Your Devotion is Worthless

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May 29, 2018

Most men who fail with women, fail because they apply the "Golden Rule".

They treat women how they would wish to be treated, and, when they desire love, they act in a way that would inspire love in them. But men and women are different, and they want different things. How you wish to be treated, women hate. And how women wish to treated, you would hate.

The easiest way to understand how this is so, is to understand why this is so.

Many of you are in university right now, and some of you are nerds and will graduate with degrees in Computer Science, while others are losers and will graduate with degrees in Literature. Five years after that, you will have very different experiences.

The Literature graduates will be desperately looking for a job, any job, and worrying about the rent.

The CS graduates will be ducking phone calls and emails from Amardeep Nagpal, who wishes to advise them of much very fine opportunity to move to San Francisco and spend sixty hours a week coding javascript for some shitty startup's website for fifty bucks an hour. He also wants them to have a blessed day.

Now, the Lit guys would be thrilled to have a job come looking for them, and aren't going to understand that software engineers loathe Amardeep for the same reason that women despise attention from most men. It makes no difference to the engineers that Amardeep is very impressed with them, they get that every damn day. They are swimming in a sea of attention from the Amardeep Nagpals and Pritesh Krishnamurtis of this world. They hate them because San Francisco is a shit city, working sixty hours a week is a shit life, and fifty bucks an hour is a shit wage.

Men who court women by telling them how devoted they are making this same mistake... men's devotion is worthless, because girls have been swimming in a sea of constant male attention, love, and devotion since they were old enough to recognize emotions in other people. Offering them your love and devotion is like offering them plenty of air to breathe. They can get it anywhere. What they want isn't men who care, but men who are awesome.

  • Do not offer women your devotion. Your devotion is worthless.
  • Do not show them how deeply you care about your their feelings. Everyone cares about their feelings. Human beings are genetically hardwired to care about their feelings.
  • Do not tell them about how awesome you will treat them. Everyone is nice to them. Human beings are genetically hardwired to be nice to them.
  • Show them how awesome you are.

Men want to be treated awesome by someone okay. Girls want to be treated okay by someone awesome.

Post Information
Title Your Devotion is Worthless
Author Whisper
Upvotes 896
Comments 133
Date 29 May 2018 09:38 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Original Link
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[–]no_face363 points364 points  (11 children) | Copy

Amardeep Nagpals and Pritesh Krishnamurtis

Are these real people? I couldnt find them on linked in

[–]_flashpoint177 points178 points  (1 child) | Copy

I laughed. Take my fucking upvote because not only is it funny but as someone in STEM with an advanced degree it happens alllllll the time.

[–]RightNeedsMight2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm as well! I'm in this biz.

[–][deleted] 53 points54 points  (1 child) | Copy

You don't find them, THEY FIND YOU

[–]Brantmobile20 points21 points  (0 children) | Copy

In Mother Russia the Pill swallows you.

[–]Hibear8 points9 points  (2 children) | Copy

I think Pritesh isn’t a much of a typical Indian name? Krishnamurtis however sounds very South Indian

[–]susyplz 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

I'm south Indian. Yes it is. Also I have a great opportunity for you if you'd like to hear about it. Have a blessed day.

[–]Hibear2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You didn't offer me the salary upfront hey!

[–]RightNeedsMight1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm. I get calls from these guys all the time.

[–]Rian_Stone130 points131 points  (7 children) | Copy

If you give it away, don't be surprised people value it for what they paid

[–]blownnnn43 points44 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is true. Never give anything of value for free and never give a discount. Every person I've given a discount to has complained or treated me like shit for my kindness. YOU must have a policy and stick by it. Frame really is everything and society is so fucked up, that people's reactions is to treat people this way.

[–]greatamericancities5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy

For some, price determines value. And vice versa.

[–]Endorsed ContributorKeffirLime0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

This strategy always fails in the long run. The market adapts when everyone realizes they bought an expensive piece of shit.

