I overheard this fellow in his late 40s/early 50s chatting with a friend the other day. It was a story as old as time. Had I heard it 15 years ago I'd have been outraged, but hearing it this week was just a sad reminder that not everybody has read TRP and many men still believe the fairy tale lies.
The man illustrates a bitter, emotional divorce after almost 30 years together with multiple college-aged children. She had been cheating on him, in his bed, for the better part of year without his knowing.
The sad part, hearing this story, is his surprise that suddenly this woman that he thought he knew was operating under a completely different set of rules, and that she appeared to him to be a completely different person.
He still believed in morality and justice. Why would she act contrary to the promises she made? It just didn't make sense to him. The shock from this revelation will stay with him, likely until his time is over. The actors in his life he believed to be rational were anything but, and suddenly he is forced to acknowledge he doesn't understand the rules.
He described the all-too-common behavior of her re-labelling past events. I swear you could interchange every god damn woman in this scenario:
- She says she never truly loved me.
- She says one time, when we had sex and she was unenthusiastic about it three years ago, was actually rape now.
- She says I'm defective and only think about me.
- If she had just come clean when she first cheated I'd have been able to work with her to move past it!
- I asked her what she wanted, I told her we could fix it!
- I swear I don't recognize her anymore. She has a dead look in her eyes.
- Her behavior is so completely different it's like she's had an episode!
- She isn't even trying to end this amicably.
The pleading and negotiating is classic in blue pill conditioned men. The redefining of past events- well, anybody here who has been in a relationship or read the side bar can pin-point this as the lightswitch effect.
If you haven't read that, you should.
This woman blew up a family, upgraded to a new cock, justified all her actions to protect her ego, and did so with zero remorse or consideration for any of the lives she affected. Her husband, her kids, anybody.
And this 50ish year old man is surprised by all of these behaviors and helpless to prevent or stop it. He has never heard of any of this before... because it would have been misogyny to tell him.
Remember that is the opposition's position.
This man's blue pill conditioning made him a perfect stooge for her hypergamy to do its thing. He was used and discarded and she optimized her strategy.
If you don't marry, you can't go through a divorce. Remember that. Everyone. There is not scenario that exists where you can get married and not expose yourself to this.
It may or may not be 50% of marriages that end in divorce, but 100% of divorces begin with marriage.
And of those 50% around 85% are initiated by women.
They also instigate the man to initiate it (this is behind a certain % of man-initiated divorces) by acting rudely and bitchily on purpose (to break-up without "appearing" as they want to break-up. Remember that responsibility-shifting is a core part of their programmed behavioral firmware).
Absolutely true. Exactly what happened to me.
Also known as "killing the puppy".
I think the remaining 15% are alpha males that know they can get a better pussy, a beta male would never take that risk. Too much to lose.
I remember reading that's it's around 70%.
100% of deaths begin with life fellas. Don't get a life.
Ps. I understand that marriage is a controversial issue on the redpill and certainly it seems better for a man not to marry according to current legislation. (I won't be getting married). That doesn't mean that something like marriage used to be would be good to eventually recreate when society is ready (10+ years at the least), as it is the best model for producing healthy children.
Controversial? What's controversial? Don't do it. It's that simple.
Seriously how the fuck did this turn into people trying to justify marriage? NO! MARRIAGE IS NEVER THE RIGHT CHOICE.
I thought this was universally clear here...
Men like to try to fix things. It's a natural state. Unfortunately, too many men are trying to fix their shackles.
I'm with you that you should never get married. However, there are men here in the unfortunate position of having been married before ever knowing that there was such a thing as TRP. RP concepts may still be useful to them in either managing their present condition or in fighting their way out of it.
Marriage is the only correct choice in the long run, especially if you want to have kids.
Just don’t go into it blind.
Marriage as it was prior to gradually being destroyed from the 60s was a good for society, and for children. So if parents cared about being good for children; then it was good for men and women too.
I agree that one should not do it now, but it's not bad to have a decent perspective about WHY it's BECOME bad.
It was still a profoundly blue pill institution. Do you want to be a leader or a workhorse? Let's the proles do the shit work.
Why should one care what's good or not good for society though?
Forgive me as I don't remember where I got this from:
Marriage would not be a big deal if they just change the divorce laws honestly. They are still using laws from what? Late 1800s or something where women didn't work.
Times have changed drastically since then so there is no need for alimony or child support (meaning the woman gets more than what she needs).
I watched a joe rogan podacst and he said the biggest thing that will flip this on its head is to leaglize prostituion. If a man can get laid for a couple hundred bucks from a pro that is tested for disease and stuff, men will stop marrying. The women will panic because they will lose all their power. They can't control his sex and threaten to take half his possessions. He said they would get their shit back in line in no time. Kind of made sense.
They will change the divorce laws (and court attitudes, even more. Because the letter of laws is fair, it's just they are applied in a patently anti-male wise) when males organize and apply enough pressure to counter the anti-male legal violence.
I don't see it coming, because alphas mind their own business, and betas are enamoured with their bondage.
Not to mention that women are not only working but on the ascent in the West. In the USA, women dominate education and are on a clear trajectory to dominate the high-paying positions in the work world. They don't need help.
Fuck you and your italicized disclaimers.
Bad comparison.
You can have the same type of relationship with a woman without the legal contract entitling her to half your assets upon failure or reneging of one party.
Exactly. Marriage is like making a bet on a football game. If your team wins, you gain nothing. If their team wins, you lose half your shit.
Nobody would make that bet...
But that didn't happen prior to what I would call the legal destruction of marriage.
Before 1969 the United States did not have no-fault divorce and would regard one of the parties as being responsible for the divorce. That means that if a partner cheats, that partner is responsible for the breach of contract and would not be rewarded for it.
And of course the precedent of throwing out prenuptial agreements is another.
It was a deliberate, sustained and concerted attack on marriage. When we use the word marriage now it really doesn't mean the same thing as it meant decades ago. Current marriage law could be more appropriately called female subsidy. Prior marriage law, though I'm sure not perfect in a number of ways, was at least a contract where parties traded responsibilities to the other. (Which if you really reduce it down becomes a trade of resources for fertility).
Note that even without a signed marriage contract if you live together you run financial (and property) perils. Inform yourself well with a qualified, male, non-brainwashed lawyer before moving to live with someone even without marriage.
(Things change by state, too, if you are in the US).
This is just a matter of time until the courts treat women that were in a long term relationship, living together for over a year, as being married with similar rights, aka maintenance. White knights will champion it as transferring the financial support from the system paying to the man that worked the system and wouldn't "man" up and marry her. Women will give lots of Facebook likes and maybe a kiss on the cheek.
Source: Germany can require maintenance payments to non-married women that have children.
You can get child support if you're not married. You can't get alimony and there's no splitting of assets, however.
You cam also be common law married and it depends on the state you live in.
Bottom line when you get married or have kids you're betting some money on a woman's hypergamy. But for now if you want kids you have to go through a woman to get them.
If a man could gain control over life, death or divorce then I would see your point. The only thing we do control is marriage.
100% of jobs end with either being fired, quitting or retiring.
Don't get a job, fellas.
You're having a real hard time drawing similar analogies aren't you ?
That's actually not a bad idea. Jobs are needed to maintain the social structure. If people stopped getting jobs en masse, that would collapse the system.
