Why is confidence so much more important than other good traits like humor, kindness,etc. when it comes to dating?

Stargazer1919 · 2024-04-11T18:31:40+00:00

Just my 2 cents. But I want to be around people who I can enjoy their company and have a good time. I don't want to hang around anyone who is arrogant, or so depressed that it rubs off on other people, or who act like an asshole, or whatever.

Looks only get someone so far. It's not what long term relationships or friendships are based on.

SweelFor- · 2024-04-11T18:29:07+00:00

So when it comes to dating, it seems like the only trait that matters is confidence, whether you’re a confident kind person, or a confident asshole.

No

why do other positive traits cease to exist if you lack “confidence”

They don't

whereas any negative trait can be “ignored” if you have confidence

They don't

Shouldn’t it be on more of a spectrum

It is

I mean I don’t think bad traits like lack of empathy, mistreating others, etc. should just be ignored because the person in question is confident

They aren't

whereas on the other hand someone shouldn’t be seen as a bad partner if they lack confidence, especially if they have other traits to make up for it like a good sense of humor, kindness

They aren't

I’ve met too many assholes that do well with women for that to be true sorry

Ok. There are 8 billion people on the planet, there are combinations for everything that you can think of. Why does that matter to you?

You don't want to be with women who like assholes, so why does it matter that there are women who date assholes? You're not missing out on anything by not being with them.

You're not trying to solve truths about human existence, you're trying to solve your own life, I wrote this for you: https://old.reddit.com/r/IncelExit/comments/1ae0oyw/here_is_an_extremely_important_concept_the/

an_altar_of_plagues · 2024-04-11T18:29:29+00:00

Confidence is not the only trait that matters. I have known plenty of people who are confident but also not fun to be around. Or, people who are confident in their abilities and interests but those abilities/interests aren't something that align with mine.

Where confidence is important is simply getting your foot in the door, and as a spice to the rest of your interests. Someone who's not confident in themselves is less likely to be engaged with their interests or in social dynamics.

Simply being "confident" isn't going to make an unfunny person funny or an asshole seem nice. What it will do is making someone who is funny seem funnier, or increase the likelihood that they'll put themselves in new places.

ooa3603 · 2024-04-11T20:40:00+00:00

Lets start with your premise:

Why is confidence so much more important than other good traits like humor, kindness,etc. when it comes to dating?

It's not, according to most polls of men AND women the most important are:

Kindness (includes core values)
Intelligence (includes self awareness, emotional/empathy and general)
Sense of Humor
Confidence
Physical Attractiveness
Duty and Loyalty

Across most cultures and places these are the top traits most men and women look for in their partners. Where each of them place varies from person to person. There obviously many other traits, but all else being equal these are typically the most important.

My question is, why do other positive traits cease to exist if you lack “confidence”, whereas any negative trait can be “ignored” if you have confidence?

They don't. But it appears this way because of the way the human subconscious works under the influence of its society and the constraints of a limited lifespan.

Basically whats happening is that both men and women do not evaluate people objectively. Their environment and cognitive biases and fallacies affect people's decision making.

For example, the "halo effect". Men AND women tend use the traits they value the most to evaluate a person's other traits.

If a person highly values kindness, they will evaluate a person's other traits as higher.

If a person highly values physical attractiveness, they will evaluate a person's other traits as higher.

If a person highly values intelligence, they will evaluate a person's other traits as higher.

In addition western civilization is a society that prioritizes individualism and therefore places traits that are more individualistic (like confidence) at a premium. So people grow up in a society that emphasizes confidence. How do think that will impact how they evaluate others? Especially if you combine it with people's subconscious biases?

In societies that prioritize different things, you see other traits being emphasized.

For example, in China or Japan who's society emphasizes the collective, a partner's sense of duty is more prioritized and that affects the bias their people have when evaluating partners.

Shouldn’t it be on more of a spectrum, I mean I don’t think bad traits like lack of empathy, mistreating others, etc. should just be ignored because the person in question is confident, whereas on the other hand someone shouldn’t be seen as a bad partner if they lack confidence, especially if they have other traits to make up for it like a good sense of humor, kindness, etc.

You are one hundred percent correct, but American society is hyper-capitalistic, individualist/self-interested and only up until very recently hyper-masculine . Which means its people will have absorbed the traits associated with that in what they prioritize

You are seeing the affect that an environment that emphasizes self-centeredness has on its people's decision making.

The good news is that people who resist the influence and judge others on their own true values exist

You just need to decide to be one of them.

floracalendula · 2024-04-11T21:55:12+00:00

Which assholes are doing well with which women and what are they achieving?

