Why so much hate for /r/MensRights?

mtux96 · 2011-06-03T03:16:04+00:00

Theres a combination of reasons

Feminists tend to see us as the opposition to women's rights and brand us as that, due to our opposition to the misandry on the institutional level and our general disagreements of methods of action.

Its an easy target

Most people don't get (or agree with) the "women behaving badly" posts.

and the last and least popular (to admit) reason:

Misogyny. Yes it is here, it is not "rampant" as most people would like to admit (but those mix it with the WBB posts would disagree) but the fact that we have little to no censorship outside of upvoting/downvoting lets misogyny come to the top from a handful of people from time to time, and it really doesn't make us look good.

aetheralloy · 2011-06-03T03:07:38+00:00

Feminists hate people who won't get with their program.

White-knights hate people who call them dogs begging for scraps.

Celda · 2011-06-03T03:07:02+00:00

Because feminists have successfully lied to the population that women are oppressed and men are privileged / oppressors.

overcontrol · 2011-06-03T03:24:09+00:00

A big reason is because liberating men from their gender roles will have a negative affect on a lot of people in higher places. Other reasons include the fact that the the MRM is not main stream and has a radical to moderate ratio that is not healthy.

mkfrey · 2011-06-03T13:22:40+00:00

You are correct, I believe in identifying a vocal minority of misogynists who post on /Mens Rights.

My only real concern is the way in which 'feminist' is used to refer only to the extremist feminists, and the overarching abuses stemming from the results of much feminist movements. These viewpoints are wrong, and it my interest in the addressing of these issues which is why I am subscribed to /MensRights.

I think there is a difficulty in the feminist movement that 'feminist' is used as a blanket term. One which encompasses the reasonable to the extremes and the problems which have emerged from typical feminist doctrines - which you rightly identify and strive to combat by providing an alternate dialogue.

There are feminists who cling to outdated notions of an all-ruling patriarchy, and who are prepared to sacrifice men's rights in favour of women's. But I believe- and certainly hope- that this is not a stance most women would hold.

I feel that a lot of feminists -like myself- just don't have an alternate word - a peoples movement I suppose- to express the seeking of equal rights and treatments in the system. To strive for- in one very general sense- the continuing attempts at economic equality for women, and the redressing of attacks that men have also suffered, such as legal rights, since the rise of the feminist movement.

I do believe that men should be seen as equals- particularly relevant now is issues in the legal system- and acknowledgement of their equal rights and abilities in parenthood. I call this belief feminist: a continued effort to address the creation of equal rights of all, which has superceded just female concerns. And I honestly believe that most people classed under the banner 'feminist' would believe the same. If you can suggest a better word, I'm happy to hear it.

TL:DR while I stay subscribed and interested, I find the lumping of all feminists into the man-hating-oppressing extreme category as a little distasteful, as you would find the defining of the MRM by the misogynist minority.

roland3337 · 2011-06-03T04:05:12+00:00

For the same reason that religious people sometimes lash out at non-believers. They don't like having their beliefs questioned.

It's like Feminism is the Catholic church, and The MRM is Galileo.

For us right now, it is cold comfort to know that in 100 years, we'll look like geniuses, and the feminists will look like orthodox nut jobs.

Funny thing about the truth. It gets out, no matter who opposes it.

ShakeyBobWillis · 2011-06-03T04:57:35+00:00

In part because many hardcore feminists detest being challenged on some serious inconsistencies in their actions/logic. They don't like it being pointed out that their extremist views have in fact created a huge double standard for men and women in the legal system...disparities that anyone preaching 'equality' should be concerned about.

In part because there's a lot of idiots here that are net drains on the actual cause: The misogynists and the tools that upvote them and defend them. The jaded guys that got burned by a woman and are now convinved that 'all women' are stupid lying thieving bitches a half step away from falsely accusing a guy of rape or burdening him with paying child support for a kid that isn't even his. To the people that just post random anecdotal stories of women doing awful shit as if it's somehow beneficial to mensrights and pretend there's not just as many random anecdotal stories of dudes doing awful heinous shit. To the people here that won't admit that any of the above paragraph occurs here or is detrimental to the overall cause.

Don't confuse all hate for r/mensrights as always applying to the MRM in general. I'm a strong advocate of the MRM. I personally find r/mensrights to be too consistently a circle jerk of bad logic reaffirming other people's bad logic.

girlwriteswhat · 2011-06-03T13:00:03+00:00

Unless if it's a link to an article, I see many of the posts as trolls.