But you have control over your job. You can self employ if nothing else. You have NO control over death or divorce. Besides retirement sounds pretty good.
Getting married is not a job. It is a total lifestyle. A job provides money for time that you work. A wife is obligated to provide NOTHING. EVER. She has NO LEGAL OBLIGATIONS IN MARRIAGE WHATSOEVER.
Marriage is not a contract. It is a lifetime indentured servant contract offered with a false promise of sex. Once safely married, the women cuts off that false promise and because she is not obligated in any way to her husband the husband has absolutely no recourse. None. Then the woman realizing her power is total becomes less and less attracted to the helpless, powerless buffoon that she married.
Checkmate.
Great analogy! Oh wait....you walk away from a job after 30 years having been paid, what, $2million+ You don't have to give them the money back when you leave!
You’re responding to the wrong post.
If you don't understand why marriage won't have a miraculous revival, then you have a lot of theory reading to do.
Not a miraculous one. But it got its revival in China after the worst horrors of communism. It tends to require very harsh times first to go back to simple sensible ideas. And it very much looks to me that most countries in the west stand to face harsh times.
damn son you an eternal optimist
I think in 4 or 5 decades is likelier. But earliest possible point? 1 decade.
It's certainly not in line with Red Pill, which is where we are right now. If you can't next her the instant she steps out of line then you've swallowed the blue pill and given up that power.
Having said that, there are a ton of tax breaks in the UK for getting married. Insurance is cheaper. Kids are probably the biggest reason, you can't even take them the dentist to have their teeth out under anaesthetic unless you're married. Even if you don't get married she can still get half of everything if she's been seen as contributing to the household.
So you can say it's right for you if you like. But you have to admit you're taking the blue pill here.
I said I won't be getting married. I was posting my long term view of where society should take marriage in a place where leaders are and aspiring leaders are.
Sadly that's not even true. Common law marriage isn't even a marriage, other than it's name. You can still get divorce raped just for living with a woman for a period of time without marrying her.
The problem is men think women aren't playing to win. Or they think their particular woman isn't participating in the battle of the sexes.
They are. She is. Get your mind right before you get trampled.
And be careful living with them, you can still get snagged. CHECK THE LAWS of your state. Spend a few $$$ and check with a lawyer if need be. It'll beat paying $$$$$$$$$$ to her.
I think this is more hyperbole than truth, just from my research. Most states don't recognize this and, for those that do, the one wanting to prove common law has a very high burden of proof.
The burden of proof is easy to reach. A woman might not even live with a man and if she sleeps over more than 2 nights a week you are common law spouses after just a few years.
You are right most States don't have these rules but you better check.
To extend that further, never let any woman move in with you. In many countries you're considered common law after living together after an X amount of time, and is often entitled to your assets as well. Guys, just don't do it, not worth it.
Not in the US.
Out bitch!
You don't need a divorce to have a woman burn you.
By your logic: never LTR, never have kids. Hell, even a willing ONS can concoct some rape story and fuck up your life. Avoid women totally?
You can only know AWALT and manage the risk as best you can.
That's not what I'm saying at all. Not sure where you're making these assumptions from.
LTR can't divorce rape you.
ONS can't divorce rape you.
Having kids? OK child support, still can't divorce rape you.
You know anyone who has been raped via divorce court?
This is about all-too-typical hypergamy, AWALT, feelz before realz, she's-not-yours-its-only-your-turn, and general BP conditioning. In this case it plays out in a marriage, but those underlying AWALT concepts don't magically appear in a marriage nor is divorce rape the only way for a woman to hurt a man. Asserting you avoid a woman's bullshit by simply not marrying her is completely shortsighted, hence my comment.
Child support is just another word for divorce rape without the divorce; the courts have made that abundantly clear. Think you avoid that, character assassination, potential domestic violence allegations, etc by avoiding marriage but still having kids? AWALT.
And yes I know men who have been divorced raped, and I'm going through a divorce myself. I know too well how a woman can burn me and it has little to do with writing a court-mandated check.
In Canada they can after 2 years of cohabitation
Again, this is to the point I'm making. Do you have a fortune to protect? I don't. worry over loss of my fictional war chest is not a good reason, even if it's the right conclusion.
When I say get a better reason, it means only that. Have a reason grounded in reality, thats the only way out decisions have weight.
Leave fiction for female choices.
And can you raise a family with a sane woman without marrying her? It can happen, but chances are slim. She will demand the ring
Yes she will.
Have you thought about why they demand the ring when they are already living with you and in a "happy" relationship?
Hint: It is about power. The proper answer to any woman who demands marraige in return for continuing to fuck you is to get your own house and start leaving money on the nightstand after you blow a nut in her.
Well, there's a few RP splinter groups that have decided RP is a tool to sustain marriage rather than avoid it. Weird, I know. Basically every so often a thread pops up of a guy telling us all how beta we are for not being able to keep women faithful in marriage, or whatever the flavor is. They'll talk about their unicorn, how their unicorn is better than the others, that she isn't like them that she, truly is, a unicorn crafted into existence by themselves and their superior RP knowledge..
Then they drop in God or religion...
Nah.
That's fine. To each their own, but we shouldn't be advocating that or teaching others that or enforcing it by any means. Good that we route it out. A lot of these are men who got married and THEN discovered TRP and are now retroactively trying to conform it to their own situation to feel ok with their life choices.
You say that as if its wrong somehow, or these men (myself included) shouldn't maximize their current situation with RP principles.
I didn't mean it like that. What I meant was, YOU got married and now are trying to advocate that it's "not that bad" because you apply RP principles. Yes, if already married apply RP. But let's not tell people we actually think marrying is the way to go.
Apply RP principles if you're married. That's good and you should improve your lot always.
Don't advocate for non-married men that getting married is okay if you do it "RP style." No. We still tell these men don't marry.
Thanks for clarifying; I agree with you on #2.
You are misreading Married Red Pill if you think that.
“Married” RP is a farce created by post-marriage betas that need something, anything in their life to make them feel like they still have control. Denial is a more powerful pill than TRP.
If you got married, guess what. You missed the whole fucking point of TRP. AWALT, MGTOW. Take the pill or leave.
I’m guessing you’re one of them, posting diatribes about marriage, how to “do it right” and how Christianity/Abrahamic religions are RP. Haha. Nah. Submitting to a higher power you can’t even prove exists is sort of the most beta thing out there. The abrahamic religions sprang from scarcity and beta mentalities. As does marriage.
I do more than just post. I wrote a book on it.
Amazon sales rank: 221,505
Is this supposed to impress? It’s not even a “best sellers” rank.
Same shit happens in relationships, just with less legal trouble
You can walk away much easier in those instances. That's your unique power you hold, don't give it up.
Well technically there is a scenario where one of the spouses die...
Cohabitation in certain states leads to common law marriage or palimony. Be really careful. Not getting married is not a 100% solution.
It's in a handful of states and my understanding is that the burden of proof is high. If you cover your ass properly (don't enter into a contract or promise to take care of her) you should be fine.
Just curious, but wpuld it be possible to have kids, live together with your gf but not marry? I mean, worst case is you split up amd have to pay child support but idk about dividing assets and all that stuff.
There are quite a few cases where you dont need to be married even. Had a buddy get hit hard in florida just cause he lived with a chick for a certain amount of time without her working
And if you dont acknowledge the child is yours, it aint yours. And even if it is, by the time she can prove it is you could be long gone Panama or the philippines.
