I can't seem to get commitment before sex

Ok_Philosopher · 2018-05-07T16:20:13+00:00

Maybe you just need to change the way you broach the topic? For example, if you're explaining that you're not going to sleep with a guy unless he commits while his hand is trying to unbutton your pants, then you come across as a game-playing tease who uses sex as a weapon to get her way.

On the other hand, it may help to broach the topic very, very early on. Explain that you've been considered a prude before but that it's important that who you date respects that you don't put out until you're in a monogamous relationship (I would even phrase it as "monogamous relationship" rather than "til I get commitment," since the latter does ring of slight manipulation). If the guy isn't cool with that hearing it early on, then hey, that's what vetting is for--move on to the next one. On the other hand, he might hear that in his head and think "challenge accepted." Those are the ones you want to be dating.

I think they key is to discuss the matter early, rather than waiting 3-4 weeks to bring it up. The guy probably feels like he was close to the finish line and the goal post got moved on him... hence, the frustration and possibly rejection.

Whisper · 2018-05-08T15:53:10+00:00

For seem to think, like many girls, that "commitment" is a special shiny gold coin we carry in our pockets, that, if you persuade us to do so, we just give to you once, and that's it, you've done your job, you can just kick back and do whatever.

The reason you cannot get commitment is that you don't know what commitment IS.

Commitment is not "telling you you're his girlfriend". Commitment is not "agreeing to be exclusive". Commitment is not facebookthing status. Commitment is not a promise or a signed paper or a piece of jewelry.

Commitment is his attitude about you. The one that makes him decide, over and over again, to spend the evening with you instead of looking for a new girl on Tinder.

You are completely failing to inspire that, probably because you have no clue that this is what you need to be doing. You appear not to have even started the process of thinking about what the experience of spending time with you looks like from his perspective.

One of the most difficult tasks I have ever attempted is convincing women that men are more intelligent than lab monkeys.

plein_old · 2018-05-07T18:32:30+00:00

What would happen if you told people what you were looking for either on or before the first date? Perhaps on a coffee date if you meet them in real life, and before the first date if you meet them online?

A woman could say "hey I'm a Christian / Hindu / believer in certain traditional values / whatever and I think it's nice to hold off on sex until two people feel they want to be together long-term. If you don't feel the same way, no worries, I wish you the best of luck and have a nice day!"

In sales I think this is called making room for "prequalified" prospects. You weed out people who have zero interest in what you are selling, before you put any effort into them.

Some men might pretend to have the same values you do, and then you say "oh, neat! I'd love to hear how you arrived at your values. No please, take as long as you need, I'd love to hear the full story!"

This will help weed out the fakers.

Good luck!

girlwithabike · 2018-05-07T20:20:40+00:00

Out of curiosity: were you passionately interested in any of these men enough to throw caution to the wind and have sex with them?

loneliness-inc · 2018-05-07T16:17:52+00:00

Women are the gatekeepers of sex and men are the gatekeepers of commitment. This means that you decide whether sex will happen and he decides whether commitment will happen.

This also means that it's very easy for you to get sex, all you have to do for that is to allow it to happen. It's not as easy for you to get commitment. You have to earn that.

Giving away sex would be to give him what he wants without getting what you want. You have much less bargaining power to obtain commitment once you've given sex. If you want to have sex anyway, have at it, but might be the consequence.

FleetingWish · 2018-05-07T21:03:17+00:00

In order to get commitment from a man you have to make him like the idea of spending time with you. What are you doing to "sell" yourself as a good relationship option?

Grindtrust · 2018-05-09T09:30:47+00:00

I think the time when you have sex is completely irrelevant when it comes to commitment. Commitment depends exclusively on your ability to keep a man attracted to you at all levels, including sexually. You might get his commitment before sex, but that actually means nothing if he is ultimately not that attracted to you, and will bail from that commitment soon after. So what women should look for is to become that most attractive as they can, and that bears the following question, is having sex early going to help build that attraction or not?

