Feminist here...

blackedoutfast · 2018-06-07T07:42:52+00:00

read the sidebar

Aaren_Augustine · 2018-06-07T09:00:30+00:00

Sidebar, you are not special

Poster515 · 2018-06-07T09:29:33+00:00

I don't think RP men have a problem with AMALT. In fact many would agree there are broad differences between men and women and thus broad accurate assumptions of male and female tendencies and behaviours. Concurrent with this is an overall dissatisfaction with the way progressive ideology(s) and feminism seek to promote socialization, environment, and institutional structures (eg gender role prescription) as the primary if not sole explanations for our actions, foregoing and trivializing genetic or biological explanations - i.e. men and women are the way they are because of our flawed institutions, oppressive structures, and so on.

As TRP is a set of ideas meant to help men understand the true nature of women and the dating/mating dynamic, AWALT is the acronym used to warn men who feel they have found a woman who is an exception to RP rules and concepts. Even if we allow for real exceptions, it is generally believed that the exceptions are so rare it would do men well to simply assume no exceptions exist to minimize risk. The fact that AMALT also exists does not contradict TRP at all because it is beyond the intended scope of ideological concern.

hammerhaunts · 2018-06-07T05:39:07+00:00

What does this even mean? I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity. What character traits does every woman have?

I think it makes the most sense to say that the traits that would be on a list of 'AWALT' behaviors are ones that every woman will perform at least some of; some more than others.

Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

They tend to be obvious when you think of them. A mix of the bumbling sitcom father with the casanova who dumps his girls as soon as he gets bored of them

This binary thought process is, to put it blatantly, completely juvenile, imo.

This isn't a question

AloneOnTheStrange · 2018-06-07T07:32:04+00:00

What does this even mean? I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity. What character traits does every woman have?

AWALT means that there is a set of traits that are common across all, or at least the vast majority of all women. Every woman from the ugly duckling bookworm, to the popular princess. All women like men with alpha features (tall, muscular, chiseled face), their attraction is extremely tentative, they have ridden or are riding the cock carousel, and are extremely turned off by weakness and vulnerability.

Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

Yes, but there are two issues that make AMALT a bit different to AWALT. The first is that male attraction is well known, and not denied or sugar coated. Men like young, pretty, thin women, and everyone knows it. The second issue is that male sexual behaviour is very different across the spectrum of attractive men. So there's a much smaller spectrum of behaviours that apply to all men.

I would also think that men have a dualistic (to put it in relevant conversational terms) mating strategy. A hot slut at night and princess during the day (that was a virgin when they met).

This is actually a good example of why AMALT is much harder to pin down. Most men really don't give a damn about those things, simply because they're not in any position to be picky. Top tier men, that can afford to be picky, have a completely different sexual strategy as a result.

Apart from that I'm not sure what your disagreement with AF/BB is, if any. AF/BB says that women will give way more sex, and way more exciting sex, to alphas, for little to no work on the man's part. But, they will give much less and much duller sex to the betas, who have to work and pay for the privilege. Though it's probably not totally universal, I think it's common enough to be agreeable.

carefreevermillion · 2018-06-07T11:50:28+00:00

Take this and come back when you've read it all and thought about it.

DB605 · 2018-06-07T06:53:27+00:00

[AWALT] What does this even mean?

"All Women Are Like that". A reminder to men that if you think a particular woman is unique, special, or in some way above negative characteristics you seek to avoid entertaining in women, they aren't.

I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity. What character traits does every woman have?

In my experience, no answer satisfies inquiring women who ask this question. It's akin to describing porn to a blind man. An art piece of two people having sex painted in 1650 becomes indistinguishable from Brazzers.

It's perhaps more useful to simply say that the saying is only relevant in context of the greater Red Pill theory of women as a collective defined primarily as self-centered, solipsistic, callous, dishonourable, emotionally child-like individuals who shouldn't necessarily be thought of as functioning equals, but more akin to a child to be handled and shouldn't really be taken seriously.