[–]xXxOrcaxXx10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

Don't be a piece of shit then. But be expensive. It works for the same way you can buy equally sized bottles of water for 20 cents or 2 dollars. It's the same, but people instinctively associate higher quality with higher price. But of course, for this to work, you have to offer something people actually want.

[–]Endorsed ContributorKeffirLime0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That I can agree with, If you offer great value, you deserve the price tag that comes with it.

But you can't just slap a nice price tag on a turd and expect it to now magically transform into something valuable.

If you look at sales stats, premium waters don't sell nearly as much as your regular bottled water. Although they associate quality with price upfront, once they've tried it they realized it's a facade.

[–]brickwaterhouses-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Not if you do a good enough job at marketing it. People are still paying thousands of dollars for shiny rocks because they’ve been convinced they should.

[–]Endorsed ContributorKeffirLime-3 points-2 points  (0 children) | Copy

  • Those shiny rocks are rare, be rare and people will pay for it
  • They serve their purpose of displaying wealth

In 2018 you can open a Mr. Video selling VHS and market the shit out of it or Start an online platform like our brothers at Netflix have done and let the product speak for itself.

You don't need too be Jeff Bezos to figure out which one has more legs

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat161 points162 points  (25 children) | Copy

It seems obvious like this, but the reason most men are still unaware of it is that women, culture and media keep telling men that women do want their devotion, and to express their feelings, and to treat them awesomely.

But that's not a lie! Women do want beta men to be devoted, to express their feelings, and to treat them awesomely.

  • She most definitely wants to obtain a beta's devotion (so he'll stick around to provide when she's old and with child).
  • She most definitely desires a beta to express his feelings (so as to better control him).
  • She most definitely hopes for a wealthy beta to treat her awesomely (to ensure the best possible future security for her progeny).

What they don't tell you is that none of this involves sexual attraction at all. This was all on the B-side of the record, and the sexual attraction stuff happens to be on the A-side that nobody told you about and that most men fail to know exist (despite the glaring signs) because not only the B-side is the only side that women, culture and media are playing on repeat, but as OP says, it also happen to be exactly what men want to hear from women and thus naturally expect women to want to hear it too.

It's a tragic perfect storm of women's instinctive needs and men's capability for self-delusion.

[–]TheTrenTrannyTrain53 points54 points  (8 children) | Copy

This is one of the most bitter aspect of TRP that any newbies will have to swallow, to know that women and their hypergamy nature will fuck any devoted husband/boyfriend over her tingles.

[–]SKRedPill18 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy

What newbies don't know is that paternal love has almost zero needs from the child. Sexual love isn't like that - it exists to serve needs more than any other flavor of love out there - and it happens to be a very pure instinct.

Devotional love is not actually sexual, although to tell the truth - sex and feels alone are never enough glue for any long term relationship or undertaking - devotion is the only thing that allows you to survive the tough times. Sex and emotions do not know principles unless they cross a boundary they shouldn't have and face the music. The masculine principle needs morals and principles because trust is an essential component of the masculine. The feminine principle however does not care except what it feels. Morality cannot arouse anyone.

There is another angle to this in that even when a male expresses Type B love to a woman, he can still get sexy about it. She's crying and he cuddles her - tell me if he won't start feeling sexy about it (unless she's being an absolute jerk).

For men, we need to actively see the difference between the two although left to our way, our sex drive is so easy to arouse that we naturally blend the two. We could just orgasm by the very sight of a pretty woman, she doesn't have to do anything. Men can love through sex and vice versa.

Women aren't like that. For them, platonic and sexual are very clearly separated, and often established right at the start - this is why the friend-zone exists. What we as men are doing is learning to tell the two apart for our strategy, which helps us distill the sexy component of love apart from the comfort.

This doesn't mean that people can't control themselves. If that was the case every man would become an uncontrollable rapist which is not the case. But today's society pretty much incentivizes hypergamy.

