How would you fix the 'boys crisis in education'?

sugarcrush · 2016-06-24T20:10:56+00:00

I love this topic! I did some coursework on gender differences in education while getting my degree and this is what I found helpful for boys in the classroom:

-Include multiple recess (actual free play, not just physical activity time/p.e.) periods during the day -Use hands on learning techniques like blocks and manipulatives -Allow boys to compete with each other and show healthy aggression -Bring male role models into the classroom -Boys tend to work better when they can spread their work out over an area like a large table. Alternative seating arrangements like beanbag chairs or letting them lie on the floor can also be beneficial. -Boys have shorter attention spans so keep verbal instructions minimal. Provide visual examples as much as possible.

Currently, many classroom environments are geared towards female learning styles. Children are expected to sit at a desk, listen to instructions, and complete written work. Girls tend to have verbal-linguistic learning styles along with better attention spans and the ability to sit and be quiet. They aren't as affected by this type of environment as boys are. However, that doesn't mean it's the best learning environment for them either! Using manipulatives and hands on activities also help girls to develop their math and spatial reasoning skills. Really, all children benefit from more interactive activities.

TW_CountryMusic · 2016-06-24T20:36:15+00:00

I used to teach high school and have tutored everything from pre-K to adults. This and many other problems in the education system could be solved by:

-Encouraging more men to become teachers (which probably also means paying teachers better)

-Smaller class sizes (leading to more individualized education for each student)

-Shorter classes in middle/high school (it's insane and cruel to expect a 14-year-old, especially a boy, to sit still for 90 uninterrupted minutes. When my old school switched from 90-minute blocks to 45-minute classes, the change was unbelievable.)

-Longer lunches. Give kids time to socialize and unwind. Making them scarf down their food in ten minutes before rushing back to class is, again, cruel.

-More time for breaks during the day, and more student choice in how they spend those breaks. I've worked in schools that had "recess" periods that the kids could spend playing outside, reading, meeting with teachers or meeting in supervised groups/clubs. I love this.

-Give kids more agency in their own education. Everyone needs a good foundation in the basics (like research, reading comprehension, basic math/algebra, government), but it's counterproductive and a waste of time to force a kid to read Shakespeare or Beowulf if they have no interest in classical lit. Let them read sci fi or nonfiction instead if that's more their style. The important thing is that they're reading; what they're reading doesn't matter as much (and I say this as a former English teacher with an emphasis on classic American literature.)

-Project-based learning instead of rote memorization. Kill standardized tests with fire. Show kids that the things they're learning have practical applications in the real world. Boys especially are constantly asking, "Miss, when am I ever gonna use this?"

-More skills and trades classes in high school. Woodshop, welding, auto mechanics, etc. Stop shoving college down everyone's throats; let kids who like to work with their hands know they have good career options. Stop belittling blue collar work and implicitly telling kids who are interested in these things (largely boys) that they won't amount to anything. It's so shitty. I could rant about this forever.

All of this basically boils down to more localized control of education. Giving teachers more control in their classrooms and students/parents more say in their education.

I also love the idea of flipped classrooms, where students do the "learning" portion of the lesson at home via video/interactive lessons, and class time is for discussion, projects, and applying what you learned to real-world problems. This would make school more engaging for a lot of kids.

I also don't mind the idea of gender-segregated classrooms in elementary school, but I think by middle/high school it's important and necessary to integrate the genders.

bornredd · 2016-06-24T20:15:22+00:00

Introduce cub-scout type activities in classes. Map & compass day is awesome.
When group work is required, have the group vote on a leader. This would solve 75% of the issues with 'cooperative learning'.
Get rid of those dumbass desks. They have never been comfortable, and never will be. Schools should have actual chairs that the students can fit into.
Initiatives to hire male teachers in areas other than coaching and "biology teachers" who are really coaches.
As others have pointed out, greatly reduce homework. In Kindergarten, my kids were getting 4 days a week of homework, that's retarded.
Reintroduce competitiveness in all classes where possible. Even group work can be competitive - my college courses were, and my group STOMPED because all of the men were gung ho about winning.
Audit teacher grades on a gender basis at least every semester. If something is awry in either direction, that teacher is assigned to mandatory training in how to engage both student genders. (This one is personal because my oldest almost failed Kindergarten because his teacher hated boys. How does a woman who hates boys become a kindergarten teacher?!)
Get rid of all "zero tolerance" rules (especially those regarding interstudent conflict). They're all bullshit, and only punish kids who actually follow the rules anyways.
Offer classes in usable life skills - finance in high school. Mechanical classes - kids would love to know how to fix a 2 stroke engine. Wood shop has taken a nose dive in my area. Hell, in 6th grade, my wood shop teacher had a freak out because I was the only boy who knew how to properly use a BROOM. Bring it back and fund it. Bring back intra-mural sports.
Outdoor classrooms, weather permitting.
If all else fails, gender segregation of students.

