Feminism's problem isn't that they hate men or not care about their problems. Is that they only superficially care.

OldEgalitarianMRA · 2023-07-07T18:13:00+00:00

I've heard feminists say: "Yes men have problems but women solved their own problems and it's up to men to solve theirs".

But sometimes for men to progress women need to adjust and they see this as losing.

50/50 default shared custody is one issue like this. Women have to give up children as property only of theirs and a reduction in child support meaning they have to work.

Another is cancer funding. More funding for expensive screening tests for prostate cancer like MRI means less money for expensive new breast cancer screening tests.

So feminists have fought against these areas of concern for men. That's very regressive.

That's one reason why they hate our sub. They see progress for us as being a zero sum game and that women will lose out.

And they will, a little. They will have to share custody.

Equality cuts both ways.

Tiny_Professional358 · 2023-07-07T18:39:03+00:00

The problem with feminism is the hypocrisy women are supposed to be treated as equal yet they want to be treated as special which defeats the whole purpose of equality.

Current_Finding_4066 · 2023-07-07T18:40:01+00:00

If someone assumes all men are potential rapists, all accused men are guilty, and male victims of female (sexual) violence do not matter because allegedly women suffer more, and all men have themselves to blame due to patriarchy and toxic masculinity, then they are a man-hater.

This is a pervasive attitude amongst feminists.

I have read some feminist articles about men's issues. They were all extremely condescending to all men.

RandHomman · 2023-07-07T19:47:35+00:00

The biggest problem feminism has is it's unable to be clear of anything and most of their rethoric is situational and will adapt based on how they are perceived in the moment.

Them saying they don't hate men is just to win some argument because everytime someone points how hateful some of their speeches are, they'll fight tooth and nail to keep saying what they want and that includes man hate. So many women and men don't want to associate with feminism because of that and feminism doesn't want to correct any of their misses.

So I don't believe it when they say they don't hate men. I've seen plenty of racist people befriend people they hate. They tolerate some of them because they speak like them, not because they value who they are. Feminism is the same imo.

Puzzled-Group-666 · 2023-07-07T18:30:45+00:00

The feminism movement as a whole is a supremacy movement, and it wants women on top. Feminists don't care about problems that they caused and would do anything to hurt a man, even the ones who says "they aren't Feminists." Feminism screwed women up mentally to the point even moms are against their sons. Most deny that misandry even exists because it is easy to say men don't have problems.

P.S. Most subreddits are misandrist & Feminists based like Menslib, TwoxChromosome, & White People Twitter.

Trev6ft5 · 2023-07-07T18:45:25+00:00

Go watch some YT vids on female narcissist personality disorder, applies just aswell to Feminism. Narcs are compulsive liars and gaslighters, lack empathy and are quick to betray. They're mentally sick and logic doesn't work on them because they aren't interested in truth only THEIR truth that reinforces their happiness and biases.

Imo if men treated a woman's narcissism and narc influences like her bodycount, things wouldn't be as bad.

Top-Gas-4121 · 2023-07-07T18:27:49+00:00

Feminism's problem is they want to mould women into pseudo-men. Bizarre how they've decided that the default human behaviour should be masculine. Then when men object to these masculinized women, we get told we're 'intimidated', rather than disgusted.

Normal-Yogurtcloset5 · 2023-07-07T19:28:41+00:00

I find that one of the biggest issues I have with feminism is white women trying to act like they’re oppressed as if they haven’t been using their double privileges for centuries. I have no problem telling them that, if I had to choose between hanging out with white men or white men I’d prefer the men because white women like to weaponize their privilege for attention. How many thousands of Black men have been lynched because of a white woman’s lie? I was first accused of sexual assault when I was in 1st grade by a girl who I’d never seen before.

White women want economic and political parity with elite white males. They want the offices, titles, and salaries. They don’t really give a damn about working class men or any ethnicity (that’s why you never hear them talk about gender parity in, for example, sanitation work) and they definitely don’t give a damn about the melanated women who they hire to take care of their children, clean their homes, wash their laundry, cook their meals, etc., when they get those corporate jobs.

CALAMITYFOX · 2023-07-07T21:21:03+00:00

George Orwell (A socialist) discovered during the writing of "The Road to Wigan Pier" that even though most of his socialist buddies loved to talk about helping poor people, they didn't really care about them, deep down they just hated the Rich.

