Female here. I would like to ask a few questions.

theothermod · 2017-10-17T00:38:39+00:00

Stickied because there's good information for women who want to help. And some good advice for men, too.

The most important takeaway is to remember that when you're arguing with someone online, you shouldn't expect to convince them. The real goal is to influence the audience.

Also, MHRAconnect. Everyone should sign up and use it.

JestyerAverageJoe · 2017-10-16T12:31:40+00:00

So I ask, how do you cope?

It's hard.

My second question is how can I support men's rights as a female?

Unlike men, women are "allowed" to speak about gender. Use that power to speak out on our behalf.

Have you seen the film The Red Pill yet? You really should.

Ordinate1 · 2017-10-16T15:14:49+00:00

how do you cope?

Well, that's kind of how it is for us, all our lives; "swallow your pride," "man up," "just let it go."

And I'm not even saying that's always a bad thing; sometimes, those attitudes are absolutely necessary.

I just think that more women should display them more often :)

how can I support men's rights as a female?

Just be fair.

That's all any of us can ask for.

Thanks!

KDulius · 2017-10-16T12:17:44+00:00

How do I cope?

I hit the gym, I ride my bike, I go field shooting with some buddies.... and I argue against Feminist bullshit and for men's issues every chance I get, and I'm hoping to get down to the conference on the 19th in London and also the ICMI next year in Brum.

How can you help?

Lobby your local politicians, speak up on facebook/ twitter etc, don't buy into the feminist victim narrative and if you've not watched it yet, watch The Red Pill by Cassie, it's a great primer on the issues

Edit: Oh, and welcome.

tetraourogallus · 2017-10-17T04:10:53+00:00

We call you lot "men's rights allies" even though we support equality we have some specific rules for women wanting to be in our gang.

Here we go:

Understand that men are leading the way and affirm their capable leadership. Don’t assert yourself at the forefront.
When it comes to issues that directly pertain to men’s bodies and experiences, be quiet and listen.
Women don’t get to determine if they are “allies” to the men rights movement. Men do.
Take responsibility for addressing women’s issues with other women, rather than expecting men in mens rights activism to do all of the work.
Use your female privilege to encourage other women to work towards gender equality under men’s leadership.
Don’t use the label of ‘mens rights activist’ as a way to try to get men to like you — that’s disingenuous and counterproductive.
When given opportunities to execute professional tasks related to mens rights issues, consider referring other men instead.
Educate yourself about the history of mens rights activism and how men of different backgrounds have approached the movement.
Ensure your mens rights activism is intersectional.
Acknowledge that sometimes, men need opportunities to discuss mens rights issues without the presence of women. And that’s okay.
When men criticize your involvement in mens rights activism, don’t talk over them or talk down to them. Actively listen and be accountable.

joking of course

EternamD · 2017-10-16T15:21:49+00:00

How do I cope?

I don't. It cuts away at me every day.

What can you do?

Others have already said it, men don't have the right to campaign for male rights, but women do, and are taken more seriously. You'll never convince an entitled, insane feminist to change their opinion, but as long as the general feeling is slowly moving back to equal, then it will resolve in time. Thank you so much for being aware.

Dembara · 2017-10-16T13:49:17+00:00

So I ask, how do you cope?

May I suggest a reading of "An Enemy of the People"? Really a brilliant piece, as with most of Ibsen's works. The third to last line sums up the message without any spoilers: "the strongest man in the world is he who stands most alone." Do not be afraid. In its way, "isolation is the gift" (video link to the referenced poem by Bukowski). Also, keep active. Don't rest or despair. We may not be large in number, but we can still bring about great change.

My second question is how can I support men's rights as a female?

Contact your politicians. Give your experiences where you can. Write your thoughts and send them to local newspaper(s). Talk to those around you who might be willing to listen.

Thank you very much for your support!