Exis007 · 2024-04-11T18:41:31+00:00

So I explained it like this in another comment a while back. What does a confident man get you to do? Trust him. If I take you into my confidence, I'm trusting you to not reveal what I'm telling you. Confidence is a kind of trust. Specifically, it's a social trust in yourself or another person. If I confidently sing karaoke, there's no promise I'm a good singer. I can sing off-key just as confidently as I can sing well. My confidence isn't in my singing, necessarily, but the good nature of the audience to receive me well regardless of how well I do. Much the same, I can be a wonderful singer and be very unconfident up on stage because I do not trust the audience to be gracious and kind to me. It's not about expecting that everything will go well all the time, that you'll always be successful, or that you'll always get what you want. Confidence, when it comes to relationships, really comes down to trusting that other people will like you and receive you in the manner that you intend them to and that you'll be okay--emotionally and physically--regardless of what they throw at you. I am socially confident because I trust other people to like me well enough, to get me, to receive me well and enjoy my company. I also trust myself that if you don't, if you're a jackass or rude or you reject me, it's not going to crush my feelings in a way that will destroy me. I can extend myself comfortably and thus put myself out there enough to get to know people and create intimacy.

The reason we talk about it as foundational as opposed to innate human kindness or sense of humor or, I don't know, cooking skills is that it is pretty essential for making human connections. If you do not trust yourself to weather rejection or social faux pas or discomfort, you will withhold your authentic self from people. You're not going to put anything on the line because you don't trust that you'll be okay if it goes poorly. Inversely, if you don't trust other people to respond well to you, you're going to withhold connection because you think they'll mistreat you. Either way, you're never exchanging any realness or intimacy with anyone, because you hate yourself or you're sure they'll be a jerk to you, and so you never climb up the intimacy ladder with anyone. You give everyone a very polite, public-facing persona if you give them anything at all, and you never establish any connection. People might get along with you well enough, but real closeness, friendship, and romance hinges on that trust and intimacy you're not getting.

Arrogance, unkindness, bluntness, lack of tact, selfishness...all of those are personality flaws. I have an individual tolerance that's high for some of them, low for others. I'll like people who display some behaviors that might drive you nuts, and vice versa. Not everyone has to like and get along with everyone else. But those are, to my mind, different problems than a lack of connection. Connecting to you and not liking you is one problem. Not getting to know the real you because you're so unconfident that you won't put yourself out there is just a separate issue.

MistyMaisel · 2024-04-11T19:51:03+00:00

This is actually quite simple and I say this as some who has been friends and dated a lot of assholes. And I enjoyed the friendships immensely. I would go so far as to say I mostly want assholes for friends.

They know themselves better than anyone and even doing rotten things sometimes think they're great. Compare that to the no confidence dudes who seem to do nothing smelly, but act like they are horrid. Makes you think they're hiding something. Also makes you think you should trust them that they're horrid.
Everyone has a poopy butthole asshole side. Assholes are just honest and upfront about theirs which makes it easy to decide if you can handle it or not. Low confidence kind people tend to be lying about how they are to themselves more than you. Still can't trust someone who cannot smell their own shit.
Everyone has a kind cool side, even assholes, and in fact often especially assholes. The difference is that assholes have a standard to get to that and low confidence people give it away to everyone.
low confidence people treat everyone the same generally, and then are surprised to receive that same low level of investment/ low tier interest/ low tier kindness in return. Assholes aren't making this mistake. They treat people differently. So their kindness reads as special, not generic. You know they can do the other thing and they aren't.
Low confidence people tend to lack a spine and will stand for nothing, so their loyalty means very little and comes with very little benefit.
Assholes have a spine by their very nature. So if they stand for you, that means something and you know they have some goods to back that up.
Assholes generally respond very very well to special treatment because most assholes are assholes because they've never felt treated specially. They tend to feel instantly judged and dismissed by the majority of people who they're typically triggering with their confidence mixed with a difficult attitude.
It isn't very kind if you're doing it to someone who you want something from, is it? It's a little kind, but not very kind. You've got an agenda and goals this forward. As in, they aren't as good as they're claiming in this particular scenario.
I haven't met many low confidence funny people, just being honest. It takes confidence to tell the joke or say the clever thing usually.

SufficientDot4099 · 2024-04-12T04:47:42+00:00

Because human brains are flawed and have cognitive biases. Most people see other people being confident and just assume that the confident person is confident for a good reason. Most people hear someone say something confidently and just believe that what they say must be true, even if it is totally incorrect. This is how Donald Trump became so popular. It's just human nature, and human nature isn't perfect.

tallonqsack · 2024-04-12T06:08:27+00:00

It’s not more important. I’m not sure why the trope of such advice “confidence is attractive” exists other than the fact that maybe it just means showing your personality? If your personality is kind, funny, etc, you only show that if you’re “confident” enough to do so- I guess…I think this is based on the misunderstanding between bravado/cockyness & self assuredness or like, earnestness. I do believe in the advice of “just be yourself” although that’s easier said than done of course and I think it often gets lost with men’s discussions the fact that women also get nervous with dating and getting to know each other is always a process of becoming closer & closer with one another- you’re not each an open book off the bat, and of course there are social norms for interactions. Being polite is still important but ya, it’s about forging genuine connections with people over time.

