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Feminist group wants to shut down France's first ever sex dolls brothel because they argue that it encourages a culture of rape, but the police say it's legal.

Fuckoff555

March 20, 2018
868 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.thelocal.fr/20180320/paris-councillors-want-citys-first-sex-doll-brothel-shut-down
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Title Feminist group wants to shut down France's first ever sex dolls brothel because they argue that it encourages a culture of rape, but the police say it's legal.
Author

Fuckoff555

Upvotes 868
Comments 211
Date March 20, 2018 1:17 PM UTC
(8 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/85smkc/feminist_group_wants_to_shut_down_frances_first/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/feminist-group-wants-to-shut-down-frances-first.1178819
https://theredarchive.com/post/1178819
Red Pill terms in post
feminismfeminist
Top posts by Fuckoff555

Universities need to stop suspending students who are being accused of sexual misconduct until they are proven guilty. They also should have the right to stay anonymous until their convictions. At least this student won the first battle and he is now planning to seek damage over false allegations.

6311 upvotes
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We should be careful to not become like the sexist feminists we hate, and not to let rage and anger control us so that we don't become mysogynistic, and destroy this sub and this movement from within.

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197 upvotes
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Comments

[–]iSuKCoK_reddit 315 points316 points317 points 8 years ago (54 children) | Copy Link

Jeez, we let them have dildos, why can't we have our dolls?

[–][deleted] 391 points392 points393 points 8 years ago (31 children) | Copy Link

They control sex to control men.

[–]krawm 180 points181 points182 points 8 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

This right here is what it comes down too, if you cant control the sex lives of men then you lise power over them.

[–]methylotroph 90 points91 points92 points 8 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

I don't think most of them are aware of this thinking, none the less this is how they think subconsciously. Obviously if men are fucking a bunch of dolls then they are not fucking women, which one would assume would be bad for "rape culture" because why rape human women? None the less they are upset because their unconscious mind knows what that really means: that women will be ignored totally, and that they fear more then even rape.

[–]FreddyDeus 82 points83 points84 points 8 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

I think professional feminists know this very well

[–]chance01 52 points53 points54 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

They know EXACTLY what they are doing. It is foolish to think otherwise.

[–]FreddyDeus 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

So you agree with me then.

[–]Jex117 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Is this a trick question..?

[–]McGauth925 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

YES!. Claiming that feminists are stupid children with no brains or morals - well, that's satisfying, but it doesn't help us deal with reality.

[–]chance01 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The reality of my statement is that they know what they are doing. You can agree or disagree but that doesn't change the fact that they are fully functional adults with decision making ability and agency that know what they are doing.

[–]MalibuStayZ 30 points31 points32 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

I think so too. Still astonishes me that they feel so threatened by sex dolls. I think even if men find women so obnoxious that they go MGTOW and don't even have sex with them, they would rather watch porn and masturbate than use sex dolls. I would estimate the number of men who would use a sex doll is less than 1 in 1000. And I would assume that most of those aren't political anti-feminists but mostly men suffering from social anxiety or something like that.

Just like heterosexual men don't "decide" to become gay for political reasons like feminists did in the 60s. Almost all would rather stay single. That might partially be due to social conditioning to condemn homosexuality, but mainly because we just don't fancy men.

[–]ButtsMacGillacuty 19 points20 points21 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's generational, if you had told young men in the 1950's that the majority of their peers in the 2000s would be masturbating to films of other people having sex and cartoons instead of real women they'd have laughed in your face. If you had told me in the 1990's that women would seriously be protesting men having sex with dolls I'D have laughed in your face. Once something becomes partially socially acceptable it's fully adopted by the next generation.

Feminists work for rich people, rich people DO NOT want men to be single and saving their money. ALOT of powerful people have a vested interest in keeping men sexually frustrated.

[–]planned_serendipity1 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I would estimate the number of men who would use a sex doll is less than 1 in 1000

I think that is going to change surprisingly quickly. The rate of improvement in technology, manufacturing, virtual reality, and the demand curve is going to bring prices down real quick. When the price gets low enough there are going to be plenty of men who decide it is worth it.

[–]ContrasexualWoman 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

This is very true. I work for a company that sells porn DVDs and a very wide variety of sex toys, including dolls.

The ones we have aren't the Real Doll brand, but damn if they aren't close. For only $3,000 you can buy a 100 lb doll with amazingly lifelike features, and interchangeable wigs, assholes, and pussies. And "her" skin feels close to real as well, it's almost scary, like a person frozen in time lol.

[–]BionicTransWomyn 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Just wait until sex robots are a thing.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

can't you picture the outrage! Suddenly all that attention-seeking; that teasing and manipulating; loses much of its impact. Reminds me of that rather coarse saying: "Get off the table, Mabel, the money's for the beer".

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Feminists will do everything in their power to prevent that from happening.

[–]methylotroph 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah but sex dolls cost a whole lot of money, porn and jerking off is free.

[–]ContrasexualWoman 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

We're going to see cheaper and easier to purchase options as time goes on. You can buy a very good one for only $3k nowadays.

[–]methylotroph 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't think they do, I simply can't see them are smart enough. Have them pass a gom jabbar then I will believe, until then they are dumb animals.

[–]xNOM 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah but I don't think this is the mainstream feminist angle at ALL. That's the angle for NON-feminist women and lipstick feminists.

IMO, the feminists who have a huge beef with sex dolls are the same ones who think that "objectification" is a horrible crime against humanity. Dolls are just objectification. These feminists hate the fact that when a man considers a woman he doesn't really know personally, nice tits trumps intelligence. Every time.

The exact opposite is true for women evaluating mates. So it's just the usual childish projection: "I find intelligent, ugly, confident men to be attractive, so men must stop valuing looks above intelligence."

[–]ContrasexualWoman 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's only true for women who lie and want to seem "virtuous" by not caring about looks. Believe me, if I'm walking around on the beach and I see a tight male ass or a nice bulge in his shorts and he doesn't have rolls of fat, I'm going to find him visually attractive.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points23 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I keep saying this. The sole vehicles for female "power" are sex and shame. The minute they invent a doll that can clean itself up and pack itself away women who don't actually have more going for them are beyond fucked. Even at 10 to 15k the way most guus spend on their women that's a long term savings as well. So *of course^ it's being fought.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Hell at 100k it's still less expensive over a 10 year period. 10k a year. That's nothing to for a woman to expect.

[–]reachout_throwaway 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

We as a society are fucked if either gender completely ignores the other. A lot of people are forgetting that men and women need each other. We can't just give half the world the silent treatment. Not claiming you are saying this, but just sayin..

[–]ContrasexualWoman 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There's a big difference between the sexes ignoring each other and men justifiably wanting an equal partner who doesn't take their money, and spends some on him too.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I wasn't saying that. Please note that I specified women who didn't have more going on - of which there are plenty and who are generally not causing the issues being called out by this sub. Women as actual factual equals - not just in terms of opportunity, possibility and rewards but also in terms of responsibility, culpability and consequence - are a massively desirable state to be in imo.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I truly don't think dolls could entirely replace women. But they might diminish the need men have for them. Then, when artificial uteri come along, that would further diminish that need. Given our population issues, it would be a very good thing if almost all pregnancies were planned. Diminishing the power women have over men could only help men, AND help our planet.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm sure that's an aspect of this vexed area of human relations but in the "sex doll/robot" area I suspect women's attitude is based on resentment - resentment that the female, in real or artificial form, is an object of mens' lust. It's the idea they can't stand so they throw a spanner in the works at any and every opportunity.

[–]spacedogg 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

But we control commitment

[–]Surtysurt 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Only if you have a vasectomy

[–]spacedogg 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ah true!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

which every sensible thinking bloke should have as soon as he knows what he doesn't want i.e. enslavement. And if you want to keep your options open, stuff your pockets with condoms and never have condom-less sex, never.

