CMV: the "women are children" trp notion isn't so ridiculous given how often females cry and the fact that they cry at all well into adulthood

AlanHalworth · 2017-12-11T15:27:40+00:00

How about: men won't clean up after themselves, therefore they are children? Men think they are the center of the universe, therefore they are children? Men like playing with toys (electronics, fast cars, etc.), therefore they are children? Men like playing games (computer games), therefore they are children? Men can't control their impulses, therefore they are children? I'm sure you'll disagree with one or two of these, but surely some of them will make sense to you ... ? You can say "not all men" for each of them, but you can say "not all women" for the crying, like Margaret Thatcher as you point out.

SexyMcSexington · 2017-12-11T08:35:53+00:00

Women have a lot of neotenous traits

thinkytoes · 2017-12-11T16:12:09+00:00

I'm confused. Adult men don't cry? Since when?

Why shouldn't adults cry if they need to?

I never even thought of thus emotional release as exclusively childlike.

This post is weird af

SlimLovin · 2017-12-11T17:28:32+00:00

"Peaches are peach. My skin is peach. I am a peach."

-Your Logic

This is also why I'm not prepared to accept a female holding a political office if they look like a cryer to me.

Donald Trump is the biggest crybaby on Earth.

They have to be completely hard nosed bitch like Indira Gandhi or Maggie Thatcher for me to even take them seriously.

Ah yes. Just what every woman is striving for: To be taken seriously by some sexist nobody.

madscientistlove · 2017-12-11T19:15:43+00:00

"Children cry, and women cry, therefore women are children" is terrible logic.

Dogs eat meat, and humans eat meat, therefor humans are dogs. Right?

TempestheDragon · 2017-12-11T09:49:20+00:00

Personally... I don't agree with your viewpoint.

BIOLOGY

Women crying more has a few biological factors

Under a microscope, cells of female tear glands look different than men's. Also, the male tear duct is larger than the female's, so if a man and a woman both tear up, the woman's tears will spill onto her cheeks quicker.

Women's tear ducts are smaller. We physically can't help crying more.

Research indicates that testosterone helps raise the threshold between emotional stimulus and the shedding of tears.

Male hormones form a further blockade on crying.

One hormone in tears is prolactin, a lactation catalyst. Just as it helps to produce milk, prolactin also aids in tear production. By the time women reach 18, they have 50 percent to 60 percent higher levels of prolactin in their bloodstream than men do.

Female hormones promote tearing. Again, another biological factor we can't help having.

As for crying to seek validation, I don't think that's necessarily true. Since I've already covered the biological factors on crying, it's safe to say a woman expressing her concerns and worries to her friend (not necessarily seeking validation... it could be anything from seeking advice, new perspective, and ways to resolve her problem) can spiral into a few brief sobs. Chances are, the woman never intended to cry to seek validation... the sobs just... came.

THE AFTER EFFECTS

And let's say she does cry and her friend is (luckily) supportive and empathetic.

According to this article crying actually makes you feel better. In contrast, if a man suppresses his emotions and never cries / deals with the emotions in a healthy way (letting stress and sadness weigh him down and draining him of the very energy he could be using to resolve the issue) he might not get the same results as the woman who cried.

Chances are, after the woman cries a bit with her friend over the phone, she will feel less stressed and clear-minded so she can resolve her issues better than someone who gets buried underneath them.

As for a female running political office who happens to be a crier (whatever the heck that means now that I've gone over the biological factors on why women cry more) since she is releasing her stress through crying, she can fix problems in her work and life which might be a good thing.

But another thing I'd like to say... the thought of a woman being a senator then going home and crying to a group of girlfriends to seek validation doesn't sit well with me.

However, if she just so happens to get a bit choked up while discussing issues with her friends, that's not so bad.

Hopefully, I've found some sort of "middle ground" in the discussion.

Another thing I'd like to point out...

Marriage counselors report that women have more empathy than men. Ever since we were babies we've been hardwired for empathy.

If more men than women lose this trait, can I take the claim that babies are more empathetic than men so therefore babies are superior to men?

No, of course not. That would be absurd.

Men are complex.

The fact that you feel the need to reduce women to mere children solely on the grounds that most women cry more than men comes across as too black-and-white.

Eastuss · 2017-12-11T13:32:51+00:00

People do not want to admit it, but the fact that crying isn't intentional doesn't mean you're not actively trying to manipulate others by crying. Crying is solely a communication tool.

The fact women keep doing it into adulthood doesn't depict a childish behaviour, but it rather depicts that men stopped crying because it is no longer an effective problem solving reaction, while it is still an effective tool for women.

The "women are children" comparison is here solely to make you understand that they depend on you, that this isn't an equal association. She can take care of herself, but she still want you to lead for her and to lead her.

KikiYuyu · 2017-12-11T20:07:29+00:00

Well your idea is based off of believing crying is an inherently childish thing.

It's pretty obvious that men are generally encouraged not to cry and to be tough, and women learn by observation that they get much more leeway.

I believe men and women act out childishly in different ways. If an emotionally immature woman isn't getting her way, she might cry some crocodile tears. But is that worse than an emotionally immature man stomping off, throwing something, hitting a wall when he doesn't get his way?

