Why do ex red pill people say body count doesn't matter?

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lordkuruku · 2022-10-02T06:57:55+00:00

My fiancée and I both have had a lot of partners in the past. It doesn’t matter because it’s in the past. It was what we wanted then. It’s not what we want now.

Melificarum · 2022-10-02T07:07:02+00:00

I think it's more like, men and women should be treated equally in this respect. It's really up to personal preference if you want a partner who has slept with a lot of people. Often times with redpill, you see men who are promiscuous judging women who are just like them, and making excuses why it's different for men and women.

Aggressive_Orange855 · 2022-10-02T07:02:52+00:00

On the surface that would appear the case but in reality, people have noncommital sex all the time, and over enough time people rack up body counts. It does take some exposure to different kinds of people to find out what you want in a partner even sexually.

At best its a weak indicator of suitability and certainly not the only factor in determining if they qualify for a LTR.

alexbrove · 2022-10-02T09:46:23+00:00

Personally, I don't believe that your numbers matter. I'm more interested in your views on sex, and if the numbers are high, why are they so high.

Bodycount cannot hold a marriage together. What will create a happy marriage is genuine love, support, trust, honesty, emotional maturity, and compatibility in many areas, including having similar views on sex, and similar views on commitment.

My ex-husband, only slept with one person prior to being with me. He was just 13 and the woman he slept with, was in her 20s. This means he only had a 'body count' of 1, but it also meant that he was sexually abused. He remained celebate until we got married and he was very proud of this and he saw it as an expression of his devotion to God. He could never fully accept that he was sexually abused and I think it affected the way in which he viewed sex and the way he viewed women and relationships. I was a virgin when we got married, and I also saw it as an expression of my devotion to God. So if you look at the stats, we should have had a perfect and long lasting marriage!

And the stats are right, we had a marriage that lasted over 10 years but it was an awful marriage. We both tried to make our marriage work but for various reasons we couldn't. We were extremely incompatible and he suffered from various mental health issues. Over time, he ended up being extremely abusive towards me and he ended up cheating. He felt tremendous guilt for this but this didn't stop him from spiraling out of control. He started turning to gambling, then alcohol and then he would keep getting himself into debt. He had anger issues which he refused to get help for. I believe that one of the issues that he needed to work on, was the abuse that he experienced as a child.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that past numbers do not matter as much as the story behind those numbers and the person's views on sex. And knowing their story in general.

Some people have been through similar childhood trauma as my ex-husband and because of this, they go on to sleep with hundreds of women but in his case, he ended up choosing to focus on God and to be celibate.

When I married him, I saw celibacy as a good thing, now I see that it didn't really matter. The focus shouldn't have been on remaining a 'virgin' until marriage, the focus should have been on understanding and dealing with the childhood trauma.

The reality is that our religious beliefs and our joint 'low body count' didn't make our marriage stronger. In the greater scheme of things, it didn't mean anything. We both went into the marriage with very little dating experience and simply trusting in God to make it all work out.

We were married for over a decade and I endured a lot of abuse due to pressure from my extended family and pressure from my church. Because of my faith in God, I was ready to stay in the abuse until death. It was only when he started to abuse our child that I accepted that I would need to get divorced.

When I decided to get divorced, all my worst fears came true. I was rejected by my family and my church and this was so much harder than the actual divorce. Over time I eventually let go of my religious beliefs. I also stopped seeing "body count" as an issue and I started to view sex very differently.

Unfortunately my story isn't that unique, many women like me were raised in religions or churches that taught us to remain virgins until marriage and then raised to stay in abusive marriages cos God hates divorce. The number of women in my church that were experiencing abuse, was simply insane and this wasn't even a big church.

Those stats that TRP shares - those stats were created for people from religious backgrounds like mine. Those stats were engrained in us from Sunday school. From the age of about 9, we were taught to remain virgins. We wore something called promise rings, which were to promise God that we would stay virgins until marriage and we knew that if we slept around, god would not be happy and he could potentially punish us with divorce.

My husband and were both technically virgins, we didn't sleep around before marriage and we were married for over 10 years. Now that I'm older and wiser, I can see that those stats never told the full story.

While we were married, my husband and I were the perfect example of a long lasting marriage with a low body count and the church often invited us to speak to the younger generation to encourage them to stay virgins and we would speak to new married couples about how to make marriage work. But the church leaders also knew that we were struggling within our own marriage and all they would do is pray for us.