DavidByron2 · 2017-10-16T17:38:09+00:00

how do you cope

Well I guess the main issue is that men's rights aren't recognized. Other groups get treated worse of course but usually they aren't insulted and presented as powerful at the same time. If you're black for example you can count on being able to talk about your issues without someone coming along and laughing at you because "everyone knows" blacks have privilege. However I don't think the reason for the chilling doesn't matter much. People in power have always loved to up-play their own troubles and down-play others'. The attacks on men is simply an aspect of the power women have over men in our society which is something you get used to very early on, whether male or female.

WilboCop · 2017-10-16T15:43:47+00:00

I don't think men are more angry by the Injustice and inequality. I think anyone that has a strong sense of Justice and fairness would be just as pissed. Honestly, I try to talk about this kind of stuff with my girlfriend but she says I always end up getting too passionate about it and I end up raising my voice(not at her, but she says it is hard to converse with me that way). It's true. I do get pretty passionate about it. My only outlet is this subreddit, really.

I don't really get a chance to cope with it. I think women have their own unique set of disadvantages and I think legit feminism is necessary. I just hate this thinly veiled man-hate and victim culture that is modern day feminism.

Great questions, by the way. I had never really thought about how I cope with this. Reading everyone else's responses.. it's kind of shocking realizing that I'm not unique in that I don't really cope with how things are. It's kind of sad really. Feminists and mens rights groups should be working together hand in hand.

Kuato2012 · 2017-10-16T18:37:32+00:00

how do you cope?

Partly by venting snarky, sarcastic comments here (but then outsiders peek in and think "oh, they're so toxic!"). Partly by abstaining from popular culture... I can regularly expect misandrist bullshit on Facebook, for example, so I don't use it much anymore. I'm not full MGTOW, but I can see it as a self-care option for the future.

how can I support men's rights as a female?

You're a valuable ally, because you get to have a voice. You can't be dismissed the way men are.

erenthia · 2017-10-17T08:57:59+00:00

every response calls us nut jobs.

All my internet hugs. You're basically answering your own question here about how to support men's rights as a female. By coming out in support of MRAs and applying the term to yourself you're already doing a lot.

Just by having a sense of justice and fairness and empathy for men you're basically all any of us could ask for. So follow your conscious, speak up when it's called for, and do what's right. And hey if you have a taste for activism, make a youtube channel or something, but if you don't that's fine.
The men in your life may be harder to convince than the women though, and it may not be appropriate to push them. I could go on and on all day about how to support the men you care about, but that wasn't actually your question.

Final thought: I don't actually know if it's worse for me as a man or not. I have no idea what it must be like to be infantilized by feminists for being a woman. I only know what it's like to be demonized for being a man. But it means a lot that you care.

violentchickenattack · 2017-10-16T12:20:05+00:00

I avoid women. Stay single. Enjoy my work and hobbies. Try to educate men about the dangers of marriage and women.

EricAllonde · 2017-10-16T12:38:15+00:00

It helps to remember that away from the Internet & social media, in the real world, feminists are useless non-achievers. It's their victimhood mindset. Someone who walks around, clinging to a belief that all the men in the world (the patriarchy) are oppressing them, is simply never going to pursue and achieve any significant goals. Their victimhood mindset stops them. It's a simple rationalisation: why put a lot of effort into going this thing you want, if the patriarchy is just going to oppress you and stop you from getting it.

The only thing that feminists have any success with is the job of being feminists. The only feminists who achieve anything are the professional feminist whiners, like Laurie Penny, Anita Sarkeesian and Jessica Valenti.

By comparison, it's almost an advantage to be male and grow up knowing you have absolutely no intrinsic self worth to society because of your gender, that you're to be judged and measured solely on what you do. Those social expectations light a fire and drive men to achieve, which is why we see such a big gap in results of the two genders at the high end of the curve.

I think it's OK to feel a bit sorry for feminists at times. They've got nothing of note happening in terms of career or business, and that won't change for as long as they cling to their ideology, which will likely be the rest of their lives. Doesn't that sound sad to you? No wonder they're on the Internet, bitching about how much they hate men. It's all they can do, their only option.

ExpendableOne · 2017-10-16T14:33:57+00:00

how do you cope?

