Rape culture

Auldreekie · 2012-08-16T03:55:09+00:00

The funny thing about rape culture is that the real reason it's such a big issue isn't the actual act. The more I learned about it the more i realized that the main issue with rape culture is establishing women as victims of men. If rape was the main issue then we wouldn't have to classify male and female rape or what sex was more responsible, it shouldn't be an issue who gets rapped more or who rapes more but instead how to stop rape. It's become a cirlce jerk of feminist claiming that men as a whole are preying on women.

I remember at one point someone tried to argue with me that rape was worst than murder. This was one of the first signs that the focus on this crime was mainly caused by the fact that feminist saw this as a "men hurting women crime". Try talking about male rape and see how quickly it's ignored.

2012-08-16T07:11:03+00:00

The ironic thing is that the term "rape culture" actually originated as a reference to the rape of men in prison. It was then appropriated by feminists to describe rape of women

http://meddlingrationalarchivist.wordpress.com/rape-culture/

The rape of a woman (by a man, because women don't rape dontchaknow) is seen as one of the worst things that can happen to somebody

Whereas the rape of a man by a man is seen as comedy gold. and the "rape" of a man by a woman is seen as... well, awesome.

So to suggest that society condones, even encourages the rape of women is to be completely blind to reality

yourfaceyourass · 2012-08-16T04:41:52+00:00

Rape is considered to be one of the most appalling crimes in our society.

I really wonder how many people actually protect rapists and say that the rapist should be able to rape women because it was always the women's fault.

The shocking part is that in any study on how prevalent victim blaming is, its found that more women than men are likely to say the female victim of rape is partially or completely responsible when intoxicated.

Heres one study I found http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-369262/Women-blame-raped.html

Of course, it doesn't clarify as to what "partly blames" means. I imagine the rationale for those answering it was "Even though thats terrible, she could have prevented it". Its like being shocked that people would find friends of drunk drivers partly responsible for letting them drive drunk. The study also never clarifies if the man was also intoxicated, or clearly defines rape, and hence leaves the situation very vague and open to analysis. Seems like a goal orientated study. But nonetheless, this says nothing more than that the public is throughly uneducated about rape, and there is no rational reason to identify this problem anything more than a lack of education on the topic. Likewise, the public takes male rapes as a joke. Hardly a patriarchal rape society. Oh but people think male rape is a joke because of the patriarchy too?!

When Strauss Kahn, a privileged white male politician, is completely booted out of politics on merely an allegation of rape which was withdrawn due to a lack of evidence, its hard to take seriously that society protects rapists.

Also, to quote Camille Pagilla,

Pornography does not cause rape or violence, which predate pornography by thousands of years. Rape and violence occur not because of patriarchal conditioning but because of the opposite, a breakdown of social controls.

moosetastrophe · 2012-08-16T05:37:02+00:00

[permanently deleted]

tigalicious · 2012-08-16T05:38:45+00:00

See, there's never been a doubt in my mind that what you described isn't exactly what rape culture is. Not that you're turning it on it's head, but that your example is a perfect depiction of one of the most extreme manifestations of rape culture that we have in our society.

As I've always seen it, it's not just the idea that men are assumed to be predators and women as prey. It's also that men are assumed to be invincible (other side of that coin being, women as weak). Men's pain isn't taken seriously because the "victim" role is already taken. I feel that women do have to deal with the constant fear of rape itself. But, men have to fear the consequences of being feared (false accusations being highest on that list of course), and they also have to fear society's denial of the very existence of their emotional pain.

Honestly, I don't have the emotional energy to hold a debate if anyone feels the need to respond to this comment. It just struck me as odd that we both see the same evidence as proof of opposite things.

Tamen_ · 2012-08-16T12:06:39+00:00

It is interesting that the definition of rape culture many feminist use are a perfect example of rape culture:

A rape culture is a complex of beliefs that encourages male sexual aggression and supports violence against women. It is a society where violence is seen as sexy and sexuality as violent. In a rape culture, women perceive a continuum of threatened violence that ranges from sexual remarks to sexual touching to rape itself. A rape culture condones physical and emotional terrorism against women as the norm.