I think a lot of modren feminism is more about hating men than equality.

EricAllonde · 2023-07-07T23:31:48+00:00

A study from a couple of years ago helps enormously with understanding feminists.

The study compared personality profiles of feminists with the average personality profile for the population as a whole. It found that feminist personality profiles were higher than average in two areas: narcissism and intolerance for different opinions.

When you observe how feminists behave and what they say with that study in mind, it all becomes clear.

Feminists don't care about men's issues because they are narcissists. This is why they absurdly attempt to rebut serious men's issues (which don't affect them) with far less serious or trivial women's issues (which do affect them). For example:

MRA: "Men were drafted in WW1 and forced to die in the trenches in huge numbers."

Feminist: "Sure, but women weren't allowed to choose jobs in the military if that's the work they wanted to do."

MRA: "The male suicide rate is so high it's an epidemic."

Feminist: "Sure, but women attempt suicide (actually counting all sorts of behaviors including self-cutting as 'suicide attempts') more often than men do."

And then of course there is the classic Hillary Clinton quote:

"Women have always been the primary victims of war. Women lose their husbands, their fathers, their sons in combat."

Who else but a narcissist could say something like that? The feminist-in-chief thinks that the people who are sad about someone dying are bigger victims than the person who died. Amazing.

Feminists' narcissism is the reason why they elevate their own minor issues over men's major issues in importance. They literally do not care about anyone other than themselves.

But if you point out these skewed values to a feminist, they get extremely angry. That's their intolerance to different opinions showing up. You can make a perfectly logical, fact-based argument to a feminist and they'll still lose their mind with rage, call you an incel etc etc. The simple fact that you disagreed with them is enough to set them off.

This is why every feminist discussion forum, on the Internet and off it, is heavily censored to exclude contradictory opinions and facts. Feminists prefer it that way, they don't want to hear any disagreement at all with their worldview. They stand it and prefer to shut themselves away from contrary opinions entirely.

That's why, on the rare occasions that a feminist ventures forth from her echo chambers to discuss feminism with a non-feminist, her complete ignorance of the topic quickly becomes clear. Feminists believe in nonsense like the wage gap myth, the patriarchy conspiracy theory, the rape culture smear campaign, etc because they stay in their echo chambers in order to avoid hearing them be debunked with facts.

If you are, as I am, amazed that someone could still believe a ridiculous thing like the wage gap myth in 2023, just remember that feminists are equivalent to someone who's been living on a desert island for decades, when it comes to their knowledge of feminist topics. And they like it that way.

Narcissism and intolerance of different opinions: those personality attributes alone explain most feminist behavior.

Anih1list · 2023-07-08T02:22:27+00:00

Feminists can’t address men’s issues without blaming it on the “patriarchy”. They presuppose this of all anti-male bias, making women the “actual victims”. Ironically, this actually DOES perpetuate the “benevolent misogyny” which characterizes women as society’s designated victim. For some feminists the victim mentality rises to the point of toxic femininity.

AmuseDeath · 2023-07-07T20:49:26+00:00

I'm not interested in shitting on feminism, just in doing some honest and constructive criticism of it.

Please don't white-knight this.

Movements absolutely should get criticized and put under scrutiny. That's why we have this amazing thing called science. This is why we were able to question things like flat-earth theory, a sun-centic solar system or bad-air germ theory. If a way of thinking is simply false... then it SUCKS and deserves to be blasted to hell. Don't be scared to criticize feminism if it's simply false. And the reality is... it's quite false and full of things that hate men.

Case in point: the wage gap myth:

https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/14p55pz/debunking_the_gender_pay_gap/

This has been debunked hundreds of times by economists and women, yet the mainstream feminists keep spewing this lie.

So no, feminism is full of shit and you don't need to tiptoe around it. It's a shit movement and it misleads millions of people with lies and bullshit theories. The planet would be better without it.