[–]TranquilThought 98 points99 points100 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

So let me get this straight.

All men rape.

A Brothel opens where men go-to to have sex with......I mean rape dolls instead of women

Women complain about brothel

-_-

[–]Singlebother 19 points20 points21 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That sounds about right

[–]fengpi 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What, you expected non-nonsense?

Ahahahahahahahahaha...

[–]Realworld 86 points87 points88 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

But a police source said that while the brothel posed moral questions, the use of the word rape was not legally relevant in this context. “You cannot accuse a man of raping a doll. It is as if a woman were to file a complaint with the police against a dildo,” the source told Le Parisien.

[–]AtomicGipsy 50 points51 points52 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Do you...do you realise that this officer puts the hipothetical rubbery offender as the rapist in this situation?

[–]Realworld 37 points38 points39 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes, that's what's delicious about their analogy. It's a brilliant comparison.

[–]-manatease 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Not really, because if a man can rape an inanimate object then a women can rape an inanimate object. So the reverse is complaining that women are raping dildos, not being raped by them.

[–]ThirdTurnip 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's an awesome response.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Because they think they are in control of the sex. How do you like that? I know I'm like, fuck you.

[–]HerbyDrinks 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Dildos are considerably cheaper to.

[–]Meistermalkav 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Actually, a good point. Any femionist that should be for this should not be for keeping dildos.

[–]NecroHexr 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"You cannot accuse a man of raping a doll. It is as if a woman were to file a complaint with the police against a dildo,” the source told Le Parisien.

They hear you.

[+]deville05 -7 points-6 points-5 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

You have pocket vaginas.. having a full size human being copy always ready to suck and fuck is crazy insane honestly. I 2oukd get your argument for dildos if it was full life size man doll with a constantly erect penis to fuck whenever. That is some mental shit. I cant believe you are supporting this because I think it's demeaning to men and actually bad for men in the long run. This will only make men insane. And honestly god knows what some psycho men will do to their dolls.

Let's say they videos of raping dolls or cutting them and put it on the internet... I know it's not real but how far is too far? Is it not the same thing as burning an effigy of someone or kathy griffin holding a severed head of the president even though it's fake?

[–]DirtAndGrass 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If it is not hurting anyone, what argument can be made for it being bad?

I see it as potentially therapeutic for people with sexual-psychological issues.

[–]deville05 -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

its hurting the men psychologically. in fact these men are already hurt psychologically and instead of fixing them its gonna be enabling them and making them worse. it might works for sexual-psychological issues but thats for doctors and scientists to research and decide. if its prescribed by a therapist maybe otherwise its a disaster imo

[–]iSuKCoK_reddit 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

There are dolls for girls too.

[–]deville05 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

two wrongs dont make a right

[–]iSuKCoK_reddit 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm gonna be honest with you, I made the original comment as a joke. This doesn't mean I don't support dolls, infact I absolutely do.

First of all, what you're saying is even more insane, making assumptions based on the fact that other people have used representations/representative objects to enact deeds you deem are horrible. I believe that what a consumer does with their purchased property is their buisiness. As for the examples you gave, they were simply expressing themselves and/or their opinions with a use of a representation. As evil as their actions may seem, it's their opinion, no matter what you say, everyone deserves an opinion.

I also don't see this as something demeaning to neither sex. It is not bad for men either, infact I dont understand why you concluded it. This will not make men insane either, we have always had porn and cock sleeves, if what you say is true, then where is that insanity?

Though I do agree with you on the psycho bit, but it's fine as long as they only do it to dolls. It's better that they do it to dolls rather than real women. This argument kinda blends with fictional women, and I will take the same stance here as I did with Hentai,

It isn't real and therefore is alright, there is no proper evidence that men who reads hentai does what they read, it is better that they keep their fantasies in fantasy worlds, than let it spread into the real one.

[–]deville05 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Well porn is addictive like cigarettes and I would argue that it's actually doing more damage to men. There is some research out there. Though like cigarettes it depends on how much and how often you consume and why.. like do you watch porn because you wanna get off or because you are depressed. Anyway I think sell dolls are fucked up for either sex. It not real yes, but it will do real damage like social media does. Most people arent mentally equipped to handle it.

[–]iSuKCoK_reddit 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

While I agree that it is addictive, it has barely any negative reprecussions, infact the only one I can think of is that it sets up a bad expectation, but I think most people know the difference between reality and fantasy. Otherwise, it's a good way to let off steam and explore your own body, nothing wrong with that. I think that it also helps alot with people that has depression, I know this as I am one of those people. It allows me to momentarily forget my problems.

I also don't see how social media has a harmful effect, I'd like it if you can elaborate.

I'd reckon people are smart enough to realize real from fake. If a person can't then, it's their problem, no reason for one person to stop others from buying it. I think if someone does have problems with discerning fantasy and reality, they should seek a therapist to help with their issues, then they can join us in our sex doll bandwagon.

[–]fasterfind 175 points176 points177 points 8 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

Feminists seem to be really intense about the idea that only women are good, and all men are evil... so the only real relationship that isn't rape is a lesbian relationship.

So men go their own way and fuck dolls, completely minding their own business apart from feminists... DOLLS! - And women have a problem with that too because that's still too rapey.

Good god. Where does it end?

[–][deleted] 50 points51 points52 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

In matriarchy.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

With our testicles being taken. Women want domesticated men to leech off of.

[–]Dapperdan814 25 points26 points27 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good god. Where does it end?

When the species is extinct. Seems pretty clear to me.

[–]bcmonke 25 points26 points27 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Wait until they accuse you of enslaving your oven to cook your food, and don't even get me started on the disgusting things you force upon your toilet.

[–]KingRobotPrince 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good god. Where does it end?

Presumably when no man can get sexual pleasure from a woman in any form. Pornography, prostitution, free sex, sex toys, dolls, robots, all are ripe for banning.

[–]Maelshevek 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Been watching Jessica Jones Season 2. It’s literally this.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Please explain, Jessica Jones season 1 sucked so there's no way I'm even watching part of an episode for context.

[–]Maelshevek 17 points18 points19 points 8 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

Here's basically what's wrong with the show.

On Sex:

  • Excessive lesbian relationship screen time
  • Continuous use of non-threatening gay male characters
  • Jessica is the sex initiator and stopper, she has all the sexual power.
  • One of the men had a relationship with one of leads when she was 16, and of course, he was a film director. Hmm.

On moral behavior:

  • Jessica repeatedly threatens violence and death to people
  • Jessica's assistant has to put up with her abuse endlessly and treats her well even so. He literally is getting fired every other scene and only starts getting paid when he stands up against her abuse...but he only gets 20%.
  • Jessica goes to this guy's office and beats the sh-- out of him, and his lawyer (also a woman) tells him to drop the case. She literally almost killed him and barely got in trouble. They later try to paint him as a bad guy for wanting justice. Granted, he does try to steal all her files, but that's pretty minor compared to Jessica's lawbreaking predilections.

On portrayal of men:

  • The male characters who are "good guys" are unrealistically good-natured, and the females just act like assholes (or the men start at one end and go to other). I think you could use the term "moral whitewashing" of several male characters.
  • Multiple accusations of sexism against any man who tries to assert something vs a woman (use of Master Suppression Technique). Particularly if a man wants to help a fellow human with a Real Problem.
  • The one guy who's soliciting Jessica's BFF is like a perfect human, but her friend is kind of lame. She's not worthy of him, not by a mile.

If we look at the character meta, the women play the roles of asshole male characters in other shows. There's literally no difference in the kind of behavior between the genders. Yet the women are repeatedly portrayed as being on the right side, compared to men, or that at least they are justified in doing things they would raise hell about if done by a man. Total hypocritical bullshit.

A real peach is that today I saw a headline on the rag "People" saying "Jessica Jones Season 2 represents #MeToo!"--Like it's a Good Thing(tm). Cmon!