It's not marriage that is bad, it's the femcentric laws that encourage divorce and the femcentric media that encourages women to be the self-absorbed nitwits they're inclined to be. Yet it's men that hand over their power to women. Specifically BP men either raised by single moms or by libtard dads that likely themselves were fatherless. Men need exclusive men's clubs to recover from that. This subreddit is a band-aid for those missing clubs but does a hell of a lot of service towards it.
We shouldn't really give too much thought to the whys in terms of how it got this bad.
Political ideology probably has little to do with it either - people raised by conservatives get cucked just as much, pal. Don't kid yourself.
The point is, this is the way the world works. Facts. Don't marry. Doesn't matter who, what why or how it got this way. These are the rules of the game. Play the game to the best of your ability.
Yes
by the time a guy is down on one knee offering a girl a $XX,XXX ring, well if he has to do that then he has lost.
No shit. How humiliating of an experience is that truly. Think about it. Here's a super expensive piece of jewelry for you to show off to every other woman you know! Please, please, PLEASE tell me this was expensive enough for you to love me forever!
Yikes.
True. Basically, if she wants to buy me a 20K ring, sure, i’ll handover one to you as well. but how much are you going to respect me if I treat you with more than you treat me? ha ha
It's an absurd gesture that I've seen too many friends do. Women live for this shit. It disgusts me.
That is exactly the point. To humiliate and subordinate the man. That way he starts out the marriage correctly.
No shit. That way every woman in our society gets to live out her little disney "princess" fantasy in some fashion, no matter the expense to her "partner." What a crock of shit.
Not at all correct. You can be raked through the vast majority of divorce consequences (at least in Canada) if you cohabitate for 2 years or more, and are classified as common-law whether you want to be or not.
Um, so you're saying that I am 100% incorrect? Are you sure about that?
In the United States it's rare and hard to prove. You can look at the law if you like or specific decisions handed down by the courts here. In Canada it's different. OK. Look up the laws where you live and act accordingly. This can't be that hard. It's my understanding that what you describe above is rare in common law circumstances even in Canada. Otherwise, please share your sources of legal guidance so that we all may benefit, should we end up in a common law situation in Canada.
Unless of course, you:
1) Live in a region with common-law marriage
2) Ever publicly or in writing refer to her as your "wife". This has been used in court to convert church-only marriages, to pseudo-divorce cashout litigation.
Better yet: Don't commit or co-habitate. Spin three plates minimum, or none at all. Want kids? Two options:
1) Surrogate mother, preferably from a third-world nation (so she doesn't chase you down later and ruin the kids' lives)
2) Find a childless woman who has a confirmed case of a terminal, non-contagious disease that allows her to have 12mos-24mos to live (and a high mortality rate). Suggest the option of pregnancy together.
3) Move to a region where men still have legal equality under the law. Rural China is a clear example, but Guatemala, India, and most of the Middle East would qualify.
In most places in the United States it would be really hard to have a common-law marriage. You're right about referring to her as your wife, but living together rarely leads to common law marriage, with the exception of a handful of states.
You're right about the plates. The other stuff seems really hard to do.
Yeah, I want more kids but have no idea how to do so safely. I’ve just seen too many women go bad after anywhere from a year to even ten years together! And there are so many bad possible outcomes, like stealing the kids, divorce-raping you blind, or fake molest charges- that honestly, cheating behind your back is among the least of what could happen.
Yeah we're on the same page here. I don't have kids. I don't know if I want them, but I have time.
I don't disagree, but this has to be the stupidest reasoning I've ever heard as to why.
Being afraid to get hurt is some psychologically damaged childhood shit. Get a better reason
It's not being afraid of getting hurt, it's intentionally not signing a contract that is inherently flawed.
There is nothing man-up worthy about getting into a contract designed to exploit him. Simply suggesting that it is a matter of maturity to accept such bullshit is exactly how the blue pill conditioning works.
You're handing a woman a gun, pointing at your face, asking her not to shoot.
While you dance and dance like a maniac hoping to keep her entertained for the rest of your life.
Yes, it's a good policy to not get married. However, being risk averse is not a great policy for men. I didn't argue against his conclusions, only his reasoning, which betray something that a man would do well to address.
Avoiding a moving train is being "risk averse". I see nothing wrong with that.
You took a risk with your MAP. Risk averse in your scenario would have been 'sticking it out, for the children'.
Risk is a male trait for a reason. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Why do people read "The right conclusion, but the wrong reasoning" as "man up and marry those hoes"?
Who knows. These aren't the droids you are looking for
If there was an upside to the risk, that's one thing. But there literally isn't one benefit you get from marriage worth the risk.
Again, 0 disagreement on the concept of marriage. I'm specifically addressing risk averse behaviours in a masculine framework
Part of the higher testosterone is higher risk acceptance. I'm not saying man up and marry hoes, I am saying that if risk aversion was his sole reason, then he has another issue to address
The upside is the status of being a husband and father.
Like it or not, the institution still carries weight, socially, and can have major implications for a man's professional career.
Using a Beta's failed marriage as an example of all marriage is myopic, at best, and intentionally misleading at worst.
Do you drive around in cars without seat belts?
Do I really need to add acceptable risks" or can we just assume no one here has autism?
Here is a better reason then:
There is absolutely nothing a man gains by being married.
It conditions you into a false paradigm. The very act of proposing involves getting on one's knees - literally an act of worship, while the woman towers above.
How many situations can you think of where worshippers don't get taken advantage of? I can't think of any.
It was a rhetorical question. I don't really care, it's more for OP to consider about himself
Avoidance of unnecessary risk. It's like, if you don't speed then you can't get a speeding ticket. If you don't play Russian roulette then you can't shoot yourself in the face. "being afraid" adds an emotional context and suggests the OP is acting cowardly. Hardly seems like a valid criticism.
It doesn't have to be an emotional response. I've yet to see any non-immediate situation that benefits from one.
There's a thousand arguments for why a man shouldn't get married, this one off comment was to address a peripheral issue that may need work as well.
If he makes decisions based on fear, then he can be manipulated into decisions through shame. This is the danger in letting our emotions guide us. Sub par women, detremential legal situations, no upside, and all downside...
We don't need our emotions to guide us.
I dunno, you don't put your hand onto a hot pan because you don't want to get hurt. And I'm sure you don't put your dick into a vacuum cleaner, or put a hand into a pit of venomous or poisonous snakes..
So you agree, that good reasons are better than bad ones, even if they draw the same conclusion?
Sure, but defining good reasons versus bad reasons is one of those loaded things which might be highly personalized and hsrd to get a good or coherent answer.
Exactly. So get a coherent one.
Thinking back to the metaphor of "foundations of sand"
This is poor reasoning and pure projection. Who said anything about being afraid of getting hurt by a woman? that can happen in or out of marriage. The point is to just not get married and then you don't ever have to worry about getting divorced. Uhhh yeah, that's pretty good reasoning.
If I don't leave My house, i will Never get murdered in the street.
Leaving your house has upside. My profession revolves around measuring risk vs. reward. Don't try to bait me into false equivalents.
Being afraid to get hurt, where that fear prevents you from taking justified risks for worthwhile gains is childish bullshit. A 50% shot of breaking even, coupled with a 50% shot of losing everything is not a worthwhile risk.
Fearlessly standing in front of an oncoming train isn't being brave and mature. It's being an idiot. Avoiding divorce is a pretty great reason not to get married.
