you’re single until there’s a ring

[–]analoguegirl29453 points454 points455 points 6 years ago (23 children) | Copy Link

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie33 points34 points35 points 6 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

[–]EspressopatronumjoeFDS Newbie209 points210 points211 points 6 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

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[–]bearded_dragonladyFDS STRATEGY COACH11 points12 points13 points 6 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie-2 points-1 points0 points 6 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Thank you for this question! I hope to see examples of comebacks and strategy examples from other women too.

I've been absorbing new information, and playing around with my answers to men, so any wisdom shared is welcome. Will be so helpful to read how other women tackle certain situations.

I'm sticking to mostly dating scenario examples here, as it's FDS.

/////////

Him: why are you still single?

Me: because, you're really, really lucky? ; )

/////////

Him: why are you dating other men, when you have me?

Me: I have you? LOL, that's news.

/////////

Him: suggests to meet, asks for my availability

Me: can I trust you to take care of planning? I'd like if you give me one or two suggestions, and let me know time/date to meet you.

Him: wHy I gOt To Do ThAt?

Me: it makes me feel relaxed when I can depend on you to take things out of my hands, so I can focus on having the best time with you! : )

/////////

Him: cancels date, and asks to reschedule.

Me: Yes, we can meet, but I only have time if you promise to make it! ; )

Him: cancels another time

Me: it seems you have a lot on your plate right now. I'm going to let you handle that. You can call me when you can set plans, maybe I'll have time. (Nope).

/////////

Him: suggests to meet.

Me: can we set the plan?

Him: let's confirm later in the week.

Me: I ask because when I got something to look forward to it makes me feel excited. I'd love to see you, but if you can't decide, I cannot promise I'll be available... Busy girls have to plan ahead : )

(Last minute = NO. Just plan something else, he'll learn through disappointment or not)

/////////

Him: pops up after some weeks of silence

Me: new phone, who dis?

Or

Me: ... Me: I need consistency from men I'm seeing... What do you think of that?

/////////

Me: can you please pick up the tab for these groceries?

Him: (joking) okay, but I'll charge a 10% interest rate.

Me: haha, guess I'll have to bill you for any cooking I do! ; )

/////////

Him: screwed up/didn't do x.

Me: Ok. (Disengage)

Him: apologizes, says he knows he screws up, wants to make up for it

Me: (name) honey, if you can pay more attention to x next time, that's all the apology I need.

/////////

Him: screwed up/didn't do x AGAIN.

Me: Ok. (Disengage)

Him: the expected apology.

Me: ... I believe you've got my best intentions, but I feel SO disappointed now (name), I really hoped you'd have done x. I don't want this kind of energy between us. What can we do to avoid this next time?

/////////

Him: suggests to live together but we've only been dating, not committed/engaged

Me: honey, that sounds amazing, I love the idea of living together! Admittedly, this comes a little unexpected... I like what we have but I can't see myself moving in yet. I'm looking for that amazing relationship with a man who is committed to me, and I am open to find that happiness, so I feel I wouldn't be serving myself to move in right now. Can you hold this thought for a more appropriate time in the future?

/////////

Him: hasn't said I love you back yet (only applies if seeing this man for ages, there's trust and he's HVM)

Me: (Name) honey, can you come sit with me?... I know you love me, and I see it through all the amazing things you do for me. You really care for my happiness. So... This might sound silly to you, and I know you feel it without saying it, but... I can't help but feel this is important to me... I don't want to pressure you, but at a time it feels natural for you, I want you to know... It really means a lot to me to also hear 'I love you'.

(I think usually the man would've interrupted and said it now, though you can't force it to happen, but at least he knows.)

[–]bearded_dragonladyFDS STRATEGY COACH11 points12 points13 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Cool, thanks for writing out the dialogue. My personal suggestion is to make your sentences as concise as possible. Whoever has to say/explain more has the least power in the dynamic. For example, when he says "let's confirm later in the week", you could just say "Great, lmk. I'll let you know if Friday still works for me at that point." That way, you're being polite/unbothered while at the same time letting him know that you wait around for no one. For me, feminine energy is more about subtlety and manifesting queen energy in a seemingly effortless way in front of men.