In a rape culture both men and women assume that sexual violence is a fact of life, inevitable as death or taxes. This violence, however, is neither biologically nor divinely ordained. Much of what we accept as inevitable is in fact the expression of values and attitudes that can change.

Source: http://www.shakesville.com/2009/10/rape-culture-101.html

A rape culture is a complex of beliefs that encourages male sexual aggression and supports violence against women (note the exclusion of male victims and of female perpetrators)

It is often stated (although not in this particular definition) that rape culture involves erasure and minimization of rape and rape victims.

It has since beeen amended, but in January this year Wikipedia had this in their definition of rape culture:

…a culture in which rape and sexual violence against women are common and in which prevalent attitudes, norms, practices, and media condone, normalize, excuse, or tolerate sexual violence against women.

And hence we get idiotic statements like this "Only men can stop rape" from some feminists. ( http://goodmenproject.com/gender-sexuality/rape-culture-men-women-power/ )

SSJAmes · 2012-08-16T06:07:08+00:00

Rape culture is a thing, so is murder culture, theft culture, etc. These are all crimes that normal people agree are wrong (thievery is more or less wrong based on context). Men are killed and assaulted far more than women, and while I wouldn't be so bold as to say that men are more often raped than women I will quote this:

Male on male rape has historically been shrouded in secrecy due to the stigma men associate with being raped by other men. According to psychologist Dr Sarah Crome fewer than one in ten male-male rapes are reported. As a group, male rape victims reported a lack of services and support, and legal systems are often ill-equipped to deal with this type of crime.[19]

The rape of men by men has been documented as a weapon of terror in warfare.[20]

Much like female erectile response and contrary to popular opinion, male erectile response is involuntary,[21][22] meaning that a man need not consent for his penis to become erect and be placed in a woman's vagina. Penetration of a man by a woman is possible through forcible stimulation of external male genitalia or the anus, or by forced penetration of the anus with the use of strap-ons, dildos, other foreign objects which could include a tongue (inserted or external) in forced oral, forced digit manipulation, and digital penetration. A woman could also force a man to perform oral sex on her. Rape of a man by a woman could also occur when limited sexual activities are agreed upon and a man's penis is placed in a woman in violation of the limits that had been set. Rape of a man by a woman is thus possible in several ways.

However, male victims of sexual abuse by females[23] often face social, political, and legal double standards.[24] While gender-neutral laws have combated the older perception that rape never occurs to men,[25] and other laws have eliminated the term altogether,[26] the double standards still remain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_by_gender

moosetastrophe · 2012-08-16T04:31:26+00:00

I guess this is as good a place as any to ask a question about rape accusers-

it seems like many MRAs advocate some sort of punishment for (false) rape accusers. How would this actually work in practice? If someone is outright lying, I agree that there should be consequences, but if there just isn't the evidence to back it up and the charges get dropped - how would this work? would a DA bring slander charges against the accuser?

I'm new to this subreddit, and I hope to engage in positive thoughtful discourse with all of you-- I hope to have a son (and a daughter!) one day and I want to make the world the best place possible for my children of any sex.

full disclosure: I'm a woman, and I was date raped - i didn't take this to court because I knew there would be no way it would hold up in trial and didn't want to drag us and our high school community through such a tumultuous he-said, she-said situation, not because of some invisible threat of slut shaming (although I understand where someone might be coming from with that concern).

on_the_redpill · 2012-08-16T10:34:39+00:00

That pill is a tasty one

ss_camaro · 2012-08-16T17:22:34+00:00

Rape that effects women = mass hysteria

Rape that effects men = "man up" (eg prison)

Women that get raped = never ending need of support

Men that get raped = "man up"

Women that get raped = victims for life

Men that die in state-mandated violence programs = darwin awards

Is rape worse than getting blown up in a war? The obvious answer is no.