CovenantoftheSun · 2016-06-24T19:43:03+00:00

Its not solely alt-right concerns. Mainstream media articles exist that acknowledge this gap. Here's one:

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/kids-health/girls-do-better-boys-school-all-ages-subjects-study-finds-n92531

Stop making boys sit still in class. Stop making boys do cooperative group projects. Let them compete, let them rough house. Stop grading boys based on obedience and behavior, start grading them on mastery of the subject.

Lots of boys more than girls don't want to do the homework. Their grades suffer. Not sure how to solve this problem. In college, guys start to do well again because they are based on performance and test scores more than they are behavior and busy work.

alreadyredschool · 2016-06-24T19:44:42+00:00

Reintroduce recess, change homework (it cannot make your grade worse, only better but you can get As without it), support competitiveness, less group works.

Edit: More male teachers. I excelled in all subjects with a male teacher.

hakosua · 2016-06-24T20:31:53+00:00

The British have been studying the impact of gender in the institution of modern education systems in West for some time with strong evidence that the system is unfairly angled towards advancing girls and stunting boys.

Putting aside the fact that generally speaking a lot of young boys are medicated or wrongfully diagnosed with ADD for illiciting boy'like behavior, Googling "education system" and "boys" brings up study after study of the disadvantages to being male...and strangely even some feminist slanted articles claiming women's success over boys is actually a disadvantage because it turns women into uninteresting exam drones who are unhealthily risk averse and success obsessed. In any even I won't list all yhe ways boys are given the shit end of the stick and go right for the question: what would be better?

I got my best marks in school when we actually went and did stuff. I had one class where we had to pick a historical sight, like an ancient Egyptian pyramid and 3D model it on a computer as accurately as possible using sources as to how it actually looked when it was made. Another was a math class in which the purpose of every step of every equation was explained succinctly. Another was a philosophy class which mostly consisted of self directed essays and open discussions.

My worst classes/marks came from classes where book report essays would ask a question that could be answered in a single paragraph but demand 5. Math classes taught by women who could not explain the purpose of operations. Assignments that were superfluous and served no greater purpose to towards my education. Exams that had less to do with putting your knowledge to the test and more to do with cramming factoids into my head and regurgitating them onto a paper I'd surely forget the next day...

I took a classical art class all through highschool. The final exam was memorizing the artist, the year, and the art style of over 200 paintings. I failed decisively. Had the test simply been to be presented with an painting and to correctly identitify the art style and and explain why, it would have been both a better test of the students education and a lot less gender biased as women are much better at information regurgitation. When I was in school, I helped lightly tutor this Asian girl for a history test on WW2. She got a 96% on the unit without having any idea what a tank was.. this is not "education".

Ironically, British studies have also found evidence that men make significantly better teachers than women when teaching both girls and boys.

OfSpock · 2016-06-24T20:46:28+00:00

The education system has really gone downhill since streaming was banned and forcing kids into it. Streaming needs to be brought back. Presumably, the kids who have no interest in education would then be removed from the classes and babysat somewhere.

[deleted] · 2016-06-24T21:10:55+00:00

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salami_inferno · 2016-06-24T21:39:11+00:00

We obviously need affirmative action to get more men into higher education using the logic we've been using. Of course people would collectively lose their shit if that were to happen.

betterdeadthanbeta · 2016-06-25T04:53:22+00:00

What issues in the education system do you see that specifically impact boys?

Lack of emphasis on masculine traits like achievement, violence, competition, honor, killing, dominance, enslaving of lessers, etc.

How would you try to fix them?

Any genetically inferior looking boy is left to die of exposure at the foot of the Taugetus. At 13, the surviving boys are paired up and then forced to fight to the death, so that only the strongest half reach manhood and all will be blooded.

The purpose of education should be to inculcate a core of alpha traits. Will to power, will to survive and succeed even if it means tearing the opposition to pieces with your own two bloody hands. Anyone who can't deal is lebensunwertes leben - life unworthy of life. The world is not big enough for such untermenschen and the intellectual rot they inevitably spread.

From there, a strong education in the classics, drilling in the values of western civilization, and eventual specialization into an economic field designated to the individual by wise patriarchs.

