Is misogyny in TRP even debatable anymore?

War2kali · 2016-03-22T00:21:07+00:00

This is just a troll thread and a totally useless waste of time. You are dismissing an ideology with one term: misogynist. I thought this was about debating ideas and nuances, not just blind attacks. "Bob is stupid! Everyone should just ignore him!" Useless.

alreadyredschool · 2016-03-21T20:27:02+00:00

No, not at all. I don't see how anyone can object to that, at this point everything that is not an attempt to sign up for feminism is misogyny. TRP exists, therefore it is misogynistic. Est esse ergo est misogyny - or something like that.

They can also mean simply looking down on others or seeing them as lesser just for a characteristic like gender

They don't get frustrated by women being women, the frustration stems from the shit people do. A guy who got cheated on doesn't hate his ex for being a woman, that's laughable.

They can also mean simply looking down on others

And some people want to sell this to us as if this would be as bad as starting a genocide on women or to hate and discriminate them just because they are females. By this definition it's just a soft problem and by far not as bad as misogyny.

Relevant:

The idea of thinking that men hate women is implausible, that's why people deny it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/35qu94/what_should_women_do/cr7ga25

This debacle of a gender war is not just on the minority of women who are feminists--it's on most women who've not just tolerated it, but viewed the social and legal changes the way looters view a race riot. Sure, they might not care about the issues, but they'll happily take advantage of the measures feminists have managed to enact, or to ignore the way those measures unjustly harm men until the moment they feel personally victimized through the men they care about. The average woman will be 100% in favor of child support right up until her own kids have to go without figure skating lessons so her husband can make child support payments to his ex for kids he's never allowed to see. They'll collectively cheer the "advance" of women in education right up until their daughters can't find a man worth marrying. They'll laud efforts to make "rapists" more easily convicted until the unforeseen day their own son is falsely accused.

And she'll nod along when all men throughout history are unjustly maligned as oppressors and rapists because she's never, for whatever reason, realized that among the maligned is her beloved grandfather who taught her how to make daisy chains, encouraged her to climb that tree when she was little, started a college fund for her, and sat unsleeping next to her grandmother's deathbed for 72 hours with tears pouring down his face. For some reason, she just never made the connection that when feminists were talking about evil, patriarchal rape-machines, they were also talking about the men she loves and the men who sacrificed so she could have a better life than they did.

If the red pill is a response to anything, it's a response to the apathetic, pragmatic, mercenary nature of most women, who don't even notice the harm done to men until they're forced to personally suffer a portion of it.

And then this question in the OP, so typical. Okay, so women have been kicking you guys in the testicles for 50 years and you're finally starting to object to it in ways that affect me personally. So what should we women do?

Well, first thing would be to stop kicking men in the testicles, and try to convince other women to stop. Second thing would be to stop interpreting "OW! My testicles! Fucking hell, WTF?" as misogyny and aggression. Third would be to stop buying the trite rhetoric of a Cenk Uygur, and a Theodore Roosevelt, and a William Blackstone, which derides men of past generations as behaving abominably toward their women, as fact, rather than as a way to distinguish themselves as superior to "those bad men over there, or back then". Fourth would be to put a little bit of effort into understanding the male experience rather than judging it.

Red pill seems to be the one area that demands these things of women in general.

Anger is a legitimate emotion in the face of injustice. It is important to remember that passive acceptance of evil is not a virtue. Saying "stop kicking me in the balls" is not misogyny.

Now read this comic: http://everydayfeminism.com/2015/12/tone-policing-and-privilege/

Stop trying to dictate the debate, no need to tone police, the frustrations many men have in our increasingly misandrist society are central to the discussion. Especially if these men don't get to experience their privilege but get called entitled and shamed without a reason. I reject your shaming tactics, if you want to do anything else than laugh about the less fortunate members of society then I advice you to step down from the moral horse and leave the shaming tactics at home, as atlas aptly pointed out here they are meaningless.

COPCO2 · 2016-03-21T19:53:25+00:00

It's been a long time since I've seen a red piller deny that TRP is highly misogynistic

I thought I made a good argument about this here

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/49jqbz/cmv_the_primary_source_of_the_anger_phase_in_trp/.compact

I think the way feminists treat grown women as dainty helpless little butterflies is misogynistic as fuck

Madness20 · 2016-03-21T23:13:39+00:00

what exactly in TRP is blantantly misoginy? There might be users around that might be, but that doesn't necessarily say anything about the ideas and concepts of TRP.

TRP in itself is just a collection of concepts and ideas about how the dating scene/hook up works for humans, and the realization that both genders have a different sexual strategy, different standards and different "powers" over the dating scene, and mostly is about pointing out evidence to these facts that there is a tangible difference between men and women desires and abilities. Nothing in the TRP ideas by itself explicitly or non-explicitly hates women or thinks they are inferior, but that's not the same of course, that there aren't users around that feel frustrated and "betrayed" by common narratives in our society and sort of lash out that frustration in this sub, but even so that's no evidence to say that TRP "hates" women or thinks them as any inferior.

daveofmars · 2016-03-22T01:02:46+00:00

TRP is just a set of ideas, and those ideas are going to attract a broad demographic, and certain parts of that demographic are going to be considered "misogynist".

I don't know who Olbastard, Archwinger, or theultimatecad are. Been writing in the manosphere for a while and I don't recognize them. The stuff I do read - The Rational Male, Heartiste, etc. - don't bash on women. They'll explain women as best they can, which means they sometimes reveal the feminine mystique's darker side, but critique isn't hated.

