What would the “Surrendered Wife” approach be to husband’s excessive porn use?

ArkNemesis00 · 2023-08-04T17:37:06+00:00

We had a good comment about this topic the other day.

It sounds like from some of your comments that his need for Escape is being fulfilled through porn use. It will be hard to get him to quit without a replacement (like how smokers sometimes move to nicotine gum). Sex with you doesn't fulfill Escape. Based on what you wrote, I'm guessing it fulfills Security (and Status when you're trying to conceive, perhaps). You're barking up the wrong tree.

It'll be an uphill battle trying to get him to agree it's a problem because he's so reliant on it. Keep talking about how it hurts you and that your needs aren't being met. Tell him you'll assist him in finding something else that fulfills his needs if he would try to quit.

I don't think my personal experience is very applicable because my husband told me about his addiction and the steps he was taking to overcome it on day one. I married him knowing it would likely always be a part of our relationship, and accepted that. What has worked for me was knowing and trusting it was his problem to sort out and letting him come to me for sex. He has always been very kind and supportive in talking me through my feelings and insecurities. I know now it doesn't matter what I look like. It's like trying to entice someone away from crack cocaine with a beautiful roast chicken dinner.

youllknowwhenitstime · 2023-08-04T18:44:07+00:00

My heart breaks reading this. You're clearly willing to do anything to save your marriage as an actual marriage and not become roommates. Unfortunately, it's not up to you at this point.

Women can not rescue men from a porn addition. They can not be their accountability partner, they can not be their confidant, they can not be their guide. TRIPLY so if the woman in question is his wife. My husband realized porn was toxic back when he was a teenager, and I've watched him now as a married man guide a few others into quitting. Women can not replicate this process. I've seen so many married women with husbands who "want to quit" fall into this trap.
u/ArkNemesis00 is completely correct as well, and I don't see other commenters mentioning what she's said. Please read her comment. Your strategies, while clearly sincere and heartfelt, are "like trying to entice someone away from crack cocaine with a beautiful roast chicken dinner."
If there's no anti-porn community around, he's rather screwed. This is why one of the commenters was asking if you're religious - that's one of the only sources where the social order supplies help (and the initial censure for him to want to quit in the first place). If his Dad - or even your Dad - or best buddy were on the nofap train, it would be different. Certain body-building or male health nut communities are also anti-masturbation.
There are two recommendations I have for you, being quite powerless on your own and completely unsupported elsewhere.
1. Start going to the gym for weight training and ask him to join you. It's likely that even if he turns you down initially he eventually will after a month or two of you going several times a week. While this has a profound effect on the health and longevity of both sexes, the mental effect for men is far more drastic than for women, and encouraging (effective) weight training is one of the few assured ways of him getting enough of a T-boost to start reconsidering his habits. I recommend this program for beginning: https://stronglifts.com/5x5/
2. Ask him to read this (free, online) book: https://read.easypeasymethod.org/ I've repeatedly heard of it being the catalyst for someone to quit in a way that other methods (12-Step, etc.) rarely are. Would also be useful for yourself to read as well. But the gym work should be your #1 priority - even if it fails as a potential mental catalyst, you'll still have ironclad benefits.
Otherwise, you have to wait for him to decide he's done being a mindslave. Don't torture yourself in the meantime.

PsychoticNurse · 2023-08-04T17:24:04+00:00

OP, first, please stop trying so hard. He has to meet you halfway too. I noticed you said you offer him head every morning. Does he give you oral sex too? Does he get you off or even care to get you off? Does he do anything with the children that you both brought into this world? Just because he works and you stay home, doesn't absolve him from being a dad. Do you ever get a few minutes break from the kids so you can unwind? Does he ever say that he'll take them to the park or does he sit and interact with them at all?

Stop dressing up as anime characters, stop doing the sounds from the anime (unless it's something you truly enjoy too). Sexual pleasure goes both ways. It's not just the man who is allowed to get off and us women have to be sexually frustrated in the marriage.

I would sit him down and tell him that he has a porn addiction and needs to see someone about it. I would make it clear that the future of our marriage depends on him getting help for this addiction. Treat it the same way as any other kind of addiction. For a man to have the privilege of leading, he has to show that he's a good leader. Just being born a man doesn't make him a leader. If he refuses therapy, there's your answer on how much his family means to him. I would also suggest for you to get into individual therapy so you can set strong boundaries.

