CMV: Natural alphas are nicer than less attractive men, most of the time.

PIBagent · 2016-07-27T03:05:22+00:00

It's called the halo effect, you see people who you are attracted to in a more positive light. Inversely someone who you are repulsed by you will see in a more negative light. I'm sure the guy isn't treating you any differently than he would anyone else.

99_Problem · 2016-07-27T06:06:06+00:00

It's like attractive, socially well-adjusted people are attractive and socially well-adjusted ... or something.

lollygagyo · 2016-07-27T03:03:46+00:00

Yeah, insecurity fucks people up and makes them behave in really unpleasant ways. Having a natural leg up in the world -- ie not having any reason to be insecure -- does generally make you more pleasant to be around. It also makes you a touch self-involved and you can wind up really arrogant if you don't have the kind of upbringing that tempers egotism.

This is true amongst women as well, imo. It's the 'second tier beauties' (girls who have to try really, really hard to be pretty and base a lot of their worth on that) who are the least pleasant, ime. And the most judgmental of other women & men.

[deleted] · 2016-08-02T06:48:08+00:00

[permanently deleted]

stats135 · 2016-07-27T06:08:26+00:00

I think the issue boils down to if you view "nicer" on an absolute or relative scale. Who is "nicer," someone who was born a millionaire giving $10 to charity or someone with $10 to their name giving $5 to charity? On an absolute scale the millionaire was more generous, he gave double what the poor guy did, but on a relative scale the poor guy is more generous as he gave 50% of his money while the millionaire only gave a 0.001% of his money.

The natural alpha did not have to spend any time, energy, or money on getting his physiological need for sex met. For him to humor you, it cost him basically nothing. For your average beta and self-made alpha that had to spend a sizable amount of resources to get his needs met, that is not the case.

scrantonic1ty · 2016-07-27T07:50:14+00:00

I'm tired of saying this again and again but "natural alphas" are not nice people. They behave exactly as they please and don't give a shit about consequence. To care about social consequence is itself a beta trait.

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T08:35:55+00:00

Incoming CMV claiming that "the hottest and most attractive women are more moral, just, and amazing than ugly or average women, most of the time."

Dangerous but predictable viewpoints all around.

Halo Effect kicks ass, no doubt.

Entropy-7 · 2016-07-27T03:16:14+00:00

At least two of my closest friends would qualify as "natural alphas" and they are really good guys. They are both blue pill and have ended up in committed relationships with really great women.

One is about 6'2", of German stock with that whole blonde Viking look going for him. Not the sharpest pencil in the box but his natural charisma has lead him into a good career as an account manager at a business services firm. He married a hot, little Brazilian woman as a marriage of convenience so she could stay in the country but now 20 years later they are still going strong, but no kids.

The other guy is 6'1" and Italian. He is whip smart but only did one year of university before saying "fuck this". He currently has a business designing high end furniture, but before that he was a movie producer and before that a magazine publisher. He lives with his flamenco dancer girlfriend and they have a young daughter together and he is planning on buying a villa in Tuscany to retire to.

Both super great guys who - if they decided to be players - could slay to no end. I have had more and better looking girlfriends than they have had but both are effectively married and I am not, so there you go.

However, #2 was also my business partner back over 20 years ago and - to say the least - he is fucking intense. In any situation, there are two ways to do things: his way, and the wrong way. Plus he is extremely extroverted while I am very introverted. We were roommates and that drove me a bit crazy because we spent between 8 and 12 hours a day working together on our business and then I would retire to my room in our apartment and within 10 minutes he would be knocking on my door asking what's up because he could not stand not having another person around.

This may also be why you see a lot of alpha men over 35 dating and marrying women their own age. When they were young they had sex and got the attention of plenty of teenaged girls, so they grew out of putting them on a pedestal. When they get older they want a woman with looks AND a brain, which is why they get with women their own age.

I've known both these guys since we were 15 years old, so that is going on 35 years now, and back in the day they simply didn't care about girls. Lots of girls had the hots for the them but for whatever reason they just didn't bother. Seriously, my little sister pined about Viking boy and my mother - being something of a cougar - expressed in very careful terms that Italian guy was a rather strapping young lad.

Both of them just sort of stumbled into relationships without actively trying. Both of them ultimately settled on looks rather than brains. Their SOs are not stupid or bimbos by any measure but they are certainly no match for me or the circle of friends I built later when I did post grad studies (as opposed to these guys and my other friends from high school).

The Viking married a women a few years older; the Italian is with a girl several years younger (maybe a dozen or so, I am not sure).