Is it really hard to hold both "marriage is bad" with "risk averse is a Femenine trait"
Together?
Is it really hard to understand that recklessness isn't manly?
There are no positive outcomes to marriage for men, so there is no potential gain on the risk of getting married.
If you are taking risks purely to feel like you're avoiding the feminine quality of risk aversion - you're not being masculine, you're being a moron.
http://www.open.edu/openlearn/science-maths-technology/science/biology/how-testosterone-affects-risk-taking-behaviour
It's 100% tied to masculine behaviour
The Blue Pill sub called.....they're looking for their village idiot! Dude said not a single thing about getting hurt.
Who is this?
Its obviously hard for you to think or operate outside of the frame of a married red-piller.....well, because you obviously are one. Your confirmation bias is evident and every time someone posts that disagrees with your pre-existing beliefs or life circumstances you get triggered. Stop battle axing for marriage.
The nuance is lost on this crowd, unfortunately.
Gives me more comments to further articulate it to others.
Remember, for every comment, theres 100 lurkers who are looking for persuasion, one way or the other. In all honesty, it's a theme I see that isn't addressed nearly enough in RP.
Very easy to show every example of women being bad, it's low hanging fruit, and I cannot add much to that discussions. Pointing out our self sabotaging behaviours, and how to remove them (before they get us making dumb decisions that fuck us over) is more fertile ground at the moment.
True, but some people want children and not many are comfortable with having children outside of wedlock. Additionally, not marrying and not having children would be a direct contribution to the extinction of the beautiful white race. For me, ensuring that I put some more strawberry haired, lime green-eyed white people with porcelain skin, slender lips and noses on this planet is enough to make me risk the agony of divorce one day. I'm not happy about a potential future where people are exclusively Asian, Arab, Black, Indian or mulatto and no more Nordic whites :(
There is legitimately something wrong with you and you should seek professional help.
OR...
You're a mega troll.
Hatred of others is a poor replacement for love and passion as a reason to get married.
Well if you want children you need a woman. If you want good for your children you need an LTR with their mother and the best - most stable - form of that is still marriage. So either you give up on having children or you better learn how to handle your woman.
Fuck, I remember the light switch moment in three different relationships. It really fucked with my self-esteem for a long while. The sudden reframing of never having loved me. Of an ex telling me I was the worst boyfriend she'd had. And one that never said anything bad in my face, agreed we split up amicably and then spent years spreading poison behind my back until I rooted it out as coming from her.
I really subscribe to the idea of women being politicans, of playing the field to her own advantage, reframing as need be. I've stopped judging them so harshly for it to; they simply are what they are and it's the best they can do. I've logically accepted that I will not find the companionship I used to expect from women; but to get a submissive companion that drinks from my fountain until she doesn't will do.
And this is why we advise men at TRP that when women try to break things off with you, you agree with them or ghost them or simply laugh and say "cool". Act like it doesn't phase you ... or even better yet don't let it phase you.
They want to feel like it affected you, that they "won", even if they won't admit it. Women compete in the psychological/social sphere, much like men do the physical one. If it phases you, then they know they conquered you.
But if you simply walk away without out a word, it fucks with their head. Makes them second-guess. Not so you can "get her back", but because a man with real presence should always leave a trail in his wake. If they want to flip the switch, let them. Hold your head up high and walk like a man.
Just walk away. It’s the loudest way to say: Fuck you, childish creature, without actually saying it.
The lose-or-win thing is part of an undeveloped, childhood-fixated ego. And of course it's there as you said, nearly all the times.
What's depressing though is, when all they allow you to do is this kind of walking a way or being exploited. A life of walkaways is hardly a life of enjoyment (even spicing it up with some sex).
That's why you don't rely on the affection and devotion of a woman for life satisfaction in the first place. Your happiness should be outside the clutches of a woman and in your own hands. Having a gf, a wife, etc. is cool when it's going well, but it should be seen as a sort of add-on like a nice car, or a video game you enjoy, not something you can't live without to have an enjoyable life.
Totally right. You admit though it's a bit ("a bit") sad, I hope.
It can be sad when coming to terms with this in the first place after being blue-pilled for so long, but once you've fully accepted it and have seen first hand how well this thought process actually works, it's part of a truly freeing revelation which is associated with a deeper revelation that, at the end of the day, happiness/contentment comes from within.
This is some of the best advice anyone can take from the TRP community.
Naturally Machiavellian but lacking the self-awareness to realize it.
That's not a deficiency, that's an important power-up in their arsenal.
(Wanna get depressed? Read Robert Trivers' book The Folly of Fools, just keeping in mind that, although the politically-correct Trivers dared not say it, females have much more developed self-deception and deception than males).
The short version being: fooling themselves, they fool better the others. This is why they fool themselves all the time.
Yes, you are exactly right. If they were given true self-awareness, the hamster would fall off the wheel and into the street. Nature insists they not know what they're doing else they would probably kill themselves.
Think of this, there are these 3 apps in the mind
1) Who we are (reflected by what we actually DO, and how we do it)
2) Who we believe we are (of course, we'll tend to have the best opinion of ourselves)
3) Who we want the others to believe we are.
There's a gap between 1) and 2) and 3) in every human mind (mine included!). Point is, it's socially favourable if there be a great gap between 1) and 3). Given this, self-aware, sincere-with themselves people will have smaller distance parting 1) and 2). This will tax their mind with a higher cognitive load ("stress") if they have to put up a socially successful persona (3).
Only a few, self-reflective minds have a "sincere" 2) — and usually they'll have a clumsy, inefficient 3).
Your ideal male-exploiting Fakebook-triumphing female has 2) and 3) almost coinciding, both very far, and looking away, from 1).
This gives her the best results in terms of pursuing her interests in the social world, and minimizes her cognitive dissonance (strain), because they want to believe they are following morals, being "polite", honorable, "fair": they can't dispense with societal programming, and their self-image will be, at all times, that of the Perfect Person.
Meanwhile, they do what they do (we know what).
To make ends meet, and things square with one another, they rewrite "history" (including memory and perception) on a non-stop basis. At every given instant, they will remember/"believe"/see/understand/... anything that suits their interests, supports a positive image of them, and accords with their instincts providing a rationalization for them.
Unsettling biological machines indeed. (Men have these mechanisms too — I certainly have them too — but, on average, they are 1 standard deviation below on these traits. In men with more developed minds, we could say, the frontal cortex [rational area] actually as a say in determining behaviour. That's why, later, they can be answerable, keep promises, and know some truth about themselves — they don't have too many reasons to be ashamed of themselves forcing them to have to rewrite their history continuously. In women, the most recently developed parts of the brain are completely subservient to the deep brain and its instincts. So they produce hypocritical, flicky and variable-by-the-second, adaptive self-lies and lies.)
Their egos and masks are glued together, basically. They enjoy a slice of every cake. Like in successful male sociopaths (and psychopaths I guess).
Thank you! Really enjoyed this
This was a great read! Are there more info about this topic in the book you suggested above?
Can you elaborate on how this went down? If you find it painful to recollect I understand but something like this is happening to me right now.
No,it's fine. I noticed that everyone I met, that had met her first gave me the stink eye, took longer to warm up to me than other people. When she showed up at my gf's shop to talk with her about me I was done with the situation. (she had known her before I did, but had never had anything but superficial contact with her, my gf found the visit weird).
