Why are women allowed "beautiful at any shape or size", but men aren't?

Mrs_Drgree · 2020-07-02T07:30:56+00:00

No leading questions

BROWN-TOILET-PAPER · 2020-07-02T03:24:51+00:00

Because no one cares about men's feelings.

People care a lot about attractive women's feelings. Adjacent, less attractive women want the same attention, so it is pandered to them via marketing. It's about money.

Archibald_Andino · 2020-07-02T03:31:09+00:00

Because men are attracted to women of all shapes and sizes. Tall, fat, thin, obese, etc. A common theme around here is how women have it easier because the standards are "just don't be fat" which is funny, because... they, in fact, can be fat and they will still get a huge amount of attention.

By contrast, very few women are attracted to men who are ____ (short, bald, fat, etc)

tossa445 · 2020-07-02T04:08:31+00:00

Men might be held to some higher standards but I'm not convinced weight is one of them.

All of the media messaging that big women are beautiful means nothing if men aren't actually attracted to them. Some are but most aren't and cultural programming won't change that.

I probably see more fat dudes with hot women than fat chicks with handsome men. Neither seems really common but neither seems rare exactly either.

Part of the discussion is how fat we are talking.

With women a little curvy or skinny-fat won't hurt them as much as the same amount of fat on a guy.

On the other hand an obese man probably has a better shot than an obese women as long as he has some other stuff going for him.

BlackPorcelainDoll · 2020-07-02T03:38:11+00:00

What is a confirmed "bachelor" at 16 ... you are aren't even legal.. normal bullying by teenage, adolescent, childhood psychology standards.. if you haven't been bullied or victimized by 20 you aren't living..

Almost more women can tolerate or "romance," men with beer bellies and hairy backs without it being a weird fetish.. "Fat women" are only attractive in fetish.. they need to be told they are loved and 'ok' outside of feederism.

TheBookOfSeil · 2020-07-02T03:38:29+00:00

I think it's because men are generally more forgiving of women in cases where sex is involved, and also when they've been single for awhile, but women don't exactly have those problems to the same degree so they're less likely to lower any standards or allow for forgiveness unless it was for someone that they genuinely liked and developed feelers for.

I've been the victim of life-long bullying, criticism, and out-right viciousness from the opposite sex regarding my physical appearance. Everything from my nose, to my height, to my eyes, to my cheeks, to my hands, to my chest. Everything. I've basically been a walking target for the opposite sex to take their day out on. It's not like I go out of my way to ask women's opinions (I've been a confirmed bachelor since I was 16, currently 24.)

Women have gone out of their way to demean me to make themselves feel better, and I know that this is the case for tens (if not hundreds) of millions of men worldwide.

That's when you don't care about what they say and ignore them, and if you feel like going the extra mile, you tell them to go fuck themselves or throw in a few witty comebacks. It doesn't do you any good to let women walk all over you, so don't allow it.

Men are held to higher physical standards than women are these days. What are men who cannot afford plastic surgery or orthodontics supposed to do to fix our physical appearance?

Nothing. You start acting like a man by, again, not letting women walk all over you. Aside from that, have a decent job, be sociable, treat everyone with the same respect that you expect from them, and live your life. Don't waste it trying to appeal to women because you'll likely never be happy.

Lily-in-the-Valley · 2020-07-02T04:01:47+00:00

Because almost all women attract some kind of male attention regardless of their sizes and shapes. But only a handful of men attract the attention of women. This is caused by the level of testosterone flowing through men's bodies being 11 times more than through women's. It's just biology.

I personally am not sexually attracted to majority of men, probably 99.99999%, yep, including all those Calvin Klein male models lol. But I just treat everybody as respectful human beings, regardless how they look.

For those who shame your look, please ignore them. They should be ashamed of themselves.

LittyKitsune · 2020-07-02T04:22:11+00:00

Women are told, ad nauseam, that no matter what they look like they are physically "ok", while the majority of men are told the opposite.

By who? Do you think the women who are bullying and demeaning you are telling other women that they're "beautiful no matter what."