With that said, the better movement for advocating for women would be women's rights which would be a pro-women group based on facts and data, not bullshit like wage gap myth, male gaze under the grand bullshit umbrella of patriarchy. Oh no, a queen a hundred years ago must have lived a worse life than a male farmer because she's a woman! It's like feminists can't understand that social status might be what determines if you have privilege, not gender. 🤡🤡🤡

khanivorus_rex · 2023-07-07T19:22:15+00:00

Imo the movement and ideology feel insincere, contradictory and lack of integrity from the start also they are really bad with naming stubs, for the individual and can only generalize so much because of my experiences. Personally what annoying about it is the general attitude toward the end rather than the means and i mean yeah in some cases i guess it could but giving a gender a free leg up even though temporarily wont stop the main problem, hell it might make the problem worst in a new direction and sometimes when i ask a self proclaimed feminist i get "that didnt get us the right to vote". Another thing is that some want the benefits but dont like the demerits either that or have a this is what i have to compromise attitude. Now thinking about it Feminism could be a case of Hanlon's razor.

And worst of all there was a case where in the Nothowgirlswork sub a girl have to dm me about the source of the thing she post which is just this sub and the reason is because she could get banned in which she wont because i already check the rules but nonetheless it show a stupid group mentality and apparently unless some are the exception or just being loud they arent that good at calling out their own group bad behaviours despite a lot of people not agreeing with it. So i dont think they hate men, i just think they think their views is right in explaining and solving the problem.

i agree with your point that they view the men's problem second because according to their view women were the more oppressed so they want to level the playing field first and funny enough a self proclaimed feminist tell me something similar. And the whole dynamic with the triggering when we said otherwise i would say yeah no shit.

For the menslib i think its because they fundamentally still accept the whole patriarchy views so you would get banned or get the low effort tag. Personally i think it shit for most people in general no sex is the bigger loser so yeah.

matrixislife · 2023-07-07T20:37:02+00:00

One of their favourite arguments: if there's a bad apple in the bunch and the others don't remove it, they're bad as well.
It would be helpful to get some numbers on the amount of misandry by feminists, I had someone trying to tell me earlier that there were less than a million feminists who did the "I hate men" shtick world-wide. Yeah right.

Strong-Menu-1852 · 2023-07-07T22:23:33+00:00

No their problem is that women hate women and refuse to stop hating each other because they love the drama

Modern_Ketchup · 2023-07-07T23:14:27+00:00

it’s almost like everything about equality nowadays that’s mainstream involves the glorifying of one group while belittling and dehumanizing the other. being born as a man you must be forced to accept your outcome unlike women who get to “fight back against the system”. many great changes have come from both men and women and those men that have advocated for more women’s rights are themselves ignored it seems as well.

thoughtful post

offcamber2 · 2023-07-07T23:27:59+00:00

Feminism is politics, not principle.

Last_chance_23 · 2023-07-07T17:54:48+00:00

Feminism is fighting two sets of problems.

One is very real, like rape, domestic violence, murder, child sexual abuse and threats. We all are very against that but feminists deserve credit for shining the light on violence against women.

Then there’s a bunch of other shit that’s just communism wearing a pink vagina hat. Resist that with all you have.

lumpynose · 2023-07-07T20:40:41+00:00

And when they do cover men's problems, feminists tend to oversimplify them, blame things completely outside of feminism for those issues, and react defensively at the mere suggestion that some actions or policies promoted by feminism might have harmed men in general, even if accidentally so. ... Another problem they have is their insistence of treating men and women's macro dynamics as an "oppressor vs oppressed" issue. This inevitably causes feminists to apply double standards whether they do it consciously or subconsciously.

I see these as symptomatic of the underlying cause which is that women are very unlikely to use analysis and logic when trying to understand problems. And that they are much more likely to let their emotions run away with them.

I definitely agree that very few women actively hate men and want to see men suffer. Rather that they're simply dull witted and clueless and unable to understand. And as I said before, "thinking" with their emotions.

Top-Gas-4121 · 2023-07-07T20:54:33+00:00

Perhaps read some of the articles on 'Medium', it's a cesspit of midandry.

hotpotato138 · 2023-07-07T20:56:24+00:00

You're totally right!

ConestogaCreek · 2023-07-07T21:06:13+00:00

Nah I disagree, it’s hate.

rabel111 · 2023-07-07T22:17:14+00:00

Femiism is a hate movement that hyjacked the work done by the Women's Liberation Movement, a popular movement that appealled to many men and women seeking equality and sexual liberation.