My husband and I are conservative, RP'd all the way. We are mainly traditional gender roles in the home with some variations (we both work fulltime). So I'm not saying these things to you on some liberal, feminist pov. It is my hope that you stand up for yourself. Being RP'd doesn't mean that we're doormats either. Submission is a gift we give to our husbands, it's not just assumed they will get it.

lifelonglistener · 2023-08-04T19:22:47+00:00

I dated and came close to marrying a man who I cared for deeply, who was tall and handsome and generous, who was smart and had a high income, who was kind and who my family loved. I ended it because I felt as you do – undesired. I felt hurt and ashamed when I was naked and he wouldn't even glance up. When we had sex he had to close his eyes and fantasize, who knows about what. I've never had that experience with other men – I've always felt desirable. I don't know if he had a porn addiction or just some deep-seated sexual issues – apparently there had been some sexual trauma in his youth. But just as we were about to move in together, it hit me like a thunderbolt that I couldn't live with it. Your situation is very different, as you have two very young children and so much more at stake. I am just saying that I know what you are going through is deeply painful, deeply personal, and that I respect your deep desires to fix things. I think my only piece of advice involves really trying to take care of yourself and take responsibility for your own happiness as much as possible, and that includes your own sexual fulfillment (I'm talking about creative and sensual self-pleasure, not infidelity).

buttermiIk · 2023-08-04T16:22:17+00:00

Following because curious for what type of solution rpw comes up with for a situation like this

fossacecak · 2023-08-04T16:22:56+00:00

Unfortunately it sounds like he’s addicted to porn and it will not stop unless he wants to. I subscribe to Doyle’s way of life too, and I’m not sure where I heard the quote, but I heard once that a good man isn’t an addict, a liar, a cheater, or an abuser. Right now your husband is addicted to porn, lying to you (”It’s going great…”), and porn lights up men’s brains in a way sex does so I consider it cheating.

I really am not sure what kind of advice to give you, but I want you to know that there isn’t much you can do physically to make him want only you. All the effort you have been putting in is extreme and you deserve someone who loves and wants you for who you are, not someone who tolerates you because you bend over backwards to look like a hentai character.

And there is nothing wrong with you. This is a him problem. The best you can do is support him if he commits to getting over his addiction, or figuring out alternatives if he can’t change. This isn’t normal.

If I were in your shoes, I think I would reconsider this marriage if things don’t change. Good luck ❤️

Ok_Outside149 · 2023-08-04T17:29:49+00:00

Should be this approached the surrendered wife way or the why men love/marry bitches way? The comments mentioning how you’re bending yourself backwards to appeal to him made me think. It’s like reciprocal investment. If you were dating him and making him dinner, baking for him etc and he wasn’t giving you anything back, would you bake even more goodies for him? No, because that approach clearly isn’t working. It’s a two way street.

Just thought I’d offer up another perspective, feel free to disregard

Wife_and_Mama · 2023-08-04T16:53:24+00:00

Just like any problem in a marriage, he has to a) agree that it's a problem and b) genuinely want to change. It doesn't sound like he's there yet. As much as I support women being the soft place to land and pampering their husbands, I'm not sure you jumping through hoops to be his own personal porn star is the best method.

At this point, I'd suggest steering him toward some anti-porn social commentators, like Matt Walsh and Jordan Peterson. Listening to another man tell him how harmful this is might make a bigger difference. If you can convince him this is a real problem in your marriage, I would also recommend you look into some of the softwares available to hold people accountable for their Internet usage. He's less likely to fumble if there are blocks in place and weekly usage reports involved. This is, however, only going to work if he wants to fix the problem. I am not suggesting you spy on your husband.

If he's not going to do anything to improve your marriage, though, I'd stop bending over backward to make his life easier. I'm not suggesting you threaten to leave or stop doing the basics of a SAHM. I'd certainly stop dressing up as the anime characters he's getting off to, though.

StructureNo3388 · 2023-08-04T17:26:28+00:00

Maybe checkout r/pornfree

They are a suppirt group for those actively fighting against their own porn addixtions, but seem kind and genuinely helpful towards partners seeking help and resources.

I learnt there that there is a huge link between the excessive use of porn and erectile dysfunction. This might ease your mind that he has caused himself physiological and psychological damage, and that YOU are by no means the reason why he can't finish with you.

vintagegirlgame · 2023-08-04T23:58:40+00:00

According to Laura Doyle, porn is on his paper, not yours. It’s a hard thing to surrender this but it’s not something you can control and trying to will only make you less attractive in his eyes.