When it comes to dealing with people in a personal basis? I assume like most men do, by learning to be quiet and keeping my views or feelings to myself. Just in a general basis? By doing your best to keep moving forward. Find other things to focus on(like work, relationships or hobbies).

how can I support men's rights as a female

Just empathize with men. Treat men how you would like to be treated. Speak out whenever you can, if you can(not just because you are in a position to do so more effectively as a woman but because it can show men and women out there that there are women who support men). Reach out to men who might be too shy, disparaged or hurt to reach out to others. If you don't support gender roles, then embrace make sure you stay consistent on both sides of the equation with me(try not to think less of men who are not tall, assertive, strong masculine men, and try to take charge/responsibility when it is necessary).

factsenrageyou · 2017-10-16T14:54:37+00:00

I cope by refusing to allow any misandry or misandrist into my life. This, of course, makes my pool of associates very small. I married outside my culture so she's not a feminist.

To your second question, challenge the bullshit when you encounter it, with damning, probing questions:

Why do you oppose post pregnancy choice for men? If a woman can't be forced to be a parent just because a pregnancy occurs, why can a man be forced? How is that equal? Her body? Her Choice? But HIS responsibility? How is that not slavery?

Why do you oppose 50% custody for men? Wouldn't it be outrageous if men started opposing any legislation guaranteeing women custody? How is that equal? etc..

theidgafdude · 2017-10-16T18:36:08+00:00

My goodness I was looking for a women like you but I gave up.

RapeMatters · 2017-10-16T13:34:08+00:00

It's hard. But worthwhile things almost always are.

bufedad · 2017-10-16T13:45:40+00:00

I try to think about why they feel the way they feel.

I'm personally of the belief that we evolved to protect and take care of women above all else as a species. So, it's completely understandable that they would react this way. On the other hand, it makes short term successes in the pursuit of equality next to impossible.

2017-10-16T17:05:57+00:00

So I ask, how do you cope?

By saying fuck it and not participating in society until things change for the better again.

chicayeye7 · 2017-10-16T19:48:41+00:00

sorry to say this but men call feminist nutjobs all the time, they actually call them NAZIS so... About how can you support men's right as a female? being a feminist, because feminism by definition is the belief that women should be allowed the same rights, power, and opportunities as men and be treated in the same way, or the set of activities intended to achieve this state ( this is according to the cambridge diccionary) . Sure there are some radicals forms of feminism, like in every movement, but that doesn't change what it really is and how most feminists are. Feminisms looks for equality, for women to have the same rights as men, not for men to have less rights.

CountVonVague · 2017-10-16T21:29:06+00:00

My second question is how can I support men's rights as a female?

There is no "as a female/male" idea at play here, honestly if you are a real person i'd say bring up how the Women's Rights Movement ended up giving women More rights than men and to bring a measure of true equality to the situation either women have to have their rights stripped ( good luck with that ) or men must be given more lawful rights.

Whenever I search up men's rights on the internet, every response calls us nut jobs.

.....k

rg57 · 2017-10-17T02:25:20+00:00

how do you cope?

Honestly, with all that is wrong with society right now, this is about 20% of what I care about. I mean, we could all be nuked tomorrow.

I cope by realizing that most people are morons, and they are not swayed in the least by evidence. But one thing is sure... they will age and die. We have an ability to reach the next generation, simply by existing.

how can I support men's rights as a female?

Be you, and don't take shit.

2017-10-17T08:30:20+00:00

Modern western feminism is more like religion than a movement.

Always saying feminism is the one true way to achieve equality,

exaggerating the problems women face,

blaming a vague evil entity for all the problems (i.e patriarchy, the devil),

spreading lies about other movements,

shaming others who don't believe in feminism, even if that person is a woman etc.

nomadyesglad · 2017-10-17T08:52:06+00:00

How do I cope? I try to keep on going. My biggest issue is that I see a lot of limitations on what it means to be a man, and a lot of people are not willing to recognize that.

