Are most relationships with women really like this?

Alethiology · 2011-02-16T15:56:46+00:00

The short answer is: probably not. People are much more likely to comment on a negative experience than a positive or neutral one.

tomek77 · 2011-02-16T15:00:34+00:00

Many of the people in this subreddit have been personally hurt, and it shows, but the main point is that the current legal environment makes it extremely easy (and sometimes also profitable) for a woman to hurt a man. This is really the bottom line. Given the wrong set of incentives and rules, people tend to become abusive.

If you have a good relationship, you should cherish it because it doesn't happen every day in this day and age, and it gets worst as people get older..

On the other hand, know the risks: if you get married and have kids, she will have complete and absolute power over you. She can evict you, kidnap your kids, take your savings, and turn you into a wage-slave working for her benefit, under threat of imprisonment. As I said, this kind of power doesn't bring out the best in women an she has zero incentive to treat you with even the most basic respect. Will it change her? Nobody knows, but yes there are many cases of "decent" women turning into abusive monsters a decade or two later.. YMMV

enkidusfriend · 2011-02-16T16:26:44+00:00

You are correct. Not everyone has the same experiences as you.

I suppose there are issues that affect women in the same ways, though, too. Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?

I think the problem is seeing justice as some sort of universal goal that all people have the same interest in. Society is, at present, a field of competing interests and justice for many of the agents in that field means "whatever is best for me and the group that I identify with." In many cases the "just" cause for which a particular group is working towards is really a case of advocacy for individual or group power which they often see as being deservedly theirs or being unjustifiably withheld from them.

A society in which we all recognize what is "just" in a broad, variegated, and diverse manner seems like a lovely idea. That is not the society we live in, nor do I think we will see it anytime soon.

2011-02-16T15:37:32+00:00

This reddit only portrays the negative experiences men have with women and how the legal and societal situations men are put in are not fair to men. Men who are having a very fulfilling and loving relationship like you are and I am with my fiancée don't have as much to post that is negative. There are men that haven't been as lucky and their SOs have used unfair laws to screw them over. So in conclusion I would like to say that I'm happy for you and I hope none of these situations presented in this subreddit ever happen to you (or me for that matter.)

solinv · 2011-02-17T03:01:53+00:00

No. The situations discussed on this subreddit tend to be rare extreme cases of female craziness. There are men who are just as bad as the women described in this subreddit but they're crazy in a different way. Most people are decent and respectful towards other people. Just because there is a small minority of each gender that is manipulative and abusive that is no reason to stigmatize and discriminate against an entire gender.

tl;dr People are people. Don't let a small fucked up minority of them jade your world view.

deathsythe · 2011-02-16T15:13:24+00:00

A good majority of the relationships I have been in throughout the years have been very similar horror stories to some of the things mentioned here.

I am currently in a very loving relationship with a darling, caring, and adoring girlfriend that is very similar to the one you are in OP. I really wonder how/why I put up with all the crap when someone like my current girlfriend has been out there the whole time.

ineffable_internut · 2011-02-16T14:39:09+00:00

This subreddit points out the worst in male-female relationships. Not that it shouldn't be done, but extreme stories are the ones making the news/getting the upvotes. The normal stories don't really seem worth telling.

I find it to be very similar to the Rally to Restore Sanity and/or Fear. The most outspoken and extreme stories will be told, while the more normal ones won't.

zyk0s · 2011-02-16T18:52:23+00:00

My personal experience has been a very intense relationship with a girl I thought was smart, kind and would love me forever. We also shared a lot of opinions, and we would routinely talk about our views on how relationship should function, what it meant to share responsibilities. I even remember we made fun of feminists together.

I was very much in love and ready to do anything for her. Then, out of the blue, she "fell out of love" and that completely destroyed me. Among other things, I thought of how to hurt her as much as she had hurt me. But this is what I learned from the experience: 1. That women will be more prone then men to break up on a whim. I've seen it happen all around me, but I didn't want to believe it. There are ways to keep a girl around, but not the ones I was using, and if you fail at that there's little you can do to change her mind. The bottom line is you can never claim to fully know a person. 2. That a one-side initiated breakup after a very involved relationship can have a profound impact on the way people think and behave. If I had changed to the point of not recognizing myself, I know that were the tables turned, she would have also wanted to get revenge on me. And that's a dangerous thought, because 3. When things go bad, women have a multitude of ways of getting their revenge that men don't have. False accusation of violence, stalking, rape, in cases when you were both legal spouses, claims of alimony, when there are kids involved, exclusive custody of children and claims for child support. Fortunately, nothing like this happend to me because she was the one who wanted the separation, but I still pondered on what could have happend.

You'll notice that I didn't think my lesson was "women are bad", or even that my personal relationship was bad. But there are factors, natural and legal, that can way too easily transform what you think is now a loving relationship into a nightmare. The further involved you get, the higher the risks, contrary to what most people believe. I'm not saying this to try to discourage you, and obviously being always suspicious about the person we're supposed to love is not going to make things better. That's why the MRM is primarily concerned about changing the law to redress injustices for those to whom it happened, but most importantly to remove the risk factor from forming relationships with women.

ignatiusloyola · 2011-02-16T23:27:29+00:00

To some extent, a person will end up in relationships that are very similar to each other, simply because there are qualities of these partners that are initially attractive, but also often go along with other qualities that may be less attractive.