If a man says something like "oh man, I met this girl, we went on a date, she's so cool and mature. My ex cheated on me with her lab partner after I confessed my fears to her! I can really be myself around this new girl!", he'd be told "Stop being a beta. AWALT. Man up".

Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

Technically no because RP holds men as the more virtuous sex, but I'm sure every woman and her dog disagrees so the term exists and is used, but it's not really from RP.

This binary thought process is, to put it blatantly, completely juvenile

Considering you're a lesbian, you're probably (read: definitely) not in a position to be holding particularly strong opinions on that.

I would also think that men have a dualistic (to put it in relevant conversational terms) mating strategy. A hot slut at night and princess during the day (that was a virgin when they met). I'm okay with that, but the cognitive double standard seems hypocritical and logistically unattainable.

I cannot parse what you're attempting to say here. You start with men, then you're talking about female whores? Then you're talking about a double standard that doesn't exist.

2-3-or-not-2-3 · 2018-06-07T07:58:08+00:00

Hi, Welcome,

First, good job on you being you and for deciding to ask questions from the other side - its an excellent redpill approach to search for truth instead of blindly following unfounded beliefs.

AWALT shouldn't be meant literally. This is not communist Russia, "everything, always, all the time" is not the intent. Perhaps its easiest to see as highly likely events that across time will most will likely occur. I'm sure someone could put it in a model and determine a 95% confidence interval that it would occur within X time, 99% over y time, and given z time its a near certainty. In essence its the more scientific rationalist approach that sits on the opposite side of pseudo-science terms you may hold like "male privilege"

If you want an AWALT trait, lets pick an easy one. Emotions. My proposition would be that across the lifetime of a person, a woman is more likely to be emotional then a man. And, that this is grounded in biology - it may be reinforced by cultural norms, but men and women are biologically different and these manifest in different ways. Would you disagree with that proposition being - in general - true?

Also, understand that across all groups (RP, BP, liberals, conservatives, nation x, nation y) that different classes exist. Class in both economic terms and in their demeanor/charm/"game" - the socio-cultural manifestation on how they act. The RP men that are going to reply and explain to you that women are inferior, etc, they are right but for the wrong reasons. This is necessarily true. If you accept (and of course you can disagree) that a womans natural tendency leans towards hypergamy, then each women respective to their man must be across some dimensions 'inferior'. They take this to mean that all women are inferior or childish vs men, but its a simple statistical misunderstanding.

To give a specific example, I can say with a high degree of confidence that the men in the reddit RP community are vastly inferior to me (Hi Guys!), but, that I am inferior to my partner. My husband is superior to me in several ways, I am in other ways but those only indirectly increase our competitive advantage (ie maintaining social contacts assist economic gains). I could never do what my husband does, but we are a team and he will instruct the boss of the manager of the supervisor of the folks in here on what their future should be. If you extrapolate that phenomenon cross all people and generalize it then its reasonable to see how that error could occur.

They suffer from these simplifications because they are attempting to learn - to mimic - being 'alpha' - it is not their NATURAL state they are simply attempting self-improvement - which is in general good. As a sexual strategy it is highly effective to understand what the market 'demands' what you 'supply' and then bridge those gaps. Unfortunately for them, though they can learn from RP to understand the natural tendencies of both sexes, they remain stuck in the old "thinking with the wrong head" issue, they fail to understand that though their strategy is effective, that they are playing the wrong game and that is why they will remain occupying the lower classes then those who have adapted.

Eastuss · 2018-06-07T13:21:00+00:00

ll this "sexual strategy" stuff does not apply to me (at least not in the way y'all intend).

Why not?

AWALT. What does this even mean?

Women all have similar natural incentives and subconscious behaviour. It doesn't mean they can't override the decision with their conscious, it means what makes them happy and what motivates their behaviour and decisions can be safely said to be the same in all women.

I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity

Technically we should stay neutral on AWALT, it's not negative, it's just a thing.

What character traits does every woman have? Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

All this can be understood easily from an evolutionary standpoint. A living form is a mechanism defined by its incentive to perpetuate. Otherwise it wouldn't exist. As simple as that. A living form is a perpetual machine that is going to optimise its perpetuation.

