Are nice guys/betas/blue pilled men only nice because they were "lied to" and think it'll get them a girlfriend/wife/laid?

jax006 · 2020-04-17T15:45:19+00:00

You just wrote this thread yesterday then deleted it but yea same response;

Many nice guys were simply raised with the idea that being virtuous and good (in the culturally popular modern weatern society sense) yields things that you want in life.

Some things are totally at odds with that, like trying to get laid, an endeavour where being "virtuous" is probably more likely to work against you.

It's no surprise that guys figure this out, and then decide to buck the system entirely out of frustration.

Cobra_x30 · 2020-04-17T17:04:29+00:00

What is up with all the morons who think nice guys are just nice to get laid? I was nice because thats how I was trained to be. The problem is that being nice is actually a turnoff. I changed nothing about myself but just became a jerk and suddenly I have no issues with women.

Actually the other thing is that in a relationship being nice drove women away!

gunbusterxl · 2020-04-17T15:39:16+00:00

Some guys are generally nice to everyone. Guys that are only nice to women, attractive ones at that, are the "nice guys" that all the memes are about. 99% of the time, they're hoping to get laid.

Barely-moral · 2020-04-17T16:46:12+00:00

From the same comment chain and user that you were quoting.

But, unfortunately for BP, aggression and dark triad traits are also attractive. Being an asshole, to some degree, is sexy as a man.

Yes. Men do things to get laid. Being nice included. The thing is that while being nice is a non factor at best. Being an asshole can actually be a positive.

Why be nice when it is a non factor when being an asshole can actually be a positive?

A man that wants to increase their chances should not only be fit, well dressed, fun, charismatic... he also has to be kind of an asshole. Why not take that advantage if he can?

Also, it reinforces the idea that the system is absolutely broken and undefensible. What kind of system gives better lives to immoral assholes (Henry the serial abuser and wife beater) than the lifes it gives to moral boring nice guys (Barry the beta doormat)?

A system that anyone that thinks that morality should be rewarded and immorality should be punished thinks it should be changed.

wtknight · 2020-04-17T18:43:07+00:00

It's possible to be both nice and interesting. The problem is that many nice guys are not interesting. Then, they figure out that being nice is not attractive but being interesting is, so they unnecessarily drop all of the niceness and just try to act like douchebag Chads (actual Chads probably like women more than the pseudo-douchebag Chads do). However, dropping the niceness is completely unnecessary, as well as disadvantageous, because it will turn off high quality women. All a guy needs to do is become interesting and confident towards women. Dropping the niceness is overkill.

TheJim66 · 2020-04-17T16:56:39+00:00

No, they were nice because they are good dudes. They are nice because they liked the chick and you are nice to people you like. They didn't expect to get laid because they were nice, they expected being nice to be a bonus or at least not hurt their chances, because that's how it is when women are nice to men.

Reality is however that being nice is a demerit and being an asshole is sexually attractive.

reluctantly_red · 2020-04-17T17:34:57+00:00

Being a decent reliable guy gets you lots of things -- but sex isn't one of them.

Eastuss · 2020-04-17T20:00:55+00:00

Being nice is just comfortable, you aren't the aggressor, and you're told women will approach you because you're nice and open. That's why, and it makes perfect sense that men let women move, because men are more intimidating.

But in reality you still are the intimidating one and the aggressor or nothing good ever happens to you. If you're not socially aggressive, you do not get close to women, you do not get intimate, they do not like you as a man.

the_calibre_cat · 2020-04-17T20:56:58+00:00

I actually think that they think that it's actually what women want. I certainly did. Takes a fuckton of deprogramming that shit to get away from it, when you think earnestly trying to be as moral of a character as possible, being feminist, and not broaching people's boundaries makes you stand out.

Facts: It does not make you stand out. It makes you spectacularly forgettable, but depending on how deeply you've invested in that cultural trend, you may actively reject the idea of adopting more sexually aggressive, traditionally "manly" antics.

