CMV: Female dating advice is useless because what women find attractive and who they want to have sex with are two totally different things.

hyperrreal · 2016-11-17T19:07:13+00:00

Women tell about what makes a man attractive, but that doesn't mean they want to have sex with him. Therefore to men, female dating advice is useless.

Are you really arguing there's no overlap or connection between the men women find attractive and the men women want to have sex with? Because that seems absurd on it's face.

Also, your conclusion doesn't follow from your premise. Even if we assume that a man's attractiveness to women is entirely separate from his sexual desirability (and again this is ridiculous, but for the sake of argument), that doesn't in any way lead us to conclude that female dating advice has no utility to men whatsoever.

I believe that guys who want to learn how to get laid should primarily get advice from successful players, as they have the most relevant experience. However, that does not mean that advice from women is totally useless. It just needs to be taken with a grain of salt, and considered in its proper context.

goatismycopilot · 2016-11-17T20:54:49+00:00

I think that one of the common themes of postings here from a TRP perspective is that women are useless except for a few things, they are too stupid to self reflect, they are too stupid to understand anything beyond their own momentary emotions, and as a result they give bad advice about everything but especially dating advice. Here is the thing, women are never going to give good advice to men about getting casual sex because despite claims made about how every woman in America is slutting it up almost as often as they breath and jumping on strange dicks with the same sort of frequency as casual lane changing because huge numbers of women are not having casual sex, are not interested in casual sex, or they tried it once or twice and decided they did not like it. Oh and holy fuck, God help you if you tried casual sex a few times and did not like it and had the temerity to change your mind about something based on specific experiences, the TRP acts like women who do something and then decide they do not like it later are about the same as serial killers.

The actual population of women who want to jump on a dick for no random reason at all on a regular basis is pretty small so yes woman are going to give bad advice about how to get casual sex because they themselves are not having casual sex as often as the average TRP seems to think they are.

So, female dating advice is not useless because lots of women actually do want to date and have relationships and some of them have actually learned from their experiences and could offer something except they are not being asked for dating advice. Men just want to know how to screw chicks and many women have no idea because they are not out jumping on random dicks, don't care about it, and don't really have than many friends who jumps on random dicks.

Men also give one another shitty advice because they do lie, because they do not want to look like morons in front of friends, and because they like to inflate victories. Men are also often completely and utterly wrong at reading people and situations especially trying to figure out if a woman is attracted to them.

However, when in default TRP is going to explain away things by saying women don't know shit.

edit, words.

SipsSparklingWater · 2016-11-17T20:42:07+00:00

When women give dating advice they are usually talking about how they want a man they are already attracted to act towards them.

biblesjedi_mindtrick · 2016-11-17T19:17:27+00:00

When a man thinks a woman is attractive, the man wants to have sex with the woman. When a woman thinks a man is attractive, it doesn't mean she wants to have sex with him.

Women tell about what makes a man attractive, but that doesn't mean they want to have sex with him. Therefore to men, female dating advice is useless.

RESPONSE

Male tunnel vision missing too much. Female dating advice is actually telling men how women will both date & agree to sex with men, the things necessary for women besides attraction. However men can't seem to believe women need something beyond attraction, since attraction is "all" that's necessary to pull dick. So men completely miss what women say, and then wonder why the women they "attract" don't stay long.

stonepimpletilists · 2016-11-17T20:32:05+00:00

Mens advice is better because they can't lie. They tell you something, because they've tried it, and it works (assuming you aren't listening to retards)

Girls will say, what they think works, because they have no idea what goes into a F close scenario. It just happened completely oblivious to the planning, the gym workouts, the diet, the game, the logistics.

they also have a sample size of 1, what worked for them. A guy can tell you what worked for 10 women, and will probably work on 10 more.

They aren't ignorant to it, they miss the triggers, and can only comment on the afterglow

future_space_boobs · 2016-11-17T19:14:10+00:00

What I didn't address in my comment and what you're ignoring in your post is that, at least for me, familiarity breeds desire. A hot stranger in the street? I'll 'mire him, but I won't sexualize him in my mind or have any interest in engaging him.

However, if I get to know that stranger... if we have a class together, for example, and I get to know him and we get along, then I might start to get interested. At least for me, attraction can be immediate but desire takes time to build. I have given plenty of guys advice to this end but ultimately it still comes down to luck. you have to be in the right place at the right time or else incredibly charismatic and able to quickly disarm someone socially. or just both be drunk.

nomdplume · 2016-11-17T20:02:26+00:00

The main difference between these viewpoints is that one includes a time-compression element. Redpill assumes a time-atmosphere which could be called "5x sped up relationship time" and Bluepill assumes "normal social relationship time". In normal relationship time, a compatible and single woman in your vicinity, who you connect with, would have a pretty good chance of sparking some interest. Chances would be pretty good, given time.