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I remember in season 1 when Jessica's investigations uncovered a woman stepping out on her husband with Luke, who had no idea he was banging a married woman. When hubby finds out his missus is a slur, wifey goes to Jessica's office and acts like she's been wronged because she's been caught shagging around, and blames Jessica for her husband and his pals going to beat the fuck out of Luke. The lack of personal responsibility astounded me, not to mention the husband taking it out on Luke instead of his cheating wife. I mean, if you're being cuckold and you know the other guy, then fair enough, but if you don't, why take it out on him?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you. I'm not in the least bit surprised.

[–]Surtysurt 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The jeri relationship with the nurse felt like someone pitched "the implication" from always sunny and no one caught on it was satire so they just went with it.

[–]TheStumblingWolf[🍰] 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

It's a giant powerplay on a global scale.

[–]killcat 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's the same reason they are against porn, it's an outlet of sexual tension that does not involve woman directly, and is therefore out of their control, it's about power and control.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Toxic femininity: the obsessive need to control the actions of all men in their proximity just because they know better and men need to be told what to do.

[–]fengpi 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Where does it end?

With a noose dangling from the ceiling, probably. That's the only thing feminism officially approves of men doing. After you've donated all of your money to their pet causes, but that goes without saying.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

it's the male mental-attitude women hate and want to prevent from being exercised i.e. the female form as a sex object.

[–]McGauth925 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

That might be part of it - the part they can admit to. But I have to think it's mostly about women losing sexual power over men, which they'll never admit to in large numbers..

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

you know, I'd be really interested to see the outcome, if guys would go to a brothel to fuck male dolls or completely gender neutral ones. would that still promote rape?

[–]ContrasexualWoman 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It doesn't end. These women are insane.

[–]Dgprehec 129 points130 points131 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

So these poor straight men who are totally afraid to approach a woman in today's society for fear of retaliations, false accusations, or just because saying "you're pretty" is considered sexual assault, now can't even fuck a plastic bag ? Like what's next? "Men if you masturbate thinking about women then you are no better than Ted Bundy" ?

Something tells me that feminists will never be happy... You want to have sex with them? Rapist!

You don't want to have sex with them? Rapist!!!

[–]Lethn 52 points53 points54 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

That's because it's about control, they aren't there to compromise and that is precisely why I label them as ideological fanatics. You're more right than you realise, their ultimate goal is to control everybody and that is why no matter how nice to them you are or how empathetic you try to be to their point of view they will always attack you. The labelling and shaming is their preferred method of control, they'll scream your a racist and in order to take over your life they will tell you what you need to do in order to have that label removed from you.

They're mainly terrified of shit like real sex robots ( Which are pretty pathetic currently in terms of technology ) and male contraceptives that work really well because they know it will render them and their horrible behaviour obsolete.

Gone will be the days that feminists or really any opportunistic woman can at all dominate a man with their vagina, because why would men have anything to do with these sorts of women when they can spend a couple of thousand on an advanced sex doll and sleep with women without having to worry about women getting themselves pregnant to entrap them?

[–]moose-rider32 15 points16 points17 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

something tells me that feminists will never be happy

That something is these feminists themselves. Sjw are fueled by their own misery and so they want to change society to try to make themselves feel better. But it won't work so they stay miserable. Here they are upset over something that literally doesn't involve them but they still insist it will lead to more rapes because they don't know how else to cope with their feelings.

I'm not sure how many are maliciously motivated to try and control sex (perhaps some are) or how many are just upset that it doesn't include them (men can't have anything without women or it's wrong (

[–]Dgprehec 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Agree. It's totally about control! Tbh is a childish behaviour, it seems like they still want to be a part of a man's world but at their terms, conditions and they want to control what men think.

Have you noticed how these feminists attempt so heavily to enter and join typical men's spaces, while excluding them from their own world? Sports, jobs, music, etc While men don't give a shit about women's spaces, interests, hobbies and so on. Cause we value the beauty of both masculinity and femininity and the ways they are represented in western culture.

For instance, feminists pretend women only spaces, but at the same time refuse the idea of a men's only space where boys and men can talk about masculinity and other things, whether is suicide, prostate cancer or just sports and sex..

I am totally happy to be a gay man and don't have to deal with these crazy twats like my straight brothers do. And I totally understand them when they just get fed up and pay prostitutes or buy a sex doll. I pray for you my friends

[–]moose-rider32 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean, I'm not sure if prostate cancer is the topic I would go to in a men's only space but I get your point! For what it's worth, there are billions of women in the world, only a small fraction are this crazy. They get a disproportionate voice and political power, but good to remember most women are great, at least better than sex dolls! But if a guy wants a doll, it's no one's business but his own.

[–]chadwickofwv 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm not sure how many are maliciously motivated to try and control sex

100% no exceptions

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

control full stop - sex is but one of their levers.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

that's about it. Men can't win.

[–][deleted] 50 points51 points52 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Its control of sex. Control sex, control the man. Men are more willing to do stuff for sex, and by giving men an outlet, the women no longer have control. Women lose their benefits from horny men.

[–]MGTOWtoday 38 points39 points40 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Sue to shut down the feminist group because it encourages a culture of divorce and male suicide.

[–]Fuckoff555[S] 55 points56 points57 points 8 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

I can't understand how those feminists think, i just can't. Fucking facepalm.

[–]ItSeemedObvious 30 points31 points32 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Communist members of the Paris Council have tabled a motion calling for the closure of the "brothel" on moral grounds, while feminist groups argue that it is encouraging a culture of rape.

My first impression was it was child like dolls but that doesn't seem to be the case...

[–][deleted] 33 points34 points35 points 8 years ago* (11 children) | Copy Link

Communists calling on morality as a reason? That's rich. I thought communists were amoral, hence, the 're-education' camps, gulags, and planned famines for a total death count exceeding 100 million. There is no right or wrong only what the Party allows.

[–]ItSeemedObvious 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

I did find that a bit amusing. Communist and Feminists hand in hand.

I'm sure nothing about that unholy alliance will go wrong. I'm sure the two will function very well, and couldn't possibly have any ideological differences that make long term cooperation impossible, that could never happen...

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Feminists today use the Marxist dialectic. Instead of economic class warfare they use sex and relationship terms. Destabilizing and overthrowing previously existing structures is the goal.

[–]mikesteane 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You don't need differences to make cooperation impossible. Two people or groups with exactly the same ideology of "I'm the victim, therefore I can do no wrong" will always conflict.

[–]FreddyDeus 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Have you not heard of Marxist feminism before? It’s not a new thing

[–]ItSeemedObvious 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Yes but never a Marxist and a feminist group working together. Normally they don't.

While feminist are generally Marxist, Marxists are not generally feminists per se.

[–]FreddyDeus 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I never said that.

[–]ItSeemedObvious 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't know what you mean by that.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Feminists take the worst aspects of communism and traditional conservativism.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

You bought all the propaganda that the US government AND all the power of the wealthy have been feeding us for about a hundred years, now. The first thing any group in power does about rival groups is to demonize them.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I've meet people who grew up inside the Soviet Bloc. I heard their firsthand stories of what the Communists were like. One had photographs of the butchery in the village their family lived in. I've read the history of the rise of the Soviet state. Denying what they did should be on the exact same level as Holocaust denial. We mustn't let people white wash their history. They should be viewed with the same horror we look at the German government of the 1930s and 1940s.

[–]The__Tren__Train 16 points17 points18 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

imagine having both a undying thirst for absolute power and control

and an unparalleled victim complex.

[–]SpeaksTruthToPower 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Sir, if I may, you are making an erroneous assumption: That feminists can THINK.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, that's fun to say, but it's not true. I don't think we serve men by claiming that feminists are completely stupid. We serve men by accurately assessing reality as best we can.

[–]ThirdTurnip 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Inability to comprehend madness is a sign of good mental health :)

[–]Mythandros 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Feminists are stupid. This is why they believe in Feminism.