Although I do find the idea of confirming later in the week to be a red flag in general, which would cause me to put the guy on the backburner. I personally would have just said "Great", and then later when he tries to confirm, tell him that I unfortunately already have plans because I assumed the plans with him were not solid. I would only go out with him if I had absolutely nothing else to do, since he clearly isn't prioritizing me.

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]jewdifulFDS Newbie8 points9 points10 points 6 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

This...wow. None of this is FDS behavior. These could be straight out a Pickme’s text messages. I wasn’t going to go through these and point out why I feel this way, but fuck it haha.

This approach you’re taking is the very kind that attracts LVM and repels HVM. You have to be willing to set up boundaries, you have to assume the man is capable and intelligent enough for your actions to speak for themselves. You don’t explain to a man why he should be treating you right, why he should be doing A, why it was bad that he did B, nah, stop all that! You simply expect to be treated properly, with consideration and respect, or else you walk. Be prepared to walk, at any time! You don’t need to manipulate a man to stay with you — you expect a man to impress you enough that you won’t want to leave! And if he doesn’t you have much better things to do so BYE.

The energy you give off in those text messages is just all wrong imo. Men aren’t toddlers, but if you treat them like they are they’ll start acting it. You don’t sweet talk a man into treating you well, you simply observe how he treats you naturally and then make decisions accordingly.

If he shows himself to be low value, you don’t try to change him. You leave.

Your Examples/My Perspective

Him: suggests to meet, asks for my availability

Me: can I trust you to take care of planning? I'd like if you give me one or two suggestions, and let me know time/date to meet you.

Him: wHy I gOt To Do ThAt?

Me: it makes me feel relaxed when I can depend on you to take things out of my hands, so I can focus on having the best time with you! : )

Don’t explain to a man why he should be planning and scheduling dates — it’s obvious to a HVM. You want a HVM and not a LVM you have to explain the most basic of things to, right?

Him: cancels date, and asks to reschedule.

Me: Yes, we can meet, but I only have time if you promise to make it! ; )

Him: cancels another time

Me: it seems you have a lot on your plate right now. I'm going to let you handle that. You can call me when you can set plans, maybe I'll have time. (Nope).

No girl, nooo! Don’t do this. He’s cancelled twice, he is OUT. Don’t send a long text message that basically says “I get that I’m not enough of a priority for you to fit me into your life right now, but when that changes — call me!” That’s not queen energy. That’s not the vibe you want to put out there, is it? Not to mention, after the FIRST cancellation he’d be likely out. And it strikes me as pretty Pickme to try to wring a promise out of him — “promise me you’ll make it!” Just seems kinda desperate sis.

Him: suggests to meet.

Me: can we set the plan?

Him: let's confirm later in the week.

Me: I ask because when I got something to look forward to it makes me feel excited. I'd love to see you, but if you can't decide, I cannot promise I'll be available... Busy girls have to plan ahead : )

Don’t explain to a man why he should be respectful of your schedule and your time. Just accept that he’s not, and move on! Don’t give him multiple chances like this.

(Last minute = NO. Just plan something else, he'll learn through disappointment or not)

Agreed!

Him: pops up after some weeks of silence

Me: new phone, who dis?

Or

Me: ... Me: I need consistency from men I'm seeing... What do you think of that?

This might be okay if you simply said “I need more consistency than I’m getting from you, sorry!” and then block/delete. Life is too short to waste time waiting on a man to respect you. But to add in “what do you think of that?” it’s like why? Who cares what he thinks, he’s already SHOWN through his actions that he’s not that way. You literally don’t need any more information from him than he’s already given you. So why ask?

Him: screwed up/didn't do x.

Me: Ok. (Disengage)

Him: apologizes, says he knows he screws up, wants to make up for it

Me: (name) honey, if you can pay more attention to x next time, that's all the apology I need.

That’s how a parent would talk to their kid, not what a grown woman says to her partner when he does something he should be apologizing for. You don’t apologize unless you mean it, so this was a fake apology because...

Him: screwed up/didn't do x AGAIN.

