What would happen to sexual and dating dynamics if the welfare state was completely eliminated?

pragmatic_ancap · 2017-07-26T10:18:09+00:00

It would be a very good thing overall. Real communities would start forming again, extended families would reunite, and societal climate would improve, including most people's dating life. Less hostility and toxic competition overall.

Divorce rates would probably plummet, but I'm not sure if female workforce participation will. Some women like their job a lot, others are just LARPing or have to pay the bills.

There would be a tremendous shock initially, including riots in the streets and all that. But the welfare system is doomed anyway.

storffish · 2017-07-26T11:58:06+00:00

well let's break down what the effects would be...

Medicare and Medicaid were designed to replace public hospitals, which died out 60 years ago. without them, poor and retired people (unless they'd saved a ton of money) would largely go without medical treatment or buy the bare minimum catastrophic coverage. preventative care would no longer be covered, so many wouldn't be able to see a doctor until they were in a late stage of illness.

speaking of, if you did get sick or injured there'd be no ADA or disability coverage to help you out. you'd probably lose your job. oh, and no unemployment or food stamps if you face hard times. hope you're not dumb enough to try to support a family with a job where you could get injured. and once you've been injured or sick there's no government incentive for any company to hire you, you'd be an unemployable liability.

farm subsidies stabilize the food supply and keep farmers in business with such cheap food prices. without them the cost of food would skyrocket and the supply would plummet.

without FAFSA or public colleges higher education is only available to the rich, and if middle class kids do brave the waters they're likely to default on their loans since there would be no protection.

no minimum wage! this one is fun. companies can pay you whatever they want. the $1.50/hr job would make a comeback.

on that note... are we including corporate welfare? because a ton of companies would pack up and move their operations overseas if they lost their government incentives. your plush programming job would eventually head to India unless you're willing to work for Indian wages, nerds!

no social security. pensions are dead, so you'll have to fund your retirement and, without Medicare, your elder care/end of life treatment. if something happens that you have to spend that money on you'd better hope your family is generous and isn't working those $1.50/hr jobs!

having a baby would be exorbitantly expensive. without PP, the back alley abortion industry would boom, but I'd guess a lot of women would avoid sex altogether. not working would be difficult to pull off and there would be no head start or help with daycare.

so... you tell me how this would affect dating. methinks all but the richest guys would lose out. there'd be more poor people and less chance to escape poverty. Id expect that a lot of women would opt to live with their parents over dating a poor guy.

the_calibre_cat · 2017-07-26T08:31:23+00:00

About a quarter of the people in the US get means-tested welfare, so cutting all those programs would mean harsh poverty which isn't exactly an aphrodisiac - the biggest demographic being folks under 18. The assumption you make in the post is that welfare and 'sex/dating dynamics' are somehow linked but I'm not sure how.

For many in poverty around the world, prostitution and bride selling are ways to survive poverty, possibly you'd see more of that if you were to cut away social programs. Is that what you mean by 'sex/dating dynamics?'

IIHotelYorba · 2017-07-26T09:01:39+00:00

Dating would barely change. But you'd have a lot more kids actually be raised because women would value and latch on to lower betas FAR more. So less hyperviolent fatherless idiot children who raise our gun violence stats to deceptively high levels.

Gorgatron1968 · 2017-07-26T09:51:18+00:00

Well, all those single mothers would probably rush to settle with the first beta they see.

Bluepillers would look at all these shitty, sexless marriages out of obligation and scream "Look at all these healthy loving relationships based on communication! TRP is wrong!"

Terrible, really.

DemonConsulting · 2017-07-26T09:07:50+00:00

short term probably increased poverty, dead kids, general reduction in quality of life. In sex and dating, the poor will still breed like rabbits, probably more so if they can't afford abortions - maybe the old coathanger makes a comeback. For the middle class, the age of marriage would be delayed more and there would be even less children since it is now vital for the woman to support herself and the child without any safety net and children themselves are expensive, so are births at the hospital and both are quick ways to slip into poverty.