At my high school the same girls who were making fun of "ugly" guys were also making fun of girls and even each other behind their backs. People can be cruel. The sugary PR advertising campaigns targeted at women and verified Twitter accounts aren't all there is to the world.

hiilive · 2020-07-02T06:22:05+00:00

I can't imagine how isolating it must be to be bullied for one's appearance by the opposite sex for years in end. But you can, and your conclusion is that it only eber happens to men? You've actually been through the cruelty of bullying, and decided somehow that it never happens to women?

Of course women are berated or bullied for their looks, all the time. Women are judged harshly by their looks from men and women alike, completely picked apart for every body part - a cruel way to treat people as you've experienced yourself.

Women have more socially acceptable options in making themselves prettier, but that is because the standards for women's appearance have always been higher. Women are for looking at, men are the one's who are looking. Passive physical beauty has always been the female virtue. Most women go out of their way to conform to this still - with fashion, skin/nail/haircare, makeup and just a general heavier interest in appearance.

Then, with social media came the rise of platforms for people to speak their own minds, it's no longer just magazines, fashion houses, models and tv/movies that get a say in what should be considered beautiful. Social media is responsible for a lot of shit, but it sure has helped democratize a lot of opinions. So the body positivity movement grows, catering to women, by women. No matter how you try and spin it, this is still a fringe movement.

Women are more often told that the way they look is not nearly good enough than they are told "ad nauseum" that they are okay. All those standards for physical beauty and the carriers of those (magazines, ads, movies, fashion) all exist, to an even greater extent than ever. And a movement started by women and for women in direct response to the image of women also exists. Do you not think the "pioneers" or "spokespeople" of the body positivity movement are bullied? The way I see it, men are free (and even encouraged by the body positivity movement!) to start curating their own movement.

Anyhow, your question was about what a man can do to fix their physical appearance, and even though women have more socially acceptable options for doing so, men's options are severly underused. Dressing well is a start. Getting a custom skincare routine, proper haircut and products, knowledge on appropriate clothing for different situations, working out for aesthtic reasons, proper teeth care, managing their facial hair - hell even learning how to use concealer are major steps towards better physical appearance. And honestly, with the exeption of makeup, all these things are very socially acceptable for men as well, so I'm not sure women's repetoir is that much bigger.

atreethatkeepsgrowin · 2020-07-02T03:23:11+00:00

Body liberation is for men and women. Free yourself bro.

Aaren_Augustine · 2020-07-02T03:27:13+00:00

Women - Hella thick to hella thin equals fuckable.

Men - Top shelf or you pay girl to hang around you.

Victim - Why you no love Quasimodo? What? I'm not Quasimodo and you just are turned off by how low my self-esteem is? No, no. I identify as victim. Accept me, even though I can't accept me.

spacechicken1990 · 2020-07-02T03:42:56+00:00

[removed]

Awkward-Office · 2020-07-02T04:03:08+00:00

Because historically women were made to feel much worse for being physically unattractive, so it’s a rebound from that. Even to this day unattractive women are made to feel shame about their appearance, that’s why the movement started to begin with. In fact I can’t even recall any cases within my personal life or in the media of men being bullied for their appearance.

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Pastelitomaracucho · 2020-07-02T05:06:47+00:00

Because beauty is women's most important asset to attract men. But beauty is not men's important asset.

2020-07-02T05:49:45+00:00

For the most part of history, at least in my country, women were held to the highest standards and men didn't have to look good at all. I still remember the old saying that "a man should be just a little prettier than the devil".

So maybe now it goes another way around. Hopefully, it will balance itself.

