First, let me make it clear that I am not arguing that TRP strategies can be effective. I am not interested in discussing whether or not being a muscular asshole can get you laid; I know it can. I am interested in debating the assumptions that lead some men to believe that TRP strategies are necessary and the value of the end they hope to achieve by using those strategies. I want to make this very clear because I have seen a lot of threads in this subreddit devolve into that debate, and it seems to always ignore my biggest questions and concerns about TRP --like if there were a movement devoted to punching kids to steal candy, I'd want to know why they thought they had to punch kids, whether there was a less violent way to get candy, and whether or not the candy was really worth it, and all of the responses to my questions were people insisting that punching kids is a really effective way to get their candy, just look at all of these field reports.

With that disclaimer out of the way...

I am curious about whether or not people who believe in TRP ideology can recognize relationships that are exceptions to their rules, and, if they can, why they believe that those relationships are less ideal pursuits than the relationships they choose to pursue.

I have included a couple of examples that might help ground the debate below.

EXAMPLE 1: My father's first and second marriages

My father's first marriage is the type of disaster that people who spout TRP philosophy love to use as an example. His ex-wife threatened him, emotionally and physically abused him, and eventually "divorce-raped" him. She was a totally emotionally unstable person. He spent all of his money fighting for custody, which he did not get because this was >35 years ago and fathers rarely got custody, even if they fought for it. She manipulated the children to turn them against him and make them afraid of him. All-around terrible situation. What's strange is that he didn't become bitter and decide AWALT--he recognized that it was one terrible person. He went on to meet my mother, who became his best friend. They fell in love, got married, and had some kids (me and my siblings). They have been together for over 25 years, and they're still very happy and very much in love. They make each other laugh and genuinely enjoy each other's company. Growing up, I can remember them making it very explicit to us that they viewed each other as equal partners who respected one another. My dad would frequently say that my mom was the smartest person he knew, and he cooked while she managed money. There weren't really traditional gender roles, and my dad certainly wasn't an "alpha" in the family. He also made it clear that my sisters and I could do whatever we wanted to do, that women were equal to men, and that we were smart, talented, and strong.

EXAMPLE 2: My grandparents

My grandparents, who were together for >60 years had a similar relationship, and after my grandfather died, my grandmother spent ten years with his picture at their kitchen table so she could still talk to "him" about what she read in the newspaper.

EXAMPLE 3: Me

I've written about my SO and I before on this subreddit. We're a very happy feminist couple who see each other as equals. We support each other and each helps the other to become better and to pursue his or her goals. My last serious relationship was with a guy who, I recognize now, used a lot of TRP strategies. While I usually went along with them because I cared about him and wanted to make him happy, they always left me feeling kind of sad and off (for example, if I didn't want to have sex, he would claim I was manipulating him and persist until I agreed to have sex because my reasons for not wanting sex didn't seem worth the upset he would express). I didn't realize how much he was manipulating me (or how much the success of many TRP strategies can rely on twisting generous and loving intentions of partners). In my current relationship, I not only feel completely comfortable and safe, but I find that I want to do many of the things I used to have to be manipulated into before (SO MUCH SEX). So...I want way more sex with my decidedly beta fiance than I ever did with my alpha ex, and I'm substantially happier now than I was then.

Summarizing Questions

  • Can TRP acknowledge that relationships like the ones I've lived can exist?

  • If so, why would TRP choose not to pursue those types of relationships?