Personally, I feel that women that value themselves, have clear values and don´t let themselves be used by men are more attractive that women that try to use sex to lure men. On the other hand, women that really like sex and that are courageous enough to have sex with a man early because they really want it and do not bend to society pressure on that front are also more attractive than those that use sex as a bargain.

So it really depends on what kind of woman you are. If I am dating a woman and she tells me that she respects herself and since she is looking for something serious she prefer to feel comfortable with that person before having sex, that is probably going to make myself more attracted to her than if I feel she is giving in sex despite wanting to wait. And the same goes for women I feel are very sexual and desire me from the beginning, if they decide to have sex early on because they will enjoy it, as opposed to feeling that strong desire and them trying to hold it against their true will just to “play the game of waiting”, hence being fake on that front.

So to sum up, being honest, knowing yourself, being courageous, not trying to play games because you read something online, being genuine and owning your own sexuality is far more important than the fact you had sex before a man said “we are in a relationship” or not. Those are empty words and only your overall value as a woman will bring true commitment from a man.

First post ever in reddit, sorry if the format is not the right one but I hope it helps!

Nullberri · 2018-05-07T21:38:28+00:00

RPW preaches commitment before sex, but I have a very difficult time achieving or understanding this.

After reading your post I was strongly reminded of the two part series by Whisper linked below. I don't have any greater strategic insights to give, but this may help you understand why these men act as they do given your current approach.

https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/4ebnsb/passion/

https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/4gfzqa/the_final_exam/

GarbagebagFemale · 2018-05-07T23:47:13+00:00

I've read before that men aren't sure if they like you until after you've had sex with them. Like once they orgasm they see a woman for ALL her qualities instead of just getting caught up on her looks and the curiosity of how she is in bed. So this makes me feel like there's no point lol I feel your pain

MissNietzsche · 2018-05-08T01:46:09+00:00

As someone who has only slept around in her past, when I broke up with my ex, I promised myself that I wouldn't sleep with someone ever again without commitment first.

Fast forward two months, I was talking to this new guy and was pretty involved. He knew about my promise to myself because I told him after he kept cranking up the sexual touch and tension, and he was completely fine with upholding it. Well, we found ourselves cuddled up together in his empty house, and after weeks of restraining myself, I couldn't help myself and broke my own promise. (As I was initiating, he kept reminding me of my own promise, whoops [what a doll]). I honestly just wanted the sex; I did not have sex with him to try to get him to commit to me.

Well, turns out he said I gave him the best sex of his life, and he asked me to be his girlfriend like the next day, lol.

No situation will ever be the same with these kinds of things. While yes, there are general trends one may follow, humans tend to be more complex on a micro scale.

adirp · 2018-05-08T10:31:21+00:00

Read everything /u/Whisper posted on this sub.

asteadyheart · 2018-05-07T19:18:23+00:00

Do you clarify that you just mean a monogamous relationship, not that you need to be married/engaged?

Do you act like you are waiting for them to say "well I'm committed!" Or do you make it more matter of fact?

When I told men, I told them very matter of fact. Like "this is just me. You can agree or not, no pressure. This is just how I roll." So it wasn't like I was fishing for a response, it was like a fun fact about me.

"I'm 5'8" and I don't have sex without being in a monogamous relationship!"

Tone is a big part of this, so if you make it seem like a big deal or that you're sensitive about it, they will get nervous and just think you want him to commit right then and there.

Edit: also when you're dating, letting him know you're looking for a family can just make him think you are husband hunting. Looking for your free ride. Saying things like "oh I love kids" will suggest to them you want a family, and if anything that can reassure them that (if they want a family as well) you are the right person for them.

Saying "I want a family" can sometimes just translate to "I want to be a stay at home mom who drains you of all your money and thinks day drinking is funny."

WhatIsThisAccountFor · 2018-05-08T06:13:36+00:00

How are you meeting these men? I'd guess online dating from how many and how it usually ends

Online dating in my opinion is pretty bad for RP goals. It short cuts a lot of key vetting points in men during the "pre-dating" phase, and men who actually know a woman before dating are much more willing to wait for sex than those who don't.