However I think devotion's become worthless simply because the masculine isn't dominating the feminine and setting boundaries like it used to. In conservative societies devotion is respected because it's rewarded and trust violations are punished. In the west, devotion's a liability now.

[–]trtanon3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy

Incorrect. Women are very capable of being loyal *to their alpha*. And some even to their beta, although they live in misery (maybe analogous to having to sleep with a 300lb woman that pays your rent).

[–]propesh 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

Your comment won't get the points but I agree. The number of cuckolds relative to what is RP theorized is big.

Yes, they are miserable and the disparity in tingles is also there. I think woman have more self-control than is given credit in RP circles...though definitely not as strong as Iron Will.

[–]SKRedPill6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

I do know many women who're devoted to their husbands and families despite hardships - the thing is, a sense of duty, karma, respect for marriage and religion has been drilled into their heads and they've grown up in stable families with lots of extended relatives and are usually virgins or extremely low n-counts. I know that many of them do not use pills, IUDs or all those hormone wrecking stuff - it's almost always the condoms. There's no question of drugs and alcohol in most of these women - it's said in some cultures that if a woman goes bad, that's the end of the family. They also don't get to see traumatic stuff like abortions unless it's a medical emergency.

Even one strong alpha partner however can alpha widow a woman. There are quite a lot of them who did crazy stuff with their first boyfriends that they can't quite do with their husbands. Even if it was just one partner.

I compare these women with many more modern, feminist women and I'll tell you what -- at 50, many of those old school women are going to look far better and far healthier while the next set are gonna be done in their 30s. Those women are a dying breed - the next gen fall short on all parameters in comparison.

I am now a firm believer that while SMV and orgasms and tingles are powerful stuff (even more so on women than men), this is never enough glue for the long haul. Attraction is a pure instinct - put in in a tough situation that doesn't help it and POOF!

The only thing that ever survived tough times was masculine virtues like a sense of duty, trust, stoicism and teamwork. Back in the days of Moses and before that, they got this drilled in women as well. I won't say that many women didn't have unhappy marriages or beta husbands, in fact most men have a long way to by that yardstick, but they stuck it out. And in those days, a woman abandoning her family meant losing everything.

Feminism called all that stuff 'patriarchy' and threw it all out - with no discipline, anyone (especially emotionally vulnerable cases) can easily fall victim to pleasure addictions. The result is a bunch of increasingly obese, ugly, drugs and alcohol abusing, overly masculine, prematurely aged and sometimes insane creatures calling themselves women. That's what passes for empowerment.

[–]trtanon3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

I disagree that you're a cuck if your girl cheats on you. If your girl constantly puts out for you, loves sex with you, does everything for you, but cheats, and you don't know, does it really matter? Not really. You just have to be secure enough knowing you can get a new girl if she stops satisfying you. *Everything else is bullshit.* And I have to stick to that because there's no other stress-free way to live. That's just me though. I'm not sure if women are as cheat-crazy as TRP thinks either, but my mindset helps me not care.

[–]AnyDoughnut6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly, unfortunately most men are oblivious to women's sexual strategies. Women want a reliable provider and alpha seed to breed her. It is uncommon that one man possesses both attributes, so women line up 2 or more men to fill her needs.

Movies and Hollywood paint an unrealistic picture that most men strive to mimic, which ends with disastrous results.

[–]SKRedPill8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

Media's a load of horseshit. It's the very peak of what I term the fundamental female lie (FFL). Sex is a pure instinct - pure sexy. Everything else is just comfort.

[–]Morningsun921 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Literally every girl I’ve talked to says; clingy, constant attention, always available guys give a reverse lady boner.

[–]awakenedspirit10 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I've been reading this comment a lot. Great elucidation between alpha and beta. Much appreciated my man.