'Rape' has been redefined to mean "random dick rejected on account of [x] circumstances."

Polim10 · 2012-08-16T19:07:27+00:00

Rape culture isn't half as damaging as violence culture among men in general.

It puts us in hospital, in jail, on the street and generally fucks us up, and happens far more often than rape, yet in the midst of all this we're supposed to be putting women's house in order before everything else.

Naturally this is because of biology - we're hardwired to be more concerned about women's safety, but we have to look to ourselves too.

AnnArchist · 2012-08-16T04:17:10+00:00

Rape culture does not exist in 1st world countries outside of prisons.

SteelCrossx · 2012-08-16T16:21:06+00:00

Feminists don't think prison rape is justified at all. You're making a huge fallacy by equating the reaction of society to the reaction of feminists. No feminist I know has believed prison rape is justified. As a feminist I do not laugh at jokes about prison rape and I denounce people who think it's "part of the punishment."

It's exactly what you said; it is rape culture and it's intricately connected to victim-blaming and the rape of women.

Please, embrace feminism on this issue. We may not concentrate on male rape, but we're not your enemies. We don't condone it. You will find support from us as long as you don't blame us for creating a culture of prison rape.

rightsbot · 2012-08-16T03:36:18+00:00

Post text automatically copied here. (Why?) (Report a problem.)

Miracle_Fruit · 2012-08-16T17:59:18+00:00

Strangely enough, I read this post and not two hours later found myself embroiled in an argument very much along those lines. Except... I'm just gonna let this quote from the other party in the conversation speak for itself.

Prison rapes do not count as a problem in society

It's difficult to find the will to try to reason with these people without losing faith in humanity sometimes.

2012-08-16T20:49:23+00:00

Nice one, but be careful you don't accidentally make him think about why so much of the language that's used to describe prison rape uses feminine terms to describe the victim.

rottingchrist · 2012-08-16T09:11:59+00:00

Rape subverts a woman's reproductive choice, and is a heinous crime in society.

Similarly, paternity fraud subverts a man's reproductive choice and acceptance of that is practically institutionalized in society.

Do we have a Paternity Fraud Culture?

2012-08-16T15:35:28+00:00

Well at least you accept rape culture exists even if you only care about men being affected by it.

ApoChaos · 2012-08-16T13:55:43+00:00

I post regularly to SRS (instant-pariah, gooo!) We consistently condemn the upvoted prison-rape threads that crop up. I think most anyone who has put enough thought into problematic gender dynamics would condemn how socially-acceptable these jokes are. It looks like there is a consensus here which it would be nice to see embraced.

The issue is that most rapists do not consider themselves rapists; they are normal people who make waaay too many assumptions about a situation, and when they could open their mouths and communicate desire, or seek clear consent, they just make an aggressive move instead. The victim is intimidated and feels that they have to perform or may face severe consequences; they freeze and become submissive. What I just described happens all the time, and it destroys people's sense of trust, or even their perception of 'normal'. The reason it gets over-simplified to 'don't rape' is because too many people would respond to that situation with something like 'Well, why did you go to the bedroom with them if you didn't want sex?' Rape-culture is essentially victim-blaming that puts 'Does this have to be a thing?' before 'Oh, they used you for sex against your consent'. It is similar to the victim-blaming of prison-rape; the victims got themselves put in prison in the first place, so... No one uses the word 'deserves', but the subtext is obvious and pretty disgusting.

Icanus · 2012-08-16T07:10:12+00:00

Ten thousand years ago, all sex was rape.

Rape culture

Comments

3. Keep in mind that you are not the universal standard. Just because you got over something quickly, does not mean that everyone else will. Also, you don't recover from , ya know, actually being dead.

Title	Rape culture
Author	Alleggro
Upvotes	102
Comments	127
Date	August 16, 2012 3:34 AM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/yauvi/rape_culture/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/rape-culture.1015747 https://theredarchive.com/post/1015747