Living forms have two way to perpetuate: reproduce, or be immortal. Living forms who are mortal and reproduce have a super high potential for perpetuation: they can optimise their perpetuation by reproducing as much as possible and the potential is virtually infinite.

Now you know one thing for sure: you're a living form, women are living forms, men are living forms, we all have instincts for survival and reproduction. But the way we reproduce isn't the same AT ALL mechanically, therefore our strategies to optimise it will be different.

There are typically two strategies to maximise reproduction:

Quality : reproduce and make sure you produce good offspring, eventually nurture them so they are protected until they are functioning individuals who can survive alone.
Quantity : reproduce as much as possible and produce as much offsprings as possible.

Some species only implement one strategy, birds often privilege quality, reptiles often privilege quantity.

In the case of human beings, women are set to be about Quality, because a pregnancy can produce only one kid and is a long risky investment. While men can use both strategies. And this is where AWALT and AMALT come from: the simply idea of optimising your reproduction but with different reproductive systems.

Now to retrieve AWALT you have to question what will optimise the Quality of women's offsprings:

Having sex with genetically strong men
Getting resources
Getting protection

Everything in AWALT is about these things: finding a genetically strong sperm donor, finding and "enslaving" a provider (can be the same individual, or not), having other individuals or simply society protects you and your kid. And enhance all these when possible. This as a result gives you hypergamy, the higher standards of attraction (most men are unattractive to them no matter what), the interest for the status of their partner, natural child caring traits, among lot of other things that can help.

Now to retrieve AMALT you have to question what will optimise the reproduction of men when child mortality isn't too high:

Having sex with lot of fertile women, the more genetically strong the better.
Preventing other men from impregnating their women.
Getting resources to attract more women and to dominate other men.

Everything in AMALT is about these things, finding lot of genetically decent fertile women, maximizing their resources and their status.... This as a result gives you polysexuality, the care for mostly only the physical appearance of women, the natural ambition and competitiveness, incentive for novelty of partners... Keep in mind that men will employ the Quality strategy out of options or in an highly hostile environment.

Now keep in mind all these are evolved behaviours and traits, they're not conscious, and they're sometimes really indirectly linked to the end goal and can be "hacked" (video games are stimulating men's ambitions and competitiveness without providing any actually benefit). And keep in mind that there is no "superior" gender.

Now the problem we usually will have with feminism, is that it'll mostly be about fighting against "toxic masculinity" which is basically polysexual men's natural incentives, as if it was enforced by the environment and not by human nature. While at the same time enforcing all "toxic femininity" traits, or better formulated, female incentives. Despite the fact that women already have it better than 80% of men in the sexual market place. Feminism slowly reshape society so that access to the 20% best men is easier (while ignoring the fact that they're so rare), and enslaving/marginalising the 80% other men, and overall controlling the entirety of men.

AF/BB. This binary thought process is, to put it blatantly, completely juvenile, imo.

This is the separation women apply when they can't find a man to fill all these roles at once. The end goal researched by women is rather simple, that's why this model is as well rather simple.

I would also think that men have a dualistic (to put it in relevant conversational terms) mating strategy.

Yes!

quicklogaccount · 2018-06-07T10:28:12+00:00

1) AWALT
What does this even mean? I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity. What character traits does every woman have? Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

It means we all observe the same behaviors from enough women to make a fair generalization that ALL women have a drive to act in such ways instead of SOME women randomly acting like that for various reasons. These behaviors are also described by some sources in evolutionary psychology and we believe they stem from female's hypergamy.

Folks are VERY quick to cry "AWALT" though, it's almost a parting word these days. It's quite disappointing when guys describe traits that are overtly associated with structural mental issues, such as histrionics and bpds, and say "AWALT". Even if those put together are frequent enough to be a concern they don't come from hypergamy.