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T03:45:17+00:00

Yes. Chad's not a sad, bad, mad lad.

disposable_pants · 2016-07-27T07:47:58+00:00

You're seeing what you want to see -- you want to believe that nice people are attractive, because nice people deserve to have the success attractiveness breeds. It's the Just World Fallacy. There are many natural alphas who are complete dicks; I'll show you why.

People respond to incentives, right? Look at the incentives for attractive men vs. average/unattractive men:

Attractive men are going to get female attention no matter what. Unless they live in an extremely small community, they aren't going to run out of women who are sexually interested in them any time soon. Even if they're a bad person who treats partners like shit, that's not written on their forehead -- it's going to take a while for them to show their true colors. In the meantime they can get laid. So where's their incentive to be nice? They can do whatever they want and never materially affect the supply of potential partners available to them.
Average/unattractive men rarely get unsolicited female attention -- they have to work to attract any potential partners. Their supply of potential partners is far smaller than that of an attractive man; small enough that each woman who will seriously consider their advances is far more valuable to them than any given woman is to an attractive man. If an average/unattractive man screws up with his current date he can't count on being able to go out to the bar on Friday and find a few other potential partners (he may not even be able to find one). He has a huge incentive to be nice because he doesn't want to foolishly drive away one of the few women who will reciprocate his interest.

The presence of some natural alphas who are nice doesn't change these incentive structures. Broadly speaking, alphas are going to behave worse because they can get away with it. The average man is going to behave better because pissing off his date means he might not get laid for a few months.

lbspredh · 2016-07-27T06:00:37+00:00

A lot of people who grow up with a lot of money or are just generally a bit spoiled turn out really nice because they never face any adversity ever, conversely a lot turn out like spoilt shits who feel entitled to everything and have no qualms about demanding it.

This is probably the same of people and sexual charisma, some are really nice, some are outright horrible, on the other hand people without this can grow up humble and grow real character and learn to make the most of what they have or turn into spiteful shits who want revenge on the world for all the BS they put up with, so yeah I'd challenge the certainty of your view people react to different situations in very different ways

I'd say acting like a total shit is equally prevalent across every demographic

lurfly · 2016-07-27T02:54:23+00:00

Yeah. Last paragraph illustrates a good point though, which is that men who are natural alphas fall into the marriage trap worse than anyone else.

The guys who are good (even mediocre) with women always portray themselves as the nice, fun guy you described. I have a good friend who does everything you described. Will be nice, crack jokes and make a girl laugh and then 5 minutes later turn around and show his friends her nudes and make fun of her. Him and his friends are the most popular kids in the biggest school in my state.

A lot of those type of guys may portray themselves as nice, but their true selves may not always reflect that. Not necessarily in this case, but in general.

GaiusScaevolus · 2016-07-27T03:53:45+00:00

There's an attractiveness bias at play here, but you aren't necessarily wrong. I'd imagine it's similar to how 9s are usually relatively friendly, down to earth chicks, but a 6-7 tends to be rude and somewhat stuck up.

MarriedLifter · 2016-07-27T04:40:39+00:00

I remember that many of the most popular jocks in high school had this weird mix of being friendly guys and total assholes. One day they might be surprisingly nice; another day they might try to beat somebody up.

Of course, some nerds can also be pretty obnoxious when you wouldn't have expected it, but that's not news to anybody on Reddit.

louplop · 2016-07-27T05:45:35+00:00

One question to change your view : Do you treat people the same way ?

Nice behaviors call nice behaviors..... There are asshole et good guy in all shape and attractiveness. And FYI.... at 35 women don't necesserly have a brain. You know why I generally don't date woman my age and go as down as 9 years younger? Because I do look younger and I have more interested/sucess with younger women. Nothing against women my age or older. And guess what.... I still want a brain in side a potential gf :)

DrunkGirl69 · 2016-07-27T03:22:05+00:00

There's no automod! I can't CYV because I agree: CHAD IS BLUE PILL! Chad likes women and is kind to them because they love him and are good to him so why wouldn't he be nice? All of the hottest guys I know are also really nice people. I spent my college years with attractive athletes and they were great friends who legitimately liked hanging out with women. I also noticed that many if not most of the top guys really preferred monogamous relationships (with the top hottest girls of course) and would be in them most of the time.

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T03:36:23+00:00

The Halo Effect: The thread

hakosua · 2016-07-27T04:20:23+00:00

I really like your point about alphas not having cultivated the same resentment towards women. But I'm still reluctantly siding with a lot of the RP posters: alphas seem no nicer than other guys.