Although I don't see men helping to higher standards than women. Not in Poland, not in mainstream media, it's not a general way of thinking.

pooppeebuttmcnuggets · 2020-07-02T05:50:51+00:00

Because the majority of men arent sexually attractive to begin with. Bodybuilding and working out is the biggest myth perpetuated by redpillers, they thing they will see a presumably large increase in female attention once they meet their goal physique, but most woman would not even notice. As a man when I think of an attractive man, I think of ian somerhalder, or a young brad Pitt most men simply arent equipped with the sexual characteristics woman respond to, and tbese ittle nuances like being tall or being ripped dont compensate for having and average to moderately pleasant face. Not trying to make this an incel rant, what I'm trying to say is you'll get farther with woman by being funny, having an attractive personality and social status, it's what puts you ahead of other guys, along with being financially independent of course.

InfamousLob · 2020-07-02T03:33:47+00:00

To cater to the feminine imperative. Men aren’t allowed to have standards, but women are.

throw-away-140214 · 2020-07-02T04:03:16+00:00

Is it purge week or something?

Zippo-Cat · 2020-07-02T04:13:06+00:00

Gynocentrism.

SmurfESmurferson · 2020-07-02T03:57:48+00:00

Because, unlike women, men aren’t judged solely on their physical appearance. You guys have charisma, status, etc to make up for your short comings. Just looking at wives of the objectively unattractive guys on TBBT - they’re all hot, those guys aren’t

Women say this to other women so we realize that we have worth outside of our sexual and physical attractiveness. Sometimes, we need to be reminded of this, as 50% of the population will judge us immediately on looks

Men don’t have that barrier

HumanSockPuppet · 2020-07-02T03:58:43+00:00

Because the ones who say it are lazy fatasses.

saladfingers4141 · 2020-07-02T06:33:31+00:00

Women aren’t either it’s just something the delusional ones tell each other

stonedkyuby · 2020-07-02T06:54:53+00:00

The body positivity movement was founded to combat anorexia and body dysmorphia in women, an issue that persists today in women destroying themselves to fit a specific idea, not to force you to date fat women. If any of you gave even an ounce of an iota of a shit about men with body dysmorphia fucking themselves up with steroids you'd do something similar instead of whining about feminists.

DissonanceBadger · 2020-07-02T07:03:18+00:00

They are not held to a higher physical standard, wth are you talking about?! Men need to be neutral looking to be good enough to date, because female attraction mechanisms are about avoiding the bad, rather than running towards the good, so what they care about is that you’re not ugly, not that you’re beautiful. Being better looking is indeed better, but once you’re good enough improvements in that department yield significantly diminishing returns. You get the most gains to your SMV by going from ugly to neutral, not neutral to beautiful.

Women have a very different experience though. Men’s attraction mechanisms are about running towards the good, and the more beautiful a woman is the more attractive she is. There is no point of diminishing returns, and the minimum standard to get noticed by men is at least pretty, not neutral. A woman should be at least an 8/10, maaaybe 7/10 if she tries hard enough, and she won’t be nearly as attractive as a 9/10. The problem for women is that this is incredibly unfair, because your ability to affect your looks is limited. This is why women love make up so much, it gives them a feeling of agency about something with very limited agency. This whole culture we have right now about “women are beautiful in all shapes and sizes” is really a pushback against the rules of the female SMV competition. It’s saying “we don’t want our attractiveness to be determined by our looks”. But tough shit, you don’t get to decide that, nature decided it for you.

iam_hexxd · 2020-07-02T04:50:46+00:00

First of all, let me say that I’m sorry for what you went through. You don’t deserve it, and I hope that you’re working through that trauma with professional help.

As for the broader discussion — if your thesis is “women are allowed to be beautiful at any shape or size but men aren’t,” I think it’s mostly attributable to long-standing societal norms and structures rather than something that women get to “have” and men “don’t.”

Physical appearance is vastly over prioritized among women relative to men. You can discern this from a variety of factors that are easy to research: how much time and money women spend on beauty products, comparative pricing of clothes, the behavior among teenage girls in which they have a tendency to put each other down due to their appearance more than boys do, physical appearance giving women more opportunities in the workplace, etc.

Women (again, speaking broadly here and not to your experience specifically) get to be beautiful at any size because it’s necessary for them to be beautiful. This creates situations in which not being called beautiful is disastrous for mental health, to the point of severe depression. Normalizing all women as beautiful is in many ways a survival necessity.