I showed up to her house uninvited and confronted her. In my mind, the importance was that she would fear me and expect negative consequences for spreading shit behind me, as well as permanently burning the bridge. In hindsight and with new lessons learned, I would have instead set out for a more carrot and stick approach, while only burning the bridge mentally from my side.
So I asked her if she was talking shit about me behind my back. I got angry. She got scared and asked me to leave (though I think not expecting me to leave). When I turned around she grew a little more confident and wanted to talk a bit more. We talked 2 more minutes, her admitting, but also attacking back. I told her to stop talking about me behind my back. She said she never would again (which I didn't believe and after my breakup she did meet up with my ex, but at that point, who cares?). The people giving me stinkeye ended though.
I also know she didn't sleep well that night. She could never sleep if she had personal conflict, particularly in her house, which was supposed to be hera safe haven. I would have done it different for each ex I had, but this was the approach I thought best for her at the time.
Once a woman cheats on you, the relationship is never the same. It's like gluing back together the pieces of a broken vase--looks similar, but it's a lot weaker and a lot less attractive.
Trying to bargain her into faithfulness ("I asked her what she wanted") is a fool's game. You already HAD one bargain and she broke it - why the fuck would she keep it this time? In fact you've already shown her you're too weak to hold her accountable for past agreements - which makes it even more likely she'll do it again next time.
Redefining things that happened in the past is reminiscent of #metoo, and just as false. It's like those rorshach pictures that people see things in - she looks at past events and sees whatever she needs to justify her behaviour. One very common thing with cheaters is, they like to find a reason why it's "your" fault. It will be because "You didn't give me enough attention" or "You were always so busy at work" or "You never listened to me" - whether you actually did or not is irrelevant. A cheater will just seize on some justification so that she can pretend to herself and others she is a not cheat. Righteousness is a cheater's mental armour.
"She says she never truly loved me" - so why the fuck did she take your money all of those years? And stay in your home? And eat your food? And use your things? If she never loved you anyway but did all those things, then isn't she just a long-term prostitute? It's strange how women can think "I never loved you anyway" can justify anything when really all it does is condemn them.
Also, why should love justify all? Even war doesn't justify all acts - why the fuck should "love" be some kind of magic trump card that overrides all previous obligations or morality?
Poor guy. Sometimes I think blue-pilled guys are really just social relicts - fossils from another time who don't realise that the rules have changed and many women actively parasitize men. They are men who were unable to change or didn't see the world changing around them.
Women have this great natural Machiavellian instinct to improve position either when a better opportunity arises or when a 'power vacuum' exists.
The better opportunity part is pretty well known/described in these parts.
The 'power vacuum' part is also important. Sometimes the result is worse than simply being discarded. It starts when you first date. You tolerate multiple dates without sex? She just may exploit that. You tolerate vanilla sex? She just may exploit that. You relax and trust her and begin to form commitments that limit your options and ability to exit/next/walk away? She just may exploit that and take an action that you previously would have walked away from(maybe even fucking another guy more openly), maybe demanding a harder commitment (living together, kids, marriage, etc...)...
The 'power vacuum' is why guys end up in dead-bedroom LTRs. Some are fuckups, but half of these guys at least started in that direction because they thought they were being nice, and they trusted their partner, and they relaxed. Unfortunately for the man, the woman took up the slack. Wake up one day, and you have this moody sometimes-friend who you have to devote most of your resources and/or time to.
A women doesn't owe you anything, ever. She's not your 'friend', and even friends are fickle.
If you don't have leverage, you are mishandling even the most loving situation.
It's not that men can't or don't behave this way as well, it's that women have advantages in our social system, and that men are often naïve of both the behavior and the advantages.
This is comprehensive of becoming her true self (as opposed to being her prettified man-attracting persona before you committed, economically legally and psychologically). Let's say half of her true self (the other half you'll see, and she'll "become", when you are no longer useful and replacement with a more useful tool has been put into effect).
(By the way, ever read the Treatise of Love? It expands on the same subjects you touched on.)
This sets of behaviours is as differently developed in females and men as muscularity is differently developed the other way around. Both sexes use both systems of arms to make their way in life, but females are specialized in deception, self-deception, manipulation, and all the tools that are used in today's "court", to quote Robert Greene, in the social war.
Can you please link the book you mentioned (Treatise of love)
http://www.oocities.org/protopop_1999/treatise.html
More like Humpty Dumpty.
I made the mistake of trying to stay with cheaters two separate times. Jesus Christ how fucking stupid. Ultimately, I ended up cheating on them later. Of course both times I was blamed and they rationalized their own cheating.
First one changed her story a couple of times, saying she was tricked and taken advantage of by a guy who lied to her and tricked her, plus she was drunk, blah blah. Why you getting drunk in a bar with a stranger and going back to his place you fucking whore?
Second one was her with an ex. She changed the story multiple times as well. She had TWO rationales for why it wasn't cheating that she flip flopped between. Rationale 1: it didn't count because he just finger fucked me while I was using my vibrator and he was jerking off. Graphic details. Rationale 2: it didn't count because we weren't in a relationship (even though she was lying, saying she was exclusive, and I had stopped seeing other people as well).
In both instances I should have just ghosted cold. But I was being vindictive both times instead. Both of them actually did end up infatuated with me, ended up completely trusting me, and then I cheated like crazy behind their backs. The first one I told about it straight up. The second one I probably fucked eight girls until I just got so brazen about it and not even trying to cover my tracks that it was almost impossible she wouldn't find out. She did.
I ended up breaking both of those women. At the time it felt really good but I look back now and it was such a waste of my mind and energy.
When a woman cheats on you don't seek revenge.
Cut your losses and ghost.
"Cut your losses and ghost" I agree.
Also, "it didn't count because he just finger fucked me while I was using my vibrator and he was jerking off" was hilarious.... it's hard to believe anyone can be so proficient at mental gymnastics that they could use this as an excuse...
Man. I hate to admit but I thoroughly enjoyed mind fucking this bitch. I was her last prewall relationship. She's gonna hit it hard soon.
After we broke up I made it a point to show her pics of the hotties I was dating.
Relics? I think they are the majority of males at every time over history. And that's true of many other species besides humans, by the way.
If you are willing to get depressed, here's a long, extensive, truth-filled read on the matter of men-women power balance in nature and in human history (http://masculineprinciple.blogspot.it/)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relict
It was actually relict, but relic will do fine.
Thanks for the link, I am going to check it out...
Edit: Link won't load...
I self-awarely changed your fine words with another fine words of mine :)
that URL works
Link still doesn't work for me....I'm behind the great Chinese firewall though so perhaps it's blocked in China. Ah well.
You nailed it.
Just use a proxy/VPN then
Thanks for the link, I am going to check it out...
This is golden, thanks for the link.
The feelz before realz of AWALT explains most of the revisionist history; its part of the programming.
Yes. The thing about feelz is, it's all in the mind. If someone says she FEELZ neglected or FEELZ unloved, there's no way to prove objectively that she wasn't.
It's the perfect way to win an argument. "I FEEL you don't treat me right"
How can you counter? How can you measure feelings? And if you do try to counter she can then say you are discounting her feelings.
It's rubbish. I'm not saying feelings don't exist, but they do exist wholly in the mind. Which means they can be revised later or changed at any time to suit the mood of the accuser - and importantly, to make her feel justified in cheating on you.