You’ll want to use the SFP “Spouse Fulfilling Prophecy.” Even tho he’s struggling he has admitted a problem and made a commitment to improve and that is huge. You want to pump this up. “I’m so glad you’re not addicted to porn anymore” instead of nagging him about having a problem. It may feel like a lie at first but every inch counts and over time these positive statements encourage him to live up to the man he wants to be.

“I miss you” are the code words to respectfully and vulnerably let him know you want physical affection.

And then just STFU and stay off his paper about it. I believe LD has one of her podcast episodes where she talks about the porn thing.

Mommy_Koala · 2023-08-04T17:00:21+00:00

I’m not sure what the surrendered wife approach would be, but I would advise against enabling his addiction by participating in and reinforcing it. You studying up on how to be his perfect anime sex doll doesn’t really scream “this is a problem that will destroy our family!”

I find his fixation with anime porn especially troubling. Do some research on that, there’s often a pipeline between anime porn and more disturbing content. For that reason, if I were you, I would focus on what I can control here, and that’s minimizing the impact this has on myself and my children.

I’m sorry you’re going through this. I hope he seeks the help he needs for your family’s sake if not for himself.

LoveWitchXo · 2023-08-04T16:13:29+00:00

I’m trying to learn this also as I’m going through the same thing.

Nelaboji · 2023-08-05T08:52:20+00:00

As someone with a social media addiction (which is very well described as womans porn) I can tell you, it's definitely not your fault. Not your looks, not your behaviour in bed, nothing of the sort. Addictions usually fix some sort of anxiety of the addict, not a shortfall of their loved ones. And fix in a way a drug fixes - for a short moment and with an increasing need for more. Most probably, he turns to porn not out of lust or any other form of sexual need at all. Maybe he's anxious, maybe just bored out of his head. Again, that's not your fault. Addiction changes the baseline of dopamine and after a while it's almost painful to do anything other than your drug of choice. Sex too, sadly. It just doesn't cut it anymore, because the brain doesn't fire up the body sufficiently.

Extremely good advice already given here - convince him to start weight-lifting. I'd add also - try and change the diet together. Healthy eating can do wonders to brain chemistry. Also healthy lifestyle can be a great motivator to change other bad habits. Do your research about dopamine cycles. Hubermans lab is very information dense podcast on YouTube, maybe he would be interested too, it's geared towards personal improvement, but not to the specific problem of porn, so you can just mention as "something interesting I found". A book Dopamine Nation is also very good, if you can spare the time.

Try not to nag him. I understand how frustrated you feel but it's just not helpful at all. A much better approach would be to try and anticipate when he is prone to turn to porn and try to distract him. Ask for help with kids for few minutes, come in to his work room for a "coffee break". Lite topics to distract him and give a tiny boost of mood. Think of something to tire him in the evenings. A garage cleaning, a kitchen reconstruction, anything really to keep him busy. But don't start to feel responsible if you fail to anticipate and prevent his breakdowns. It's his responsibility at the end, not yours.

And please stop playing the porn star / anime character. It won't help. Don't normalise his addiction. It's a problem to be solved not some sort of lifestyle to live. And it can be detrimental to your self respect. You are fighting a difficult battle, give yourself some grace.

fatbandoneonman · 2023-08-05T13:31:18+00:00

I don’t have much advice, but know that the porn issue is very common and like a plague for the modern man. If you follow Rabbi Manis Friedman on Instagram, he gives a good mini talk about how porn has feminized men. It turns them from the initiator to the receiver essentially. Interesting perspective, it may have some impact to frame it like that to him. I just wish porn would die already.

KECON3 · 2023-08-04T21:37:11+00:00

I’d ask, do you still desire him? If not, you are justified! Stop giving sexual effort and attention. Be uninterested. If he is looking at cartoons, he is probably far, far down that black hole. Keep praying he changes but don’t court him down this path.

caroiiiiina · 2023-08-04T22:07:45+00:00

It has nothing to do with you and everything to do with him. The porn addiction is evident and he's not doing anything to stop it or treat it, now ask yourself, can you live like this 10, 15, 20, 25 years more? Can you give up sex? You're not even 30 so I assume you are far from putting your sex life in a coffin.