There's more to being childish than just crying. Unless you add more behaviours to the list, your way of judging is completely unfair.

eliechallita · 2017-12-11T20:32:59+00:00

Crying isn't limited to children: It's a normal response to many heightened emotional states, from distress and sadness to joy. I rarely cry, but I have cried as an adult on occasion either when things were going bad (when my grandfather died, when I was afraid I would lose my job and my visa, etc.) or when they were going really well (when I saw my mother for the first time in 2 years, when my fiancee and I got engaged) and I really don't think that any of them were childish or inappropriate.

I think that the reasons for which you might cry should change as you mature, but the act of crying by itself isn't an indicator of adulthood or maturity

Willow-girl · 2017-12-11T13:23:13+00:00

I always chuckle a bit at these assertions that women are childlike or "the oldest teenager in the house." Generally men are the perennial adolescents who play video games and surf porn, and need to be "reminded" to put their dirty socks in the hamper and dishes in the sink. No?

VasiliyZaitzev · 2017-12-11T09:08:05+00:00

So, I read once that, from an evolutionary perspective, women (and children) cry because men are really only good at figuring out when someone is angry at them, so crying indicates to men that a woman (or child) is hurt or needs attention in some way.

I have no idea if that's true, but it does make a certain amount of sense.

Mr_Smoogs · 2017-12-11T14:14:05+00:00

I think you are misinterpreting what it means to treat women like children. For the most part, when I treat my SO like a child it is seen as romantic. Holding the door for her, making her a lunch or putting on her coat. Things she would never do for me, because women hate babying their boyfriends. But when you treat your SO like a 'princess' so-to-speak, you are in fact treating her like a child.

i_have_a_semicolon · 2017-12-11T14:50:24+00:00

A women's greater propensity to cry mean nothing imo. So what if they cry ? It doesn't mean they make worse decisions.

Actually, males must expend more mental energy to control their emotions on a base level. Since controlling emotions takes mental energy and men do this for all emotions without paying regard to the consequence of holding those emotions, you can assume there are times when men are expending their mental energy when it's unnecessary and therefore waste their limited energy stores on inconsequential things. LOL. Meanwhile for women, they can be more choosy with where they apply this energy. Maybe they apply it at work but not at home, or at a big board meeting but not when chatting to a friend. The difference is they would have more energy left over than a man to do other things.

I've never believed there's strong evidence that crying == bad, but I do believe there are consequences to sapping all of your mental energy , for little reason to boot

BettyPages · 2017-12-11T18:59:44+00:00

Babies laugh a lot, too; doesn't mean people who laugh are childish. All adults have to share some traits with babies and children, seeing as we're the same species. It's basic human communication/expression.

wuboo · 2017-12-13T03:14:29+00:00

Crying makes someone a child or feminine? That’s stupid.

Aaren_Augustine · 2017-12-11T08:48:28+00:00

TLDR, you're basically saying you don't respect women because they act like dysfunctional men. Which is retarded. One behavior, like the propensity to cry more, doesn't make them less qualified humans.

If you are worried about a woman holding a political office because tears, are you not worried about a man holding a political office motivated by greed? Aren't you being just as irrational?

None of this is merit driven

Orange_Paisley · 2017-12-11T08:29:33+00:00

You would hate my boyfriend then. He cried when his niece miscarried at 5 months and he cried at the end of Jesus Christ Superstar. Some people just feel things more deeply than others and it is not a sign of weakness to me but a sign that he is frank about his emotions.

Il128 · 2017-12-11T12:45:07+00:00

Women are like children. The can't help but be deceiving and manipulative, because it works. They are entitled, things have always come easy and they always get more than they deserve. They have no accountability. They hold no thoughts or opinions of their own. No sense of fair play, honor or respect.

Finally, the key to their child like behavior is, women do not view sex as love or love as sex. She'll have sex with a man she hates and she'll withhold sex from men she loves. Sex is about being dominated. Love is about dominating.

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DB605 · 2017-12-12T01:43:54+00:00

This is a really weak (vaguely Foreign/Indian) sounding argument, and probably amongst the weakest arguments that could be made on the topic.

Women are no better than children because women cry and children cry is incredibly silly. Adult men cry too, for a myriad of reasons like their dog dying. The connection you're making for the foundation of your argument isn't even particularly strong.

ivegotsomequestions0 · 2017-12-13T02:12:14+00:00

You're looking at the symptom, not the problem.

You are associating crying with incompetence. However, incompetence and weakness is what you really see as childish -- quite rightly. If we had a person who cries frequently but never lets it stand in the way of getting shit done, and we had someone else who never cried and also shirked their responsibilities constantly, the second one would be the child. The crying is irrelevant.

AstuteBlackMan · 2017-12-11T08:55:40+00:00

Yes women are children. At least most of them. Most don't begin truly maturing till around 45 when their looks start to deteriorate.

They get jealous like children. A kid can have a toy play with it, then get bored and move on. Once they see another kid with a toy they get jealous and want it back. This happens to men occasionally but the amount of times I've seen it with women is laughable honestly.

They often act like children too. Yes. Some men do this but I've personally encountered scenarios like this. When they're upset they want to be held and caressed and told things will be ok. They enjoy male presence.

This isn't to say women are equal to children but the comparisons are really astonishing.

This is probably gonna get a lot of hate but I honestly don't care.

Title	CMV: the "women are children" trp notion isn't so ridiculous given how often females cry and the fact that they cry at all well into adulthood
Author	sumant28
Upvotes	5
Comments	102
Date	December 11, 2017 8:17 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/7j0wmx/cmv_the_women_are_children_trp_notion_isnt_so/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-the-women-are-children-trp-notion-isnt-so.264529 https://theredarchive.com/post/264529

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