This makes you useful to women, rather than attractive to them.

2020-04-18T02:26:22+00:00

They believe people actually follow the golden rule. They hope to be treated the way they treat others. It's sad, really

Sir_manalot · 2020-04-17T15:37:31+00:00

[deleted]

dylang92 · 2020-04-17T18:23:54+00:00

Well the true NiceGuys definitely were, but it’s deeper than that. When i was 15, I was 100% a NiceGuy, but it’s because I though being “Nice” was my edge. I would see girls on social media being like “all guys are dicks! I just want a nice guy” so I used to think that could be my in because I obviously wasn’t getting looks or interest from girls. It obviously didn’t work, but many NiceGuys feel that being “nice” is their edge in the dating scene, that their niceness is so sought after, because they don’t have something that is sought after.

2020-04-17T16:39:36+00:00

In a way. Nice people are just nice without necessarily expecting anything out of it.

"Nice guys" are especially nice to women because that's how they were taught to get women.

Edit: This, of course, is a turn off. Even more so when most "nice guy" types typically place all of their cards on women wanting them purely for their nice personality and are lacking in appearance.

However, I am not in the boat that thinks it is wrong to treat women well as your way of winning them over... The only problem is it doesn't work when you don't consider everything else about yourself that women wouldn't be attracted to, leading to frustration.

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reluctantly_red · 2020-04-17T15:55:50+00:00

You wear your best clothes to church.

You treat gals nice because you want to impress them.

Barely-moral · 2020-04-17T16:04:12+00:00

As a general rule men do what they think they have to do to get laid.

If a lot of men are doing something, probably is because they think that would help them to get laid.

901735 · 2020-04-17T16:32:16+00:00

Not only lied to, I'd also say stunted development.

But it really does seem like these guys were only nice because they thought it would get them love/sex.

And now they know. And it's ok.

And soon, if the trend keeps spreading at the rate it does, females will soon have to woman up, too. Don't worry tho, it won't come to that.

mitch310 · 2020-04-17T16:33:32+00:00

I would consider myself a nice person. I try to be respectable to everyone including women.

What really makes a guy beta is WHY or HOW he perceives nice. A beta will always have strings attached to being nice to a girl (Ex: if I just am super nice to this girl and buy her a bunch of gifts I will get laid)

Well turns out that is a huge turn off since the girl will feel as if you have no other options. It’s all about having options at the end of the day.

I’m not sure how much reading you do. But I would recommend you pick up a book called “the predatory female” this takes a look at marriage, dating, and is a wealth of knowledge in my opinion.

Hope this helps

BruhMoment45886 · 2020-04-17T16:39:58+00:00

Platonically being nice is part of societal expectations and just wanting to be accepted.

Non platonically everything we do is motivated by sex. We're biologically hardwired that way. The guy getting in shape, the girl buying new clothes or wearing makeup, it's all for sex. Even if they tell themselves "ok doing this for me"

mydikishomofobik · 2020-04-17T16:41:00+00:00

If a man is only fake nice to girls cause he wants sex, but it doesn't work, he'll soon realize and adjust his approach accordingly. If a guy is genuinely nice in general, he'll be nice to women as well. But if he's a heterosexual then he'll also want to fuck women in the pussy. Being nice and also wanting to get laid with females isn't a crime.

sagoooo · 2020-04-17T20:02:27+00:00

I treat everyone nicely, but It's not like I expect anything for it. I was raised to treat everybody fairly and to help people when they need it; there's nothing else to it. You can call me a "beta" or whatever, and it's probably true, but most people can't be alpha Chads. I don't expect to get laid all the time or find a lot of long-time partners, it's a matter of finding somebody with a similar mindset, and I realize that will probably take a while. I'm not about to start pouting about that; that's what kids do.

2020-04-17T20:28:18+00:00

Yes the women lied. Even here on PPD.