Also, apparently EVERYTHING is rape to a feminist.

So if everything is rape... Then breathing is rape. Since all feminists breathe (unfortunately), they are raping themselves with every breath.

See how stupid that sounds? This is feminist "logic".

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

BS. When feminism really took off, things were very different from they way they are now. When I was in high school (US), I thought just about all women were going to get married, stay home, and raise children. I thought I was going to work my entire life supporting others. As it is, and MOSTLY BECAUSE OF FEMINISM, I've only supported my dogs. My life has been improved by being free of that. I think feminism has done some good, in that women do have a lot more freedom, and men have somewhat more freedom. We have the idea that anybody, and especially women can do anything. I don't care what anybody says, that's not all bad.

I expect some of the people here to attack that, but I believe it to be true. I believe looking at what's true serves all of us far more than suppressing truth does.

BUT, there are the radical ones, who receive a lot of attention, who really think the whole culture is a plot against women, and aimed at serving men. Anything that makes men's lives better is bad for women, in their thinking, and especially if it diminishes the power of women over men. They are the enemy, because they see us as their enemy.

In this case, MOST women won't like if women lose sexual power over men, the same way men would feel uncomfortable if suddenly most women were larger, stronger, and could physically overpower them.

[–]Mythandros 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You are wrong. On 2 points.

  1. Feminism has nothing to do with anyone's rights. That was the women's suffrage movement. Two very different things. Feminism has not given men anything other than an enemy to rally against. In fact, feminism crusades against men's rights.

  2. There is no such thing as "radical" feminism. Those "radfems" are regular, normal feminists. Feminism teaches nothing other than how to hate and dominate men. It has ZERO value to society.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes. We disagree.

A woman's sufferage movement? Yes, back before women could vote. And, guess what? Suffrage is a right. And men's lib isn't what feminists wanted, but IT DID NOT EXIST AT ALL BEFORE FEMINISM CAME ALONG. It was one of the results of women demanding more freedom. Back then, they couldn't really sell it that women should be completely free of sex roles, while men should be bound to them.

In these times some have hit on the method of making female sexism excusable as a response to the sexism of men, while continuing to condemn every remotely sexist act by any man. Thus they portray female sexism is either relatively insignificant or excusable, while they attempt to criminalize male sexism.

And, there are feminists, and there are feminists. Some looked at men controlling EVERY institution, and thought that should change. Some think all men should be castrated and made to serve women.

Yes, we disagree.

[–]cantthinkofowtgood 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Maybe it's a hygiene thing? I mean they don't chuck the dolls away after use. Boke.

[–]HeForeverBleeds 25 points26 points27 points 8 years ago (42 children) | Copy Link

They're dolls. They're literally objects, like dildos or vibrators. More evidence that feminism cares more about attacking male sexuality and controlling men than it does about actually protecting victims of sexual abuse

[+]contexistential -29 points-28 points-27 points 8 years ago* (41 children) | Copy Link

To be fair, the existence of these dolls does paint women as fuckable objects, which does have implications in how society views women. Do you disagree? I don’t see how this is evidence of a desire to control men over protecting victims.

Edit: the fact that my completely reasonable comment and request for alternate points of view is being rapidly downvoted really speaks volumes. This is not a space for intellectual conversation. Good thing fake women can’t talk back, huge win for men.

[–][deleted] 36 points37 points38 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

There are no victims here.

Meanwhile women shove disembodied dicks inside them, and nobody argues that they're treating men as only good for a dicking. Nor should they, because that's stupid.

Rather than being happy with disembodied vaginas [flesh lights/pocket pussies/whatever] like most women are happy with their dildos and vibrators, men actually seem to want something as close to human as possible.

Because to men, women already are more than "fuckable objects". They long for the intimacy you get from sex, but can't get it with real women. So what's the next best thing? A doll that resembles a woman.

How is that "painting women as fuckable objects"? It's the opposite. The only reason men do this is because they can't get that intimacy with real women.

[+]contexistential -17 points-16 points-15 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

I can see your point. I don’t entirely agree with it, but I’m not even sure if I fully disagree with it. Either way I don’t think your opinion, or the way you stated it is sexist. (just stating for the record) I can have empathy for the type of men you describe. I don’t have a fully formed POV to respond further to that aspect yet, but I get it.

If I had a daughter, I wouldn’t want her to think this is how society sees her, and if I had a son I wouldn’t want this to send a message that men are entitled to sex. I don’t think it’s healthy for people in general to see a woman being depicted as an inanimate object that exists to act out rape fantasies.

Or if we take the rape fantasy out of it, normalizing the idea of sex as a commodity that should be paid for, and replacing intimacy with a partner capable of communicating or moving does have some effect in our collective mindset.

I think it’s less about a doll as a victim, and more of how this effects the ways society views women and sex. When it becomes normal to fuck a fake woman that can’t consent, what implications does that have on our real life relationships?

I honestly don’t know the answer to that question. I think all of the points I make have counter arguments, I just think it’s not a stretch to recognize why some people have a problem with this instead of mocking women and accusing them of trying to control men. I’m not accusing you personally of doing this, it just seems to be the overall knee jerk sentiment here.

Anyway, we’ll see a lot more of this type of conversation with the advancement of AI and VR and making these dolls illegal seems unrealistic and certainly won’t halt technology. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out and the ways in which we reframe sexuality as a society.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If I had a daughter, I wouldn’t want her to think this is how society sees her,

Then don't spread the lie that this is how society sees her? People keep saying this, and I don't see it at all. All I see are people saying it. No actual evidence that this is actually how men see women in society.

People only really seem to use "objectification" for this. But where is any actual data that says that sexualization of women [or men] leads to the mistreatment or devaluation of women [or men]? I include men since I'm egalitarian, but that's not what society cares about. Many feminists jump through hoops in order justify a double standard there. Amounting to "well suck it up because we had to deal with it since the dawn of time!" or similar.

Take street violence. We tell women to be afraid, despite evidence that they are safer from street violence than men. Yes they are more often victims of sexual violence on the street, but that's not as common as other violent crimes. And those crimes affect men far more. So we tell women to be afraid, despite the evidence... and how do you think women will feel? They will, and do, feel afraid. Since all we do is tell them to feel afraid. Again, despite evidence to the contrary.

Don't you think that this is the same way for "society sees women as just sexual objects!"? You tell girls that boys/men view them this way, of course they will FEEL that way about it. Because nobody is talking sense. I'm not aware of any evidence that proves there's a link between sexualization and viewing women as just a "fuckable object". Men want to be wanted. That's why they strive to provide for women, since it's the only way men know how to earn the affection of women. Short of genetic lottery.

Finding someone attractive =/= viewing them solely as an object.

and if I had a son I wouldn’t want this to send a message that men are entitled to sex.

This isn't? It's sending the opposite. That if you can't get sex with real women, you can masturbate with a doll to mimic sex as best you can. Because you are not entitled to sex.

I don’t think it’s healthy for people in general to see a woman being depicted as an inanimate object that exists to act out rape fantasies.

This doesn't exist to act out rape fantasies. This is a healthy way to get what is close to sex, when legal prostitution is not available. And that's a complex issue of it's own that we won't be arguing.

In fact, I suggest you take your "rape fantasy" worries to romance novel writers and the publishers of them, and the countless women who consume them.

Or if we take the rape fantasy out of it, normalizing the idea of sex as a commodity that should be paid for, and replacing intimacy with a partner capable of communicating or moving does have some effect in our collective mindset.

Again, this isn't sex. It's masturbation with aids to make it seem more like sex. Most people can't afford a sex doll on their own dime, they're thousands of dollars, so they can rent one this way for much cheaper and as needed.