I honestly highly doubt it would lead to a white picket fence patriarchy - more like the slums of Brazil or India. Basically look at what western society used to be before welfare and that is about what you can expect - in the west that means slums with the poor being exploited from a young age and forming radical movements when the food runs out (compare the industrialization in Europe). Probably more prostitutes.

What the "marriage 1.0" was based on, for the wealthy, was preservation of wealth. For the poor, it was largely enforced through law and religious indoctrination. If we don't bring those back, as in making divorce very hard and , as a society from top to bottom, enforce monogamy and religion, there won't be some magical "return" to provider-marriage (which even in the past wasn't universal for the poor - a lot of cheating, prostitution, parents just leaving and the family starving, early death, etc.)

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2017-07-26T16:23:38+00:00

What about child support?

If that was gone random sex would probably go way down and women would suddenly become far less likely to forget their birth control.

questioningwoman · 2017-07-26T19:38:17+00:00

Many people would die because they can't afford the medical bills. Children would be forced to work and there would be no child labor laws. It would be a horrible idea. People would either marry very early or never marry at all and house with 10 other people in an apartment to pool resources. We must never go back to that.

voteGOPk · 2017-07-26T22:26:37+00:00

Harems would be a real thing.

goatismycopilot · 2017-07-26T10:59:12+00:00

My life would be pretty much the same. I have a job. Eliminating social security would fuck over plenty of men as well. Most people do not have fixed pensions at retirement.

Willow-girl · 2017-07-26T11:39:36+00:00

I think more women would be willing to marry their baby daddies as there would no longer be a financial penalty for doing so.

WeCaredALot · 2017-07-26T23:42:11+00:00

I think it depends on how well/safe society is overall. I've said to folks before that if there's ever a major war or conflict that changes life as most people know it, then we will see a slight resurgence in gender roles, since men will be expected to pick up the physical slack re: fighting, etc. and women will either link themselves to a man or take a non-physically demanding military job. If the welfare state simply collapsed but with no societal breakdown, I think people at the bottom economic rungs of society will be SOL, but I don't know for sure what would happen to the MC, UMC, or UC. Probably nothing -- at least nothing negative.

IHeartDay9 · 2017-07-26T18:49:15+00:00

Ah, back to a time when the multiple families packed into each unsafe tenement, people literally died because doctors didn't work for free, and children were pulled from school at age 10 to work cleaning rich peoples houses or to work in the mines.

I imagine that all of the women dying from back alley abortions, childbirth (csections are expensive), and the subsequent infections would end up creating a shortage of women, and especially poor women willing to risk death just to get married and have sex, now that there isn't religion to guilt them into being fruitful and multiplying.

I wouldn't be surprised if most bisexual women just swore off men altogether.

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Aaren_Augustine · 2017-07-26T08:23:45+00:00

Consequence. A lot of people act right due to dread, so when it's not there...YOLO

[deleted] · 2017-07-26T21:19:21+00:00

No more beer :(

Shipcake · 2017-07-26T08:40:23+00:00

I imagine the "patriarchy" would return in some way, not completely, but there would definitely be a stronger "patriarchy".

The patriarchy was created specifically because of economic inequality. If there is equality to access to resources, then the genders are also more equal. This is why hunters-gatherers societies were a lot more gender egalitarian.

BookwormJane · 2017-07-26T12:28:41+00:00

If MGTOWs didn't have to pay for alimony anymore, guess what guess what - they would still hate on women, they would just find another stupid excuse to do it.

badnews4u · 2017-07-27T10:54:26+00:00

you need to get rid of birth control for this thought experiment to work. or else we'd have poverty off the charts

Title	What would happen to sexual and dating dynamics if the welfare state was completely eliminated?
Author	Shipcake
Upvotes	4
Comments	90
Date	July 26, 2017 8:18 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/6pmnyn/what_would_happen_to_sexual_and_dating_dynamics/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-would-happen-to-sexual-and-dating-dynamics-if.266758 https://theredarchive.com/post/266758

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