What can you do? Make rom for mens issues, and listen when it's talked about. And if you're in for an argument, speak up for u. I've sometimes said to some women that for feminism to continue to prosper, they have to make room for men. They either gets shocked that I say that, since men are so privilegde that it's not an issue, or they tell me to start advocating for it myself.

TheSpaceDuck · 2017-10-17T13:38:18+00:00

What I would personally suggest is: find reliable information, facts, laws and statistics. And use social media (facebook, etc.) to share them.

I've seen that one of the patterns in the behaviour of feminists is to use "flashy" titles and short quotes, often using strong words. They generally tend to avoid informative material and pick that which has more impact instead.

As some have mentioned it before, as a woman you'll encounter less hostility from speaking about it (less doesn't mean none as you probably realized the hard way). There are very good articles like this https://recalculatingthegenderwar.tumblr.com/post/162336650896/new-cdc-data-again-finds-as-many-if-not-more or this https://www.opinionpanel.co.uk/2014/03/24/why-is-it-legal-for-men-to-be-raped/ that can really open the eyes of many people who are not even remotely aware of these issues (as well as remove the social stigma that men are inherently predators, find rape acceptable etc.). You will never change the mind of a feminist just in the same way you'd never change the mind of a far-right person no matter how much factual data you have. However it's the people who are not feminists yet see the stuff they post everyday that can really gain a lot (if nothing else, knowledge and empathy) from seeing a lot of about men's issues, especially if it's from credible sources.

deciples · 2017-10-17T17:04:14+00:00

My second question is how can I support men's rights as a female?

this question actually deals with the issue that is pissing you off.

unfortunately men are easy to dismiss. women are though, are listened to. you will have to deal with being called a sock puppet, or internalized misogynist, but the more women who acknowledge or stand up to feminists or for MHR the less the feminists can just dismiss us.

icxcnika · 2017-10-18T08:30:17+00:00

how can I support men's rights as a female?

I'll steal from Rotary here.

Of the things we think, say, and do:
Is it the truth?
Is it fair to all concerned?
Will it build goodwill and better friendships?
Will it be beneficial to all concerned?

Ask that question to any allegation, movement, anything you come across.

Is what you're hearing/thinking/saying/doing grounded in fact, or is it hyperbole, based on presumption of guilt, etc.? Do the statistics reasonably back it up?

Is what you're hearing/thinking/saying/doing presenting solutions that benefit society as a whole? Or does it presume that men are at fault for the problem? Does it account for all the potential dynamics of the situation?

Is what you're hearing/thinking/saying/doing going to recognize the full scale of the problem, or will it only serve to polarize genders?

Is what you're hearing/thinking/saying/doing going to benefit humanity as a whole? Or will it benefit one gender by punishing another?

In another way, try to put yourself in a man's shoes. Approach a topic from "how would men feel about this, or be expected to react to this?"

2017-10-18T23:14:21+00:00

Best way to support men's rights is probably just to treat men with respect.

When other women comment on Men's rights issues (almost always in the negative i assume) kindly correct them or show your support.

2017-10-16T20:29:46+00:00

Answer one: see MGTOW; women fucking hate being ignored.

Answer two: call out those fucking bitches whenever you like.

2017-10-16T17:44:09+00:00

Tell me about it!

alclarkey · 2017-10-16T20:29:25+00:00

I simply try to avoid dating feminists.

AloysiusC · 2017-10-16T21:10:27+00:00

It just pisses me off that they are even allowed to write this and get away with it.

They must be allowed to write it. Just as we must be allowed to refute it. On a level playing field like that, they lose every time. They only ever win because they get so much systemic advantage.

So I ask, how do you cope?

There are multiple ways. The best I think is to separate the political activism from your personal life. Yeah I know that's easier said than done.

Also, don't outsource your happiness. Meaning, don't let the injustices of society pull you down - even if you're on the receiving end of said injustices. You can have a good life even without being part of the "nobility".

If I'm a female and I get pissed off, it must be worst for men

Well there's one advantage: Men learn pretty early in their lives that they can't expect much from society in terms of how they're treated. So there's less room for disappointment.