Not everyone is capable of finding a partner. Should they simply sit in home and do nothing? It's not necessarily their fault they can't find someone. They could be perfectly nice, but not be attractive to anybody near them, and not have money or status to offset that. Why should they be alone and depressed? So what if this helps them feel better about themselves? It's not your life is it?

I think it’s less about a doll as a victim, and more of how this effects the ways society views women and sex. When it becomes normal to fuck a fake woman that can’t consent, what implications does that have on our real life relationships?

You can't say it's "less about a doll being a victim" then in the next breath talk about it not being able to consent. A dildo can't consent either. Shall we make those illegal?

What's the message that this sends to women? Not only is a dildo a disembodied penis, but it also has no pleasure. It can't ejaculate. So women are learning that men's pleasure doesn't matter, and that all that matters is herself and her own pleasure! See how ridiculous this gets? It's stupid. And yes I'm aware there are sex toys that mimic ejaculation. I doubt those are as common as a dildo or vibrator that doesn't. Point still stands. Why are we arguing consent for a doll?

If we argue it for a doll, I don't see why a disembodied penis can't also have consent. And a car. And television. Where do we draw the line on consent of inanimate objects? Is it just when they're humanoid? What about children's dolls? I don't think Barbie consented to people undressing her and changing her clothes, or cutting her hair. What's that send to little girls? That they can just take off women's clothes and do whatever they want with women? Truly evil. Is it just humanoid things that are used for sex? Well that's oddly specific to start caring about the feelings of something that doesn't have them. What if someone uses a doll for sex that wasn't intended for sex, like shoving Barbie in their vagina? Is that woman a criminal?

I honestly don’t know the answer to that question. I think all of the points I make have counter arguments, I just think it’s not a stretch to recognize why some people have a problem with this instead of mocking women and accusing them of trying to control men. I’m not accusing you personally of doing this, it just seems to be the overall knee jerk sentiment here.

I think some of the people that oppose this, do in fact want to control sex and men's access. Same reason some oppose prostitution. Not all, but some. You are free to disagree and think that not a single person opposing these things wants to control men's access to sex, or even pleasure which this is. But I would argue that's incredibly naive.

I think the argument that that's all it is is wrong as well, but I understand why they feel that way. Because men's sexuality is constantly demonized and attacked as a negative. And you are doing it yourself, by acting as though men having access to sex dolls will create a bunch of sexual predators that will harm women.

If you feel I'm misrepresenting your argument, I would ask you to really think about your positions and what that means for the men you're talking about. Because I fail to see how it means anything less than it will cause me to become sexual predators and dangers to women.

[–]contexistential 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You make some interesting points. I will give this some thought and respond. I would be curious to hear your thoughts to the response I wrote to DirHr a second ago if you’re interested. I don’t want to spam this thread with a duplicate post, will figure out if there’s a way to properly link to it.

[–]r2401 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You have fair concerns but none of these concerns come close to justifying limiting an individual's freedom to consume a product that doesn't involve another human or victimize anyone.

You could raise the same concerns about sexy dancing but anyone attempting to legally prohibit dancing would rightfully be mocked. So yes mockery is also justified in this case.

[–]contexistential 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah well I never infringed on anyone’s freedom by raising questions, I’ve had a hand in creating products I feel way less morally comfortable with than this one so I’m already guilty there, Im capable of seeing things from multiple angles and enjoy learning how other people perceive things I might not see, and I find mocking things I don’t agree with to be laughably arrogant. But you do you, dude.

[–]r2401 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't mock things I disagree with, I specifically mock people that are so presumptuous to think that their "moral questions" about activity that has no victims and involves what is generally considered in modern society to fall under the umbrella of an individual freedom, should allow them to even consider sanctions against said victimless behavior. I would say that kind of thinking is far more arrogant than anything I've posted here.

I mock such individuals the same way we mock the townsfolk in "Footloose" today. If you think that's arrogant and that I need to give any hefty consideration to that viewpoint, so be it. But you won't get away with the reductive assertion that I mock everything I "disagree with." It's much more precise than that and here I am informing you of that precision.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I think it’s less about a doll as a victim, and more of how this effects the ways society views women and sex. When it becomes normal to fuck a fake woman that can’t consent, what implications does that have on our real life relationships?

Women's number one sex fantasy is forced intercourse. If there was a way to act that out I guarantee you would say it has no implications on relationships because, no matter what, a woman's rape fantasy in absolutely positively no way implies she wants to seek out non-consenting sex in real life. However, if men have sex with a doll that can't talk you presume it's a rape fantasy and moreover automatically assume men will seek out "non consenting" situations in real life.

It's blatant sexism that gives women the benefit of the doubt that their fantasies, or acting out their fantasies, have no bearing on their behavior or what they want in real life. This hypocritical thinking strongly implies you (and other people with your thinking) have an ulterior motive with keeping men away from sex dolls. Conscious or unconscious.

[–]contexistential 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I never said having sex with a doll would make men more likely to rape. You raise an interesting point with the women’s rape fantasy angle though, and I (sincerely) appreciate that you acknowledge the difference between submission fantasy and desire for non consensual real-life rape. I would be interested in discussing further, but honestly the suggestion that myself and others “with my thinking” have an unconscious ulterior motive to keep men away from sex dolls induces supreme eye rolling and strongly implies a massive ego and/or paranoia tendencies.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

k

[–]YouNeededCorrection 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

And dildos, retard?

Edit: added a word

[+]contexistential -11 points-10 points-9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good thing you added that word before I wasted my time responding to what I mistakenly assumed was a valid question. Seek therapy.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Blah blah blah... reverse the genders...

[+]contexistential -8 points-7 points-6 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

How might I reverse the genders exactly?

[–]Historybuffman 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Dildos.

[–]contexistential -4 points-3 points-2 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

I would equate dildos with fleshlights or something else that resembles a vagina. I think creating a market for fucking fake woman has other implications. To each their own, but the reversing genders argument doesn’t really hold up. I think it’s a fascinating topic to explore from a sociological, gender and technological lens, but since most replies I’ve gotten are completely condescending and most of the comments here are completely sexist regardless of whether the dolls are, this doesn’t seem to be the space for intellectual conversation.

[–]Historybuffman 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

I would equate dildos with fleshlights or something else that resembles a vagina. I think creating a market for fucking fake woman has other implications. To each their own, but the reversing genders argument doesn’t really hold up.

It isn't really about specifically dildo/fleshlight or male or female sexdoll, it is people's attitudes around male/female sexuality.

Look around. Women owning a dildo is nothing. Either people shrug it off or its "grl powa!" A man owning a fleshlight or some other sex toy? Sad, pathetic, loser, he can't get laid, etc.

And come on, are you living in the same world I am? Some men are now terrified to be with women due to the mass amounts of accusations flying around, but still want and need sex. You do the math here.

since most replies I’ve gotten are completely condescending and most of the comments here are completely sexist regardless of whether the dolls are, this doesn’t seem to be the space for intellectual conversation.

That is because you come in here mindlessly spouting the same feminist propaganda that we read every day. We know. You are bringing nothing new to the table and so you appear to be just another feminist troll that we get on here from time to time.

You are refusing to see our points, so why must we listen to yours, much less debate you? Not to mention your "debate" MO here seems to be:

  1. Say something commonly spouted by feminists

  2. Someone challenges your argument and/or offers a different viewpoint

  3. You waffle and say you are still unsure, we need to think about it

... not exactly the best kind of debates anyway.

[–]contexistential -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

I ASKED for alternate viewpoints, not rejected them. I received one from u/elvick and found it interesting. I’m secure enough that I can say when I don’t have the answer to something, or that I haven’t yet developed a nuanced point of view that would add value to the conversation. That is what is supposed to happen in a discussion. Someone gives me something new to think about, and I don’t actually feel the need to double down. That is not “waffling”. I enjoy hearing a male perspective on these things. You call me a feminist troll. No one wants to engage in actual conversation, this whole exchange is pathetic.