Me: Ok. (Disengage)

Him: the expected apology.

Me: ... I believe you've got my best intentions, but I feel SO disappointed now (name), I really hoped you'd have done x. I don't want this kind of energy between us. What can we do to avoid this next time?

HE DID IT AGAIN!! “What can WE do to avoid this next time?” NO, sis. No. You don’t beg a man to apologize to you, you don’t give him multiple opportunities to disappoint you in the same way. You have to be willing to walk away! There is nothing in your response here that would indicate to him “wow, I really might lose her.” It reads like a parent talking to their kid, trying to sweetly and gently convince them to act right. Nobody got time to parent grown ass men!!

Him: hasn't said I love you back yet (only applies if seeing this man for ages, there's trust and he's HVM)

Me: (Name) honey, can you come sit with me?... I know you love me, and I see it through all the amazing things you do for me. You really care for my happiness. So... This might sound silly to you, and I know you feel it without saying it, but... I can't help but feel this is important to me... I don't want to pressure you, but at a time it feels natural for you, I want you to know... It really means a lot to me to also hear 'I love you'.

You don’t beg a man to say I love you. You don’t ask, you don’t hint. If he’s unwilling or incapable of saying it in a reasonable amount of time, it’s time to end things with him. No healthy HVM needs to be pressed into saying I love you to the woman he loves. If he doesn’t say it, he either doesn’t feel it OR he’s got issues with his emotional functioning in some way, which is a red flag in itself.

I don’t see any scenario where it works out well for a woman to prod her man to verbally declare his love. If he says it because she asked him to, she will always wonder why he didn’t say it on his own. It will cause insecurity and make it hard for her to ever truly trust that he loves her.”

Not to mention, men tend to HATE being told by a woman what they’re feeling. Saying to a man who hasn’t said he loves you “I know that you feel it without saying it,” that’s not right the right move at all IMO. You can tell him it’s important for you to hear verbally that he loves you, but you shouldn’t assume he does when he hasn’t said it yet himself.

The other alternative here is that you’re expecting him to say it way too early, and in approaching him like this he gets freaked out and uncomfortable. I’ve never experienced a man not saying I love you past the point I felt it should have already been said, so I don’t relate to this personally. But my gut tells me if this happens to you it’s a sign that something is wayyy off — with the man, with the relationship, or with you. And whatever the solution, I don’t think it’s trying to cajole an “I love you” out of him.

Those are just my thoughts though — I’d love to hear what some of the other ladies here are thinking.

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

Really? Interesting. A little nudge only if needed has come a long way for me! I've got 2 rotational dates currently, men organizing and paying my dates, my rent, my groceries, making me breakfast in bed, doing chores for me... A fast improvement from past dating experiences lol

Edit: saw you gave concrete feedback on my examples, appreciate that!

Edit2: I've been part of a dating community for divas for the past 6 months before stumbling on FDS. FDS spoke to me, because it's based on the same principles. The only reason why I've told men some of the examples above is that even generous and well-intentioned men don't always know what I expect. When I ask for his input without making him wrong, I have a chance to see how he takes accountability, before I decide whether he's worth a second chance. You're going to run into annoyances with every man at some point. LVM give shit responses so it's clear quickly.

Examples I made about moving in or saying I love you, were in situation with a guy who has been a truly amazing support and great friend to me. He doesn't expect exclusivity or sex from me, but he has all eyes on me. He regularly surprises me with breakfast in bed, a concert, paid vacations, taking care of my cat when I'm out of town. Not long ago he took me windowshopping to ask what kind of engagement rings I like (emeralds? saphires? His eyes landed on 10k ring while I humbly looked no higher than 2k) but he wants to reserve I love yous for when it's forever. He's not a very emotional communicator, more a do'er. I still see other men and remain available, because my attitude is if I'm not engaged/committed I'm single.

I'm still looking to further change my mentality towards dating, so thanks for the kick in the ass ; )

[–]jewdifulFDS Newbie7 points8 points9 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I think these kinds of responses could definitely work in the short term, with some men — but are they necessary in the first place, if your ultimate goal is a committed relationship with a HVM?