My second question is how can I support men's rights as a female?

Probably the best thing you can do is speak out when you see or hear injustices. When people you know start rambling about the "wage gap" or "male privilege" and so on, challenge it. But be sure to arm yourself with sufficient knowledge (statistics, terminology and some names) for it. Showing people a truth they don't like means you have to be 300% more of an expert than if you're just telling them what they want to hear (i.e. that women are helpless victims).

cld8 · 2017-10-16T23:53:18+00:00

We cope by marching on. It's frustrating but the most we can do is try to spread awareness of our issues and tell our stories.
As a female, you have more credibility with the public when it comes to gender issues. The best you can do is to speak out and provide support. Call women (and men) out when they make sexist statements, or reinforce stereotypes.

For example, there is a thing going around on Facebook right now where women who have been sexually harassed post "me too". I saw one guy post something mentioning how he had also been sexually harassed by a woman, and the comments attacked him for trying to steal the spotlight and making everything about men. If a woman had pointed out that men can also be harassed, people would take it more seriously.

roguedawg279 · 2017-10-17T04:56:14+00:00

I just want people to be happy, and I don't think they do. If they want me to get riled up because of that, it's not going to work.
Help however you want, or you feel is necessary. Spread the word, attend rallies, or just refute a point every once in a while, same way men do it, gender doesn't really matter for activism, but it might mean more to some coming from one. Your participation level is your own choice, ultimately.

Spurnout · 2017-10-18T00:58:10+00:00

I treat women equally and if/when they get pissy I tell them I don't give a shit. I also end up in a lot of arguments with women. i'm ok with that because I feel like we should talk about our rights more.

2017-10-18T03:49:59+00:00

How do you cope

I don't really have emotions

2017-10-18T09:16:16+00:00

How? when a fellow woman starts saying "all men" this or that- ask her- of all the men she personally knows- how many have sexually harassed her? It's likely a tiny percent.

abaxeron · 2017-10-18T12:14:08+00:00

how do you cope?

PFFFFF. Are you serious? Look, most of us were raised by women. Even in intact families, women had a lot of influence on outcomes of our childhood. They told us to "man up" and "hit the gym" after we came home injured by bullies. They told us "that's just in your head" when we developed mental illnesses as a result of stress in school. They screamed at us, a lot. They slapped our dads around as if they were their dumb uncontrollable pets, but instantly switched to playing the victim as soon as dads would once slap back. Most of us were not aware that something is wrong up until we grew up. Most of us did not understand that any of this is inhumane and abnormal. Many of us grew up to replicate the same patterns in our own families later in life. How does a man without any respect for himself cope? - He doesn't, he sincerely thinks that he's fine.

how can I support men's rights as a female?

Realistically? - You can't. The vast majority of women will keep abusing the legal system and voting for more loopholes to abuse the legal system. The vast majority of women will keep having "Being A Woman Is Hard" and "What You Do For Me Is Not Good Enough" as their personal mantras. We will eventually find a way to fix it all, as we always do. And we will make some mistakes while fixing it, and only those mistakes will be remembered.

2017-10-18T19:03:58+00:00

I love you

JediOfTheShire · 2017-10-18T20:18:50+00:00

Unrelated question for you OP. You get your name from [this video]](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miomuSGoPzI)? It changed my life!

WhiteAsTheNut · 2017-10-18T22:14:59+00:00

The best way to support men's rights as a female is to speak out about it. Women won't care until it comes from another woman.

2017-10-16T20:42:51+00:00

we cope by the fact that we know men are biologically superior to women, so we basically just laugh at all the feminist bullshit claims as we can just look at the real world and how things play out to see how wrong feminists are about basically everything. Going mgtow and only using women for sex also helps.

Title	Female here. I would like to ask a few questions.
Author	violentchickenattack
Upvotes	167
Comments	174
Date	October 16, 2017 12:05 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/76q0ne/female_here_i_would_like_to_ask_a_few_questions/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/female-here-i-would-like-to-ask-a-few-questions.912861 https://theredarchive.com/post/912861

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