It’s also a well placed effort to decrease some of the disadvantages that less-attractive women face. If you can change what the general standard for beauty is, then (hopefully) that evens the playing field.

Men do not have, or perhaps more accurately have not broadly tried to institute this thinking because physical attractiveness has never been as highly important for men as it is for women. There are plenty of ugly, balding, male CEOs out there. Men have the advantage of being judged on a much broader array of features with physical appearance being much lower down on the priority list. Because of that, it is (largely) unnecessary to broadly normalize diverse male beauty, because doing so changes very little.

My personal advice to you would be focus on what you can change. Go to the gym. Nourish yourself with good and healthy food. Practice being confident; as crazy as that sounds, the more you practice the better you get at it. Develop your intellect, if that’s something you have more of than most. In other words: find a few good attributes your have and place those at the forefront of who you are with a load of confidence. It’ll take you a long way.

bann2787 · 2020-07-02T04:51:30+00:00

In general, when a man sees another man who is in better shape, it inspires him to work harder. He admires him. Not always, but more than women for sure. He knows society doesnt give a shit about him and it's up to him to fix his problems.

When a woman sees a hotter woman, she feels shame and becomes less motivated. In turn, she develops a victim complex and blames society instead of herself. That's why you only see women involved in fat acceptance, and other victim movements like feminism.

It's a lot easier to listen another fat woman say "it's not your fault, it's your metabolism, your thyroid, its society, its diet culture, but its certainly not you taking in more calories then you burn." It feels good not to take personal responsibility and make excuses for your actions.

imagayfaggo · 2020-07-02T05:09:24+00:00

To me as someone born female it feels like the opposite. Seems like women have always been objectified. There's a whole thread about how women would be worthless if men werent attracted to them. Because men think they have created all of society with women just being an accessory. Plus all the tropes in media where the fat stupid funny guy gets the hot wife. In every sitcom. Also all the fairy tale type of stories where the guy is really ugly but the girl learns to love him anyway. Is there one singular story that has an ugly monster woman being loved by a normal guy as the entire plot? Try to think of one. But I could think of five with the ugly one in the relationship being male.

As for the bullying idk. You must be really shockingly ugly to get bullied that much. but just do what the phantom of the opera did learn to play the piano or some other skill like what Disney's Quasimodo did carve little wooden figures. Hobbies and skills is potential access to pussy no matter how ugly you are because you can just keep playing the misunderstood pity brooding cards back to back while looking for a girl with a nurse curse and/or cptsd.

HacksMe · 2020-07-02T05:22:51+00:00

I’d argue the opposite, that women are held to a higher physical standard than men. This is evident from the existence of make up products and the “beauty at any shape or size” slogan. These don’t exist for men because men don’t feel as pressured to look beautiful; at least, not pressured enough for men wearing makeup daily to be commonplace. Advertisement and magazines even to this day feature attractive women to sell products. Recently advertising is using more “beauty at any shape or size” strategies so they don’t alienate “less than perfect” women.

Edit: Those women who insulted your are definitely bullies. Don’t let them ruin your opinion on women in general though. I’m certain there are women out there who will adore what you think are flaws.

GGMcThroway · 2020-07-02T05:46:23+00:00

Because a guy can be ugly and still considered normal as long as he has social skills and charisma.

An ugly woman is seen as an abnormality no matter who she is as a person.

LeJacquelope · 2020-07-02T03:27:29+00:00

Because women have wombs and having a womb means women deserve 100% forgiveness for any flaw that they have because if women were held to any kind of standard they would die before procreating or during procreating or humanity would go extinct.

Did I miss anything, TRP/feminists?

Title	Why are women allowed "beautiful at any shape or size", but men aren't?
Author	brettharvee
Upvotes	31
Comments	140
Date	July 2, 2020 3:17 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/hjpc0m/why_are_women_allowed_beautiful_at_any_shape_or/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-are-women-allowed-beautiful-at-any-shape-or.702329 https://theredarchive.com/post/702329

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