As for the traits themselves, I'll leave to other folks, RP's sidebar material or something else, unless you feel the want to point something out and discuss.
There is AMALT, we talked about it here, too. It comes from men's polygamy. We did some unflattering descriptions on a thread here, too.

AF/BB

That's not about preferences, but rather about female humans adopting a dual mating strategy. There are some articles on this one, or under hypergamy, and we hear all around, even here, about how and why it happens.
In RP we kind of settled on the idea that men's preferences vary way too much, and there's an underlying understanding that preferences for virgins over sexual women stems from low value traits or religiosity, but we're pretty pacific about such preferences. There's no reason to sermonize or shame them other than benefiting sluts so it's not done. But it's mostly cool pointing out once the guy becomes a slut himself he'll bother less about her past.

Nu_Guy · 2018-06-07T11:18:25+00:00

1) AWALT and its function : Obviously all women are not exactly the same. We have seen enough women display certain characteristics that will burn you if you are complacent, so its best to never get too comfortable and take your relationship for granted.

2) AF/BB : You want to have sex with the "bad boys" more than the "good boys" its pretty straight forward. Personally speaking when I was on OK cupid, 100% of the girls I saw who answered the question chose the bad boy option when asked if they like the bad boy or good.

mistercheeez-o____O- · 2018-06-07T23:19:10+00:00

1) One part of it is like a mantra really. I think a lot of men do this. It helps us to not freak out when we are disappointed by the behaviours of many a woman in our dating pool. Or I guess it helps bottle it up frankly. Whatever works lol. It reaffirms the "unconventional" behaviours that may garner better responses from women in the hook-up/ dating scene. It's unfortunate, but you can see how seduction sometimes makes people bargain with their manners/ethics. All's fair in love and war apparently so AWALT. Brush it off and carry on.

There is also a part of it that is like a quasi-theory I guess.

2) Imagine having struggled with women since puberty. Through short lived relationships that resulted in several heartbreaks, multiple rejections, and long periods of loneliness/celibacy^{Involontary^{anIncel!?^{quick!BuuuuuurnHim!}}} (and not for a lack of trying) you muddled through. You worked on yourself for years if not at least a decade. Let's lay out the fruits of your perseverance:

You're near your thirties, it gets slightly better for ya. You have somehow fumbled into love. She looks pretty good too! Congrats my G. Keep that ball rolling! (marriage - kids - property etc.) But eventually the elephant in the dead bedroom cannot be ignored. Do you still desire your wife? Yup. Does she desire you? It turns out that after a strenuous period of couples therapy, arguments, and many tears, she finally admits that she no longer feels sexually attracted to you. Of course this is framed like you're the arbiter of these woes. Maybe she said it to guilt you into trying harder. Maybe it's to soften the blow by providing you with some hope that this may change if you do certain things. Maybe she wanted to convince herself that her motivations were authentic at some point in time.

Thus, you double down on the romance, retreats, expressions of gratitude for her, experimental sex, vibrators and the such. It improves slightly for a we bit....subsequently plummets. Couple more years of that, and the ultimate confession knocks you sideways, she never really was in love with you, but but but BUT SHE STILL LOVES YOU AS A LIFE PARTNER AND THE LIFE YOU BUILT TOGETHER ETC... Sounds inspiring eh? To them that's like the best possible BB outcome, the worst is: "let's open up the relationship" (possible swinging; more like cucked), she's been cheating on you, elopes with an old "adventure"(that she may have been in contact with this whole time, and she probably did buttstuff with'em, but never wanted to with you! :-O ), elopes with a boy toy, elopes with a girl toy, both, or you get served divorce papers, takes all of your shit, you'll never see your kids again! Or perhaps a table d'hote of all of the above? Monsieur.. today we are le serving oon faive course Cluuustehr Fook (now you're: FUCKED^aaaaaaaaah!)

Just to give you some insight about the aversion TRPers have in regards to Beta Bux. It may seem soapboxing, but you can understand where that's coming from eh? If you put yourself into this mindset, would you not want to avoid a similar outcome?