[–]Historybuffman 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

I didn't call you a feminist troll, I implied that coming in here spouting feminist propaganda makes you

appear to be just another feminist troll that we get on here from time to time.

I did have a conversation once you seemed to actually want to engage. But now that I have pointed out what could be our problems with you, you have taken it as a personal attack.

And yes, you do not have to double down on a point, but you certainly do waffle. You present your side as if it were the truth and then immediately backpedal when challenged. That's wafflin'.

[–]contexistential -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I did not backpedal when challenged. I acknowledged the validity of someone else’s views and offered a different but not necessarily conflicting perspective. But there is a complete lack of ability on this sub to even consider that another point of view could be valid, much less examine whether that point of view might contribute context to ones own. Anything that doesn’t adhere to the narrative is automatically deemed feminist nonsense. I don’t speak for all feminists or represent all facets of a feminist movement. I am not a spokesperson, and I am not a one dimensional feminist concept incapable of coherent thought. I am a person. No one has to agree with me, but the thought of receiving a response that even resembled “I have a different opinion but I understand a little better now” instead of a bunch of misogynistic abuse is pretty much unfathomable. That is such a low bar for expectation I feel like I’m actually gaslighting myself. This sub is a mindfuck.

I recognize your user name and believe you and I had a healthy conversation recently that I appreciated and learned from, so I really want to give you the benefit of the doubt and examine whether I misinterpreted, but you literally said that I came in mindlessly throwing out feminist propaganda. What am I supposed to do with that?

I try to engage in conversation in good faith, and I almost always get replies full of abuse and condescension. I am interested in expanding my views and challenging my biases and care about men’s rights. I have posted comments in other threads that are completely void of any kind of disagreement and are 100% empathy, support and validation of men’s issues. They get downvoted and ridiculed faster than it takes to actually read them. In the past 24 hours I’ve been called a cunt and a retard. The general sentiment here breeds and celebrates distrust and contempt for women that isn’t healthy for its members and is detrimental to your cause.

On the benefit of the doubt point, regardless of the judgement I find in your last response, I believe you will at least read this admittedly tedious and misplaced comment and consider it before deciding whether or not you find it of any value. You too are not a spokesperson of the others in this sub, so no obligation to respond (unless you want to). This is a toxic environment that I am not welcome in, and I’m fine conceding.

[–]LikesTacos 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Everybody is a fuckable object. Anything is a fuckable object. This has fuckall to do with societies view of women. There are no victims when people fuck inanimate objects.

[–]manafest_best 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Almost nobody is going to use these dolls for 'rape fantasies'. The kind of people who want that shit won't be turned on by something that can't experience (ore at least believably simulate) pain or fear.

The fantasy these things will be fulfilling is simply sex with a woman for men who want, but can't (or won't) achieve this through traditional means. People with embarrassing medical problems, or maybe crippling social disorders who want something closer to a normal sex life than jerking off into a rubberized tube. Or perfectly normal men who want the tactile and visual stimulation without investing in a relationship or taking the risks associated with anonymous hookups.

The men who want this type of thing will be satisfied, and they won't be in the dating pool for women to have to deal with. How is this not win-win-win?

What do you tell your daughter? "Look for someone who loves you and wants a real woman."

What do you tell your (presumably heterosexual) son? "A doll can never give you what a real, loving woman can, but they can be helpful to some men who can't find a loving partner."

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You made a really good point. One can't push the idea that dolls will allow acting out of rape fantasies if the dolls cannot simulate a power dynamic. Maybe if they had voice recordings of women verbally resisting (ick) I could see a valid argument about rape fantasies. But otherwise no.

Even then I still haven't seen studies saying acting out fantasies causes one to seek out those fantasies in real life though. Women's number fantasy is forced intercourse, and if they were to simulate that somehow with a doll I'm not seeing how it would cause them to want to seek out the real thing.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

my completely reasonable comment

this is not a reasonable comment.

It's like saying we should legally forbid police, actually lets make it the entire population, from shooting hostage-situation target practice depictions of armed minorities because it "has implications in how society views minorities" and instead the silhouettes/pictures of attackers should only be white males. It's not reasonable to pretend target practice silhouettes paint minorities as "shootable objects" just like it's not reasonable to pretend sex dolls paint women as "sex objects."

Society wouldn't care whatsoever if there was a male sex doll brothel, or if there were male sex dolls in the female sex doll brothel. This fact eliminates the idea they care about objectifying a particular group. The whole idea of sex dolls painting women as objects is just victimhood-seeking and an attempt to control men's sexual outlets.

[–]contexistential -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

K

[–]DirHR 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

These dolls are fuckable objects, nothing more. Just like dildo's don't paint penises as fuckable objects.

[–]contexistential 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I see the point on an individual case level, but I believe there are larger implications to consider when taking this from a consumer product with an anatomical form factor and/or design that literally resembles a penis or vagina, to a doll that realistically resembles a woman, and creating a commercial market for sex with it.

Would you consider a less charged example? I study AI and have a particular interest in the dynamics created by the intersection of humans and machines. Currently, Alexa is pretty stupid. She is a voice interface, and is less “smart” and capable than many of the apps on my phone. And yet I feel compelled to thank her when she tells me what the weather is, and I get annoyed when she doesn’t understand me. Even at this rudimentary level of technology I experience emotional reactions that more resemble feelings I have towards humans than those I would have towards traditional tech. So what happens when digital assistants get smarter and become more interwoven in our daily lives? Will we know the difference between a human and a machine? Probably, at least for the foreseeable future. But when we are conditioned to bark orders at them, is it unreasonable to suppose widespread use could have an effect on the ways in which humans interact with each other? I believe it is prudent to take this into account and develop ethical design frameworks that maintain human empathy.

These dolls may not currently be capable of any kind of intelligence, but that is where it’s going, and sex is obviously a prime use case. There is no reality in which this won’t have an effect on society, for better or worse.

The other responses I’ve gotten lead me to doubt anyone is interested in an actual discussion, but I would appreciate the perspective of anyone who wants to challenge or add to this without attack.

[–]DirHR 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You may say Thank You to Alexa but at no time do you think Alexa is a real person. Technology is bringing humanoid robots and people will have to (and will) maintain a distinction.

I dare say that women have made dating in today's world very scary and dangerous for men. A man can lose it all over a false accusation, it's really no wonder men are interested in sex dolls.

[–]reachout_throwaway 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Does your interaction with Alexa change the way you interact with other humans? Or is Alexa just another tool, and you are capable of drawing the line between real and fake.

[–]Brusanan 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Your comment is being downvoted because it ISN'T completely reasonable. It isn't even slightly reasonable.

[–]contexistential -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Cool. This really adds something to the conversation.

[–]Dancing_Anatolia 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It is a space for intelligent discussion. Don't blame us because you have nothing intelligent to say.

[–]pardonmeimdrunk 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Dildos are mainstream.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't like the way romance novels and movies and women's mags portray relationships. I worry women, being stupid and impressionable, will confuse that for real life.

Such outlets that cater to women and aren't 100% realistic should be banned.

[–]Aivias 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

existence of these dolls does paint women as fuckable objects

But they are. In fact some of them like it!

[–]PlasmaBurst 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I disagree because they're objects. I don't think that having fuck androids would paint women as such, because it paves a route for an open market that allows women to have their version of a sex android. Hell, maybe something even modular if that floats your boat.

The reason for the argument of that this is evidence for the desire of controlling men over protecting victims is that banning the android will have no impact on protecting victims. Whether people like it or not, this is where the future is heading.

When there is a toxic growing movement that lies, tries to promote inequality, and generally throws men under the bus that speaks volumes. I don't see how it isn't a desire to control men, because the movement itself has implications in how society views women.

If anyone that actually buys into the product knows its just a robot, then they're mentally aware that is all it is.

However you should also have been aware that downvoting are people disagreeing with you, because you probably didn't make a good enough argument.