GotThaAcid5tab · 2024-04-12T09:35:58+00:00

No no no… when you have true confidence, the other stuff like humour and kindness is a byproduct of that. Confidence is not being a big tough guy or a rude/arrogant ass, it’s being unapologetically genuine in who you are. Self acceptance is the key.

markd315 · 2024-04-12T21:50:20+00:00

I think confidence is highly predictive of success.

People tend to go after traits that are highly predictive of success.

Don't think it's more complicated than that.

In my experience there's rarely any reason to not project confidence.

Nuclearwaifu · 2024-06-10T09:19:31+00:00

Because confidence signals that you are healthy enough in yourself that you will not depend too terribly on others and become burdensome at least that‘s my theory. I‘m generally not a fan of animal comparisons but from a evolutionary perspective I‘d assume that it also ties into maturity. The less you depend on someone emotionally or physically the more mature you come off as and ppl seek that kind of stability out. But in general, i think that confidence in itself is just a thing that makes you not care too much leading you to come off more natural, self assured and enjoyable to be around with. That is also why socipaths are so charming cause their confidence is really high cause they lack the capacity to care about other people and their feelings and opinions.

FastCardiologist6128 · 2024-04-11T18:25:41+00:00

In my opinion it has to do with attraction and perceived value of the other person. Even men often prefer a mid woman who is popular and confident to an insecure pretty girl who doesn't dress well and is seen as a loser.

The human psyche is weird and gets tricked easily, it's the same with marketing: people would rather buy a low quality product who has a lot of hype around it and good marketing than a high quality product that is boring and doesn't appear special.

People don't only need to be a high quality product (kind and loving), they also need to be able to sell themselves well to the world and market themselves well.

Also we humans tend to see others how they see themselves. So if you see yourself as a catch and carry yourself as one, other people will perceive you as such.

I think the same goes for friendships. We tend to gravitate towards people with more charisma, because we are drawn to those who have traits we would like to have ourselves. Everyone wants to be happy, charismatic and confident, so we wre drawn towards those people.

AssistTemporary8422 · 2024-04-11T20:44:59+00:00

So when it comes to dating, it seems like the only trait that matters is confidence

No a very large number of traits are involved with dating and different women have different preferences. For example looks, flirting, sense of humor, etc. But I will agree that confidence is an important trait.

My question is, why do other positive traits cease to exist if you lack “confidence”, whereas any negative trait can be “ignored” if you have confidence?

Would you buy a product from a salesman when he doesn't like his own product? So why would like someone expect to be liked when he visibly doesn't like himself? Many people just take his word for it and figure he must have a good reason for not believing in himself.

Also this lack of confidence comes from bad past experiences and that brings up the question what is this person doing wrong that has caused these bad experiences. Additionally lack of confidence indicates someone may struggle in basic things like their lives, and confidence is an indicator of competence. Being nice is great but being able to function in life is probably more important. Lack of confidence hints that they might have mental health issues.

Raging_Dragon_9999 · 2024-04-12T01:45:28+00:00

BEcause confidence is the net result of several other personality traits that are fun and pleasant to be around. Working on your confidence transforms your whole personality.

WEBENGi · 2024-04-12T14:21:20+00:00

Confidence can come and go depending on what you are confident in. You might not be confident with telling a story but you might be confident when explaining math. It is based on the strength in your beliefs.

Abstractly speaking, how would someone know what they are getting if you aren't confident in saying who you are? Like how does a joke come across if you act like you aren't sure it's even funny?

But In the most common case, if someone is looking for someone to introduce fun into their life and take them on an adventure, how does it sound if you have no ideas of what to do?

In actuality you might have confidence in some of these things, so pinpointing more specific things might help with self improvement.

But no one needs to be perfect and cliche way to summarize my point is "be yourself" and you should probably at least have some confidence in existing as yourself.

Personal_Dirt3089 · 2024-04-12T17:23:48+00:00

It's easier to find after you talk to more people and notice that you, yourself, are way more comfortable around confident people.

I mean actual confidence, not someone that brags about things that are not real.

ThePenguinQuack · 2024-04-11T18:30:08+00:00

Humans are very intelligent apes with a great capability for self-reflection and self-control. But we still are to a large extent controlled by our primal urges and our lizard brains. Just like men look for traits that indicate good motherly qualities in women, women still are instictively drawn to men that indicate an ability to protect them. But both men and women are also capable of self-reflection and can recognize that this isn't necessarily what is actually important in a partner. But I honestly believe it's a hard-wired preference for most women, just like most men have their own hard-wired preferences.

Title	Why is confidence so much more important than other good traits like humor, kindness,etc. when it comes to dating?
Author	AlphaTrion2628
Upvotes	30
Comments	67
Date	April 11, 2024 6:05 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/1c1lr7t/why_is_confidence_so_much_more_important_than/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/why-is-confidence-so-much-more-important-than.1514733 https://theredarchive.com/post/1514733

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