Women see men as pure utility

thechairinfront · 2015-03-23T16:27:48+00:00

This is why women have no sympathy or empathy for men.

What? At all? At any time? Ever? Really?

GridReXX · 2015-03-23T14:28:35+00:00

And men see women as...? You sound like a feminist shaking your fist at reality. The humans only care about each other for specific things. Get over it. No one will love you "for you", not as a man, not as a woman, not as a friend. The world is not your mom

belletaco · 2015-03-23T19:47:51+00:00

This sounds more like a personal problem than you actually wanting to debate.

placenta_jerky · 2015-03-23T23:33:58+00:00

Wait, I dont? Hmmm.

tomatostew · 2015-03-23T16:07:16+00:00

women as a group feel absolutely nothing for men? Doesn't that seem like kind of a stretch?

There are countless women that would understand/ empathize with being a "workhorse". Just as there are men that support others, there are women that support families without a man. Maybe I could see your point of view as somewhat understandable decades ago, but times have changed and struggles are more similar than ever before.

cxj · 2015-03-23T23:00:44+00:00

This is not true to the extent that you and TRP believe. When I was falsely accused of domestic battery, I had over 10 female witnesses show up to my trial ready to testify that they had been in an intimate relationship with me and I was not, in fact, violent. I had treated many, if not most of these girls, quite poorly. A couple of them flat out said "yeah you are a piece of shit, but you aren't THAT bad. You do not deserve this, this girl knew what she was getting into dating you, and is going way overboard with her revenge."

philomexa · 2015-03-23T14:57:27+00:00

AS opposed to what, some men viewing women as walking sex holes/walking wombs?

Like, what is the point of this, other than advertising your extremely chaffed ass?

theory_of_kink · 2015-03-23T18:54:29+00:00

If a friend said this to me face to face in a bar I would assume they were having some kind of crisis deeper than falling out with their partner.

Seems like the issues go deeper than just women but a kind of philosophical issue with the world in general.

Sure you can reduce the world to transactions between lover, friends and family. But when you see no value in a human life than its utility then you break with society.

[deleted] · 2015-03-23T22:43:15+00:00

Yet so many women sacrifice their career, social life, freedom, body and sometimes health to bear men children.

BlitheCynic · 2015-03-23T23:04:34+00:00

This guy is trolling guys. Like legit old-school trolling. Leave it.

rulenumber303 · 2015-03-23T15:42:36+00:00

Well don't be fucking useless then and we'll get on fine?

RobotPartsCorp · 2015-03-23T17:20:19+00:00

None of this resonates with me nor applies to anyone associate with. Who is your demographic? For one thing, most couples I know are both working, one isn't using the other for anything. Even some couples I know where the guy is a stay-at-home parents or the primary parent and the mom has a high-powered job. I wouldn't say either is using each other in that case as they both are bringing value to their family. So I just want to know who your assumptions actually apply to?

PM_ME_UR_PRETTY_PINK · 2015-03-23T18:06:18+00:00

What kind of sympathy and empathy are we talking about?

GridReXX · 2015-03-23T16:42:37+00:00

They see men as a means to an end, be it validation, sex, or resources.

And men see women as a means to end, be it validation, an ego boost, a warm hole, or a home made meal?

What is your point?

We all have woes.

BlitheCynic · 2015-03-23T22:54:14+00:00

I don't think I can change your view because your view seems wrapped up in a whole bunch of truly fucked-up assumptions that would probably be best worked through with a therapist, but here goes:

women have no sympathy or empathy for men.

I am a woman and probably two of my favorite people in the world are my father and younger brother. I routinely listen to my father rant about his problems for no reason other than that I know he needs to vent, so that's sympathy. My dad and I are also pretty receptive to each other's thoughts and do nice things for each other all the time, so that's empathy. My brother is one of my best buddies and we generally have each other's backs. I also let my ex-boyfriend move in with me for five months (while we were still dating) to help him get away from his abusive roommate even though I put a lot of emphasis on personal space and would ideally have not been living with him. I think that constitutes empathy. So there's some objection by counterexample - an anecdotal rejection of an unscientific claim.

This is why women don't give a fuck about the struggles of a man.

Except for RPWs, female MRAs, and women who support egalitarianism.

They see men as a means to an end, be it validation, sex, or resources.

It is worth asking yourself - what DO you want? How DO you want to be seen? What do you want from us? I don't know what kind of women you have dealt with in your life, but it is always possible to argue that someone is using you, no matter what they do - "Oh, she just hangs out with me because she enjoys it", "Oh he only loves me because he needs me." What does it actually mean to see someone as an end? What do you require? Are you holding women to an impossible standard?