I have dated several people with Borderline Personality Disorder, primarily because they are very outgoing - a quality that initially attracts me.

That is the kind of trend I am talking about.

captainnomarriage · 2011-02-17T00:44:46+00:00

I think the thing is...they're not a bitch at the start...they're usually the nicest, sweetest loving girl until they realize they have you right where they want you. And "right where they want you" meaning they know you won't leave them either because they know you love her too much, moved in together, married, etc...

When they have you right where they want you is when you start seeing her true colors, suddenly you have to compromise a little bit more here, and a little bit more there. All the while she compromises a little bit less here and a little bit less there. Arguments start over meaningless stuff and no matter how much you try to win her over with logic and facts, that just makes her get more and more illogical and unreasonable and she will scream and yell and argue until you have had enough and just give her what she wants.

Tell me...have you had to give up any hobies or interests? Do you think that's just part of being in a relationship? Has she had you change anything about yourself, what you do or say...even the smallest thing, is a sign that she is working her way to fix you and change you into what she considers the ideal man. You may be okay with it now, but eventually you will be changed so much everything you do and think will be a result of her manipulation.

If you're lucky enough to have found someone who isn't like this, kudos to you...she is the exception to the rule. Either that or she's really good at manipulation and you're not even aware of it.

Damn, I think I'm starting to sound paranoid...ah well that is my only experience with women.

PierceHarlan · 2011-02-16T15:38:31+00:00

"Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?"

I'm founder of False Rape Society. I repeat my offer to do a rape website where the interests of rape victims AND false rape victims are both fairly represented. I've made this offer numerous times and have never had any feminist blogger express an interest.

I predict that not only will my good faith offer on this thread generate no interest, but that my comment itself will be downvoted by angry young feminists, for whom I am the devil incarnate.

2011-02-16T16:57:28+00:00

It makes sense that if you come from a kind, loving family full of mutual respect that you would try to find a companion who will meet those needs and expectations. Not everyone will find that on their first try.

Also, they might not want to admit it, but people who are in relationships with "crazy" person after "crazy" person have their own issues to work through before they will ever find a peaceful relationship.

toastedpirate · 2011-02-16T18:43:21+00:00

You sound like you have a good head on your shoulders and are mature (or have matured) and, perhaps, lucky. I have been on both sides of the coin personally, and even now that I am in a wonderful relationship where I don't have an ounce to complain about, and still see the abuse of males around me. I have several co-workers, friends and family that are perfect examples to just how bad it can get. I've taken women's studies courses and have volunteered at women's battered shelters. I feel like I have a well rounded viewpoint from my perspective. What I usually see is a universal "strong praying on the weak" whether the victim be male or female. Because of this I mainly lurk in this subreddit. I do, however, see a need for a little more equalization in the laws and social views of society as far as men's rights go. I will always support what is right in my opinion, and as of now, I feel men are being slighted in some ways.

Racehorse593 · 2011-02-16T22:21:36+00:00

I think you are the ideal advocate of Men's Rights. A fair minded individual who does not want be discriminated against is a simple, straightforward, and valuable position.

I saw a post here the other day which hit the top of the charts: Women teaches other women how to get free drinks. Then all these MR redditors hit up the comments on the link and started calling her a bitch or the antichrist. If you don't like being used, don't buy women drinks! It's really not that hard.

My point is, if they don't buy her or women like her drinks, they are not going to jail. They are not going to be branded as a mysoginist or a rapist. You only weaken your position if you betray that you are coming from a place of hurt or hostility. This is why people got super wet over non violent protest as a means of promoting equality.

And finally, it's not that I don't enjoy a, "bitches be crazy," of my own every once in a while, just maybe that belongs as a separate reddit, or at the very least a sub reddit. Actually, how do I make that?

RollerDoll · 2011-02-16T22:27:57+00:00

I think unfortunately that mensrights redditors and feminism redditors have an inherent mistrust of each other to the detriment of both sexes. The constant argument is "who has it worse" legally and economically, instead of talking about ways to change things. It's more comfy and safe in an echo chamber.

Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?

This.

2011-02-17T04:22:46+00:00

Women are some of the most amazing and loving creatures (or humans if you don't believe in humans being creatures) on earth.

Some fuck up and the legal system help them. It is to be expected that some fuck up but the fact that the legal system which is supposed to protect us the people helps them is the major issue.

bananapajama · 2011-02-16T15:06:46+00:00

Do most women in relationships really act the way that they're portrayed on this subreddit?

Not the ones I've been in relationships with. But I've been very selective and have good judgement of female character. However, the evidence I see is that this type of negative female behavior is becoming more prevalent.

Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?

If you look into any of the "big" points you mention, you will find in every case the people who are actively opposing attempts to improve the situation of men are self-identified feminists. These feminists are our enemy, not women in general.

There are good women - I married one - but even with a good woman you must pay attention to the dynamics of your relationship. It is important to understand what women really respond to, and how to maintain their sexual interest in a relationship. It is very important to understand that most of feminism's teachings about what women should want and how men should treat women are just flat out wrong and don't work. It is important to understand game, and how to use it in a LTR.

Cromlech · 2011-02-16T16:45:32+00:00

I'll start by saying that you are a fortunate guy for never having experienced a wrathful partner. To be in a great relationship is amazing for your life, and you are obviously doing something right by not ever entering into a bad relationship.