The truth is that my ex husband and I, were not equipped for marriage, we'd both had very traumatic childhood experiences, we had stayed virgins because of what we'd been taught in our childhood and due to our religious beliefs around marriage, we couldn't even imagine a world where we would get divorced.

Now that I'm divorced, I can see how those stats and training from church influenced my beliefs. My ex-husband hates me for divorcing him as he believes that this is a huge sin. In his view, he remained a virgin until marriage and I took away the blessing of marriage from him.

The saddest part is that the church views me as sinful and unforgiving. When I bump into old friends from church they tell me that they are still praying for me, that despite all that has happened, I find forgiveness in my heart and I remarry him. I explain that I have forgiven him but I don't want to be married to him.

The reality is that divorce is not a concept that they can accept and if you look at it from this perspective you can understand why people wish to publish reattach that 'proves' that virginity increases your success in marriage.

My advice for OP is to just focus on the person that you're dating or marrying, focus on their story, make sure their emotionally healthy and make sure you're compatible. This is way more important than the stats.

TLDR:

If its important for you and your partner to keep your body count as low as possible, then go for it. Beyond the numbers, what really matters is the story behind those numbers.

You've got to know your partners life story. Regardless of what the number is, make sure you know the story behind the numbers.

RedPillDetox · 2022-10-02T11:33:37+00:00

Stop generalizing, there's no "ex red pill people", there are people here, some ex red pill, some are not, some believe past matters, others don't.

I for instance am a mod here and i believe promiscuity isn't a good marker for a LTR. This is common sense. Anyone trying to argue otherwise, suck it up already.

I also believe, however, that relationship variables are much more important to define the success of a relationship rather than personality characteristics like promiscuity/sociosexual orientation. One may have been a hoe and still be a good partner. One may have been a virgin and still be a horrible partner. studies are mere probabilities, most of those based on weak correlations.

I also believe (and there's no way denying this) that the number one reason why TRP men care about sexual past is because it reminds them of their feelings of inadequacy first and foremost. If they had the opportunity to have been manwhore they'd take it. And if they did they would not be as bothered by partner n count. That's also a fact, stop trying to hide behind studies and suck it up already.

Newbie1955 · 2022-10-02T13:07:05+00:00

Because sex isn't a simple biological insertion of Tab-A-into-Slot-B, repeated with multiple partners like muscle memory. Having multiple casual sexual encounters while single is a wildly different behavior than cheating on a partner while in a committed relationship. The mechanics may be the same, but the environment, behavior, and motivations are not.

Yes, there is a high correlation between failed marriages and high body counts. This is because sex isn't the same behavior for everyone--some use it only within the confines of a committed relationship, some use it recreationally in a safe and responsible way, and some use it as a type of reckless self-therapy in the way alcoholics self-medicate--i.e., in a very destructive and unhealthy way.

What you really need to keep in mind here is that correlation does not equal causation, no matter how many times you see it. Ice cream sales are highly correlated to increases in shark attacks. Consistently correlated, and highly correlated, over a large amount of time and different areas. It would be easy to hypothesize that ice cream consumption causes sharks to attack for some reason, but in reality, when the weather is hot people go swimming more and buy more ice cream. One is not causing the other, no matter how tightly linked they are on a graph. A large number of previous sexual partners is not causing problems in the current relationship. Whatever emotional issues commonly lead people into indulging in risk-taking behaviors (including getting married before they are ready) is resulting in failed relationships. One does not cause the other. Another thing that is highly correlated is the US marriage rate and the US rate of measles cases. These two are bizarrely correlated, consistently, over decades. Getting measles doesn't motivate people to get married, and the lack of measles isn't failing to push people into marriage. They just happen to correlate.

So let's really think about why high bodycounts happen: what are people seeking? They may just be seeking some fun, and if they are being safe and responsible, then a high bodycount isn't really a red flag for future relationship issues. If they have self-worth issues, are desperate for external validation to the point they cannot maintain boundaries, and/or are using sex as a crutch to not deal with other issues, then that is a problem that will almost certainly bleed into future relationships, no matter what their bodycount is. These would also be exactly the sort of impulsive people highly likely to rush into marriage. Not hard to see why there is a likely correlation here, but it's not causation.

AdventurousTie8034 · 2022-10-02T11:21:02+00:00

I think two partners should have the same past experiences. So a promiscuous man shouldn’t judge a promiscuous women. A virgin man on the other hand may be afraid of comparison with the previous sexual partners of the woman and have many insecurities…

vcreativ · 2022-10-02T14:35:04+00:00

I think ex RP disagrees with RP in general, not necessarily on every last little point.