As it relates to sexual preferences, women virtue signal by giving the politically correct answer (such as “I like nice guys) but their actions always follow the path of hypergamy as they rationalize it away.(going for douchebags, then make excuses)

In some cases it is innocent and in others it is malicious blue pilling that many women here in this sub has admitted to

LittyKitsune · 2020-04-17T22:32:49+00:00

Ime not...really.

I know a lot of current/ex-doormats and they never cited "I thought I would get girls" as a reason for it. Many dealt with middle child syndrome, bullying, wanting to impress teachers, demanding parents, moral codes based in religious belief (I think it's said repeatedly in the Bible that it's best not to expect earthly reward for good behavior), toxic opposite or same sex friendships, and so on.

Also I'm pretty sure we all knew at least one asshole who was still able to get girls at any given point in our lives. I don't know how anybody missed that.

AdolfGandi · 2020-04-18T00:14:10+00:00

I'm a natural beta, I.E sensitive and laid back. Women aren't into me whatsoever because of that, but I'm still that way.

Zippo-Cat · 2020-04-18T04:53:44+00:00

Radicalizing the Romanceless a peek into the ego and entitlement of the clueless "nice guy"

It takes a special kind of fanaticism to take something that basically disproves your belief and claim it proves your belief.

Flair: I trigger you? Block me

lmao

Troy016 · 2020-04-17T15:32:31+00:00

Yes😂

DeuxPistolets · 2020-04-17T15:56:28+00:00

I wouldn’t say so. First off, technically, 99% of men in the world would be considered “Blue Pilled” since they haven’t been exposed to TRP.

I have seen “nice guys” and “betas” run the gamut in terms of physical attractiveness and career/financial success. I don’t think this is because all men do it with the underlying expectation that they’ll get a relationship out of it or get laid. Some people are genuinely nice, men and women.

Do I think there are men that play the part of a “nice guy” to try to win a woman over? Yes. I don’t think men do this because they were “lied to”. Generally, when you want to win someone over, you will naturally be “nice” to them. This is the default behavior for men whether it’s making new friends with other men, or seeking out a woman for a relationship/sex.

eboy4hire · 2020-04-17T16:14:50+00:00

If a guy asks "I'm nice why aren't people nice to me" , well it makes sense why he's confused. If you're nice to other you'd expect them to be nice to you. But when he asks "I'm nice why can't I get sex". Idk it just kinda seems like they were only nice because they thought it would have gotten them laid. Really sex was never supposed to be your main incentive to be good(nice).

I like the way you phrased this because I feel like I can rebut it. So ultimately, they feel like since they're nice, women will treat them nice, and over the course of their nice interaction, it will naturally lead to sex. It's not an entitlement to sex, they just feel like being a dick is the only thing that could hold them back from sex. They feel like their niceness is the charisma they need for sex.

DeepCrimsonPill · 2020-04-17T17:20:46+00:00

You misunderstood my point. My point wasn't "Just be an asshole". My point was "be fit, well dressed, fun to be around and charismatic AND an asshole". We stress the latter point because women and Blue Pilled men keep denying that aggressive, dominant men who don't focus on her emotional needs get the most sex.

But it really does seem like these guys were only nice because they thought it would get them love/sex.

When I was a kid, I had $20 dollars to take with me to the zoo. But before we left for the bus, I saw that the school was accepting donations to improve the school's garden. I wanted to be a good person, so I donated my $20.

When we went to the zoo, I found a very colorful book of insects that my teacher would show us in class. I really liked that book, but had no idea this chance to buy it would ever come up to me. And because of my good deed, I couldn't afford what I wanted. I cried like a bitch. (I cried a lot as a kid) I wished I hadn't donated my money that day.

Now, if we were to apply BP's logic to this scene, they would think "Oh my God! This seven year old thought donating money would make HIM happy! Doesn't he know he isn't entitled to free books? He wasn't legitimately nice!" In reality, I just wanted to be a good person, but being a good person did not fulfill my emotional needs. It would have been far wiser to just keep the cash, maybe donate a smaller amount of money on another day.