I too am in a fantastic relationship with an incredible woman. We married last May, and are working on having our first child. She's caring, understanding, supportive and an awesome person to be around all of the time. These people exist. If anything, this subreddit can point out what not to look for, what behaviours shouldn't be rewarded or overlooked, and gives men the ability to speak out about what they feel may be unjust.

Sure, there are going to be some redditors in this subreddit that can take the discord too far, but the bulk of its inhabitants are actually quite intellectual, and are not the typical woman-haters that they are perceived to be.

False rape claims don't get media attention, and yet are so incredibly damaging, they must be addressed. Only through pointing out their prevalence will the thoughts on this topic change. HOW we argue about this may need to be refined, but at least there's a conversation happening.

As for your questions about why people would stay in a bad relationship? That's kind of attacking the victim. People don't always know that their relationship is going to be bad from the beginning. People change. Situations change. I'm in a great relationship now, but that's after going through small handful of AWFUL relationships along the way. I lived, and learned from those experiences as to what's healthy, and what's not. Sometimes we don't have an expectation about what a good relationship looks like, but once we see it or get a glimpse of it, we know what to seek and what to help grow.

Now, I will say that your "why can't we all work together" sentiment doesn't work here. The reason is such that Men's Rights are still seen as a joke by the feminist side. If anything, you should try posting this same post on their side and see what comes up.

This is a subreddit that allows men to bring up their issues that aren't taken seriously. There are more than just the false rape claims: - An almost automatic decision making process regarding male circumcision - Overreaching legislation that punishes men for being male - The fact that we die earlier in life - The fact that we take on the bulk of the world's most dangerous jobs - Advertising and media and the portrayal of men on television as dumb apes - Family courts and their huge slant regarding custody battles - The art of gold digging - Divorce laws and the ridiculous settlements that damage the nature of marriage - The flippant comments and jokes made about men, violence directed towards men, and attitude deriding men in the media and society that goes overlooked

It's not an us vs them mentality that is necessarily the goal of this subreddit. It's just the fact that their is an 'us' and that we have feelings, challenges and issues that deserve their own recognition and attention.

Not all women are bad. But those that seek to destroy what it is to be male are of concern and must be addressed.

VoodooIdol · 2011-02-16T16:48:12+00:00

Do most women in relationships really act the way that they're portrayed on this subreddit?

Yes and no. To be fair, not many men act terribly well in relationships either. The problem, for the most part, is that people don't know how to actually get to know each other any longer. People get into relationships because of a mutual attraction and/or because it seems the right choice for their career/what they perceive as their social future. Most people don't even understand that they are doing this. The end result is that you end up with a whole lot of relationships between people who don't know each other and aren't even a remotely decent personality match. The results of such relationships go from mildly annoying to incredibly bad.

aaomalley · 2011-02-16T21:14:10+00:00

I am a survivor of abuse. My ex-fiance used to get drunk and beat the crap out of me pretty much every night. Was she a bad person? No, she was an alcoholic. That doesn't mean it wasn't right to end it, even if it took 3 years, but it does mean that now that she is clean I still care about her.

Many of the men here have been through hell with a woman at some point in thier lives. Also, you have never been through a divorce or a custody battle, so you don't know how your significant other would respond to those situations. Often times that is when the worst of people come out, and is what has tainted a lot of mens view of women on this forum.

I personally think most women are great people who may have some flaws, jsut like men. We, however, tend to deal with the worst of the worst in this subreddit because it is the focus of our conversation. If you aren't careful a person can come to belive that all women are like this, which isn't the case. The stories here are meant as a warning about the women that are that way, and how to try to avoid them.

What this forum has taught me is that I don't ever plan on getting married, although I do plan on living with and possibly having children with a woman in the future. I don't plan on /ever having unprotected sex, even if she is on the pill or other birth control (which is something I did much of in my youth) unless I get a vasectomy. I plan on getting a contract drawn up in the event of long-term co-habitation that would be much like a pre-nup that protects the intermingling of our finances. This is to protect myself from the predatory women out there, while still remaining open to the wonderfaul and beautiful women that do stand for equality (which is most of them)

Thinks_Like_A_Man · 2011-02-16T20:55:18+00:00

As a woman, I have an opinion on this that will no doubt be downboated into oblivion.

TL;DR It's all about competition.

Men (as a whole, we're not talking about you personally or any individual) do not value women for being a good mother, a nice individual, caring, kind, compassionate, or smart. They like these things, but when was the last time you heard a guy say, "I would like to meet a woman who would be good at raising children?" Or, "I would gladly date a troll if she was a genuinely nice person?"

Men value women who are beautiful, first and foremost.

Even if they want a nerdy girl, they still want a hot nerdy girl. Even if they believe that other characteristics are important, they will not seek out a woman who has those and ignore the looks portion. They will not choose an intelligent woman who is also fat and ugly. If they settle, it will often be a smart woman who isn't ugly, but merely average looking.

And while I understand that we're naturally drawn to people who are more attractive, men seem to put an undue amount of value on this one characteristic. And many men will often ignore other important qualities to get this, and I personally believe it is because they get a pay-off by being able to land the hot chick.

In other words, the hotter a woman is the less likely she needs to be nice, caring, compassionate or anything positive in order to "succeed" in the dating world. No matter how wonderful a woman is, her ability to date is proportional to her level of hotness. Big tits are far more important than say something like charity.