CursedLemon · 2015-03-23T14:38:57+00:00

That's pretty much how I'd feel if I was under direct subjugation for...all of humanity's history up until roughly the last century.

thereddespair · 2015-03-23T19:09:48+00:00

Men are no different. That is the nature of everybody. To say men do not is hypocritical.

taiboworks · 2015-03-23T14:26:59+00:00

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=118736

[deleted] · 2015-03-23T17:23:55+00:00

ummm, that's not true at all. There are a shit ton of women in my life who have sympathy and empathy for me and other men (I identify as genderqueer, but in your mind I am probably a man)

cuittler · 2015-03-23T15:43:04+00:00

Humans, as animals, are selfish by nature. We do things because there's something for us in there and, while this is considered something negative, I think it's just natural. I think it's better for one's mental sanity, to accept this fact and act according to it. The "attraction can't be negotiated" tenet is brilliant in this regard. As simple as that.

We're not friends with random people, we don't start relationships with random people, there's always something there for us.

Why, from a red pill point of view, may it seem that women only see men as utility? I agree that, at a very basic and primal level, "women are, men do", so what a woman wants, from a selfish human point of view, is what a man does, his utility, not what he is. Society, as a whole, seems to follow this motion and that includes men as well. The "empathy gap" is real.

In the other hand, men pay more attention to what the woman is, so in example, their physical attractiveness would become her utility.

So, I don't think I can change your view here, but maybe I can help you to see it from a different perspective. In the end, we all see others for their utility. A woman's attractiveness is her utility, in a way. Society, as a whole, will also care only about your utility.

So, I'd say that it's not that women see men as pure utility, is that humans, as animal beings, only see others as utility, but it takes different forms. A man is what he does, a woman what she is, but in either case, we only care about what we can get from them.

emptypillbox · 2015-03-24T01:30:21+00:00

Here's a philosophical take. Let's assume men and women are definitively different in their experiences. Then we have a problem akin to Nagel's, "What is it like to be a bat?", where he describes the impossibility of ever knowing what it is like to be a bat while we are a human (that is, even if we became a bat, and then got turned back into a human, our human mind would interpret our memories/experiences differently to the bat mind).

With this problem, if men and women are so different, then it is impossible for men to know what it is like to be a woman, and so impossible to know whether or not a woman has empathy for a man.

...except, if it is impossible for a man to imagine himself as a woman, then men can't empathise with women by definition, and vice versa. So in this hypothetical, no one can empathise with anyone else - which makes any results where we correctly assess what someone else is thinking highly unjustified.

On the other hand, if men and women are similar enough to imagine being in each other's places, then they can empathise, and the question is whether or not they do. Now, in the absence of hard data (I don't have access to any results that suggest women have selective sociopathy/psychopathy based upon gender, and you haven't provided any), we could simply take an approach that acknowledges that at least one person reports that women have no empathy towards men (that's you), and at least one person reports that they do (that's me). I'm sure if we asked around a few women as well, we'd probably find at least one of each answer.

With the equal presumption that we're not lying and with the equal likelihood that we're mistaken (this, because we have no hard data, we are just going to work through as a logical puzzle), we'll find that if our reports are accurate then it is probable that some women, at least some of the time, have empathy for men, and some women, at least some of the time, don't. Without access to hard data any more than our minimal case studies, we can't throw out one report as rubbish without throwing out the other, as they have the same empirical justification (in this case, self-reporting).

So I would suggest that it is likely that women can and do empathise with men, which, to me, suggests that they do not see men as pure utility.

Curiously, I made a thread called "Moral Value of a Person", and the responses generally indicated that RPers in general define others (men and women) by their utility.

Edit: forgot to add non-participation link. Sorry.

nermalsweater · 2015-03-24T02:58:06+00:00

This seems like something that should be on r/im14andthisisdeep. All I see is a bunch of whiny terpers who have no life experience in a sensual circlejerk.

TheHeroReditDeserves · 2015-03-24T04:22:25+00:00

FullRedvolution are you sure your not a women ?

LUClEN · 2015-03-23T19:27:53+00:00

Everyone sees everyone else as utility. This is like the most primary tenet of economics.

Title	Women see men as pure utility
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	3
Comments	248
Date	March 23, 2015 2:17 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/300hoh/women_see_men_as_pure_utility/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/women-see-men-as-pure-utility.283027 https://theredarchive.com/post/283027

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