RedPillDad · 2023-08-05T02:58:22+00:00

Seems he needs sex therapy, badly. Maybe he's conflicted because you're now a mother and he struggles to see you sexually. He's certainly escaping from reality.

HalosOpulence · 2023-08-05T04:20:27+00:00

I hope we merge right and ban pornography.

Funny_Garage3895 · 2023-08-04T17:27:04+00:00

If hes having issues to stop curb the additiction...

Research how to block over 18 sites 😅

Different_Citron_777 · 2023-08-05T12:20:48+00:00

Into younger girls? Madonna-whore complex?

VasiliyZaitzev · 2023-08-04T20:34:25+00:00

I’m sorry this is happening to you OP.

Porn rewire is the human brain, and based on who typically uses it, those brains are typically men’s brains. Porn can create an addiction, just like any other addiction. The good news is that it’s less physically harmful than other addictions. And it can be beaten, but he has to treat it like it’s an addiction. Notice I say “he has to“ and not “you have to.“ At the end of the day, it’s up to him to make the right choice.

The other good news is that if he can stay away from it for at least 30 days, he will have a shot at rewiring his brain in the good way. But he is going to have to do it himself.

I also note that you should not take any of this personally. Men understand the difference between “fantasy girls” and their wives who have given them children. I suspect that he loves you very much, but the disease forces him to choose the drug, and will continue to do so until it is controlled.

A couple other random notes:

He may not be concealing his porn use out of any bad, intent, directed at you, it could well be shame. Why do I say this? Because men are used to being expected to and being able to “handle” the issues in their lives. He may look on his inability to stay away from porn as a “failure.”

Also, if he ever is able to break his addiction, he’s going to have to remember that that is not a “permanent condition.” There is no “oh I can handle looking at something for half an hour while I’m traveling for business and my wife isn’t around as an alternative.” As ex-smokers sometimes say: ”You are a puff away from a pack a day.” It’s not enough to make the right choice once; you have to make the right choice every day.

Finally, he may need to hear these things from another man. See the bit about “shame,” above. He’s not going to want to confess his ongoing failure with respect to your sexual relationship to you of all people. Good luck.

basedtrader_dev · 2023-08-04T23:11:59+00:00

Just a guy's input here; please understand that it is NOT personal (it is not a reflection on you or your attractiveness). Porn addiction tends to be strong. Porn addiction for men is on par with something like social media addiction for women. It is not an easy battle by any means.

You are taking the wrong approach by being "forceful". He has to come to it by himself, that's the truth, you're basically emasculating him at this point (but we can see that you definitely mean well).

Many people try to take a forceful approach and "resist" pornography, when they need to tackle the problem at its very core. I won't elaborate on this in favor of something more relevant below.

I'm going to give unconventional advice. Pray to God (or a higher power, or the universe) to help you let go of trying to change him and control him. Maybe your man has to hit rock bottom in order to let go of the addiction, let him, that would be a very good thing for him.

David R Hawkins book "Letting Go" is a very good start that I would 100% recommend you read.

Best of luck. I can see you have good intentions.

cheesmanglamourghoul · 2023-08-06T03:53:42+00:00

this is a serious addiction that can only be helped. if he wants help. please consider giving him some resources to look into sex addicts anonymous and sex and love Addicts anonymous. they are awesome and 12 step programs where he can find a sponsor to help him, because as A wife in any type of marriage it is not up to you to fix your partners trauma/mental issues. it’s only going to lead to power imbalances and you do not want to be the main person nagging him. after all how are you supposed to follow someone who can’t lead?

you are not his mom. I go to these meetings for love addiction there’s a lot of men in there who are dealing with porn addiction. A lot of it stems from childhood trauma and attachment issues.

basedviet · 2023-08-04T18:16:01+00:00

Is your husband seeing other women?

AquariusBear · 2023-08-04T16:56:07+00:00

I’m so sorry this is happening! I have experienced porn addiction in my own life. It can be so difficult to quit. From my experience, you cannot control his behavior so you will just tire yourself out by trying.

Since he’s into porn have you guys tried making your own porn together? Perhaps your own sexy videos that he can watch later.

The next solution is setting boundaries. He’s getting all his sexual desires Met and you are not. That’s not fair. Maybe suggest that you be allowed to get your desires met elsewhere too if he isn’t willing to work on the porn habit.