It seems like in a lot of these examples you’re responding to examples of LVM behavior, so that’s why a lot of my responses involve not responding at all and just moving on. So much of dating with FDS involves weeding out low quality men who aren’t worth ANY of your time, regardless of what HVM-like things they do alongside the red flags. If a man flakes or cancels on you once, he better have a damn good reason, and if he does it again, the only response is NO response. Instant block and delete. If a man makes obvious screw ups multiple times, he’s a LVM, that sort of thing.

So much of the time it doesn’t matter what you do or how you respond to him, you can’t turn a LVM into a HVM with your own behavior. Only thing you can do is walk away immediately when you catch those flags. OR option 2, which is training them to better hide their LVM qualities, by responding in some of the ways given by your examples — which is not what the goal should be!! Imo anyway.

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, I've used the top examples like "why are you single" or "why do you date other men, when you have me" (which are LVM questions) and those answers, just so I don't end up explaining myself but neither channeling negative energy. But those dates honestly didn't last. If you need to answer such questions early on, fully agree it's not a good sign. Next.

With Brexit screwing his work schedule, one of my rotational dates is close to burnout and became flaky early January. That guy had been consistent, dependable and generous. So after simply being unavailable because I plan my own things, I gave him a clear reminder. He stepped up and came over to make me breakfast in bed, offered to pay my rent while I'm away abroad so I'm financially cosy, and planned a date to see a classical concert. So I cut him some slack. He's under a lot of pressure with work, even if I don't like that he let it affect his social life.

I don't want LVM in my life either, but I'd never tell a man "cuff me or shut the fuck up" which was the example I tried to offset with other communication examples. I don't consider myself to know the holy grail of communication, so thanks sis for your feedback, I'll def take it into account. 💕🙏

[–]g7gfrFDS Newbie11 points12 points13 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie-5 points-4 points-3 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]EspressopatronumjoeFDS Newbie40 points41 points42 points 6 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

The idea that "feminine" energy is 'nice'/'polite' though, is problematic.

That women are automatically more nurturing is largely due to socialization. Using something that is used to oppress us, as "empowering" is akin to saying that the corset actually makes us look beautiful. And therefore corsets or compression underwear are inherently womanly. It's not womanly, it's a mark of an oppressed class.

"Feminine energy" is however women communicate. But you are meaning it to have the connotation of 'soft' or 'polite'.

I do not always need to be emotionally vulnerable to get my point across. Sometimes it's totally necessary to be blunt and tell them you expected them to do all the laundry, not just theirs and you're disappointed.

Sometimes the man IS wrong and when we expect them to meet a basic bar of partnership and responsibility our corrections may very well be "nagging" especially if they aren't listening to us. It is not our responsibility to make them feel secure. If they don't want to listen to us, however we say things, they are LVM.

I would even argue that nagging has less to do with us and more to do with them. Same as "bitching", "bossing" or whatever insult they use to make our points invalid.

I don't have to "nag" my husband, only because he recognizes that I'm his partner and he respects that if I have a complaint, I'm not just making something up. But if he didn't, my energy would be the exact same, but would be considered "nagging".

When women are held to completely different standards of communication than men, it means our oppression is still tangible. The fact that you are defending this large difference in communication and justifying it as "feminine" energy it means the man you are seeing sees you as less than his male counterparts. We should not have to do a nice dance in order to be listened to. If your man is making you dance a jig and only then will he be receptive to your points, it's not a respected partnership. If your man gets angry or raises his voice when you speak plainly about what you are unhappy with, he doesn't respect you.

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 6 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

But you are meaning it to have the connotation of 'soft' or 'polite'.

I think you really misunderstand me. I believe we have different connotations and associations with the concepts I use. I dont believe it's healthy to suppress our frustration, anger or disappointment. I don't believe I have to be polite either. I don't believe in forcing myself to be anything less than connected with myself.

Masculine energy is the "doing" energy, while feminine energy is the "being" energy. I like men who are assertive, set the dates, are problem solvers, like to be the hero. While I am in receptive mode, allowing my life, my man, and experiences to fill me up. It's not yes-amen feminity, which is a patriarchal definition in my eyes.

