra thought and effort to become better at it. Kino is actually something women do. Some of us just have to be made aware of it (like all those AFCs around you), as when it comes to reading a woman and her signals, most of us males are pretty god damned retarded to say the least.

leitey · 2011-03-25T07:54:38+00:00

My motto: "Fake it 'till you make it."

Force yourself to approach people until you are comfortable doing it, over time it will start to come naturally.

frogma · 2011-03-25T04:41:38+00:00

I've never used pickup lines. I'd feel fake using em too.

But I'm usually not afraid to be forward. Experience will show you that being forward is a thousand times better than being cautious.

Stop using pickup lines and focus on the basic philosophy/methods.

acartoontiger · 2011-03-25T06:13:34+00:00

I think that most of us here on Seddit understand that it is about becoming naturally attractive. If you find yourself using lines after lines you are probably doing something wrong. Also you should never be using more than one pickup line per set. Lines are to help AFCs get over AA and actually get into the game. One time I delivered a line just to see if it would hook and I felt a little fake, but it ended in a kiss and a number so it wasnt so bad. Mainly I just think of opening lines as crutches for the inexperienced. Once you graduate past the need for pre-prepared material you will stop feeling fake because you won't be fake. Also, being forward is a good thing, women like men with spines. Do a little bit of both, the subtle and the forward, they mix nicely.

2011-03-25T12:35:48+00:00

I obey two rules: passion and power. I try to somehow exhibit these two at all times. Passion is hot and power is sexy.

senator_mendoza · 2011-03-25T13:12:48+00:00

upvotes for all (most)! i'm gonna parrot what other people said but with a little analogy.

are you into sports? say you're learning boxing. REGARDLESS of what feels natural or comfortable to each individual, everyone learns the fundamentals the same way. stance, hand position, shoulder and hip rotation, footwork, etc. and sometimes it'll feel a little forced but that's just something you gotta deal with. once you get this stuff and understand WHY it evolved how it did, you can start to tweak it to fit your unique style. and if you get in a slump you can go back to the basics and work from there. but if you don't go through the motions with the fundamentals then you wind up with some bad habits.

same thing. make sense?

xmod2 · 2011-03-25T06:28:34+00:00

There will always be some falseness in courtship, even if it's just self editing.

You should feel bad when you're talking to a girl who isn't wearing heels, makeup and a pushup bra.

BrokeStudent2 · 2011-03-25T10:44:30+00:00

Words can only get you so far.

KINO, man!

2011-03-25T12:58:31+00:00

Unless you are a complete natural you are going to find yourself in situations that you are not perfectly comfortable in. You may have an anxious feeling wondering if what you are doing is the best possible move.

Nothing is perfect, no technique or routine is going to make the girl interested in you. But anxiety and the lack of confidence it projects can make her lost interest.

If you are anxiously rattling off a routine you are going to seem to lack confidence. But maybe you will encounter a situation (e.g. a shit test) and you'll remember some PUA FR or technique. You'll realize what you are dealing with and you will have a confidence that you are capable of dealing with it. As a beginner you can use a routine and as you get more advanced you will probably just deal with it naturally.

glassuser · 2011-03-25T13:01:49+00:00

rattle off so many pick up lines

There's your problem. It's not about pick up lines. Sure, in some cases, they're useful for building confidence and pushing you into constructive situations in the real world. But for the most part, pick up lines are garbage.

Focus more on that "inner game" stuff. Improve yourself, physically, mentally, and emotionally. Surround yourself with and engage in relationships with other high value men, or engage with the men already close to you to improve yourselves together. Learn some of the "hidden" obvious truths about interaction with women (they're usually more self-conscious than you, they're just waiting on you to present yourself, etc) and approach them with that in mind.

You're not a tool - feeling lame about relying on pick up lines means you actually have a brain and are growing.

RedErin · 2011-03-25T14:57:52+00:00

Can you give an example of when you thought you were being false and douchey?

I think I know where you're coming from. I used to be one of those "nice guys"™ who thought that being forward and teasing with women was an asshole thing to do. But it's not. It's fun and it's the human mating dance. It's the same as calling a peacock an asshole for showing off it's plumage and doing a weird dance.

madcaesar · 2011-03-25T16:02:04+00:00

The only pickup lines I use are those approved by Troy McClure! Such as:

Hi, I'm actor Troy McClure! You might remember me from such driver's ed films as "Alice's Adventures Through The Windshield Glass" and "The Decapitation of Larry Leadfoot." For the next sixty minutes, we'll be seeing actual film of car crash victims.
Hello, I'm Troy McClure! You might remember me from such celebrity funerals as "Andre The Giant, We Hardly Knew Ye" and "Shemp Howard: Today We Mourn A Stooge."
Hi, I'm Troy McClure. You may remember me from such educational films as "Two Minus Three Equals Negative Fun" and "Firecrackers: The Silent Killer".

philosarapter · 2011-03-25T17:56:29+00:00

First I'd ask you to analyze your defintion and context of the word "douche". What defines a douche to you and why is there a negative connotation assigned with the word?

For many, they would define a "douche" as an attractive guy, who is very aware of his own attractiveness, so much so that it may fall into narcissistic tendencies with a 'gods gift to women' mentality. Why does this come with such a negative connotation to many? My best theory is that the nay-sayers, also known as "haters", are angry at their own inability to have the same effect on women. [I've often wondered why we get so upset with those who are so confident in their own abilities, why we look so unfavorably upon olympic atheletes which brag about their greatness.]