Being "legitimately nice" to women likewise does not make me a happy person. I want sex, I want romance, and while not every woman has to land on her knees, SOME do. Even platonically, I do desire things from friends - affection, meet-ups, gifts, being there for me when I'm down, etc. And while I won't abandon them for not doing one of these things, it does create a hierarchy of whom I'm closest to, one that women do terribly in. I'm not some well of happiness people can take from when they need to feel happy, I have my own needs.

So I do advocate for selfishness in life. People struggle because they want things that can't be given, so they seek power and subjugation. Things aren't so simple as good vs evil, oppressor vs oppressed. SelfLESSness has a place to, but our world's current philosophy is so absolutely neurotic when it comes to our darker half, we need special focus on reviving our inner barbarian.

reluctantly_red · 2020-04-17T17:37:38+00:00

It's not so much that asking for sex means you were never nice.

If you're asking for sex you have more problems than just being too nice.

2020-04-17T17:41:42+00:00

They just stop being nice. Sure more power to them. But it really does seem like these guys were only nice because they thought it would get them love/sex.

Yeah true, they just all need the knowledge or whatever is needed to quit being nice (I mean specifically nice to women, since I imagine that's who heterosexual men would be expecting sex from in exchange for being nice to them?)

2020-04-17T18:09:28+00:00

Are nice guys/betas/blue pilled men only nice because they were "lied to" and think it'll get them a girlfriend/wife/laid?

Right concept, problematic wording.

Imagine a baby boy is born, age = 0

Then imagine the same dude age... 23.

How did he form his worldviews? It's a mix of messages coming from (in no particular order):

parenting
education
traditional media
social media
role model(s)
what's predominant and pervasive
socializing
conversations
readings
movies
advertising
[I am sure there's more]

so he "process" all this info as bast as he can, and often the result is the stereotypical "Nice Guy" or - worst - "Mr Nice Guy". There are also other versions like "White Knight", "Mangina" and "SoyBoy". Again , there might be more.

For some of the works, and works very well.

For some of them works... till it doesn't.

For some others, it doesn't work.

There's no hard data, but the Manoshere implies that the categories of "doesn't work" + "works... till it doesn't" constitute the majority. Regardless that portion is surely vocal enough in the Manosphere and in PPD.

Was it a lie? Was it not a lie?

I think it's irrelevant, we're just debating semantic which does nothing to solve or ameliorate the problematic situation of the "doesn't work" + "works... till it doesn't" guys.

We all need to take accountability, and apply some critical thinking skills. If someting in life doesn't work for me, the onus is on me to figure out how to react/act and make the appropriate decisions.

Complaining doesn't work.

Debating over 1 word / 2 concept like "I was lied to" vs "it wasn't a lie" is an exercise in futility/

NockerJoe · 2020-04-17T18:34:39+00:00

My advice to you is to ignore a vast majority of the people here. Like 90% of red pillers are shut ins roleplaying as Chad and trying to say outrageous things for upvotes, because Reddit promotes that kind of behavior.

2020-04-17T19:54:39+00:00

No, some people are just nice by default. It rarely gets them far in life.

SaBahRub · 2020-04-17T20:08:53+00:00

Yes. Just like those conservative women who think that being cool with the guys is going to protect them or make them better than the other bitches.

basedmillennial95 · 2020-04-18T03:57:21+00:00

Hmm. I'm a nice guy but that has more to do with my religion than wanting sex...which isn't happening since I'm MGTOW.

diladusta · 2020-04-18T13:11:45+00:00

Nah i like making my so happy

Title	Are nice guys/betas/blue pilled men only nice because they were "lied to" and think it'll get them a girlfriend/wife/laid?
Author	YoureNotAverageLoser
Upvotes	4
Comments	83
Date	April 17, 2020 3:25 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/g343oi/are_nice_guysbetasblue_pilled_men_only_nice/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/are-nice-guysbetasblue-pilled-men-only-nice.654189 https://theredarchive.com/post/654189

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