Women who are very ugly, or fat and the most wonderful human being in the world will have significantly fewer dates (if any) than a model type who is completely mentally fucked up. I know of extremely wonderful yet unattractive women who have meaningful relationships, but no matter how great they are, they will not be able to "score" as much as a hot, bitchy, mean, mentally-ill, drug addicted, bulimic, hot chick.

I know of a crack whore who regularly abandons her children who is dating a slew of middle-aged, average guys, while her best friend, who is fat but a great individual hasn't had a date in three years. The two women hang out all the time. Men don't fucking care that the crack whore is a terrible mother, because she's hot. Hotness excuses a lot of personal failings in women.

And why do dates matter? Because you don't have a relationship without a date. So the fucked-up, beautiful woman has more opportunity to do damage than the nice woman has to heal those wounds. Men keep hoping for the holy grail, a beautiful woman who doesn't have to work hard to maintain it, that also has a heart of gold. Those women exist, but they are rare.

So women are trained (for lack of a better word) that their character and integrity mean nothing, that their real capital in relationships is their looks followed by their sexiness. If this is not valued by society, why would someone work to develop it?

Which is going to be more beneficial for a woman. . . spending her time and resources getting fake tits or making the world a better place?

P.S. BEFORE YOU FLAME ME please understand that I realize there are exceptions to this, and I am talking about groups as a whole, and the general trends in both genders. I am not talking about you personally, or lumping every single person into these groups.

2011-02-17T00:03:45+00:00

Insane<--X-----------------Normal------------------Y-->Insane

Where X=MensRights and Y=feminisms. Until both sides decide to stop being so radical and disrespectful, no one wins. Its much like democrats and republicans, except that Men vs. Women often has valid points to stand behind, whereas Reps and Dems are generally both a bunch of posturing jerks playing to the lowest common denominator.

MoriPPT · 2011-02-16T18:47:32+00:00

Your titular question: Pretty sure this is a no unless you're attracted to some subset of women who often turn out to be crazy.

No doubt, false rape accusations are one of the worst things in our society and give women unjust power over men. And men's parental rights are nowhere near as established as women's. I suppose there are issues that affect women in the same ways, though, too. Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?

Because these issues aren't given as much press in comparison to their severity. And working together against all types of injustice is great, but when was the last time you saw a group dedicated to fixing everything in the world? Groups with focus are more effective.

kragshot · 2011-02-17T00:11:11+00:00

To further elaborate on Tomek's response; there are quite a few women who are just regular human beings and furthermore a significant number of those I just mentioned do not even identify as being feminists. While there are quite a few men here who espouse the "don't get married" concept, the point of those discussions are to make the general population aware of the inequity that is currently present in the family court system in particular and with the balance between men and women in general.

The point of this reddit is not to make you skeptical of your current partner, but to simply make you aware of the current socio-political nature of heterosexual relationships in general and how they are skewed against heterosexual males.

Most people lean toward being considerate and decent toward each other. But there is a specific subgroup of people who allegedly identify as "feminists" and these people have a significant investment in souring the attitudes of women to turn them against men. In addition, they have influenced the legal and social climate in many western countries to make such attitudes acceptable. Because of this, specific women who are willing to indulge in illegal activity and socially reprehensible behavior against males (and already have done these things) are given an unfair degree of legal and social consideration when they are brought to task for their actions.

The purpose of this reddit is to bring those inequalities to light and to discuss what can and should be done to right these wrongs.

The anger and bitterness you see here is equivalent to the same anger and bitterness you see on some feminist websites. Both groups are angry and frustrated at the (perceived) injustices that they have suffered and often come to their respective sites to vent. A male posting in a feminist forum is often told that they should expect and respect this anger and bitterness towards them as it is justified. We agree and feel that females who post here should not be surprised or angry when they get that here from some men.

I hope that helps you understand things here.

waldoxwaldox · 2011-02-17T00:16:29+00:00

when guys are desperate they get involved with shitty women...

not all men will get involved with just anyone ... seems like you are pickier than most

I_divided_by_0- · 2011-02-17T11:52:30+00:00

I'm not going to lay on the couch and rehash my issues, but for me, it's hard to enter into relationships of any substance. This is because when I was younger it was drilled into me that all men are rapists. Now everytime I have sex with a woman, I can't enjoy it unless she is actively enjoying and I can see it. It makes it hard to have a good relationship of any kind.

Relationships are built on trust, and because of years of mental abuse, mostly by women but also by 'heroistic' men, it's hard for me to overcome the feeling that I can't trust myself and 'control my urges'.

PJP9623 · 2011-02-16T15:54:41+00:00

I had a certifiably insane girlfriend for a over a year that failed to see just how hypocritical her "devotion to radical feminism" as she liked to call it was. I thought it had blinded her to the point that she pigeon-holed all men as sex-craving, insensitively empty shells, and completely defeated the supposed purpose of her beliefs, until I realized that gender equality wasn't her purpose; she was simply bigoted and sexist. In response to ech0sphere, I DID put my dick in crazy, and it hasn't gone too many places in the short time since.