These haters often have their own "Disney fantasy" on how they think women SHOULD behave, which most assuredly leave then frustrated when their ideals of romanticism do not play out in real life. Thus instead of blaming themselves and their failed techniques, they immediately look for the easiest candidate to blame: other (more successful) men.

I think there needs to be some investigation on why we mock and make fun of those men who have found that good hygiene and an exorbant amount of confidence are an effective key to attracting women. Despite what you may think of them, their methods work.

Sure, you may say they are unintelligent, but I, an intelligent douche, can assure you that for many of us, it is the role we play in this game in order to disseminate our genes and further our lineage in the most biologically effective way. [Banging lots of chicks]

Ahem. Sorry for the rant. [/unpops collar]

You don't have to 'rattle off pickup lines', canned openers are just there to give you something to start off with until you can open easily without them. They are the training wheels. Once you are comfortable enough, start a conversation just out of the blue with someone, where that someone just so happens to be a cute girl.

Finally, stop judging yourself or other people. Let them be, see them as pivots or alliances to be made in the bar scene, acting like you are somehow better than other people (by labelling them as dismissive names) will not get you anywhere. If you believe you are 'coming off as a tool' then that is exactly how you will act, and you will doubt your own ability which will come through in your body language. If you feel you are forcing confidence, then perhaps its time you work on your inner game until you ACTUALLY feel confident.

Perhaps you have a few things to learn from the douche.

yokhai · 2011-03-25T13:07:40+00:00

Don't use pick up lines? It's all about being natural and feeling good in your own skin. Yes we will ask you step outside your comfort zone for somethings, simply because its about growth.

You have to learn to believe in yourself, because that's where confidence comes from. If you want to play subtle game, go ahead, but you do need to escalate. Read some of the FR's by verterans. TofuTofu, reseddit, afcanon, throwaway. You will see they all have very different styles but none of them are canned routine oriented or overtly "alpha" in an annoying way.

Once you know how to be confidant and own the situation you are in, you can act any way you want.

postdarwin · 2011-03-25T13:56:20+00:00

Don't forget that from time to time we all repeat stories that we think are funny or interesting. After a while we know where the cadences and punchlines are. You're talking about the very same technique, just with 'manufactured' stories, i.e. ones that have not occurred naturally from other conversations.

Sinn (or was it Savoy?) recommends carefully constructing fables from your own life that (while true) manage to highlight your attractive qualities without bragging. Basically, adding subtle DHV spikes to your flow.

alexryane · 2011-03-25T14:13:56+00:00

Forget about lines, but meeting and sleeping with new people should feel natural and right to you. When that feels natural and right then whatever you say to people to get there will feel natural and right.

If you jokingly used a cheesy pickup line on your girlfriend you would feel weird because you're already comfortable with her, for example.

on_the_dl · 2011-03-25T14:39:38+00:00

every time I feel like I'm trying the techniques described here, I end up feeling extremely false

I feel that seddit sometimes over-emphasizes witty remarks and opening lines. AskSeddit questions are often "What do I do in this situation?" with the popular answer being some witty/cocky retort.

It might be because most people have trouble with opening. The Mystery Method says: The game is played in comfort. Meaning that the witty opening and the negs are just to get your foot in the door. I think that 90% of your time with a girl is about generating a connection (comfort).

KFitz · 2011-03-25T16:33:42+00:00

I'm with you on this, OP. Sometimes I read posts on here and can't help but roll my eyes and think the poster is a total d-bag. Some of the methods I find to just be cliche and embarrassing and the terminology sometimes makes me feel like people here are too cold and calculating. Having a worldview in which women are people too sucks I guess...

Apparently they are doing something right though. The shit I try certainly isn't working. So I'm trying to learn. If you can't beat em, join em right?

In regards to pickup lines, I try to avoid those but maybe you just mean openers? That's what I struggle with. I never know wtf to say to start a conversation without feeling like a fucking tool. Once I get going I can hold my own in conversation/banter... but opening sucks!

ayman85 · 2011-03-25T16:57:07+00:00

i think you should just look at it as more of a better way to make conversation. i don't use any lines or tactics, i just talk, and that's what you need to get out of it.

2011-03-25T17:40:27+00:00

Pretending to be something that you are not is the definition of being a douche - don't do it. You may get the ladies but you will still be a douche.

thefudgeman · 2011-03-25T21:40:03+00:00

My style is all subtlety, and I don't want to be too forward.

I don't use any lines or techniques, but I'm anything but subtle. My whole "game" is basically this: talk, tease, touch. It can feel natural, if that's what you want.

2011-03-25T22:14:31+00:00

It's not about lines. Yeah, lines work fine sometimes, but the point is to understand why they work and internalize the concepts.

cptncrnch · 2011-03-25T09:33:11+00:00

Here, here. All the times I had "game" in my head, I ended up pissing off the girl. I'm sure I'm just not reading the situation correctly or trying too hard, but I don't feel like myself. Either way, I probably just need more practice and learn from my mistakes. Negging's new to me and I think I overcompensate. You can't neg an HB<8 and get away with it without some resistance or outright rejection.

Title	Alright, this is cool and all, but, fuck...
Author	singularity_time
Upvotes	53
Comments	38
Date	March 25, 2011 3:49 AM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/gb0mq/alright_this_is_cool_and_all_but_fuck/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/alright-this-is-cool-and-all-but-fuck.1316728 https://theredarchive.com/post/1316728

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