In redpill 5x-sped-up-relationship time, you have to meet a woman in a coffee shop, and walk out having made a significant impression on her. Both you and her have to be relatively unstable, in terms of boundaries, for that to happen. You have to have both artifiically accelerated your relationship forming processes by conscious effort, e.g be experiencing some form of "desperation" (hoping to use that word in a non-shaming way, as I dont think its something to be ashamed of). I just don't think thats how humans connect. Or you have to experience some kind of "soul mate"-esque deeper connection, which is not something that you can manipulate anyway, so useless to strategize about.

The reason why Redpillers live in "5x sped up social time" is because there are underlying social phobias - not enjoying being around people, not being in social scenarios, not connecting with people generally - that keep them out of the social space. Redpill is like a video-game mission, to enter into and extract a pretty woman from a social environment.

female dating advice is useless

Are you dating, or just building mental castles in your head? Female dating advice is generally good. If you haven't had redpill advice backfire on you yet, that indicates to me a lack of experience, specifically the experience of having an emotional bond with another person. Believe me, it will backfire in hilarious ways.. just give it time. (Sorry for the smugness of that, I can't logically talk you out of your convictions).

Edit: sorry, I'm being a smug asshole at the end here. I'll leave it as is though.

[deleted] · 2016-11-17T20:23:34+00:00

That second quote could be the poster saying that she also needs to be romantically attracted to the man to even consider having sex. So she needs to find him attractive (as in good looking) and with an appealing personality. Not either or. Both at the same time. She isn't sleeping with all the men she finds attractive, but she won't sleep with someone unattractive either.

anitapk · 2016-11-17T20:28:16+00:00

Women make it known when they're attracted to men. Not in the same way men do, but they still do

Edit to add: men who look for dating advice online are those who arent receiving attention from women so they think that women don't show interest

winterrider · 2016-11-17T21:36:25+00:00

I don't think it is totally useless, the problem is men and women are speaking different languages. Our thinking in terms of sex and relationships is completely different.

Women, even fat and unattractive women, can have sex with any of a number of attractive men anytime they want. It takes almost no effort for a woman to get an attractive man for sex. So they aren't looking only for a hot sex partner. So their relationship advice is all from the point of view of what traits should a guy have in addition to being, hot, sexy and great in bed.

Men on the other hand can have any number of attractive women we can orbit. We don't need help with getting more women to orbit. We have absolutely no need to learn how to be a "good catch" that no woman shows the slightest sexual attraction towards.

A lot of female advice is how they wish a super hot, attractive guy would treat them.

GridReXX · 2016-11-17T22:48:23+00:00

I'm speaking generally here on out:

Women have a reactive sexuality.

I'll attempt to change your view by saying yes it's important to take into consideration the men that women find attractive in passing even if she has no desire to act on that fleeting thought of "ooh he's hot."

As a woman, I will agree with the woman you quoted in your OP in that there are plenty of people on a regular basis I see who are attractive but don't compel me to stop what I'm doing to get to know them so that I can have sex. My libido simply isn't that active nor set up that way.

However if that person were to approach me I could be inspired to lust or be more amenable to being turned on.

Invalidity · 2016-11-17T22:53:34+00:00

Female dating advice does not focus on what women find attractive; it focuses on what qualities a woman is looking for in an attractive partner. Many women will have played the field and will know exactly what physical qualities are attractive to them.

When they are looking for a guy, the initial physical qualities that they are looking for will allow the men who meet that requirement to pass that screening. The next layer is what you hear women tell you they are looking for. They are not lying: they are indeed looking for those qualities, but what they don't tell you is that a guy must be a certain level of attractive already to get to the next step. That's where female dating advice fails - it does not cater to all men, only men for whom that particular woman is looking for.

So in short, female dating advice is useless because it doesn't tell me about the initial screening - which is ABSOLUTELY crucial.

Candy_Kittens · 2016-11-17T23:59:18+00:00

Most advice seems to be vague and useless in my opinion. From both men and women.

The best advice that I get is not advice at all. It is just about reading and listening to other people's dating experiences. For example one lesson I took away is don't be bitter or lash out. No matter how hurt you may feel.

SetConsumes · 2016-11-17T23:34:11+00:00

Female dating advice is useless because what women say means different things to men and women, women don't know why they're attracted to someone necessarily, and depending on what the woman currently wants(fucktoy vs husband) what is attractive also changes.

I think you're playing on the last part mainly, women saying what makes a man attractive for marriage is not what makes them attractive for fucking.

phantasic79 · 2016-11-18T00:05:20+00:00

Do we not all realize this is a supply and demand issue? Hot women have no problem obtaining sex. If guys had no problem obtaining sex we would have the same attitudes as women regarding attractiveness and whether we act on it or not. There is no value in sleeping with random men that women find hot. Your average hot chick could bang mutiple hot strangers a day every day. I think a simliar analogy is i love boating and always wanted to go out on the water every time a friend asks me to go out on his boat. Now that I own a boat and can go whenever I want I rarely ever make it out on the water. Not that I don't enjoy it anymore but I can always go next time and other priorities take over in the mean time. Result is that I only actually go boating a few time a year as opposed to every weekend like I fantasized before owning a boat.