2011-02-16T19:06:10+00:00

I dated a girl (I'd say woman, but that would be gross exaggeration), for seven years, who gradually got worse and worse. Or maybe she was the same the entire time, and it took me seven years to realize how crazy she was. She alienated me from my friends, constantly made a scene in public by verbally abusing me. She always wanted to fight about everything, all the time. And, of course, she never listened, and always thought she was right no matter what. She was under the impression that the best way to strengthen a relationship, was to fight. By the end, verbal abuse turned into physical abuse. Hitting me, throwing things at me. Her poor attitude toward life, made my friends not want to be around her or me anymore. And I could never do anything without her. She needed attention 24hrs a day. Calling her multiple times a day to check in, never having a "guys night," never eating without her there, sleeping without here there, etc etc. No time to myself aside from being at work. If I didn't give her the attention that she needed, it inevitably turned into another fight. So after seven years of abuse, I finally had to end things. Why I stayed with her that long? I'm still asking myself that.

A year after we broke up, I started dating someone else who was amazing. We got along great, all my friends liked her, mutually respectful, all the good things you could want. She had amazing taste in music and had awesome ideas of cool places to go and fun things to do. We had a lot of fun together. However, after a year of dating, she turned out to be a lesbian. No joke. I mean that quite literally, not derogatory at all. She wanted to date women instead of men.

So yea, I'm taking a break from women.

tl;dr Dated crazy for 7 years. After that, dated a girl who turned out to be lesbian. fml

ech0sphere · 2011-02-16T15:15:12+00:00

congratulations, you DID NOT stick your dick in crazy. However, crazy abounds in the world around you. If it did not, this sub would not exist. I am lucky enough to have a good woman also. She would never do the things that you read about here. But my heart still aches for those who have been shat on by the injustices of the world. Most of the people here wish for true equality of men and women and are quick to expose things that don't fit that bill (radical feminism).

eventhorizon07 · 2011-02-16T21:08:25+00:00

I think it's kind of like a "Good customer service/bad customer service" story. The people who get good customer service don't tell that many people the story. But those who get bad customer service will tell everyone that wants to listen, and even some who don't, the story of how everything was all fucked up. I don't think there are more bad relationships than good, you just hear about the bad ones the most. I have been married to a wonderful woman for 9 years this year and it's had it's up's and down's. I think the previous crappy relationships before I met her helped me be a better person in our marriage.

2011-02-16T23:00:18+00:00

Not only are you participating in a subredit for men who believe their rights are suffering by the hand of the opposite sex, but you are witnessing a majority of people that get involved in the same type of bad relationships over and over, complain about the outcome, and blame it on their partners.

In other words, you hear more stories from a single bad habit than you do from different men with different experiences. I think there is a guy here that says he had 50 relationships all lasting more than 6 months (LOL...do the math), and that all but two women cheated on him. Geez, wonder what might cause that trend!

I think he's picking up dates at "Lookers" on the beach. lol

radioactive21 · 2011-02-16T17:19:02+00:00

Please do not mistake my tone, I am not trying to sound like a douche. BUT you are in a subreddit that deals mostly with negative experience towards men. It's like going to a surgeon and being surprised he recommended surgery.

These are some really bad case scenarios that men have experienced. Don't get me wrong these things do happen, but again, I also know women who have been mistreated by men, so it cuts both ways.

The only things I read out of mensright is when it deals with the court system, or laws relating to men, which I strongly believe favors women. Everything else I take with a grain of salt.

On the bright side, it does seem like you have a good relationship, dont let the negativity spoil it.

mean0dean0 · 2011-02-16T21:58:48+00:00

Never had a bad relationship--in fact, I've been the asshole in pretty much every one. But that's just because I've always had my eye on the prize, and girls are notorious for wanting their guys to stop focusing on their dreams and start focusing on them, their shared dreams (like stability for her, a house for her stuff, a dog for her, kids for her, etc.). I have always been married to my work, and most women don't want to play second fiddle. I don't hold it against them--I wouldn't necessarily want me as a partner, either! But I know what I do want, and I go for that instead.

Kaluthir · 2011-02-16T23:16:12+00:00

No, but the most extreme stories are the ones that get published.

TBcasualty · 2011-02-16T18:02:31+00:00

I am a 22 year old male, living with my girlfriend of 2.5 years. Our relationship is exactly like yours. Additionally, our parents both also have great relationships. I am in love and I am excited about the prospect of spending my entire life with this woman. THAT BEING SAID, my last girlfriend before her was a complete cunt. She treated me like shit, stole money from me, put me into situations where I had to get involved with her own life issues, and eventually lied to me about having STDs and being pregnant (both false, thankfully). The fact is, you and I are lucky, but we're the exception. Many women feel that they have the right to treat men like shit, and if we don't put a stop to it, more men will end up trapped in relationships that they want out of but do not have the luxury or the means to leave (kids, financial situations, etc.)

Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice?

That's what we're here for. There are men who aren't as lucky as we have been, and need resources to help them. Unfortunately, all of those resources only go to women. That's why it's mens rights, we're fighting for our rights to equal treatment and assistance.

gaviidae · 2011-02-17T06:07:52+00:00

I don't think everyone here is in a bad relationship. Personally, I've been in a wonderful relationship for 20 years with a woman who has been kind and wonderful to me for those years.

But just because it isn't happening to me doesn't mean I don't care about problems that are happening to others. In American society we have worked hard to get rid of the inequalities towards women but in the meantime we have not done much to get rid of the inequalities towards men.

2011-02-17T08:33:45+00:00

Happy women do not, unhappy women who get one sided advice for other unhappy women, yes.

Women can be the worst offenders because at their core they seem to be driven by emotions and not by rational thought.