[–]TracyMorganFreeman 26 points27 points28 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"Having a sexual outlet that isn't rape encourages rape."

[–]PM_me_UR_duckfacepix 22 points23 points24 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Lorraine Questiaux of the feminist group Mouvement du Nid (Nest Movement) has argued that Xdolls is making money from “simulating the rape of a woman.”

Granted, when someone is fucking a sex doll, it's certainly possible that they're suspending disbelief and imagining they're doing something other than fancy masturbation. But: Whatever they're imagining is in their head.

The only thing Lorraine Questiaux thinks they could possibly be imagining is rape.
That says a lot.
About her.

[–]chadwickofwv 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I suspect all she is capable of thinking about is rape fantasies.

[–]Secksiignurd 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If an actual rapist was going to rape someone... wouldn't a sex doll, idk, potentially diffuse a rapist? Did Lorraine ever think of that??

[–]DeadeyeLan 19 points20 points21 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Welp, it Is a mans right to fuck an inanimate object after all. And feminists most certainly do hate men’s rights.

[–]furchfur 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

C'est la vie. France in 2016 made buying sex from prostitutes a crime, men are fined 1500 Euros.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

At least the guys in Alsace Lorraine can just go over to border to Germany.

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points18 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

yet no calls to ban 50 shades.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points17 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Or dildos.

[–]Hwga_lurker_tw 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Bad enough they made paternity testing illegal.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Wait, what? That's how corrupt our courts have become?

[–]Hwga_lurker_tw 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Never fuck in France.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

France.

[–]McGauth925 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That really is an outrage. It's bad for society when men find out how much women lie to them. This tells us exactly how men are valued in relation to how women are. It is organized sexism, at the behest of women - who have no power, remember.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

I thought men were "trash"? I thought men sexual harass women too much? Seems like they would be happy that us terrible men take out our toxic masculine needs out on inanimate dolls instead of them. They don't need no man, after all.

Hell, they consider us to be rapists anyway. They already believe we live in a rape culture. So how would those sex dolls make things worse than they are now?

[–]McGauth925 -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Dolls would diminish the power of women. Think how the world would change if men didn't spend so much time, effort, money chasing women. Think of how the transfer of resources from men to women would diminish. That's what feminists fear.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Dolls would diminish the power of women.

What power? I thought women were oppressed? Oppressed people can't have power over their oppressors, right? That's the reason they say women can't be sexist towards men.

Think how the world would change if men didn't spend so much time, effort, money chasing women.

There would be less rape, harassment, and abuse of women in the world, right?

Think of how the transfer of resources from men to women would diminish.

Women are strong and independent. They don't need no man.

That's what feminists fear.

It seems like they fear the exact things they are asking for.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

You have to decide if it helps you more to try to understand how feminists see feminism, or to portray them all as stupid and evil instead.

I'm NOT a W guy, but he either came up with this, or borrowed it.

WE JUDGE OTHER GROUPS BY THEIR WORST EXAMPLES, AND OUR OWN BY ITS HIGHEST IDEALS.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

You have to decide if it helps you more to try to understand how feminists see feminism

Why do you have to try and understand an ideology and a group of people who are objectively harmful to us? Should we have tried to understand what Hitler did? What Charles Manson did?

I'm not equating feminism to either of those criminals, but trying to make a point. It doesn't matter how they see something as justified, when it is objectively wrong and harmful if left unchecked.

Even if we DID try to understand how they see feminism, what would that solve? What that make what they are doing better somehow?

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

If I have to tell you the answer, then you're not likely to see any merit in it. So, imagine you actually can see a reason to face reality, instead of the unreasoning, power-mad demons we all see portrayed and condemned here.

Or, don't. Maybe that will serve you more. But, I doubt it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

If I have to tell you the answer, then you're not likely to see any merit in it.

Nice dodge. The "I won't have to defend/explain my position if I just assume that other person just won't 'get it' or reach my height of enlightenment" defense.

So, imagine you actually can see a reason to face reality, instead of the unreasoning, power-mad demons we all see portrayed and condemned here. Or, don't. Maybe that will serve you more. But, I doubt it.

Okay I'll bite. Since you're so enlightened compared to others who just see feminism as bullshit, what merits does feminism in the current society, where women have the same rights as men and even advantages in some areas?

What is the "reality" in your opinion? What can you say to steer us away from the "unreasoning, power-mad demons we all see portrayed and condemned here".

Here is your chance to shine, and convince someone to see your point of view. Maybe that will serve you more. But, I doubt it.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

You lead the horse to water. If s/he doesn't drink, so be it. If you can't see how women would like at least some aspects of feminism, AND how they could believe it's not simply a power grab, then you really don't want to. I'm not going to waste time trying to convince you of what you don't wish to believe. That would be exactly like you trying to convince a rad, man-hating, feminist that she's just wrong.

The general principle I'm touting here is that looking for reality is better than believing what I want to believe, that it's more useful to us, long-term. I think painting all, or most feminists, as either stupid, evil, or power-hungry simply doesn't help us deal with them. And, when we do paint them that way, we make it easier for them to portray MRAs to the general public as brainless reactionaries. Hearts and minds, my friend.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

You lead the horse to water. If s/he doesn't drink, so be it.

You haven't lead anyone to water though. You pretty much said "water exists", and then when asked to show us, you say "well if you don't know where the water is... you won't drink it..."

I asked you to explain your position (where is the water, I would like to drink), and you refused, saying I wouldn't understand if I didn't already know (not leading me anywhere, and not making sense).

If you can't see how women would like at least some aspects of feminism, AND how they could believe it's not simply a power grab, then you really don't want to.

Again, this is bullshit reasoning not to defend your claim.

I told you that women have the same rights that men have, which is supposedly the goal of feminism. EQUAL RIGHTS. But I'll extend an olive branch: what "aspects of feminism" are there to like? Aspects exclusive to feminism that couldn't be accomplished with feminism?

I asked you, what reason should feminism exist in today's society? Instead of a solid answer, you respond with passive aggressive "well you wouldn't understand" comments.

I'm not going to waste time trying to convince you of what you don't wish to believe.

Of course you won't. What a great way to convince people that you're right: either have them believe you 100% right out of the gate, or tell them "you won't understand" when they question why they should consider your side to be correct.

Me asking for an explanation is an indication that I am open to believing. If I wasn't, I would've just said you're full of shit and not even bother asking for you to develop upon your beliefs.

That would be exactly like you trying to convince a rad, man-hating, feminist that she's just wrong.

No, it wouldn't. Because unlike you, I have no problem defending my ideas and what I believe in. I don't tell people they wouldn't understand, or that I have no time to convince them or even have a civil discussion.

By the way, funny how you have time to reply to my comments, yet that same time couldn't be used to convince me of your opinion.

The general principle I'm touting here is that looking for reality is better than believing what I want to believe, that it's more useful to us, long-term.

I agree. Not all feminists are crazy man-haters.

Which again is why I asked you: what are the merits of feminism in today's society? What can feminism "fix" without infringing on other people's rights and freedom of choice? What things are in actual need of fixing?

I think painting all, or most feminists, as either stupid, evil, or power-hungry simply doesn't help us deal with them. And, when we do paint them that way, we make it easier for them to portray MRAs to the general public as brainless reactionaries.

I also agree. But I would say that just as there are crazy feminists, there are crazy MRAs. And that needs to be pointed out. Both sides can be full of shit, but I don't see the MRAs getting people fired and locked up over bullshit.

Hearts and minds, my friend.

I'm not your fucking friend. Don't insult my intelligence, claiming I wouldn't "understand" a dissenting point of view, then have the nerve to use the word "friend".

I want to know what "reality" you see in today's world; a reality that somehow gives merit to any form of feminism that is present today. If you have time to reply about why I wouldn't understand, you have time to explain and give me the possibility to understand.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm not insulting your intelligence. I was questioning whether or not believing the worst about feminists, and maybe women in general, is a better long-term strategy than accurately assessing the people who oppose you.

