Q4RP: Why is hypergamy in women bad?

figthief · 2017-04-07T14:18:31+00:00

Hypergamy isnt bad. It enhances the selective pressure inherent in sexual selection.

Hypergamy used to be mitigated with obligatory monogamy. Now that this is no longer the case, we are reverting to our most natural state, in which more and more men are forgotten. This is only "bad" if these men create problems. But they are pacified with video games, porn, and medications, so they won't.

However, at this trajectory more women will either

Need to get more comfortable with sharing attractive men (a surprising amount might be ok with this)
Going their own way (which a decent chunk women have been doing for all of time without issue)

bala-key · 2017-04-07T14:07:33+00:00

Hypergamy is not bad, it's just actively denied.

It's a harsh truth for the bottom X% of men. It goes against the narrative they were fed most of their lives.

It's a bitter pill to swallow.

Ultramegasaurus · 2017-04-07T14:32:30+00:00

Hypergamy has not adopted to civilization very well. A lot of time it leads women to men who would have been great father material in the stone age but burden society now, e.g. thugs, sociopaths and crippling low inhibition types. Meanwhile men who contribute to society themselves and who are more likely to have children who contribute are glossed over for not being tall enough, muscular enough and the like, as if it mattered in the first world in 2017.

Oh and don't forget that the super hypergamy we have now enables very low value women to reproduce. And they do, at much higher rates than high quality ones at that. High quality women's hypergamy is so strict, they often stay childless for a long time, searching for a suitor they deem adequate. And the older the women, the higher the risk for disabled/sick children, defeating the whole purpose of hypergamy, i.e. strong, healthy children.

Archwinger · 2017-04-07T15:38:45+00:00

Hypergamy, in isolation, is a good thing. It is the force that causes women to pursue and land the best mate they are capable of attracting, and causes men to compete to become the best mate possible in order to attract the best possible woman.

But when we couple hypergamy with a society that has essentially destroyed any consequences associated with slutting (by both sexes), infidelity, divorce, and non-monogamy, we end up with unofficial harems. The best guys non-monogamously fucking multiple women, the women not entirely happy with it but okay, and the worst men seething over it.

That system works fine in the jungle, where the lesser males still need to huddle with the tribe to not get killed, but in our decadent, easy society, there are no credible threats to the lesser males, so some of them go crazy and shoot things. Most of them have been successfully placated with porn, alcohol, and video games, but it's only a matter of time before we see a marked increase in shootings and bombings by loser men. Unless the government starts a war before then. Getting men into the military and giving them an outlet for rage has worked in the past, too.

prodigy2throw · 2017-04-07T13:45:16+00:00

It's not necessarily "bad". It's shitty for the bottom 80% of men because they get looked over in the SMP and then get used for their resources. It's also disingenuous for women to not admit the strategy but I guess that's why it's such a successful strategy.

Hypergamy is thee best thing to ever happen if you're top dog.

funny_lyfe · 2017-04-07T14:53:49+00:00

Women are genetically programmed to seek out the best father for their children, and mate for themselves. All animal females also go the best male. Look at some of the apes and monkeys.

For a brief while, maybe a thousand years while men were the only bread winners, and there was no social media or the internet the hypergamy got subdued. The girl would marry the best social alliance, or for money. Some of them could still be selective but the majority took what was given to them.

Men are taught if they work hard enough, and are respectful human beings they will get a female to procreate with. However, this is not true in this day and age. Most of the lower SMV males don't get a below average women, when they themselves are at the very least average.

I'll give 2 examples in the friend circle. Guy 1 makes 100k, drives a jeep, races cars and mountain bikes, owns his place, 26 years old, 5'7. Because of his height he is mostly constrained to asian girls, the white girls that will give him the time of day are fat, or have kids, or have attitude problems.

Guy 2 losing his hair at 25 makes 140k, also 5'7, awesome snowboarder, races his car, lives in an expensive downtown area, average looking. Cannot find many girls to date, the ones that are dating him will disappear after a few dates since they will find someone better looking always. He does attract a few gold diggers but even they have better options. He has never had a GF, and I think might be a virgin.

Both display a lot of alpha traits on their own, they race cars, they are into outdoor adventure sports. Neither of them are awkward with women but both are dating way below because of height issues. These men have completely gotten left behind.

Personally, I have been dating for 13 years. In this whole time maybe I've gone out with 5 women out of maybe 60-70 that were visibly more attractive than me. Another 15 were similarish on a number rating. The large majority were not as attractive as me. In college they were more likely to be similar to me, after I'll maybe go on a date 1-2 in a year that are similar, almost never better looking than me.