I don't know what it's like for other lurkers, but I hate generalizations: "women are all..." or "most women..." Just like I hate shit from the feminists: "all men are..." I get that the whole movement encourages ideas that not all women are pink pony princesses, but it doesn't mean that I'm a money grumbling lying slut who only see men as meal tickets. I support men's rights because I personally have seen how fucked up family courts can be. But I don't support slut shaming or victim blaming, which can get really muddy here especially concerning rape. Which brings me back to the trolls, I see a lot of trolls or suspected trolls and it can give this sub a bad rep. Like I said, I read the articles and take them for what they're worth, but it seems that many of the self posts are concern trolls.

matt_512 · 2011-06-03T04:30:54+00:00

Feminism is much more accepted. Feminists think that MRA's are wrong, and vice versa. Since feminism is the bigger movement, when push comes to shove it's feminists that win.

disposable_human · 2011-06-03T11:11:06+00:00

A lot of what we take as gospel here goes contrary to how we were raised as children. It fosters kind of a red pill/blue pill dynamic which makes you either look like a crazy eyed fundamentalist or a glossy eyed sheep.

fxexular · 2011-06-03T11:24:19+00:00

Look at the replies in this thread:

feminists have successfully lied to the population that women are oppressed and men are privileged / oppressors

Feminists hate people who won't get with their program

Men obtaining rights is a natural threat to the feminist supremacists in the feminist movement

It's like Feminism is the Catholic church, and The MRM is Galileo.

These may well all look like perfectly reasonable opinions to you. But to people outside your movement, they do not. To the world at large, these ideas are little more than conspiracy theories. Like it or not that's way it is.

Then, you have replies like these:

White-knights hate people who call them dogs begging for scraps.

[People see "women being bad" stories as offensive"] - The reason why it's offensive is exactly why its needed.

shove female evil in people's faces till it is just accepted as a part of life.

This makes this place seem outrageously misogynist. You may disagree, but the world at large does not. It sees opinions like these and perceives them as hatred for women and men who like women. The whole thing about "women being bad" is a huge issue for this subreddit. It will never be seen as anything other than petty point-scoring by the world at large. The more you "shove it in people's faces" the more people will hate and ridicule you for it. Again, you may have hundreds of reasons why it isn't really like that if only people would listen - but people aren't going to listen; they're going to interpret it all as rationalised hatred.

And beyond that, this subreddit has other issues.

Differing opinions are massively downvoted here.
Downvote brigades form and downvote people in other subreddits (major problem right here).
The paranoia about "concern trolls".
Instinctive distrust of all outsiders - often shown with anger and insults.
General "the sky is falling" air of hyperbole and sensationalism.

Now put yourself in the shoes of just another average redditor with no knowledge of this subreddit and imagine his response at seeing all of this for the first time. It's rather damning when you think about it that way.

Shattershift · 2011-06-03T05:25:51+00:00

Feminists can often see themselves as wholly in the right, with women being universally victimized. Men's rights then appears to them as "attacking" women's rights, a similar fear of atheists from the religious.

(Not that feminism is a huge mystical conspiracy akin to "The Patriarchy", just that feminism can impress harmful ideas of defense on women, leading them to see MR as misogynistic.)

Feminism is used to being "The good guys", men's rights then makes a crudely intuitive target for being "The bad guys".

dieyoubastards · 2011-06-03T13:28:20+00:00

Shit like this, from the sidebar:

"I'm a man, a feminist, and I.." Yes, we call you "white knights" and we were you once. You are just our past selves. "I've been married for over two years and..." Awww... pats you on the head like a cute little scamp

For the record I'm a man, and I think men's rights is a much-overlooked issue, and there are a variety of obscene ways in which there is inequality towards men in our society. I want to argue and fight for men's rights. And I'd like to browse and contribute to a subreddit about men's rights. But the tone in the sidebar links is insulting and childish, and I'm afraid from what I've seen /r/MR is more about opposing feminists and less about male equality. So that's why I won't be coming back. Sorry.

pakmanishere · 2011-06-03T04:16:55+00:00

There's always lots of trolls trying to discredit the MRM and we also attract men who are rightfully angry about injustice...read more on the side bar.

Thanks and hugs for you.

rhythmbandit · 2011-06-03T06:24:59+00:00

Well I wouldn't say I hate MensRights, but I generally don't like visiting this subreddit. As a young man I have seen how Mens Rights effect me, and I definitely feel that at its root, there is a noble cause.

What I don't like is the defensive nature against any slight against any man by someone that may happen to be a woman, and sometimes by another man that just "doesn't get it."

Also, I do feel there is a bit of hate towards woman here. It is said that Men's rights issues are about equality, but it doesn't always feel that way. There are plenty of complaints about feminists, but the people in MensRights are guilty of some of the very same things. When I see posts talking about how nobody should every get married, it makes me think of sad old men that have been hurt, or young men that have just never been good with relationships or women.

When I think of MensRights issues, I think of issues against a certain group of PEOPLE. But I feel like there is a terrible "us against them" mentality here that views everyone as someone purposely trying to do them grave harm.