I hadn't heard the term "light-switch" until this post, and it accurately describes everything I went through during divorce, except(to my knowledge) the cheating. I thought I'd woken up in Bizarro World because the woman I'd fallen in love with had suddenly transformed into this different person - a deciteful terrorist who not only had my children to use as her pawns and threaten me with, but controlled the narrative and had the state backing her play. It's a horrible and confusing experience that will undo most men. It has forced me to reconsider everything I thought I knew about life, including marriage and family. Frankly I have no idea what advice I'll give to my children on the subjects when the time comes.
I feel bad for this guy because it happened so late in life. I hope he can hold on and rediscover his masculinity.
I like to bring it back up every now and again. It's worth revisiting for veterans, but it's crucial information for newcomers.
Everything you said in the bullet points, even the rape part was told to my dad when she initiated the divorce. Yes, women initiate divorced and yes the go straight for the gut/wallet shot. She fucked him emotionally, financially, and unfortunately a judge will soon grant her legal access to my dad's bank accounts after she skimmed who knows how many thousands of dollars from their joint account.
I like women, I really do. But every day that goes by the pipe dream of finding a unicorn is fading. I want a girlfriend and I want to have a family but man at what cost?
I guess it's like they say. If it flies, floats, or fucks, rent it.
I've been struggling with this question lately too - at what cost? And the price keeps going up. I just learned another term I didn't want to know, "the light switch effect", to go along with the host of other things I'd rather forget, i.e. "retroactive regret rape". Sadly, mgtow is seeming more and more reasonable.
I think a lot of men are MGTOW and just call it "not being a pussy" or say things like "I don't want to get fucked over or sued for a bad joke"...that's part of the first step of MGTOW. They're aware of the issues. Maybe not pursuing changes or fixing it to the level people here are but the first step is to recognize, hey something here is not right. We are not being treated equally. Something is wrong.
More like hedgehogs. Stop looking for a unicorn when the species you love and are sexually attracted to are in fact, hedgehogs from the start. They look cute and cuddly, but there's no escaping that arsenal of pricks to hurt you if you get too attached. At no moment in time will they ever leave the pricks behind.
A hedgehog wearing a unicorn suit is still a hedgehog.
Deal with it, accept it and start planning your every move with this in mind. This is the unfortunate hand dealt to us my mother nature, we have no choice but to play as intended. We are dating hedgehogs, so go in with rubber gloves and a healthy dose of abundance, lifting and financial planning.
For me, I'm always looking for ways to mitigate my losses and prepare for the worst. I'm well aware I'm playing with fire.
Well apparently prenups are beat, the Panama papers ruined offshore accounts...what's your solution? Your kids are out of the question.
I feel the same way about wanting a family. I think we need to look for women with traits that would make for a good mother; disciplined, ambitious, healthy etc. I just wouldn't expect her to be a unicorn to me forever, I wouldn't expect a monogamous relationship from her. I would expect her to be a strong female role model in our kids life. Just my opinion.
True but then you're back to square one. If she's not a unicorn eventually you'll get screwed
Also if it flickers, flitters, or flits...
lol
how they oscillate and swap between "no" "yes" "maybe" "I never said that" and...
phew, their mental anti-truth and anti-responsibility defenses aren't even wort a description
Just find a woman who has more money than you or who earns more than you, so you can go into it with the assumption that even if you lose in the divorce, you don't get financially fucked.
So divorce rape her? Nah I'm better than that. The whole point of MGTOW is earn your own, not leech off others.
Golly G Wilikers could it be possible that the normalization of divorce rape amongst Boomers and Gen X has somehow jaded Millennials on the idea of marriage?
Nope! Must be that there Muh-Soggy-Knee
No you have it wrong. Millenials just loved growing up in a world where every married guy over 35 feared and was hated by his wife
Yesterday I also was snooping on the hardbody next to me on the train. She was fingerfucking her iphone when a text came in from her live in boyfriend. I knew it was a bf because the previous messages were logistics around dinner and boring shit.
Anyway the borefriend texted a photo of the two of them from some party and asked when she would be home.
She ignored the question and expanded the photo of herself only so he wasnt even on screen and studied herself for 30 secs and put phone away and checked an old blackberry.
Women dont love men like men love women
Tell me what was on the blackberry. It was chad wasn't it
Come on, bro. Even FB has a "secret conversations" option on messenger. It's all bullshit
So you're saying she's smashing some hammer with thor thundercock
I'm sure there's an explanation
Jesus christ
Reading this ... it could have very well been me as I went through all of those things, and there are alot of guys who have.
Personally I dated my Ex about 10 years and we were married for 16 after that. To label this dude as a "Beta" I would not guess its entirely accurate ... most true Betas I have seen would be dumped far prior to that, lets face it ... best case scenerio she weds a Beta for 10 years for it to be considered a long term marriage to get all the Beta Bucks she can before she risks jumping on any dude resembling Chad.
For me (currently 45) , I may not have been the Chad Alpha ... but I was pretty damn alpha not knowing there would be a RP site about it. Prior Military, took care of myself, good job ..DJ'd on the side (Talk about the dred game in full effect) I had many things that check off those RP boxes before I ever knew there was a 'side bar' ... I will tell you this .. life just happens, and one day you get the bomb drop and your wife discloses all those things above and the fact she is banging Alpha wanna be gym trainer.
So what happened?? ... its a slow gradual erosion of your frame, your manhood, your alpha status, and society pounds into you all those things ... you do not lose it all at once, its ever so gradual and you realize not only do you not recognize your ex of 25+ years ... you do not even know who you have become.
The first two books I read that both hit home hard was NMMNG and Rational Male and my own light switch went off. Unlike many of the sad stories you read ... I dropped my job of 17 years when we were doing the 'trial separation' and positioned myself to where she could not gut me nor my accounts... infact as far as divorced men go I made out very very fortunate thanks to advice from guys who had gone through it before me. I also spun multiple plates ranging from 29-39 and had more sex that first year than I probably had my entire marriage. I found myself .. and continue to self improve and make.
This board is primarily for you younger fellas ... but just understand there is life after something like this and its not all bad.
Great and underrated reply right here. We've been creating Armageddon scenarios about the divorce rape, while what we should be looking is at contingencies to put in to place for us to be able to have peace of mind while being able to be a bit more lax with women.
Kudos for you for finding yourself. It’s no small task.
I'm gonna need you to expand on this bruh
Well without going into a novel. At the time I realized the severity of the situation I opt'd not to go begging and do the pick me dance, this did a number on her tbh and bought me a good deal of time, almost 4 years in fact where we were legally married I quit a job of 17 years and took on a new role less pay. I also went off the books for the salary with this position thankfully my partner had been through a nasty divorce so I made the same but on the books it was much less. I also took up residence in a small apartment and she kept all the assets (knowing this would be divided/settled later). I traded my car in and went with a lease (again not an asset) while her car was paid off already. After I had my ducks in a row I filed knowing I now was on equal ground as far as the courts were concerned (I live in a no fault state).
I do not think many 'plan' for this type of thing but once faced with Divorce many jump to try and save the doomed relationship .... I only appeared to do this while I worked my ass off to protect my future.