I think you are wrong about far more guys getting attractive females. It does happen but it's rare. I think it's the other way around, all these fat women that I see with normal weight guys. I see it almost every time I am out to the mall, I don't almost ever see the opposite.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-04-07T13:48:39+00:00

Hypergamy isn't "bad" to RP, it is just female nature and sexual strategy is amoral. It is bad to certain moralizing individual TRPs, mostly the mgtow and incel types

badnews4u · 2017-04-07T13:36:20+00:00

Trp doesnt say its bad but brings it to light. Thats why its called the red pill

DarkLord0chinChin · 2017-04-07T13:42:31+00:00

Embrace your hypergamy if you want to be a rpw

Littleknownfacts · 2017-04-07T13:49:15+00:00

Hypergamy is not bad in women. Low quality men will try to tell you it is to shame you into sleeping with them. Don't fall for it, female hypergamy makes the world go round.

ThirdEyeSqueegeed · 2017-04-07T15:06:38+00:00

Hypergamy is neither bad nor good. It depends on the perspective. If you're an honest decent man whose wife leaves you for someone who is higher up the pecking order then it's bad, for you. If you are the woman, or the new man, then it's good.

As a man, it's better to recognise, understand and accept hypergamy than to be ignorant.

sublimemongrel · 2017-04-07T15:30:15+00:00

Hypergamy isn't bad, in and of itself. That's like complaining about why the sky is blue, instead of green or purple or yellow. It just is and it can't be changed.

What's bad are:

1) The inability of almost everyone to understand what it is, as recognized by The Red Pill (the subreddit and the manosphere at large. Everyone wants to continue to call it by its dictionary definition, when it has a very specific term of art meaning in the manosphere and when discussed here).

2) men's failure to use it to their advantage

3) The complete unwillingness of society to put any restraints on it.

Gorgatron1968 · 2017-04-07T14:46:35+00:00

Because it causes women to cheat and break up families

BPremium · 2017-04-07T14:40:18+00:00

Hypergamy is bad cause its always about money or looks.

Christian_Kong · 2017-04-07T15:38:39+00:00

Women measure attractiveness by what a guy does

This is not exactly true.

OT: Well since TRPs a mens thing, hypergamy is bad because it makes relationships a more of a gamble than it already should be. Relationships cost us a lot(hopefully for a reward), with time being the most valuable thing we invest in them. Long and short, this all ties in with the TRP mantra of not getting married, divorce rape, etc.

SetConsumes · 2017-04-07T16:58:13+00:00

Hypergamy is good and helps women, unchecked hypergamy however is bad, it leads to the breakdown of families.

analt223 · 2017-04-07T17:06:20+00:00

It isnt. Hypergamy + women in the workforce + men screwed in divorce courts = societal collapse though.

dj10show · 2017-04-07T18:05:02+00:00

It's not bad, as that implies morality and morality has no influence on the SMP. It creates a huge disparity in SMP for men depending on whether you are above the Mendoza line or not.

[deleted] · 2017-04-07T19:59:55+00:00

If a man wants a woman to submit to him and be led by him, he should work on being a little bit better than her. I don't see what is so bad about that.

This is my biggest complaint about RP in a nutshell.

They whine because they can't get laid, but don't want to acknowledge that they are seriously un-fuckable. They whine because they cannot get a girlfriend, yet refuse to acknowledge that they are not Relationship Material.

Men (and women) need to Get Their Shit Together^TM if they want to attract the level of people and relationships into their lives that they want.

vitringur · 2017-04-07T21:58:33+00:00

It isn't bad. Everybody is hypergamious.

It just is what it is. It just depends on how much people are aware of it, because it can explain things that might otherwise confuse people.

Edit:

In a sense it's just optimism bias or over confidence. Heuristics and stuff that is used in psychology and economics. They are models that can also be applied to the sexual market place.

Drippyskippy · 2017-04-08T00:54:25+00:00

Most women don't care about looks as long as the guy isn't ugly (despite how people insist otherwise.)

K

lbspredh · 2017-04-07T13:29:42+00:00

Everybody loves a gold digger when they can afford one

Eastuss · 2017-04-07T13:47:36+00:00

TRP's definition of hypergamy deviates from the official definition of hypergamy.

Official: women aim for higher status than her

TRP: women always seek for better partner

It's not bad, but it doesn't play in our personal interest and we just have to recognize it's a thing.

If you pick someone that is THAT better than you, why that person would even choose you? Doesn't it sound a bit hypocrite to you?

From a BP perspective, hypergamy is immoral: men and women are equal, if women are picky about men's status then why wouldn't men be picky about women's status. Nobody is a leader, both should have their shit together and lead together. You pick me because I am uniquely loveable to you, not because I will provide something to you.

BP finds hypergamy immoral, but also doesn't believe it as the default instinct of women.

On a practical level, it's annoying that when my wife is sick I must take care of her, and when I am she just shit tests me. I can't trust her being supportive in difficult situations. My wife is supposed to be my other half, we're supposed to not be in concurrency, and that's what I was ready to do. But things aren't like that, any sign of weakness is a threat of her leaving/cheating.

AutoModerator · 2017-04-07T13:21:51+00:00

Attention!

You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
For "CMV" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
OP you can choose your own flair according to these guidelines., just press Flair under your post!

Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

winterrider · 2017-04-07T15:32:52+00:00

It is neither good or bad. It just is. And a woman is entitled to any standards she wants to have. Personally, I have no problem being the one who makes the most money in a relationship provided the woman fulfills her role in the relationship. This would include taking care of herself and providing love and emotional support. Relationships are not only sex but a healthy sex life is part of a healthy relationship. I would definitely expect her to take care of me in that way as well.

the_calibre_cat · 2017-04-07T15:46:13+00:00

I don't think it's bad. Sure does suck if you're not the one hypergamying, tho.

flashbang123 · 2017-04-07T16:19:42+00:00

Video games, drugs and porn have suppressed weak men in droves - but what will be there to surprise the legions of women unwilling to date/marry down?

SeemedGood · 2017-04-07T17:04:43+00:00

It's not bad - per se. But is does lead to the objectification of men, and that's not really a great thing.

Like all of our innate behaviors and sexual strategies, it exists for the preservation and advancement of our physical beings - but we are more than just physical beings. Part of our evolutionary task is spiritual, and to the extent that we allow our innate behaviors to guide our actions as opposed to our conscious will, we starve the spiritual evolutionary process to feed the physical one.

[deleted] · 2017-04-07T19:33:37+00:00

Why is a hammer bad?

Beacuse you can hit me on the head with it

you can also build a house

Fair point

tryingmyhardest88 · 2017-04-07T20:13:52+00:00

I'm subbed to PPD, TRP, MRP etc... and to be honest, I'm sick of seeing all these opinions on how people should behave and if not how they are getting the short end of the stick. Most people don't need to go to this level. Just use your fucking common sense! Don't be a dick and don't let anyone be a dick to you either. End of story. Un-sub'd. Bye.

Pope_Lucious · 2017-04-07T23:25:35+00:00

As a man, I can say I don't find hypergamy "bad". It simply is a phenomena i work into my perspective on male/female relationships in my life. In my experience, it tends to be women who get offended when you bring up hypergamy, or deny its existence entirely.

kick6 · 2017-04-07T23:53:14+00:00

Hypergamy in a vacuum isn't bad. Hypergamy in a society of no fault divorce + cash&prizes, and uberbeta daddy government is.

FairlyNaive · 2017-04-08T13:07:33+00:00

It isnt. It encourages competition among men which leads to guys getting of their asses and getting shit done.

AutismoCircus · 2017-04-08T14:15:35+00:00

It's not bad in and of itself.

The problem is when women also want to have equal salaries (gets paid the same amount. Not talking about earnin which should be equal) . There will only be a limited amount of viable men.

The result are "Where have all the good men gone"-women.

There will be individual women who can get both but in the wider society you can't have both of those things at the same time unless there's more women then men.

Vegeta_Da_Prince · 2017-04-09T02:11:37+00:00

The only thing a woman shouldn't be hypergamous for is looks. Most women don't care about looks as long as the guy isn't ugly (despite how people insist otherwise.)

So you'd date a 5'4 110lbs japanese guy? honestly can you delusional retards just leave

[deleted] · 2017-04-09T05:22:51+00:00

Women might like the thought of hypergamy on the surface, but they don't understand that when they evade their duty and responsibility to be good to men, there is an equal reaction.

Right now there is a growing consciousness among men that women have little loyalty to us, and think of us as disposable. In my case, I was in a long term relationship where I was bailed on at the end, despite doing my part. I am not exactly a beta male either at all, she just met someone "better". No matter what kind of man you are, there will always be someone better.

The only thing that neutralizes the feeling of betrayal is reimagining women as plates for me to spin. A generation ago, a single mom/widow could find a man to adopt her child and remarry. Today, men see a woman with a kid and immediately put her in the casual sex category.

If you don't owe us anything, neither do we. You might think it makes no difference, but that's only because you take the leeway and benevolence of men for granted.

In the younger generations, I see less and less "white knight" behavior. I don't just mean the cheesy stuff, but the expected stuff, like men stepping in when a woman is in danger. Men are driving past the woman with the flat tire, looking the other way when her ex boyfriend smacks her around in public (maybe calling the cops, if that), and refusing to do anything for a woman.

Just wait for all the men under 35 to mature into this hypergamous system. Life isn't just about pleasing your pussy. It won't be 100% of men, but a good 50-60%, and women are going to notice.

cxj · 2017-04-07T19:31:21+00:00

"Bad" is a subjective moral statement. Personally, I view things more in terms of "cause/effect."

That being said, I think lots of people would subjectively consider social instability to be bad. I also think hypergamy combined with the welfare state and easy divorce leads ultimately to a highly lop sided SMP/RMP, where many men are unable to procure mates. Historically, societies with large numbers of single, young, disenfranchised young men do not end well. OTOH, societies where large numbers of women are forced to marry and breed with men they are not attracted to are quite stable, and often yield happiness for women later in life.

Title	Q4RP: Why is hypergamy in women bad?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	18
Comments	274
Date	April 7, 2017 1:21 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/640bw7/q4rp_why_is_hypergamy_in_women_bad/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/q4rp-why-is-hypergamy-in-women-bad.269032 https://theredarchive.com/post/269032

Comments