Bonus Question: what issues do you see specifically impacting girls in education and how would you fix them?

They are taught things that are irrelevant to their gender like math, science, history, literature, etc. Should be home ec x 1000, slave/household management and a priestess armed with a lash beating and forcing them to not be sluts.

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[deleted] · 2016-06-24T20:50:56+00:00

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[deleted] · 2016-06-24T22:43:15+00:00

The problem is school. School is not and has never been a necessary component to living a rich, sustainable life. The most successful men in history had almost no formal education, but their resumes and work experience were already impressive at age 18.

We're too far down the rabbit hole to fix it, but school should never have been turned into a way to acclimate children to corporate culture. Girls thrive in school for the same reason that they thrive in do-nothing office jobs. Boys and men aren't meant for that lifestyle.

Apexk9 · 2016-06-24T23:07:40+00:00

Home school.

To enrich their brains not just regurgitation of information.

darkmoon09 · 2016-06-24T23:10:03+00:00

This feminized gynocentric culture has no interest in the plight of boys because boys are the evil patriarch and they deserve what's happening to them.

99papaya · 2016-06-25T17:01:27+00:00

I would try to study the family lives of the boys who do better in school vs the boys who do more poorly, because I think this is one element of the problem. I have a girl that recently graduated from high school, and a boy that is still in school. If you are passionate about making changes that means writing lawmakers and attending school board meetings. If you the public can be involved in curriculum selection...become involved in that. Of course doing things like attending school board meetings isn't glamorous, and you might see slow or no payoff for your effort. I'm not a fan of sex segregated schools. My dad, uncle and three female cousins attended single sex high schools...there is definitely a tradeoff.
I'm not sure I believe the system is entirely skewed toward girls...I spent a lot of time with my daughter in her earlier years with basic concepts that I didn't need to spend with my son. When my daughter graduated there was an end of year award ceremony...there are definitely boys who are doing very well. I suspect that there is more support for academics in those households. Parents need to be involved in making sure the kids get physical activity at home. In my generation many of us walked to school...this is less common now. My daughter had an incredibly wacky math curriculum...my son's was a little bit less wacky. Just because something is interactive doesn't mean it is good. For kids that have a more intuitive grasp of math all the extra frills are really just frustrating. My dad learned math many decades ago under a more strict system and went on to get two degrees in math. Not every ed school idea actually works well in practice. Dads need to read in front of the kids. Take family trips to the library. Reduce video game time at home. Make kids play outside. Regarding rote learning some is necessary. Some kids need more rote learning than others. You don't start playing full violin concertos or end up in the NBA finals without having spent some time on repetitive practice. Where we got the idea rote learning is outdated for the classroom, I'll never know.

mrcs84usn · 2016-06-25T19:03:35+00:00

All boys schools with uniforms and very few female teachers. Bring back competition. Let them work with "unsafe" stuff under supervision like power tools and firearms. Physical activity would be at least 3 times a week.

Entropy-7 · 2016-06-26T19:31:11+00:00

I have been a professional educator at the high school level for the last 6 years and so I can speak from experience: boys suck! They are lazy, unmotivated and have the attention span of a goldfish.

The flip side of this is that school sucks and it just isn't a proper environment for turning boys into men.

The thing is that my teaching credentials go back 25 years to when I was a drill sergeant. I was an instructor at the Royal Canadian Regiment Battle School and with the Canadian Forces School of Military Engineering.

My suggestion? Military academies.

Having said that, I am not a war monger and certainly don't think that we should be training guys to be unthinking cannon fodder. However, the competition, the rah-rah, the discipline and a whole raft of other systems are what boys respond to and can get them to learn.

TrialsAndTribbles · 2016-06-26T19:42:25+00:00

First I would segregate them into separate schooling, because boys and girls are not the same, and should not be treated as such at school. The feminization of school is a contributing factor to the decline of boys education. I would also demand that colleges accept equal numbers of boys and girls (if it works for race balancing, why not sex too?).

exit_sandman · 2016-06-28T13:08:20+00:00

Repost from this thread.