But seriously, if you're in a happy relashionship jsut go with the flow. It's not going to turn out like the worst cases soemtimes described on here.

Why can't we all work together and fight all kinds of injustice, whether it's "male" or "female" in nature?

Coopt the agenda of the feminist movement if you want to work together... Otherwise I suggest males need a coopterative absent females.

FreddyDeus · 2011-02-17T09:24:21+00:00

There are great women out there, and if you find one, treat her well and value her. You seem to have found one.

jacobman · 2011-02-17T09:36:10+00:00

We can talk about anything, disagree about anything, without either of getting upset. I know she has my back in any situation, and she has my best interests at heart.

That's all good and well, while you're going out. The key word being while.

2011-02-17T21:29:10+00:00

Short answer: no. This subreddit is garbage. Don't buy into how hateful and ignorant all these "men" are. This sub is for people who want rape (against women) to become legal.

wild-tangent · 2011-02-18T16:27:59+00:00

Most people aren't like this. But when you break up, sometimes things get ugly.

anarchyinmypants · 2011-02-16T15:40:52+00:00

No. Most of the stuff that blows up on this subreddit really only pertains to "don't stick your dick in crazy" relationships. And if you point out that not every woman is like that, you will automatically get downvoted. I truly did come here with an open mind but I'm over this subreddit. I should have stopped reading when one user claimed that if he was on jury duty for a date rape case, he would motion to acquit the defendant automatically. Peace (I can't wait for the downvotes).

Aavagadrro · 2011-02-16T20:11:04+00:00

Out of 50 relationships that went longer than 6 months, only two over 3 years, all but two women cheated on me. Only one never lied to me. The one I married was horrible, an abusive bi polar cunt that still only wants money. She could beat, scratch, kick, bite, throw shit at me with impunity because the cops would laugh it off or tell me to leave, and if I ever hit her it would have been very different. I am not a small guy, but I couldnt do much to defend myself against her without hurting her.

She fucked her best friends husband, had two kids that werent mine that I am paying support for, and has fucked my credit so bad with her inability to pay her own bills that I will never be able to get a loan for anything. Yeah they came after me for her bills, even when she was remarried to a real piece of shit that she can control, because I was gainfully employed.

I am very wary of women, and I got a vasectomy to prevent anyone else from claiming it was my kid.

aaomalley · 2011-02-16T21:13:27+00:00

I am a survivor of abuse. My ex-fiance used to get drunk and beat the crap out of me pretty much every night. Was she a bad person? No, she was an alcoholic. That doesn't mean it wasn't right to end it, even if it took 3 years, but it does mean that now that she is clean I still care about her.

Many of the men here have been through hell with a woman at some point in thier lives. Also, you have never been through a divorce or a custody battle, so you don't know how your significant other would respond to those situations. Often times that is when the worst of people come out, and is what has tainted a lot of mens view of women on this forum.

I personally think most women are great people who may have some flaws, jsut like men. We, however, tend to deal with the worst of the worst in this subreddit because it is the focus of our conversation. If you aren't careful a person can come to belive that all women are like this, which isn't the case. The stories here are meant as a warning about the women that are that way, and how to try to avoid them.

What this forum has taught me is that I don't ever plan on getting married, although I do plan on living with and possibly having children with a woman in the future. I don't plan on /ever having unprotected sex, even if she is on the pill or other birth control (which is something I did much of in my youth) unless I get a vasectomy. I plan on getting a contract drawn up in the event of long-term co-habitation that would be much like a pre-nup that protects the intermingling of our finances. This is to protect myself from the predatory women out there, while still remaining open to the wonderfaul and beautiful women that do stand for equality (which is most of them)

Thinks_Like_A_Man · 2011-02-16T17:37:41+00:00

[permanently deleted]

KazMux · 2011-02-16T16:55:24+00:00

You shouldn't really judge what kind of relationships redditors are in, based on whats posted here. Of course there are lots of good women and working relationships out there. People just don't post about that kind of stuff because it isn't very interesting.

redox000 · 2011-02-16T18:42:46+00:00

Whenever one group of people has power over another, there will always be people that abuse that power, though not everyone will.

tedtutors · 2011-02-16T18:46:56+00:00

Have you had a relationship with a woman that started out well but ended badly? Or if she was a bitch to begin with, why form a relationship with her at all?

I'll jump to the "why" question on this one: men aren't trained to be good judges of women. By the time we know what we wish we'd known, it's often too late.

If I addressed your other question about good relationships that ended badly, the common thread would be that I failed to recognize danger signals. That makes it my fault, sure, but when I go thinking over past mistakes, the really big mistake I made was in getting away from my family and doing it all on my own. Some feedback from older siblings or a parent might have helped me see things that were going wrong.

I am glad to hear you have a good relationship. Keep it. Do not go blindly into the future; lots of people here can warn you of the fact that you do not know what your partner will be like in ten years. We all change with time, our bodies move into different phases and what we think we want changes.

You are smart to be thinking of your own protection. Keep that attitude, and keep the girl too. She sounds like a winner.

themanbat · 2011-02-16T21:58:07+00:00

Almost all relationships start off well. Of course they do. Everyone is on their best behavior at the beginning. It's when the crap hits the fan that you discover how crazy people can get.

One of my female friends somehow got a restraining order against her ex husband even though she admitted in court that he had never hit or threatened to hit either her or the kids. She said she needed it because she still felt threatened. Then after she had the restraining order she repeatedly asked me to go with her to places that she knew her ex was going to be on days when he had the kids. I refused to go. Clearly it was all about fighting dirty and making her ex suffer.