While women's libers were doing the hard work, feminists were writing hate docs like the SCUM manifesto.

g1455ofwater · 2023-07-07T23:58:32+00:00

Those aren't behaviors of people that care about men's problems. Admitting men have problems is not the same as caring.

As far as hate goes, first "hate" needs to be defined so we know what we are looking for and so we can apply the label correctly and equally.

xkirbz · 2023-07-08T03:10:26+00:00

Menslib, twox, feminism, etc. are “safe spaces”. You will never read real criticism there.

Ftpiercecracker1 · 2023-07-08T05:13:15+00:00

Feminists, cuckcervatives, and trad-cons only care about men's issues to the extent that it hurts or helps women.

Thats why so many talking heads are talking about men's issues, it's the edgy yet in vogue topic atm, but they only talk about mens issues from the perspective of how it hurts women and what men should be doing to make better marriage prospects for women.

TessaBrooding · 2023-07-08T14:31:27+00:00

Movement about women’s rights.

“Men’s issues come in a veeery distant second place…”

What you’re looking for is egalitarianism. Feminism has been overtaken by this weird notion that it’s feminists’ job to simultaneously fight for social justice of all oppressed groups. I understand your compaint but it’s rather funny if you think about it.

I think the western world is at a point where feminism can move on to egalitarianism and finally address the inequalities faced by men. But I find it laughable to blame feminism as a movement (as opposed to feminists as individuals) for not addressing men’s rights.

jhny_boy · 2023-07-07T18:36:26+00:00

I completely agree. And as for that, I posted on menslib too, in a time of great crisis, feeling a lot of the same things, and the mods took it down because it was a “personal rant” not discussion of a social issue.

Away_Entrance1185 · 2023-07-07T19:14:21+00:00

Feminism and Feminists by themselves aren't the problem, rather it's the Feminist monopoly on gender discourse, if we had both Institutional Feminism and Institutional MRM+Manosphere we'd see both battle each other in open public debates and people would debate each talking point at home, but in reality we only have institutional Feminism and it very much enforces its monopoly. Asking the women's movement to help men is like asking the Gay movement to help Trans people, they're not going to help. I know a lot of older transwomen and they often told me "LGBT is a lie, at most they recognise our issues but we have to do activism ourselves", the same applies here. The only difference is that Gay people don't blame Trans people for their own problems, the few Feminist allies of the Men's Rights Movement and Manosphere are demonised for dating to question the mainstream narrative.

The worst misandry usually comes from Conservatives, but despite having a common enemy the Feminists often would rather defend and platform Conservatives than acknowledge that misandry COULD exist. Either we try to open the doors for fellow activists in influential positions or the MRM and Manosphere are doomed to fail.

CrowMagpie · 2023-07-07T20:56:07+00:00

it is true that most feminists don't hate men.

Okay.

Now look at everything you just posted. Every single thing you said about how feminists treat men's issues. Blaming men for our problems. Treating it as a zero-sum game so dealing with men's issues is taking away from dealing with women's issues. Putting men's issues a distant fifth place to women's, even if there's no second through fourth place.

Ask yourself this:

If men treated women's issues the same way, would feminists call it misogyny? Would we have to do even a tiny fraction of what you've mentioned before it was misogyny?

If I call feminists misandrists because of all this, I'm using their own standards turned down to one (from eleven).

chalking it up to patriarchy or capitalism,

Also, gender issues have nothing to do with economic systems. Capitalism is irrelevant and communism is a red herring. Please, people on this sub, stop bringing them up.

HotRaise4194 · 2023-07-07T19:26:48+00:00

Perfect example of “When you are privileged equality feels like oppression”.

itsakon · 2023-07-07T19:12:55+00:00

Plus that they hate men and don't care about their problems.

Have you ever heard feminists talk about the men in their lives that they love? At best it's like "they're a couple of the good ones, even if they are big dummies". In my experience it's not always at at best either. I've seen a lot of irrational cartoon hero worship too, like how a true misogynist might feel about their dear old mum. No thanks.