"Increasing numbers of sex partners were associated with increasing risk of substance dependence disorder at all three ages. The association was stronger for women and remained after adjusting for prior disorder."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3752789/

Maybe that's an interesting read, ultimately you have to decide for yourself what bothers you and what doesn't.

To me someone that behaved promiscuous in the past, meh, and if that continues then they're not ready for a relationship anyway. There's no need to take it personally when someone disqualifies themselves from being with you.

gold-ee · 2022-10-02T12:04:03+00:00

The thing about “body count” is that it’s a totally context-free metric. It’s as illogical as trying to judge a woman’s attractiveness based on the number of calories she ate on March 26th, 2019.

Sure, there are stats showing that women in a certain weight range are the most attractive. And we know that caloric intake is linked to weight. But knowing someone’s caloric intake on a single completely random day nearly 4 years ago tells you nothing about her actual attractiveness. It doesn’t tell you about her activity level. It doesn’t tell you how tall or strong she is. It doesn’t tell you if she was trying to lose weight or gain weight. It doesn’t tell you if those calories were organic salads or if they were all Cheetos and Mountain Dew. It doesn’t necessarily reflect her normal diet. And it does NOT tell you what she looks like today, nearly four years later.

Knowing a woman’s body count doesn’t tell you who she slept with, or why, or when, or how many times. The number doesn’t tell you how long ago it happened, or how it made her feel, or how she dealt with it. It doesn’t tell you if her life has changed since then. It doesn’t tell you if the sex felt good, if they kept in touch, if she came, if she felt safe or pressured.

There are some numbers that might raise a red flag. Absolutely. If she ate 27,000 calories on March 26th, 2019, that might give you a reason to pause. If she has 300 prior sexual partners, that might give you a reason to question whether your lifestyles are compatible. But outside of these extremes, you cannot logically evaluate an individual’s suitability for partnership based on one single metric. You’re free to maintain whatever dealbreakers you’d like in your own relationships, but you’ve gotta admit that certain arbitrary standards are absurd.

Nightchanger · 2022-10-02T09:43:40+00:00

People change over time. Due to rarity of people that could give an LTR of decades, dismissing someone suitable due to promiscuous past reduces the pool unnecessarily further.

On the other hand if her past effects her current life to her determent; such as ended up being on the registry, made a career in adult entertainment, or is sick from uncurbable STD's. That's something to legitimately consider.

Rook_Cross · 2022-10-02T16:31:42+00:00

Generally it matters. There are some people who change their ways and can make good partners. The problem is promiscuous men thinking they "deserve" virgin women. That they should be forgiven while women shouldn't and that they, being promiscuous and more likely to end up divorced and to have issues, are still in the right, even though, they are trying to pull one over on the virgin, even though they know by their own standards, that they are not a good choice. It's the hypocrisy and the idea that they don't have to give the same in return,. Men and women are not so different. If we're talking evolution, then women don't have just one mate in life either, despite what RP types try to convince themselves of. Men think evolution applies only to them and religion/virginity only to women. Partner count can generally tell you a lot about a person's values. People can change, but if they truly changed, they would be accepting of a partner who has done the same work, and would know better than to think they "deserve" a virgin. this is kind of the pathetic trap RP types put themselves in if they're "successful". If they ever come out of RP they get the fun of realizing they actually make a worse choice of partner, not better. Sleeping around doesn't increase anyone's value, not women's, not men's. No spinning of sexual science will make it so.

Curt_doggy_dog · 2022-10-02T20:44:46+00:00

Your assumption about human behavior doesn't hold true unconditionally. For past behavior to be a reliable predictor of future behavior, an individual's behavior and life circumstances must remain unchanged between then and now. They must not have faced any incentives to change at any point within that time.

Past behavior is less predictive of future behavior over larger time intervals. The fact is that someone might not want the same thing in their 30's that they wanted when they were 21. People can and do go undergo significant changes in their lives.

Title	Why do ex red pill people say body count doesn't matter?
Author	CaptainSaveBPD
Upvotes	0
Comments	123
Date	October 2, 2022 6:24 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/xthfen/why_do_ex_red_pill_people_say_body_count_doesnt/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/why-do-ex-red-pill-people-say-body-count-doesnt.1133145 https://theredarchive.com/post/1133145

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