2011-02-16T22:27:41+00:00

I havent been in many relationships and none of them met this criteria

actually a lot of mine (especially my first when i was in the 7th grade) i am the one who screwed things up

AyeMatey · 2011-02-17T02:59:03+00:00

Maybe I've just been lucky my entire life, but all the relationships I've had with women have been mutually respectful and satisfying. My parents have always had a great relationship as well; certainly, they don't take advantage or manipulate each other. And my relationship with my girlfriend is excellent. We can talk about anything, disagree about anything, without either of getting upset. I know she has my back in any situation, and she has my best interests at heart.

This was me.

Then we got married, we had, I thought, a great marriage. 4 great kids. I had a good job, she elected to stay home while the kids were young. When the last one turned 6, she decided to start an affair. Which went badly. The other man was married as well. He divorced, he lost all custody of his three kids. My ex was shocked that this would happen. He was the stay-at-home dad, but the court did not look kindly on his infidelity. And his ex-wife went for the jugular. It worked - she won all custody and he got a tiny "see ya later" settlement.

Seeing that I suppose scared my ex. For a while she said she wanted to work out our marriage, but in reality she never stopped seeing her lover. She then lodged abuse allegations against me, which immediately separated me from the kids, and the marital home and all my belongings. That never changed.

Up until her affair, and subsequent unfounded allegations, I was you.

I walked out of the courtroom after losing my kids, wondering.... what the hell happened to me?

That's why I'm a men's rights advocate.

LunarFalcon · 2011-02-17T06:32:57+00:00

I'm a woman and I'm engaged to someone who I believe is the sweetest man alive. For both of us the most important thing in the world is each other and we talk out our few differences in a reasonable and calm manner. I was abused by my father emotionally and physically as a child and I have a lot of baggage from that but my fiance is understanding and supportive of me trying to resolve my issues and he knew about them as we were entering into a relationship. I love being able to help him with his problems as well and to see him smile truly makes me happy. I would really like to think that we have a loving and healthy relationship together.

2011-02-16T18:33:09+00:00

In my experience, the situation you've described is rare. Relationships always start out polite and respectful, but over time, the woman becomes more demanding, and her urge to pay for half of the expenses will turn into a sense of entitlement for things that you supposedly owe her.

thetrollking · 2011-02-16T16:10:12+00:00

Well, there are several things going on. First, probably like you, I was raised mostly by females and told how females are by females only to try and try and try to ignore and wave off their bad behavior. I met girls that were bitchy and stayed away from them. But I also met girls and fell in love with them and side stepped what should have been warning signs cause I was in love and lonely and in many cases dealing with the fallout of the relationship that came before her and the one before that one and so on. I put up with a lot of shit from my exs that I never put up with from female friends and I put up with tons of shit from female friends that I wouldn't have put up wth from male friends and I put up with all that stuff and would have never put up with it from a random female. It took me getting to a point where I said fuck it I won't deal cause I have had it up to here(lifts hand over head). I stood back from the situation and looked around at my relationships and my buddies relationships and started just reflecting and analyzing it. It actually took me about a year of reading feminist blogs on almost a daily basis for a hour or two a day before I was able to get rid of my feminist programming and to start working on my cognitive dissonance. In that time I went from lurking on mrm sites every now and then to posting. That was about a year ago, I started posting on the spearhead right after it went up. I don't just base my experience from gfs though, just look around at the media and how women your age act. Do you really think the media controls them like feminists claim? If so then women are far stupider than I could or would ever claim. But if you think that then read a marketing and advertising book. Culture and media is nothing more than individul and group behaviors in the aggregate.

Now sense you talk about your gf, let me say I have had some that were amazing and one or two that I really might would marry if I could go back in time. Just looking at my own past I can see that I was way too passive and basically took the girls that didnt chase after me but were available to me and the ones(sometimes hotter sometimes not) who did really pursue me made me shy and uncomfortable and I really wish I had not clammed up but instead been more assertive with them.

But let's not focus on gfs so much and look at all the little things women do. There is a reason women are said to nag. They won't usually come up and just punch you but instead try to kill you with a thousand paper cuts. Look at all the male bashing and misandry on tv and in general female or coed spaces. Look at the tacit approval for female manipulation.

Another thing. Do you really think gfs and wives that are evil act that way to get you into a relationship with them? They aren't that stupid. It is not until they know they have you hooked emotionally that they begin to drop the perfomance and reveal their true selfs. Be careful dating feminists. They are the ones who say gender is nothing more than a performance.

Also if you look at the big picture points that you claim to agree with then you will see it is mostly women, some feminist and some not, and feminist men who appose things like false accusers going to jail. Pointing out general trends in society on the female side is NOT a indictment of your lovely lady.

ataraxiary · 2011-02-16T17:25:19+00:00

[permanently deleted]

J4CKJ4W · 2011-02-16T17:37:23+00:00

There are a lot of terrible ~~women~~ people out there. You're lucky 1. Not to be one of them, and 2. Not to have dated any of them. Like, really, really lucky.

aaomalley · 2011-02-16T21:15:29+00:00

I am a survivor of abuse. My ex-fiance used to get drunk and beat the crap out of me pretty much every night. Was she a bad person? No, she was an alcoholic. That doesn't mean it wasn't right to end it, even if it took 3 years, but it does mean that now that she is clean I still care about her.