They don't you to suffer in the way cult members don't want you to suffer.

sunday0wonder · 2023-07-07T18:41:20+00:00

Are feminists supposed to take up men’s issues or not address them at all? What would be better according to MRAs?

resurrect_john_brown · 2023-07-07T21:24:51+00:00

I have a schizophrenic relationship with men. My husband is one of the best human beings I know, and I would take a bullet for him. I've had so many amazing male friends that have enriched my life greatly. Yet men are also a perpetual, pervasive, low-grade threat to my safety. I've been drugged and raped, many of my female friends have been assaulted and/or molested, and I'm living in a society that is full of men who watch violent porn. And the problem is that I can't tell who's who. I can't tell by looking who is a great guy I'd really vibe with, and who is another Ted Bundy, and unfortunately that means that I have to be wary of all of you. And I realize that's not fair to the majority of men who are normal people, but that is the way that women live.

So I exist in a state of both loving and hating men - because sometimes I feel like I do when I'm angry, but it passes because it's just a reaction - of both admiring and disdaining them, of needing their attention in some ways while absolutely hating having my tits stared at, of sexually desiring them and thinking that they're depraved. All of these things exist inside me simultaneously, and I'm sure it's like this for most other women.

Fundamentally I love men and advocate for them frequently. But the truth is that it's complicated, and it's not always easy. It's something I have to work at, especially at not letting resentment and fury get the better of me when some men refuse to acknowledge these realities even though I see women talking about them constantly. To be blunt, not everything is about you. Twenty years of men dealing with significant struggles doesn't mean that women no longer experience systemic disadvantages - it means that we need to start paying attention to men's needs and incorporate them into all of our future considerations. The constant "what about men" responses make you look like petulant children, it's wowza self-centered, and it's not going to get you anywhere. I'm sure that this will upset most of you, which is not my intent whatsoever. It's how I perceive things.

Jean_o_tails · 2023-07-07T21:34:20+00:00

Why should they care? No, seriously.

CloudCompetitive4716 · 2023-07-07T18:58:16+00:00

Vice versa, do you care about women's problems? Looking at this sub I sincerely doubt it PS: I invite all the shy downvoters to a polite discussion;)

Sendmeloveletters · 2023-07-07T20:29:38+00:00

The problem is they’re faking it for power and if you treat them as honest or take them at their word you’re falling for the ruse. It has nothing to do with anything except transitioning as much institutional power and social control over to their in-group. Feminism is a front.

dollarBillz007 · 2023-07-07T21:13:35+00:00

As men we must accept the fact that nobody will care for us other than if we are providers. Ik it’s fucked up but it just is what it is. We know what each of us has to go through and what’s expected of us so I just have come to accept that the only people who will understand it are other men. That’s why I get so upset when I see other men doing hoe shit to other men we should be supportive of each other since we know no one else will be. Idk how being a feminist is positive but acting masculine has became something to Shame. I refuse to not let my nuts dangle off what the terrain I’ll drag my nuts all over the place if need be. I say that in the most positive way possible. Support the bros tho no matter what keep ‘em in check tho too if they aren’t moving right make them aware of it. Men being able to act like men is becoming way tougher for the boys coming up. The shame they have to endure isn’t right especially since the world runs off of men being men. I love women to death yes I hate some bitches specifically but as a whole I love women and what they bring to the table but we’ve been running the world for 1000s of years and without us it would fall apart. Some women hate all men yes but some men hate all women both of em are lost af.

wumbo-inator · 2023-07-08T05:32:44+00:00

Feminism has actually and literally blocked progress in a variety of ways. It’s not that they superficially care or don’t care. They do care. They care about making sure men continue to suffer for women’s privilege.

precocious_pakoda · 2023-07-08T05:39:03+00:00

I don't know how many times I've seen this but whenever women DO speak up for men, they make almost always make their point about the issue affecting women. I mean, goddamn, can you please for once just accept that men have problems too?

Angryasfk · 2023-07-08T14:20:52+00:00

Plenty of feminist plain hate men. And the “superficial care” only exposes this, and their at best indifference. It’s in the same vein as “I’m not a racist, but…”

Title	Feminism's problem isn't that they hate men or not care about their problems. Is that they only superficially care.
Author	Troll4everxdxd
Upvotes	339
Comments	189
Date	July 7, 2023 5:50 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/14te7lo/feminisms_problem_isnt_that_they_hate_men_or_not/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/feminisms-problem-isnt-that-they-hate-men-or-not.1224587 https://theredarchive.com/post/1224587

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