I'm not saying that everyone here is guilty of this. Actually for the most part most of you aren't, until some of you get wrapped up in the hivemind and post knee-jerk reactions.

2011-06-03T16:21:53+00:00

Because to some feminists, feminism is like a boa constrictor. It wraps itself around society, slowly squeezing it into submission. Mens Rights Activists are like the hand that grabs the boa's tail, causing the boa to lose its leverage and letting society slip loose from its grip. MRAs show society that there's no reason why it has to accept the boa's grip as inevitable. That's why some feminists hate it so much.

2011-06-03T21:47:14+00:00

If I want to take something away from you, first I put you down, paint you as a monster, a loser, a pervert. Then I can take your stuff and not feel guilty.

ss_camaro · 2011-06-05T18:23:28+00:00

they have nothing better to do. really.

brunt2 · 2011-06-03T05:58:56+00:00

Men obtaining rights is a natural threat to the feminist supremacists in the feminist movement (eg. democrat 'career' women, lesbians, and 'frigid' women who resent men) and the male backstabbers in it (eg. male 'white-knights' who chase pussy by stabbing their competition in the backs/putting them in prison etc, men who were bullied/have inferiority complexes and see feminism as payback against the strong male) and the 'women-are-innocent' pedestalers who put women above men out of sympathy or belief in their 'virginal innocence' (judges often fall for this...."how can i ever give that poor, innocent woman a harsh sentence?").

It's also a threat to international organizations created by the West like the UN, who seek to use feminism to attack every non-western country (feminist-marxism) and establish an NWO type heirarchy through it. In some countries, this is also an internal goal. Examples: UN will start sanctioning countries because their rape statistics "are too low, or they circumcize women"; UN will use that bullshit RTP doctrine to launch attacks and sanctions against these countries "because there is too much pay inequality" etc.

Feminism is also useful to get neoliberals and the 'socialist left' into a pro-war stance (as anti-Islam/Muslim is for 'the Christian right'). This has been exceedingly useful to exploit for european nations, for example, in the middle east. It's pretty much become a crutch.

kanuk876 · 2011-06-03T04:21:46+00:00

Our psyches have all manner of dark corners.

In each time of our history, some dark corners are suppressed, some are acknowledged but outlawed, and some dark corners are celebrated.

Today, the female blood-lust-fueled desire to kill and dominate the penis is celebrated. Positive male traits are oppressed, and negative male traits are celebrated and outlawed.

Sucks to be a guy today. It'll be better for our grandsons, catching civilization on the rebound.

I believe this society will not value men until there are starving women on every street corner. IE: until women no longer take men's contribution for granted.

Gareth321 · 2011-06-03T11:39:22+00:00

Much of feminist logic is based on the idea of a patriarchy. It's demonstrably false. However, to admit that would be to admit that some of their core principles are not only false, but often intentionally so. This means that they must continue to uphold the lie in order to retain relevance. It's a compounding problem, so with each new claim, the foundation becomes ever more unstable. At this point I don't understand how feminism can still function. Most proponents are either female supremacists, casual "girl power" types, or people who believe in equality and mistakenly believe that feminism is the correct banner for their beliefs.

ignatiusloyola · 2011-06-03T12:32:50+00:00

Nearly any ideological group (one not based on reason, but on faith in a belief) will eventually become violently oppositional to any idea or argument that threatens that ideology. Faith has a very difficult time standing in the face of reason.

2011-06-04T01:00:27+00:00

To be honest, I am guilty of feeling slightly hostile towards /r/MensRights at times. I try my best to be objective, and I agree with most of what people say, but the vast majority of reddit are guys so anytime I offer an alternate point of view (And I do try and be respectful!) I get flooded with downvotes, stories about "This one girl that..." and "go make a sandwich".

People in The Real World don't behave like this, but Reddit is viewed as comfortable and fun, which can equal anger when 10 people are all having fun at your expense. So I'd say a combination of being extremely outnumbered, and alternate points of views being thrown away as "feminist nonsense".

Not to say feminists are better, but I can't stand being generalized as "women do this" and "feminists do that". Looking at the top rated comment, "Feminists hate people who won't get with their program", I would normally feel generalized off the bat.

violettta · 2011-06-03T03:29:46+00:00

I think it's because mens rights should be more about actively attaining rights for men, but there just seems to instead be alot of hate posts about women here.

NiceIce · 2011-06-03T05:29:38+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	Why so much hate for /r/MensRights?
Author	QuickBASIC
Upvotes	38
Comments	228
Date	June 3, 2011 3:03 AM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/hqgza/why_so_much_hate_for_rmensrights/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/why-so-much-hate-for-rmensrights.1039148 https://theredarchive.com/post/1039148

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