Many of the men here have been through hell with a woman at some point in thier lives. Also, you have never been through a divorce or a custody battle, so you don't know how your significant other would respond to those situations. Often times that is when the worst of people come out, and is what has tainted a lot of mens view of women on this forum.

I personally think most women are great people who may have some flaws, jsut like men. We, however, tend to deal with the worst of the worst in this subreddit because it is the focus of our conversation. If you aren't careful a person can come to belive that all women are like this, which isn't the case. The stories here are meant as a warning about the women that are that way, and how to try to avoid them.

What this forum has taught me is that I don't ever plan on getting married, although I do plan on living with and possibly having children with a woman in the future. I don't plan on /ever having unprotected sex, even if she is on the pill or other birth control (which is something I did much of in my youth) unless I get a vasectomy. I plan on getting a contract drawn up in the event of long-term co-habitation that would be much like a pre-nup that protects the intermingling of our finances. This is to protect myself from the predatory women out there, while still remaining open to the wonderfaul and beautiful women that do stand for equality (which is most of them)

2011-02-17T00:25:13+00:00

Do most women in relationships really act the way that they're portrayed on this subreddit?

Yes. I've had one good relationship. But the truth is, most women will take as much advantage of a man as they can get away with. It's like dating a con artist. The worst part is that most women do it subconsciously.

2011-02-17T04:30:41+00:00

"My parents have always had a great relationship as well; certainly, they don't take advantage or manipulate each other."

Is that a bit of an excuse? Is not taking advantage or manipulating the definition of a "great" relationship? Do you believe they still love each other the way you love your GF? Do you think they once did? Are you sure both of them really feel their relationship is "great"?

Perhaps you think is "normal" for love to wane and for the couple to find a more mature love. While that may be correct, do you think that is where your parents are now?

Have you asked your parents, perhaps your dad, while alone on a camping trip or maybe while playing golf, if he his happy in his marriage? You might be surprised at the answer. I was when I asked my dad.

MensRightsClown · 2011-02-16T19:49:19+00:00

Welcome to Men's Rights.

Rule #1: Women are cunts.

Rule #2: There's no such thing as rape.

Rule #3: GET THE FUCK OUT, YOU VAGINA-LOVING PIECE OF SHIT.

2011-02-16T14:37:56+00:00

Watch out, your girlfriend is obviously an alien in a human skin waiting to eat your face. To answer your question... Yes.

2011-02-17T09:59:48+00:00

I have a good woman, but the vast majority of western women are not "good".

Almost every woman I know enjoys her privilege and plays the victim in some way, even though some are much worse than others.

I've grown up with female privilege and entitlement staring me in the face. Whether it's card-carrying feminists, or just your everyday woman who thinks a man should pay for the privilege of taking her out dinner, or who says things about men and boys she could never say about women or girls, or who spouts BS statistics about how "bad" women have it, or the discrimination I face from our "justice" system just for having a penis, the list is endless.

I've grown up facing misandry every day from society, the media, men and women both.

Just because I have found a good woman doesn't mean I won't fight against misandry tooth and nail. Just because I personally can avoid most of the problems resulting in our society from misandry doesn't mean I won't be passionate about men's rights. And it doesn't mean I won't warn men I know about the dangers of marriage.

50% of marriages will end in divorce. Many more of those will be unhappy ones which the woman would happily leave if the guy stopped "providing" his paycheck. I'd guess that the percentage of marriages that would end in divorce when hubby can't work anymore would be about 90%. Most women, if their husband got sick and became bed ridden for the rest of his life, would leave him. Most western women are NOT "good". That's just the truth. Things may have been different 100 years ago.

So, yes, most relationships with women ARE really like this. Even when you find one good enough to marry, she probably won't love you as much as you love her the vast majority of the time. She won't want to make it work as much as you do. Most western woman know nothing about commitment.

wavegeekman · 2011-02-16T19:45:30+00:00

men's parental rights are nowhere near as established as women's

You haven't been through a divorce or had a child with a woman who then left you have you? If you had you would recognize your comment above as a massive understatement.

More generally you argument is an example of "Not All Women Are Like That" (NAWALT). I would suggest your perspective and experience are limited.

The point of 'game' and MRAs is not that women are evil. Rather, women think and act in a certain way and you are delusional not to recognize that. See for example "Understanding hypergamy" at this link

http://www.the-spearhead.com/2010/07/31/10-things-i%E2%80%99ll-teach-my-sons-about-women/

It may well be that the one you're with is alright, but with a 50% divorce rate and the catastrophic consequences of divorce and of separated parenthood, you had better be damn sure you are right.

captainnomarriage · 2011-02-17T02:40:33+00:00

Not all women are bad, just like not all hand grenades will explode when you pull the pin. The problem is in both cases by the time you find out which one you have, it's usually too late.

2011-02-17T05:38:24+00:00

My girlfriend is wonderful. Beautiful, smart, funny. Most of the cunts referred to in here reside in /OneY and /TwoX (although there are plenty of nice women in /TwoX

Title	Are most relationships with women really like this?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	80
Comments	195
Date	February 16, 2011 2:34 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/fmh9d/are_most_relationships_with_women_really_like_this/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/are-most-relationships-with-women-really-like-this.1043084 https://theredarchive.com/post/1043084

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