The problem with boys doing worse and worse is because changes in all walks of life snowballed into a situation that generally makes for sucky teaching, but affects boys far more than girls.

you have parents who let their children grow up without actually providing care for them. Boys are more likely to fall into the "video games-trap" than girls, thus getting used to sources of colorful engagement and instant gratification. I'd blame the male propensity for tool use for that tendency (if girls use technology, it's less for playing around and more for socializing and getting their dose of validation - it's not for nothing that the female "computer literacy" skyrocketed once internet chats became a thing; or that facebook walls from female accounts are bloated with the highlight reels from their lives).
you have parents who believe anti-authoritarian education styles are best, thus breeding little brats with a very limited capacity of reining in their natural drives. This affects boys more than girls since the latter are less prone to engage in reckless physical activities, start fighting, challenge authority or anything else of that sort - this means that boys are less suited for a education style that pretty much requires them to stop doing all that stuff on their own without an additional external incentive (apart from good grades and a nebulous "you're risking your future"-scenario).
you have teachers who aren't allowed to discipline their students, thus they lack the tools to rein in that sort of behavior as well. Which in turn leads to them being more occupied with preventing boys from disrupting the lessons than them actually learning something.
parents thinking that their children can't do any wrong so it must be a biased teacher if they get bad grades - also a consequence of them being fed the "children (particularly your own!) are special"-mantra all the time. Which is a consequence of the feminized society, read this post.
and then you have the idea that female problems have to be prioritized and that girls doing slightly worse in some fields and preserving the lofty idea of gender equality is still more important than boys doing considerably worse in many other fields. This includes the actually pretty retarded idea that if boys do worse than girls in a feminized school system, they have to be feminized as well in order for the whole thing to work (pretty far down).
Funecdote: I recently read an interview with a researcher who was active in that field (particularly gender differences at schools, in Germany). His findings were nothing special - girls do better than boys (though boys are still better than girls at math), we have to do something about them falling behind. But then he mentioned how Sweden (where else...) managed to achieve gender equality in the results of math, citing this as an example of recommendable policy because it achieved equality of outcome instead of wondering that maybe the fact that boys do worse across the board has also something to do with the fact that they drop down to the level of girls in areas they'd otherwise do better... but that would mean that they had to cope with the uncomfortable idea that the genders aren't equal. It's frustrating because the root of the problem is actually pretty obvious once you drop ideologically motivated preconceptions about how things should be instead of how they are; yet these people prefer to keep the blinders on.

Well... over time, all this turned me into a fan of gender-separated classes. There you can apply different teaching and education styles, use scenarios that cater to one learning style or the other, employ gender-appropriate teachers and also evaluate their performances differently if necessary.

darksoldierk · 2016-06-24T22:15:06+00:00

The biggest issue? The fact that boyhood is basically outlawed. I remember when I was a kid, I'd get my ass kicked very very often. I was someone who was made fun of all of the time. Did it suck? hell yeah it did, but the fact is, men need to be on either end of the spectrum. They either need to be the bully's or the ones being bullied. And there is a reason for that. The reason is that unlike women, men get life raw. Women get a well done steak that was cooked poorly and therefore tastes like shit, but men get it raw. Unlike women, men don't have choices. We've all heard this statement and we all know why. Women get more choices in relationships, but they also get more choices in life. That is why men, when given the opportunity, tend to go into professions with huge income potential such as mathematics, sciences, technology, construction, where as women tend to go for the soft sciences where only outliers make huge incomes. Because women marry up, which means men have to always fight to stay up but women don't have to fight at all. So boys need to be taught early that life bullies you. That other men will knock you out and leave you in a ditch if they benefit, and that women will treat you like you're worthless if you aren't attractive to them. The world is different for men than it is for woman, and although I'm not saying that men have it harder, I am saying that men are alone in a pit fighting for every scrap they get. Women have their issues, but the one thing they'll always have is that there will always be a man willing to take care of a woman.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to allow violence. I'm not saying that at all. Notice I said "boyhood" instead of "violence". Bullying is wrong, to be sure, and boys should be prohibited from bullying, however, medicating them when they do is simply ridiculous.

How would I fix them? Honestly as much I hate to say it, separate boys and girls. I don't understand how this is misogynistic, I really don't. I don't need a PHD in psychology to tell you that boys and girls learn differently, and that by optimising the educational system for girls, you are putting boys at a disadvantage and vice versa. Why are women so afraid of this? Let boys be boys, and girls be girls. Is there a fear that the boys will outperform girls when girls aren't given an advantage?

hakosua · 2016-06-24T20:46:52+00:00

Make school attendance optional and cut all funding for social sciences unless social science professors are able to demonstrate a level of academic rigour comparable with the hard sciences.

That's it.

Title	How would you fix the 'boys crisis in education'?
Author	cuittler
Upvotes	15
Comments	132
Date	June 24, 2016 7:36 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/4porz8/how_would_you_fix_the_boys_crisis_in_education/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/how-would-you-fix-the-boys-crisis-in-education.274256 https://theredarchive.com/post/274256

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