This will all probably change by the next century as we will have perfected realistic sex bots and advanced cheap plastic surgery techniques that will make everyone a 10. The demand for beautiful humans will decrease substantially and we can finally be rid of silly shows like the kardashians.

MasterTeacher88 · 2016-11-18T12:27:38+00:00

I don't think women give men bad advice on purpose, like they're not trying to sabatoge their brothers/friends. They mean well they just most times have no idea what they're talking about.

mrcs84usn · 2016-11-17T19:37:27+00:00

Rollo had a pretty solid write-up on attraction vs arousal.

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crowbird_ · 2016-11-17T23:05:25+00:00

CMV: Female dating advice is useless

.

Therefore to men, female dating advice is useless

Wait, what?

Also, you're basing hell of a lot on two comments posted on reddit. That doesn't make any sense, you could pick any two comments anywhere and use them as a basis for your view. These particular comments don't make sense either. People generally have sex with what they are attracted to. Outliers in that regard should not be considered to represent men or women in general.

rpquestion7 · 2016-11-17T23:08:59+00:00

The advice that women give you has very good aspects every man should incorporate into their game. For me, the starting point has always been general social skills. To be more specific: How do you make people like you? What do you already do that people often respond to positively? What value do you contribute to their life? (applying to both, men and women). These questions are also contextual - what is interesting and entertaining in one social circle may not be elsewhere.

When you combine I make you feel like I am a positive person and make you feel good about spending time with me with an understanding of how to build sexual tension, I believe that is where you become more successful with the opposite sex.

Additionally, if you are basing your attractiveness on how women respond, you will get all sorts of static in your feedback. From my experience, some attractive women have few social skills when it comes to flirting with men. I found this surprising because I was raised with the notion that women are smarter than men socially. I hold the belief that interactions with the opposite sex are like a dance. You have to have two people that know what they are doing to make it look and feel good. Pursuing a girl that has no idea what she is doing and her mantra is all I have to do is show up and be pretty can become frustrating.

BlackHeart89 · 2016-11-18T02:03:10+00:00

The only dating advice I got from women was "be yourself" and "I don't know". THAT was useless. I wish back then they would have told me what you're saying they say.

[deleted] · 2016-11-18T09:10:09+00:00

I think all hetero dating advice is better from the reader's own gender. Women's books on how to date, when to call back etc are mainly written by women.

I had a GF who kept me strung along and addicted with a "chase" that felt like a gripping video game but I'm sure she could tell you better than I how she did it.

And I think the same applies to men who are good at keeping women interested in a flirting banter conversation.

I'm not sure how to argue that without being seen as sexist though, as the popular response is obviously, "you wanna know how we think? Ask US, idiot!"

Ultimately I think the best thing for the modern dating world is when we move past game-playing but for people who feel a need to understand the "game" I think generally advice from their own gender is best.

lbspredh · 2016-11-18T11:33:30+00:00

You can't trust any advice from anyone ever. Try a few things, see what works

SockSage · 2016-11-18T14:10:43+00:00

When I think a man is vaguely attractive I'm probably not going to be motivated to break the ice. Unless circumstances allow for me to easily chat someone up then I'm probably not going to engage them at all, even if he's fucking gorgeous (gorgeous here is not a purely physical thing, a fit/hot guy who is clearly an idiot or an asshole is not a sexually attractive person to me).

The fact that I don't try to "close" with hot guys doesn't mean I don't want to fuck them. Unlike most RP guys I don't really care about "closing" with attractive people.

sunfirepassionapple · 2016-11-19T03:14:15+00:00

You're using dating advice to get laid. Of course you are going to have a bad time. When you (aka men) ask for advice on how to be with women, we women assume it's a relationship. We do not assume it's just for sex. We don't think your motive is a pump and dump. We think you are being genuine and are interested in a relationship.

Why would we give you advice on how to 'use' women?

fuxdpus · 2016-11-17T21:25:42+00:00

Women's dating advice is garbage because women don't know what they want. Asking a woman for dating advice is like asking a deer how to hunt deer, or asking a trout how to fish for trout.

Title	CMV: Female dating advice is useless because what women find attractive and who they want to have sex with are two totally different things.
Author	gavinok
Upvotes	31
Comments	188
Date	November 17, 2016 6:50 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/5dhjbg/cmv_female_dating_advice_is_useless_because_what/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-female-dating-advice-is-useless-because-what.271803 https://theredarchive.com/post/271803

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