DaphneDK42 · 2018-06-07T09:07:35+00:00

There's a famous lesbian artist in Denmark Anne Linnet. Last week she took her newest girlfriend out for a spin. Girlfriend is 38 younger than her. Otherwise, she recently broke up with another girl also in the twenties. I think you have a talk host in the USA which also married a young hottie. Also a theme in the Jessica Jones tv-series.

Anyway, isn't it fun how lesbians repeat many of the same themes which are described by trp? Older established woman trade her accomplishments in for a young pretty girl.

AWALT

AWALT means that when you approach the girl situation as a numbers game, then you get the most optimal result by assuming that AWALT. Its a pussy optimisation strategy.

Willow-girl · 2018-06-07T11:24:04+00:00

1) "AWALT" is how men rationalize away the fact that they picked a poor mate. "All of those grapes must be sour! Surely it's not just my grape, right?"

Over on MRP, there was a recent thread in which a man complained that his wife was basically spending him into bankruptcy. The other fellows comforted him with "AWALT!" I chuckled because I just negotiated an excellent deal on a real estate purchase -- the seller accepted my lowball offer without counteroffering -- found a bank willing to do some creative financing, and will be able to pull the DP out of my investment savings. Because, umm, I don't blow all of my coin on fancy handbags. But shhh, don't tell the MRP guys whose wives are running up their CCs at the mall ... they wouldn't believe you anyway. Because ... AWALT!

2) "AF/BB" is how RP explains the very natural phenomenon that young people want to party and have fun, while slightly older people (late 20s/early 30s) generally start thinking about settling down, marrying and raising a family. Both genders behave this way naturally, but only the female's strategy is painted in negative terms (that she's settling for a man that she really doesn't desire in order to have a suitable provider for her kids). While this is undoubtedly true in some cases, it isn't in others, and it's also true that some men pick less attractive women whom they think will make great wives and mothers. So a person of either gender is subject to being a "beta bux," chosen for their utility and not out of passion.

S1imdragxn · 2018-06-07T17:33:26+00:00

I fuck wit lesbian feminists it’s the straight ones I can’t stand

But yes af/B.B. and awalt have male analogs

Madonna/whore complex is similar to AF/BB but it effects men way less almost all women will attempt af/bb

RatFacedDisgrace · 2018-06-07T20:37:51+00:00

the male dual strategy: bastards & heirs

SirNemesis · 2018-06-08T18:20:20+00:00

1) AWALT What does this even mean? I see this tossed around for every example of a women behaving negativity. What character traits does every woman have?

Well this originated because originally blue pillers would go around saying "not all women are like that" (NAWALT) in response to generalizations that are true 90% of the time, so people came up with the "AWALT" meme, which isn't literally true, but is a good heuristic. Essentially, too many guys (and girls for that matter) lose their wits and go "but this girl is a special snowflake unicorn, she isn't like that". It's somewhat similar to the term "all guns are loaded".

Also, wouldn't there be an AMALT set of behaviour patterns for men? What would those be?

Yes, and women should act accordingly. E.g. all men might rape you. All men want variety. All men are shallow and focus on looks. etc.

2) AF/BB This binary thought process is, to put it blatantly, completely juvenile, imo. I'm not so dense to understand there is nuance to this theory, but it seems catered to the lowest common denominator. Even Jung had 4 categories...

Well, it's really a two-axis spectrum (alpha ness and betaness), but is easier to categorize into archetypes (the alpha, the beta, the omega, and the nonexistent unicorn).

I would also think that men have a dualistic (to put it in relevant conversational terms) mating strategy. A hot slut at night and princess during the day (that was a virgin when they met). I'm okay with that, but the cognitive double standard seems hypocritical and logistically unattainable.

Yes, this is true too. AMALT. Slutty flings virgin rings (dualistic) or "lady in the streets, freak in the sheets" (trying to get both from one person).

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Title	Feminist here...
Author	alice_monaghan
Upvotes	3
Comments	88
Date	June 7, 2018 5:35 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/8p7rv7/feminist_here/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/feminist-here.262037 https://theredarchive.com/post/262037

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