End result ... funny ... she pays all medical expenses for our son (My job offers it but its expensive) and she also pays me a small amount of child support. She keeps the furniture and old car and the house was split (She could not afford to buy me out). I just moved into a bigger place and am looking to buy in the next couple years near the beach ... new truck, Harley in my garage, a great job and currently spinning 3 plates ... life is good.
Kudos bro! I am curious how did you position yourself through the divorce so that you didn’t get raped financially by your ex? That is one of the scenarios I am genuinely worried about.
Most common question for older successful guys: where'd you meet your 29-39yo plates? Tinder? Cold approach? Social circle? Other? All of the above?
Met one on POF ... disclaimer on that is you have to muddle through some serious HB4-5's who think they are 7's ... the POF gal is a solid 7-8 The 29 was random and I actually met her on my birthday and closed that night, fluke but she likes the older man thing and the fact I have my own place and money Third plate I met through social circle and we are both busy professionals so its a no pressure low key dinner here, trivia night there ... closed with her after second date with the Harley ride that had her all wound up.
In my experience the dating apps are brutal and give women a false sense of their value while its harder for us normal looking guys to show our SMV which is attached to things that are difficult getting through via pictures and profile descriptions. So I have been spending less time with plates and more time strict game just to add variety and get myself back to where I believe I need to be.
I'm surprised a women in his 50 can still find somebody to fuck her.
My ex-wife cheated on me and we split, thats ok. We weren't married anyway, just lived together. She beg me to come back, sorry no.
What surprised me is how many guys a 45 year old mother can still fuck. She probably had 5 o 6 partners just the first couple months, way, way more than me. After that, she even managed to grab a couple of beta bucks for LTRs and believe me she's no spring chicken and about 40 lbs overweight. I'm truly amazed.
I'm guessing when you are thirsty even the toilet bowl looks like an oasis on the desert.
It isn't a shock that she did this when the kids were in college. She doesn't need BB anymore, so now she is chasing AF.
I'll bet within 5 years she will claim she made a mistake and try to get him back because she will realize there isn't a gigantic market of high SMV/RMV men who want to elope with 50 year old women who act like this. I hope he says no when she does.
Yup my ex did the same exact thing, it was so fast that half our "friends" at the time were so confused.
Literally one day I was the most perfect, chadiest chad in the world. The next day I had caused all the problem in her life, some of which happened before she met me. Yes she blamed me for things that happened with her last ex, I was the source of all evil in the world, hunger and famine all caused by my hand.
The only saving grace was when myself and the other male roommate proved in front of a crowd that I wasn't even in the state, nor knew she even existed for a few things she blamed me for.
Her response: "Whatever you probably did those things anyway and I haven't found out." then stomping out the room like a 5 year old who just got told she can't get yet another my little pony toy.
Women firmly believe they are the center of their own universes. This causes them to believe everything is done for the sole reason to effect them. You didn't forget to call her back, you specifically decided NOT to call her back. You didn't forget she doesn't like Japanese food, you brought home Japanese food for dinner so you could have 2 dinners and her have none. Anything that generates an emotion links that emotion to the person and action that seemingly generated it. This is why it is so important to be constantly generating good emotions near women when you first met them. It's not a boring party, your a boring guy. It's not that you could possibly share an interest, your supplicating to try and get in her pants.
Men see and realize this innately, no matter how blue you are. But blue pill men see this as an opportunity to mold themselves in a way to not cause any of these situations to come up again. This has the effect of justifying future outbursts. When you laugh it off and not take it seriously, yeah the get more pissed at that moment, but in the end they either eventually realize it's all in their head or you drop them and move on.
Marriage lends to scarcity mindset. I found myself in a situation very similar. The ex was screwing other dudes behind my back. As disgusted as I was, I was stuck in blue pill mindset...ill never find anyone else. Once I divorced her ass, I had no problems finding women.
This guy is in the scarcity mindset, when in fact its his cheating whore that should be worried about dying alone. He needs to swallow a red pill and dump his old whore and upgrade to fresher pussy. His kids are out of the house, nothing is stopping him.
Its frustrating to see guys like this.
She did truly love him - once. The moment another man came along and gave her tingles, she branch swung almost immediately and her emotions towards him evaporated.
The brutal sting of said branch swing. The same exact thing happened to my father after 20 years of faithful commitment by him. In light of this new man, her feelings for him were cut off completely. That damned, bitter red pill.
Same thing my mother did when she got attention from my father's alpha co-worker. She began wearing short shorts, blasting 80s rock music in a recently purchased Firebird she suddenly needed to have, and began behaving wildly - all in attempts of keeping that alpha dick interested.
Jesus. Why ever get married? I'm going to bust my balls for my entire life just to have hormones (opposed to rational thought) decide if my life and my kids lives are gonna go down in flames? Slim fucking chance lol
there's an addendum that should go there. This isn't them after the lightswitch has been turned off, this is them all the time.
Surely in the early stage NRE (New Relationship Energy) acts as a veil, covering it. But there are fissures, through which the experienced, female-violence trained eye will see, on occasion, the Behind the Mask (her real exploitative, egocentric, irresponsible, compartmentalized identity, which her ego itself is very very careful to never come into cognition of, by the way) will flash.
Betas are men who haven't tried enough women to see the patterns and the common nature. They are the resource damaged-good women and pathological liars/manipulators are most reliant on and eager to secure (specially from age 30 up). There will never be shortage of such resource, so there's no selective pressure for the pathological liars and exploiters to become more self-conscious and responsibility-taking. Actually, they are being culturally and socially invited to worsen their worse attitudes (and they are doing it).
It sucks to learn that lesson at 30, it's mind boggling to learn it at 50. Women can shut it off in a heartbeat and justify it to themselves, say it in the mirror a few times then it becomes true. I feel for the guy, it's sadly all too common.
I don't know if I was lucky or unlucky to learn this lesson at 17.
Lucky, but to be honest, it was nice to be ignorant for so long. The fairy tale feels nice, but once you look behind the curtain, it all comes crashing down.
I dunno its kind of nice to pump and dump once you crack the code. I see all the human wreckage around me of married men telling me never to get married and how miserable they are and it makes me glad i'm not them. I had one of my very wealthy IT clients tell me "sonickid101 if you ever tell me your getting married i'll cut your balls off" lol. Rich old dude trophey blond wife 3 beautiful daughters and yet miserable tries nothing but to buy the love of all four of them. The very definition of Beta Bux that had the dream shattered. Although hes an alpha at business I can't square that circle.
We know not to argue with women but sometimes you slip into it.
I started to have an argument with my girl yesterday and I noticed that I was going into that so I just quickly shut up and changed the subject.
I don't even know I only have meant it I told her I had to think about things and then I might need to take a step back. Which freaked her out.
She told me, "You always have one foot out the door." It's true though. I do always have one foot out the door and I have to keep it that way.
I feel the only way to keep a wife or LTR in check is to actually be willing and able to next her if it comes to it.
That's where dread comes in and then makes her start working extra hard and refocus her energy on you.
Bringing it back to this whole concept of the light switch effect. I don't think I've ever had that happen to me (maybe one exception but it was with a girl I wasn't that serious with when I was in my early twenties), and I'm trying to think about why.
I really believe you have to continue to improve yourself and to play dread.
What are other people's thoughts on how to prevent the light switch effect from coming into place?
Even dragging unfaithful wives to the city gates and stoning her to death could not prevent it.
Nothing we propose could possibly have any effect.