I think it sort of goes the opposite way as well though. Women who become more comfortable with being friends with men tend to avoid dating, but men usually become more comfortable with women with the intention of dating in mind already.

But there is also something that a lot of women fall into the trap of, and that is dating men outside of their league. A lot of women don't seem to understand that men will date a woman who they would never commit to in the hope of sex. You need to be honest with yourself and genuinely consider whether you think you are on the same level as the men you are dating or not.

The very simplest way to put this is that you are not worth the wait you are forcing men for sex in their minds. They are either getting other women who have sex with them sooner, or they simply do not see a future with you. 3-4 weeks really is not that long, so I think it's most likely that you are dating out of your league. I could be wrong and you could just be like 18 and trying to date college juniors who aren't interested in having a girlfriend regardless of what you do, but there are a lot of factors that I just don't know. I think adding a little more about yourself would be a good start to letting people here help you.

SKRedPill · 2018-05-09T05:49:39+00:00

Feminism's side effect - it hurts committed men and women seeking commitment - since they wanted sexual liberation (sex without consequences) and commitment was the burden that stood in the way.

You're up against a lot of competition (probably from younger girls) in favour of free sex and partying away their 20s.

mrHappyPotatoe · 2018-05-07T16:12:41+00:00

I am a man and i can tell you. It's not about u. Ask yourself whos going to buy a pig in the bag?

Ahh and trust me also when I say that you really do not want commitment before sex.

FwoGiZ · 2018-05-07T21:15:30+00:00

Here's a guy's point of view and reasoning behind the situation.

Personally, I am looking for a passionate girl and I believe more and more men are looking for that. When a women tells us that she wants to and can wait that long while "controlling" her lust, us guys see it as she isn't really that attracted to us and is in for other reasons which is usually providing for her or just a plain gold digger. Let's say we would wait, then get into an exclusive relationship, we know damn well that sex is obviously not a passionate thing and could easily be dismissed, put on the side or literally discarded and unfortunately, most men NEED sex, just like most women need attention. So for a women to ask a bunch of attention and having nothing to offer in return, will definitely scare a lot of high quality men. It may work on lower quality men but why would you want that?

Commitment before sex? It's really hard for a guy to commit when he has no idea if there is sexual chemistry or not. It would be similar to him completely hiding his financial/job situation from you and asking you to commit... i.e. you have no idea where he works and how much of his life he got together. We both know that this is really important to women, and rightfully so. Men often seems to be demonized for having sex as a very important criteria but this is just how it is.

I understand that women are the gatekeepers of sex and you have to be extremely careful with who you hand it to. Now if you go clubbing and do ONS.. we both understand that you know nothing of the guy, this is pure promiscuity... it's just plain bad for women, unless they do not plan on having a family.

Now, if you go on 3 dates with a guy and you still have no idea? Once again, high quality guys have other things to do, and needs...

Personally, I bounce after 3 dates because I just don't have that kind of time to waste and in my experience, it just won't be worth it anyways.

Another thing, is in 2018, I don't think neither men or women can and should ask for commitment anytime early in a relationship... it's unfortunate but it is how it is.

If I am seeing a girl and she is easy going, smart, we have chemistry and after a while we have The talk, then I know for a fact that she might totally be worth it, will not be one of the too many controlling women out there. Asking commitment to a men before sex would be like a men asking you to confirm you will have sex with him everyday if he commits...

This is just our men's reality which could explain why those guys are "ghosting" you.

Obviously there are a lot of other things that could interfere but those are just obvious thing such as, physical appearance, health, etc etc

tommyetw · 2018-05-07T20:19:09+00:00

I've read this a few times, and I think that this is what sticks for me. Sex should never be a bargaining chip. You should be able to get commitment without even bringing up sex as an issue. If it turns out that it's an issue, then flush those guys. You've got your answer. I've never thought that sex was my right or something to get in exchange for anything on my part. If I thought a woman was a potential lifetime candidate, then I'd do anything to respect her wishes and boundaries. Maybe I'm more traditional and I have a religious perspective. But, if you don't have a trad/religious background, then what you'll probably experience as you hold to your standards is a leveling up of the quality of men, so to speak--try a different pond might help too.