And, really, what you want is your concern.

"The general principle I'm touting here is that looking for reality is better than believing what I want to believe, that it's more useful to us, long-term.

I agree. Not all feminists are crazy man-haters"

"I think painting all, or most feminists, as either stupid, evil, or power-hungry simply doesn't help us deal with them. And, when we do paint them that way, we make it easier for them to portray MRAs to the general public as brainless reactionaries.

I also agree. "

Ok. That's what I was saying. To me, you were coming off that what I was saying made no sense to you, that I needed to justify it to your satisfaction. Then you tell me that (at least parts of) what I was saying makes sense to you. Well, those are the parts that I was trying to get at. We're done.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points12 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

If I jerk off- do I rape my hand?

[–]Everything_Is_Rape 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It was rape long before then

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I suspect feminists do not care about men jerking off as long as they aren't thinking of a woman while they perform the disgusting act.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Nah. They want men to want women, because that makes women powerful. They simply can't do anything about men jerking off.

[–]xrudeboy420x 18 points19 points20 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

They mad because we’d rather fuck sex dolls than fuck with them.

[–]YouNeededCorrection -4 points-3 points-2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They're * mad.

[–][deleted] 8 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The vagina is removable. Cleaner than a used whore.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Good to know, at least that cuts down on unwanted STDs

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

As apposed to wanted STDs? Are you making cheese with them?

In all seriousness though, you remove the used sections of the doll, wash them with sanitizer dry then reuse. Parts are replaced every 100 or so uses depending on the rate of wear.

[–]DerpHernandez[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

As apposed to wanted STDs?

You're gonna want to google bug chasing.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Huh. You learn something new everyday. Poor bastards.

[–]DirHR 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Women control men through sex, it is why stealing sex from a woman is such a big deal while stealing sex from men is not.

The control that women have over men is their meal ticket for everything. It is the entire reason men will move mountains to please women over minor complaints. For men to have freedom, we need sexual freedom from women.

When women tell us how rape is about control and not about sex, they are projecting how they view sex.

[–]McGauth925 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

VERY interesting insights. Every once in a while somebody puts his finger right on the hot button, and makes it all obvious.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They obviously can't handle the competition. Feminists have been saying for years women don't need men...now men are starting to say we don't need them either and they are flipping their collective shit.

It's a great time to be alive ain't it?

[–]DEPRESSION_IS_COOL 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Smart dolls are the future of menkind (yes fun)

[–]ollyollyollyoioioi 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Imagine being threatened by plastic so much that you have to shut it down.

[–]Revenant221 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is just mirroring the minimum wage scenario. Make some noise and people will notice you. Make too much noise and people will replace you. In the case of minimum wage the companies started to implement automated systems and in this case they're...basically doing the same.

[–]thatdude473 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What do these psychos want?!

[–]kartu3 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There is that sex desire gap.
Men want it more.
Brothels et al reduce the gap, hence are "problematic".

They go as far as considering outlawing paying for sex even if you are abroad (Sweden). It is perfectly legal in Germany.

[–]planned_serendipity1 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is just another example of feminists redefining rape to ridiculous lengths just to demean men's sexuality and to exaggerate women's "oppression."

[–]zetsthamys 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Litteraly fuck those fucking feminists.

A doll is not a person. There is no rape possible as there is no consent obtainable in the first place.

Do we really need a fucking court to figure this out ??

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Aka women are losing their power/ control over men and they don't like it.

[–]Leossauro[🍰] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Wtf, this world becomes crazier everyday.

[–]Optional_Reading 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Robotic women is the real AI threat. Not skynet/cyberdine style AI attacks. The real threat is men going their own way.

[–]TheBeardedSatanist 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Literally fucking how? If anything I'd imagine it would make rape statistics trend downwards. Do they think we're actually all retarded? Like we can't tell difference between a doll and an actual person?

It's literally a hunk of silicon and synthetic material that is soft enough to fuck, how does that have any effect on your life at all?

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They don't really think rape counts will rise. They fear the loss of power to women, when they can't control men's needs. But, they're trying to make it plausible that men will abuse the hell out of dolls, and then go on to do the same to women, even though men would have absolutely no need to.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Does using a "punching-mannequin boxing dummy" encourage a culture of violence? It's punching of a humanoid figure so it must encourage violence right?

[–]VictorVrine 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ok so do you guys know the idea of the Great Filter (some event that should happen to every civilization that is so destroying that it will almost certainly destroy it)?

That has to be it. Just sexists (both against men and women) completely making one gender feel afraid/hate the other too much for our species to continue existing

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They'll try to outlaw jerking off, next.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Cant have sex with a woman, cant have sex with a doll... well fuck, guess we're all homosexual now lads! What else is there at this point....

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I once read about farm boys in some State of America and, um, watermelons.

[–]crocsim 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is pretty stupid, however there doesn't seem to be the collective concern when loli anime is made illegal ( its considered child porn in a lot of places). Thanks may be where they are coming from. It's all stupid though, really if you can eliminate the entire sex industry by using Androids instead why wouldn't you.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Feminists resent the fact that men use womens' bodies or the form of womens' bodies to gratify their sexual urges. I'm not sure what they expect us to do in this regard. Have sex with a woman's mind?

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

I believe that radical feminists really don't give a fuck about what men want or need.

[–]ContrasexualWoman 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

They're dolls... what exactly is the harm? How on earth do sex dolls "encourage rape"?

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It makes more sense if you think of feminism as a new extreme theism. Every religion seeks to control sex in some ways. Some of them to an extreme way. Feminists are modern Puritans. But only for men. Women can do whatever.

[–]ContrasexualWoman 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's an awfully true and therefore terrifying way of putting it. Zealots are horrifying, regardless of ideology.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

EXACTLY!! Only for men. Just imagine women no longer having sexual power over men. They won't like that even a little EVEN IF THE INCIDENCE OF RAPE FALLS as a result.

[–]svenskbitch 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I am not astonished at all. And in fact, this kind of argument could just as well have come from social conservatives. Throughout history, and only a few decades ago, it was that faction that opposed prostitution, pornography, and pretty much any display of sexuality.

And feminism IS social conservatism. True, they did call for sexual liberation at some point - but we hear little of that nowadays. True, they helped open up more opportunities for women - but only once work had become suitably safe and protected and comfortable. And as for all those conservatives who truly think women belong at home - they must all be hiding under rocks, because I have certainly not come across them. And I worked for years in the Middle East...

Look, it is quite simply. Society has to protect women to protect the survival of the species. The job of the woman is to use her attractiveness to pick the right mate, or the genes that will bring our species forward. If we allow men to have alternate avenues for pleasure, then we are undermining that power. After all, they will have to want to copulate pretty badly to agree to protect a woman and her children and even her extended family for the rest of his life - in a world where almost all had to eke out a living in the true sense of the world through hard toil.

It is exactly the same instinct that lies behind slut shaming. A slut is selling her attractiveness under value, driving down the price for the rest of the women.

We need little of that in today's society. But we are still more or less the same people. Reprogramming takes generations, centuries, perhaps even millennia.

[–]McGauth925 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I would so love it if men just stopped chasing women. Feminists won't say they fear the diminishing of women's sexual power, but I have to think that's the issue.Women could just go their way, while men go their's. And, we come together again when it serves both sexes...50 years from now. With the development of artificial uteri and the new male pill EVERYBODY could have what they want. ONLY women would have a much harder time controlling men, which is what feminists fear.

[–]Secksiignurd 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[deleted]

[–]nirvanapleasure 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Rape is about power, not sex. Many men that are less attractive, such as short men are frustrated and need to release their pent up energy.

[+][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

More like they feel threatened because a sex doll is more attractive as a partner than a blue-haired dyke who doesn't shave her pussy.

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