All you can do is work on yourself so you DNGAF and have options. If you truly don't care, she cannot (and will not) turn the switch. If you do care, you will live your life like Damocles.
It's interesting you say that. Theres a lot of things I've seen other men been through or complain about that I haven't experienced. This being one of them.
I drove one of my exes crazy with dead though. To the point that when I broke up with her she tried to OD right in front of me so I called the cops and she ended up locked up in a psych ward.
But I've never experienced this unless we're talking in small doses like arguments.
I've also never experienced an LTR that refused to sleep with me. It boggles my mind how a man can accept that even in a marriage pre 65/70 years old. I've also never (to my knowledge) been cheated on. Maybe I'm lucky but it just never happened.
And even if it did, my LTRs always had more to lose than I did because I could just replace them and they knew it too.
So many of my exes want me even while being in an LTR currently. Which is funny because right now I'm actually in a rough spot financially.
I made some very bad investments and I'm approaching rock bottom yet I feel more or less at peace with it because I'm starting to realize what I want in my life.
But I digress. Call it luck, dread, alphaness or whatever, but some men go a long time not experiencing a lot of the common pit falls but like me still end up red pilled due to small events that culminate to an understanding of the world we live in.
Not funny at all. You're alpha fucks, not beta bucks.
The problem I ran into is the only women I'd want to have a LTR (low count) want marriage. Sure, I could have a LTR with a high count female that I have no respect for, but I'd rather be alone. So, am I suppose to have a tinder profile in my 60's or until my dick stops working? At some point, you have to stop being that creepy old guy hitting on someone old enough to be your grandkid.
They're not your grandkid though, that's the important bit. Do you say "she's old enough to be your sister" when the ages are close? No? Why? Because it's stupid, that's why.
Yea, but whats your end game? To be spinning plates in the nursing home...At some point even Jordan had to hang it up...
I'm in your same position bro. Well, I'm actually married for a year now. But sometimes I get the fear of missing out syndrome. But then I think, what is my end goal anyway?
When you're in the nursing home, are you gonna be banging your 80 year old wife? Or are you gonna be beating off to Aunt Bea on Andy Griffith reruns? Point is, if you live long enough, your sex life is over anyway.
Lol, well you have a point there. But it might be nice to have someone to change your diapers and feed you apple sause before you kill over.
That's why it's called a nursing home -- nurses! :)
Can't agree more. there are women who will respect you and never cheat. Also just get a prenup, any woman who is worth wifeing would understand why.
And what this man will do now at 50? At least he passed his genes and raised children. I hope he will get over it and enjoy his life. Bitch.
Find some 30 yr old and fuck her brains out? I guess there is some consolation prize to losing half your life savings to a born again whore.
Marriage should be an agreement between people who love each other and their Gods if they age any. There is no need to involve the state.
Also, sadly, zero consequences (or so it sounds like). Damn shame.
In fact, cash prizes from what I overheard.
Just reminds me of how we as men are at fault for losing the shit-test of feminism.
"Give someone enough rope and they'll hang themselves"
Funny how that was true in 2 ways. First, women with their unchecked behaviors crushing their overall happiness, then men with their blindness and legal backlash.
Lol are you saying you're scared of a powerful woman?
"Light switch" is a great term for this effect. When it happens to you, it is literally a sudden change that is bewildering if you don't know what is going on. I've noticed that crazies (e.g. bipolars, severe personality disorders) tend to "switch" a lot faster than those who are not so crazy, or the change is much greater.
Ok leaving all these bullet points u mentioned and whatever the things she told him to justify her cheating on him. What should that bluepilled man do to leave with minimal losses? I dont live in the US neither a european country, but if she is the one intiated tbe divorce papers she still takes half his money? He can just check out of this relationship and let her do whatever she wants and he also does whatever he wants till he can prove her promiscuity to prevent her from taking his assets.
I can understand in general that if u cant handle a girl just leave her to someone who can but leaving her and initiatong divorce is not the best option
I'm not much of a Billy Joel fan myself, but the lyrics to his song The Stranger nail this concept succinctly, about 40 years ago. This concept is not new, it only takes a certain willingness to see it.
Same old whore with a new dick inside her.
Someone give me a link to a post defining the specific colors of pill (I.E. Red, blue, pink?)
Red pill = Seeing past one's ego and worldview to realize an objective truth, no matter how counter-intuitive or politically incorrect.
Blue pill = plugged into the matrix, buy everything at face value. Everybody is special and no trends exist.
All the other colors are dumb by people trying to co-opt a brand to serve their own purposes.
Anyone here knows this sentence:"Peralta thats enough!"? Thats my lightswitch
Brooklyn 99 reference? You went full Boyle man. You never go full Boyle
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When did mods get the ability to shadowban?
Only Reddit mods can shadow ban.
This a solid example of the lightswitch effect.
No matter how many times I read this same old story, it hits me hard.
That said, it's an important reinforcement of the realities discussed in this sub.
I'm new to trp. What are these blue pill fairy tales that you speak of?
If you're new to TRP, probably most of your social concepts, ideas and expectations, mainly regarding man to woman interaction and dynamics, but also your place as a man in the world.
Ah ok. Is there a sticky for newbies?
Check the sidebar
It's all on the sidebar to your right. Start reading.
Misogyny or not the truth still needs to be spread to that man in particular. TRP is a guiding force, sometimes it takes this type of extreme to swallow the pill. Bet he will be bitter as fuck for the foreseeable future but after that he may come to love his new found reality
He was always beta bux. Always.
Does maybe game theory apply to this? Simon Sinek held a talk about the infinite player and finite player.
Basically, one plays to stay in the game, while the other one plays to win.
If a finite player is pitted against an infinite player, the finite player will always get frustrated.
So basically: is the red pill, changing the player from a finite game to an infinite game?
99% or husbands are basically like those house elves from Harry Potter.
I actually watched my mother do this to my stepfather. He met her when I was 10 years old and she already had three kids and was divorced. He knocked her up, and "did the right thing", and "manned up", and married her. Poor guy.
He took care of me and my brothers like we were his own kids. He taught us how to play baseball, took an interest in how we did in school, and was involved in our lives more than our real father. He instilled in me a work ethic, and taught me valuable technical skills that I still use today to earn a living.
He had two kids with my mother. Once all the kids were grown and out of the house, my mom dumped him. In getting dumped, he taught me yet another lesson, and I've never forgotten it.
She's clearly been resenting him for decades... I want to believe it's possible to have a successful LTR if you remain red pill, so your wife respects you instead of silently loathing you, and drifting into the arms of someone stronger... AWALT though. No exceptions. No fairy tales.
Thanks for this post. I needed the reminder.
I vividly remember the light-switch effect from my LTRs from high school and I was baffled by it. Seeing it twice made me realize it must have been something I was doing to illicit such a response. Very happy for TRP connecting the dots.
The worst part is the courts will agree with her (maybe not the rape part) and she will get the house, most of your money, the cars, and alimony for the rest of her life.
I would be a cautious of over-simplification when it comes to discussing marriage and whether or not it is something a man should pursue.
Universally, men have many motivations for marriage. Most are culturally/socially indoctrinated, some are side effects of behavioral traits.
It is possible to find a woman with desirable traits that with effort into frame you can retain for a meaningful amount of time. I got the impression from Rollo that this is the natural progression of a genuine red pilled man. I recall him describing one of the most profound benefits of spinning plates was to gauge the widest possible range of women and behaviors.