One practical tip, though: don't bring up any conversation on commitment. Let the men raise the issue--especially when you bring up your non-negotiables. But, don't waste your time, either. If, after you determine there are qualities in the man that you see as a future husband, wait a while. If he's serious, he'll commit and ask for it from you. If he's not so sure what he wants and needs a little nudge to wake him up, then 3-4 months is plenty of time to have that talk. After that, move on. If he's really still unsure, and you think he's still worth it, don't burn bridges and let him come back. I had my wake up call, and that really focused my mind on separating my wants vs. my needs in my wife. Just know that you are worth someone changing to be your life partner.

drops_of_Sunshine · 2018-05-08T21:24:57+00:00

I think I told my fiance within 3 days of meeting him this: "I want to do things right. The old fashioned way. I really like you, and I want this to work. So let's try something different." I had just become single for maybe a month before he and I met and started dating, and that played a factor in what I said. We had sex after being together a month, which imo is the perfect amount of time to wait. I knew him well enough to know he was trust worthy and willing to invest time. When you meet a guy, tell him within the first few days of talking what you want. Ask them what they want and see if it matches.

Kiddingyoself · 2018-05-09T15:17:18+00:00

Is there no place, or way, of meeting people these days who collectively see dating as a means to find a partner to have a family with? Most men, and maybe to an extent women, I knew growing up didn't consider marriage, or family, when they started dating. It was just an exciting game without much long term consideration, or realistic understanding.

I wonder if someone started a "dating" site which stated plainly that it was for young men & women who understand that sex isn't a toy, but a mechanism for creating a strong family, and that meeting to find someone to start a family with is the point... Certainly these days there would be plenty of people who would find it laughable, and not be interested, but the goal in relationships isn't to focus on the majority, but a tiny, ideal, niche, and find in that the very few, or lone, ideal partner.

A dating site that lead with Stefan Molyneux's facts about sex. "VirginsForFamily.com" might not be the best brand name. It may be a tough sell for youth today, but as people start to realize how diseased, and sabotaged, society is, they may come around to such reasoning.

throwawayindisbelief · 2018-05-09T16:56:56+00:00

theoppositeopinion1 · 2018-05-08T15:24:33+00:00

When my wife and I were dating, she was CLEARLY interested in sex, and showed that she was very turned on, but asked me to wait a little bit longer. That SHOW of sexual interest was enough to tide me over, so that I know that there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

NOBODY wants to wait and wait and wait for something, then the 'big prize' is starfish sex once a month.... that's the ultimate humiliation. You need to show him somehow that that won't be the case - that you're worth the wait, and not just for your cooking.

ImissAlexMogilny · 2018-05-07T16:01:12+00:00

You're dating up, maybe. Depends on your age, too. What's your age?

danlucas · 2018-05-07T17:54:28+00:00

I’m sorry but do you really think a high value man will commit to you before you have sex with him?

Sex is the pathway to love for men. ALL men are afraid of being in a sexless relationship. You’re giving him some “bad foreshadowing vibes” by not having sex. I can’t believe you got to date for 3 weeks before they ghosted, I would have been out alot sooner. And I am pro-LTR.

The two best relationships I was in, I had sex with her on either the first or second date, and I did not commit until about a month or so after.

I’ve TRIED to be patient and “respectful” and wait it out in the past because I thought she was “different”. guess what happens? no sex. Men know this.

The bottom line, if you have sex with a man, and he disappears, he did not like you, and that’s it. You gave him your greatest asset, and he did not like it enough. If you see this happening often, you are not dating within your league. You need to go down to your own league, and men will stop disappearing.

JStheHammer · 2018-05-07T17:26:19+00:00

What do you mean by commitment?

Title	I can't seem to get commitment before sex
Author	sheikha4teddies
Upvotes	24
Comments	97
Date	May 7, 2018 3:55 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/8hojus/i_cant_seem_to_get_commitment_before_sex/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/i-cant-seem-to-get-commitment-before-sex.74686 https://theredarchive.com/post/74686

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