Why would he stop if it’s working for him?

basedviet · 2023-08-04T17:42:41+00:00

Are you guys religious at all?

worldlysentiments · 2023-08-04T21:00:03+00:00

My thoughts are; it could be, that he’s not adjusting well to viewing you as a parent and partner. Before kids, you were 100% his. Now, splitting time and energy between kids and him, maybe he is having trouble seeing you as anything but a mom and not a sexual partner anymore. Its harsh but apparently common for men to have trouble shifting their view of wives from “partner” to “mom” to “partner”. Whereas women see men through a more faceted lens. To remedy, perhaps moving towards giving him some more quality time with his kids so you can develop a hobby something that doesn’t involve children. Joining a book club or something where you leave and do your thing and he has to multi role for a bit. Developing an identity outside of being at home with kids 24/7 might shift his view of seeing you as just mommy and as someone with a variety of hats. Plus being with two kids that young, it’s mentally healthy for you to get out and develop yourself too. (Not saying it’s right of him to not be able to shift views of you but it could be a scenario).

I bring this up ^ because he doesn’t seem despondent or not willing to be intimate (cuddling etc). I think he does value you at least to an extent-

Regardless of if the above I mentioned is true, he’s looking for something in the porn; not a specific type of person or woman or anything, it’s an emotional want. He’s getting dopamine from porn. Like sugar or anything else, filling a void and until the source of why is identified, it’s hard to stop.

Also have you straight asked why he likes porn? Or what would stop him from waking you during a nap? Is he afraid it’ll bother you? Does he think he can’t engage when he’s turned on because the kids are around? When he’s working in his office, is he there like “I’m turned on but I hear her cooking for the kids, oh well” and then watches porn? Instead of like letting you know he’s ready and building the excitement while the kids eat and then once they’re in bed, you guys can do whatever? It could be logistics too. I would guess he isn’t as physical and like into sex when you guys are doing it is probably because he’s already taken care of himself so he’s performing and not mentally all there.

Bright-Garden2720 · 2023-08-06T02:25:54+00:00

How about couples therapy or some kind of therapy for his porn addiction or how it's impacting you as a couple?

ChamomileMist · 2023-08-04T16:37:41+00:00

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ChamomileMist · 2023-08-04T16:56:39+00:00

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HJHKLL · 2023-08-05T07:42:13+00:00

Have you read the easypeasy method. If not i suggest you read it first and then tell your husband about it

blushingoleander · 2023-08-06T12:12:05+00:00

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TheBunk_TB · 2023-08-07T01:59:56+00:00

Does he have mental issues? Painkilling? Checked out?

Such_Beginning_1629 · 2023-08-07T14:05:19+00:00

Look up AlAnon for yourself. Expecially the three C‘s.

UpstairsOutcome · 2023-08-16T14:42:27+00:00

This was such a sincere post that I feel I should give my two cents. I love the value you put on your marriage and the work you’re putting in.

Im a great talker terrible writer so forgive this simplicity.

What I recommend would be a jump start but this has to be done from his end. You can help slightly. He needs to up his testosterone, gym, good diet. He can even use a crutch like a single pill. A single use can be a large help to get over the initial hump.

You can do exercises to become tighter

He has to want to fix this. You need to make him understand where this road is going and what he stands to loose if this continues for years. It’s not going to be a single day at the gym for him and a single day not watching. When he has worked on things long enough and he is ready to try have him tell you that he wants to do things later in the day at some point. Gives you time to prep.

Dressing up and doing the things he has been watching is a delicate issue. You don’t want him to just trigger all the thoughts of what he has been watching. You want him to enjoy you.

When the time comes be really into it. Enjoy yourself. At the same time you can squeeze a bit to be tighter.

After a single success do not get off the train. Have as much sex as often as possible initiated by him as this will remove the pressure on his end. This is where you can start to lure him in. Your not straight up starting sex but you can dip into things he likes a bit to get him started. Things you say, things you wear or don’t wear, subtle but not so subtle. You’re charged and ready.

Good Luck!

What would the “Surrendered Wife” approach be to husband’s excessive porn use?

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Title	What would the “Surrendered Wife” approach be to husband’s excessive porn use?
Author	abysmalrotoscoping
Upvotes	83
Comments	64
Date	August 4, 2023 3:47 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/15i3lyp/what_would_the_surrendered_wife_approach_be_to/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/what-would-the-surrendered-wife-approach-be-to.1227497 https://theredarchive.com/post/1227497