I mean, are we defining alphas as fearless as well as attractive? Fear serves an important purpose, inhibiting us from doing all the dangerous fun stuff. So, if you're fearless, you most likely to make risky decisions. I therefore like to conflate "alpha" with "bad boy."

They might be nice or they might not be. They're flexible because fear hasn't wedded them to any one single way of relating to people. They behave unpredictably, the same as sexy women do. That's part of what makes them sexy.

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T09:44:14+00:00

I agree with OP and it goes beyond the halo effect, people who are angry at the world just tend to be nasty. Even neo-Nazis and Islamic extremists tend to be poor and stupid rather than respected pillars of the community.

My one area of disagreement is this:

This may also be why you see a lot of alpha men over 35 dating and marrying women their own age. When they were young they had sex and got the attention of plenty of teenaged girls, so they grew out of putting them on a pedestal. When they get older they want a woman with looks AND a brain, which is why they get with women their own age.

Just because a woman is young doesn't mean she's less intelligent and just because she's old, doesn't mean she's wise.

despisedlove2 · 2016-07-27T02:09:59+00:00

Given that emotional manipulation is part of the dark triad behavior that defines an alpha, you may well be right.

betterdeadthanbeta · 2016-07-27T04:36:54+00:00

The alpha guys were never mean to you because you were invisible to them. This was because you were unattractive (sorry but its obvious from your OP, having a pity date, comparing yourself to Carrie etc.)

You were beneath contempt because you were beneath notice, except to the less attractive guys who felt you were in their league. You didn't think you were though, because like every unattractive chick you were too busy pining for Chad's cock, even while deep down knowing he would always be Stacy Cheerleader's.

Another case solved thx to BDTB, the Sherlock of Sexual Strategy. No need to thank me folks. Calling a woman ugly is its own reward.

redmachines · 2016-07-27T02:37:39+00:00

Damn. Look at all those mental gymnastics to show that manipulative "alphas" are somehow better people than the average man. BTW Why did this man take you (a fat girl at the time) out over other women if he was such a player? Perhaps you were so crazy about him, that you started to project falsehoods about this man's character and popularity. Goes to show you that looks>>>>>>everything.

Princeso_Bubblegum · 2016-07-27T03:56:41+00:00

Such people exist, but in such small numbers its insane. I think I have met like 3 people like this in my life. I've met more transgender people in contrast without looking for them.

literallyhere · 2016-07-27T09:27:24+00:00

??? I'm not sure if I've actually ever held a conversation with an "alpha" guy. There seem to be many different definitions. I can think of maybe one guy, and he seemed alright. He thought I might've been a lesbian but that seemed more ignorant than rude. There was one sort of popular boy in middle school that teased/bullied me but I don't know if he would count as alpha. In terms of attractiveness, I haven't seen much of a difference between ugly, average, and attractive guys and niceness.

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T10:50:37+00:00

It often depends on the amount of time you spent with people.

It's easy to be super-nice to people you meet occasionally.

exit_sandman · 2016-07-27T15:07:34+00:00

So you're basing your assumption on one guy you knew who happened to be both popular and nice? Uhuh.

Maybe it's because alpha guys have never had a problem with women, so they've never had a reason to be misogynist?

I know quite a bunch of guys who have been very successful with women and as a consequence came to think less of them because they realized how basic and plain they were on average.

FatTaker · 2016-07-27T20:55:10+00:00

I don't know whether good looking people are kinder than less attractive people. We'd have to look at statistics to be sure. However, my experience doesn't correspond to yours. In my life, I haven't really found a correlation between looks and character. Inner beauty exists.

It's easy to come up with a reason to why attractive people should be nicer than the less attractive ones, but it's also easy to find a reason for the opposite. You could say hot guys are better because they are happy, while ugly guys are mean and bitter. And a girl with the opposite experience could say ugly guys are better because they are more humble, while hot guys are spoiled and used to getting away with everything. Both explanations make sense and don't prove anything.

[deleted] · 2016-07-28T08:44:23+00:00

Fulfilled people are happier and nicer. Yes.

[deleted] · 2016-07-29T07:57:14+00:00

Yes they seem nicer to you due to the halo effect. In reality many of these guys are total knuckle draggers and thugs. You seriously do not have a clue if you think that alpha males are nice guys, women do not fuck nice guys

[deleted] · 2016-07-27T03:54:06+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	CMV: Natural alphas are nicer than less attractive men, most of the time.
Author	originofsex
Upvotes	8
Comments	113
Date	July 27, 2016 1:27 AM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/4us5h4/cmv_natural_alphas_are_nicer_than_less_attractive/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-natural-alphas-are-nicer-than-less-attractive.273868 https://theredarchive.com/post/273868

Comments