The overall point of TRP isn't to hate on women, because you can do that without reading a single piece of RP knowledge. If that was all TRP was about then it would be far more shallow and have nothing to do with understanding gender/sex or self-improvement.

Ultimately, TRP community is a buffet that's going to have things you'll like and things you don't like. TRP isn't about policing correct speech and behavior unless it's a tactical measure. If you don't like certain blogs of commenters because they don't meet your standards then find ones that do. Similarly, if you're hunting for misogyny, racism, or anything else, you're going to find it. Dig deep enough and you'll find worms.

SunnyFoxes · 2016-03-22T09:25:16+00:00

It is not feminism and total female worship and therefore it must be misogyny.

"Everything is misogyny, everything is racist, everything is homophobic, and we have to point it all out!" - Anita Sarkeesian, a prominent feminist.

When you believe that sort of shit, then of course, TRP is misogyny. Duh.

PurplepillBro · 2016-03-21T20:31:50+00:00

I tend to view TRP as gender neutral. It's really talking about strategies for masculine types. It'd be a great strategy for a masculine woman who wanted to pursue feminine men, for example.

thus, not sexist at all.

Whisper · 2016-03-21T23:10:40+00:00

Why should I care?

What, exactly, is so bad about misogyny?

Personally, I don't like dogs. Or cucumbers. Or Arizona. So what?

caesarfecit · 2016-03-21T23:12:06+00:00

The biggest knock I can make against RP communities is the belief that women at their worst is women on average. That's where and how it becomes prejudicial.

But to turn around and declare RP inherently sexist because of that is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Very convenient logic for feminists but intellectually dishonest.

The best way for RP to correct this is to define what makes a good woman, and something with a little more depth and even-handedness than what commonly passes.

But that's easier said than done. Feminism has failed on that front for decades now. Which is why its advice to women has often been hypocritical, self-contradictory, and in conflict with basic female nature.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2016-03-21T19:48:45+00:00

"Misogyny" is a debatable concept

Transmigratory · 2016-03-21T20:42:56+00:00

Hard to say when feminist/BP's idea of what constitutes as misogyny is so vague and ever expanding.

YaBoiTibzz · 2016-03-22T02:00:44+00:00

You have to distinguish between the core ideas and the people. I think the people in the sub tend to be a lot more misogynistic than the concepts they supposedly espouse. But something like hypergamy is more a reflection on human nature than anything else. They do tend to put a deliberately negative spin on it though, like "women are such bitches" for the crime of behaving in their own self-interest the same as any man does.

GayLubeOil · 2016-03-22T10:12:43+00:00

Much of the content on Red Pill is written to be deliberately offensive. If you are somehow ignorant of this fact and become offended anyway then your opinion counts for nothing as you are operating with the intellectual capability of a child.

assmunchinator · 2016-03-21T20:56:34+00:00

Is misogyny in TRP even debatable anymore?

I'm tired of debating the whiny weirdness of the red pill. Yes their views are proudly misogynistic. So yes, you're right there's no point in debating it.

Why is there so much red pill crap here? It does my head in every time I come to this forum.

I'd rather debate gender issues.

SpaceWhiskey · 2016-03-21T20:24:04+00:00

Lots of the RP people who post in this sub are openly misogynistic/sexist and also don't see anything wrong with it, I think we can retire this particular topic. I just tag users who truly believe that stuff so I know who I should bother debating with. I haven't seen any of the worst tags in a while though.

[deleted] · 2016-03-21T20:44:37+00:00

[permanently deleted]

ExpendableOne · 2016-03-22T13:55:25+00:00

Some will say "how can we hate women when we like fucking their holes? I love women!"

That seems like your own ridiculous projection.

this is about as convincing as a slaveowner saying "how can i hate black people when they cook my food and labor for me? I love black people!". This is a false premise to be sure

Then why did you even make it? It is absolutely absurd, and completely incomparable for many reasons, and yet you still tried to make that association(based on your own ridiculous projection of how men, or rp, sees/values women).

prodigy2throw · 2016-03-21T19:53:40+00:00

Not even remotely.

ppdthrowawai · 2016-03-22T13:27:37+00:00

Guns dont kill people, people kill people.

BiggerDthanYou · 2016-03-21T20:08:35+00:00

I think better questions would be

Why would anyone that isn't a misogynist even take a single post on TRP serious

or

Why don't RPers understand how they are being misogynistic

The simple fact that the debate if it is misogynistic even exists shows that some TRPers lack the ability to empathize with women and it's obvious that they can't see them as individual people.

Every "female hypocrisy" post shows that women are part of the out-group (in social theory) for them. If a women says she doesn't like muscles and another one dates a guy with muscles this is female hypocrisy.

They may not outright hate them, but it's clear that women are less than men for them.

The same things can be observed in racists and pretty much everyone that hates a group of people.

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energyvolley · 2016-03-22T09:36:09+00:00

deleted ^{^{^What}} ^{^{^is}} ^{^{^this?}}

Title	Is misogyny in TRP even debatable anymore?
Author	Titaniu
Upvotes	8
Comments	156
Date	March 21, 2016 7:38 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/4bdvhv/is_misogyny_in_trp_even_debatable_anymore/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-misogyny-in-trp-even-debatable-anymore.275566 https://theredarchive.com/post/275566

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