I use a lot of masculine energy to get my career forward, build networks, get things done in my life. But in relationships, I like to be in feminine to get my needs met and points across. This doesn't equate to silencing any frustration I have; on contrary, I'd communicate about that asap. Appeasing a man isn't diva energy.

The fact that you are defending this large difference in communication and justifying it as "feminine" energy it means the man you are seeing sees you as less than his male counterparts

This is really a shame. You're putting me down, based on assumptions drawn from a few messages, on a topic we don't seem to understand from the same angle. I don't make assumptions about you or your relationship. I respect you and your man have your dynamics, and if it works for you, that's all that matters!

I've never caught him thinking I'm less, and I've never felt I'm 'doing a dance'. Rather, from my anecdotal experience; leaning back, creating positive tension, not catering the man, doing my own thing and focusing on my joy, and vulnerable communication, has brought us closer together. I'm getting more attention, good moments, open talks, support and lavish treatment, so I'm happy!

[–]EspressopatronumjoeFDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 6 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]si_vis_amari__amaFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 6 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Could also just name it "doing" and "being" energy, or "active" and "passive" energy. I see your point why it's problematic that the terms are gendered. In intersectional feminist theory this is problematic, but going into semantics is losing sight of the point. Both women and men harness both energies. To find information about this, you'd have to youtube/google feminine energy in dating.

We have a lot of "doing" energy in many areas of life that require action-forward, organizing energy. Assertiveness in my career, troubleshooting my life, actively setting dates with friends and family, being part of activist groups, organizing conferences and managing network relations.

But if I demand a man to be action-forward in romance (doing) and I maintain that same energy in a relationship with him, this creates a disbalance of energies where we get in each other's hair. I'd be pushing the man out of "doing" energy if I get overly involved in "doing" energy myself.

I want to lean back and enjoy ("being") and let myself be catered, pampered and taken care of, not be the one who caters, pampers and takes care of him.

In communication this translates to a different style of expression, as "being" energy harnesses presence, feeling, observation.

Maybe a load of quack to some, but investing in this has resulted in real shifts in dating for me. Proof is in tasting the pudding, I think...

[–]EspressopatronumjoeFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

In intersectional feminist theory this is problematic, but going into semantics is losing sight of the point.

Yes I agree completely.

I guess I push back hard because I have dealt with a lot of sexism in my life. From the military to medicine. The idea that feminine energy is different from masculine energy seems extremely regressive and solidifies a lot of sexist notions that directly harm women (and have directly harmed me in the past).

I don't have an issue at all with being or doing energy, it sounds like woo, but woo can be helpful to talk about invisible things that are harder to quantify in other terms.

My only issue was that feminine and masculine energies have something to do with things OUTSIDE of the genitals or reproductive function.

But yes, I agree that both sexes use both types of energy throughout the day. I only propose that it's harmful to give these names that relate to masculine/feminine ideas.

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I agree - you’re single until you have a wedding ring. I’ve seen men appease a woman by giving her an engagement ring and calling her his fiancé. Three children later and they’re still not married. The solution is simple: never give a boyfriend the privileges that belong to a husband. Don’t buy property together or finance cars or have children or move and give up your job and social network because he has a promotion opportunity in another city. Those privileges belong to the man who’s committed to being with you, not to the guy who says whatever will keep you in your imbalanced relationship where he gets all the privileges of a husband without the responsibility. Another note - being foul-mouthed like that will also set you back. A queen who recognises her power doesn’t speak that way.

[–]ny-ladyFDS Apprentice6 points7 points8 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]artemis_moon_goddessFDS Newbie7 points8 points9 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]BlackgirlwandersFDS Newbie2 points3 points4 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]TheDeadlyBeautyFDS Newbie-2 points-1 points0 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]bluelightsonblkgirlsFDS Apprentice51 points52 points53 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Title	you’re single until there’s a ring
Author	willget_better
Upvotes	1372
Comments	84
Date	February 17, 2020 3:15 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/comments/f5a4e2/youre_single_until_theres_a_ring/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/youre-single-until-theres-a-ring.682233 https://theredarchive.com/post/682233

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