[–]trtanon-1 points0 points  (9 children) | Copy

Women don't want any of those things from a beta. They want them from an alpha.

Not getting caught in the game is very simple. Don't invest. Don't buy shit. Don't get married. She still fucking you? You're good.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat12 points13 points  (8 children) | Copy

You are confused. You are thinking of alpha as "high value man" and beta as "low value man". This is a common misunderstanding.

Alpha is the "sexually desirable man", and beta is the "reliable provider".

That's why we say women have a dual sexual strategy. They need both. They need quality DNA and they need quality resources. Of course ideally they'd get it from the same man, but not only sexually desirable men have little interest in being an exclusive partner to ONE woman ESPECIALLY after she gets old and unattractive, and even if he did, there's by definition not enough of them for every woman to have one as a provider. On the contrary, there are the other men - often not sexually successful - who are willing and able to provide resources, even if she gets old. This forces women to search for several men to fulfill different needs.

As long as you will mistakenly define alpha as "high value man" and beta as "low value man", many behavior of women will remain puzzling to you.

[–]trtanon-4 points-3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Nothing you said changes anything I said. Define words however you want. I define high value as sexually desirable.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat8 points9 points  (6 children) | Copy

It's not a matter of different definitions. It's a matter of understanding TRP theory.

Yes women are looking for the highest value man they can find. Not Mister Right but Mister Perfect, who is both the most sexually desirable man to her and other women around BUT ALSO entirely committed to her and her alone, ready and willing to pour his resources onto her and her kids only.

Except that this perfection does not exist (or extremely rare, and in any case not at a rate of one for each woman out there). It's a male unicorn.

What does exist is the most sexually desirable man to her and other women around, who is likely to MAYBE want to sleep with her, but very likely NOT being exclusive, NOT willing to give her away his resources, and certainly NOT going to take any of her demands seriously. Because he has a wide pool of options.

What also exist is a whole bunch of guys willing to be entirely committed to her and her alone, ready and willing to pour their resources onto her and her kids only, willing to let themselves be manipulated to provide always more. Because they have no other option.

So she does with what she has, preferring one or the other (or working on both tables) as a function of her SMV, her resource needs, and here awareness of her quickly fading SMV.

That's why we say women have a dual strategy. Yes ideally they want "alpha fucks and bucks", but in reality she does what she can with "alpha fucks" on one side and "beta bucks" on the other.

That's why when say "alpha" we mean "sexually attractive", and by "beta" we mean "dependable provider". They both fulfill separate needs of women.

Like thousands of others here, you probably let yourself getting ego-invested in the idea that "alpha" as this masculine ideal to strive for, high-value all around, sexually-attractive AND dependable father, leader of men AND generous team-member, fucking lots of girls AND completely exclusive to his wife. And its antithesis, the loser, incel, useless, unattractive, poor "beta". You're misguided and you don't see it, though you may find yourself puzzled to see a woman hitting the wall leaving a sexy but uncommitted man for an ageing, wealthier and more dependable man. You may violently disagree when we say characteristics of the alpha is dark triad traits: narcissism, Machiavellianism, psychopathy, and then act surprised to see women flocking to not-necessarily-hot assholes, ex-cons, or violent men.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

Arguably, the goal of biologically alpha and beta guys should be the same. Take action towards your goals and become a more actualized version of yourself. Each will have a different mating strategy. IMO, whether you are alpha or beta is biologically determined. I agree that there are a lot of misconceptions about this here, because no one wants to believe that they have inborn limitations, but the reality is that regardless of what your biological archetype is, the actions you need to take to improve your quality of life and become successful are basically the same. The truth is that betas don't want from women what alphas want, and alphas don't want what betas want, so there's no point in trying to be something you're not anyways. There's no point in putting dark triad traits on a pedestal when, as a beta, that kind of behavior wouldn't bring you what you desire, i.e. an LTR with a stable girlfriend. IMO beta pinnacle is someone like Dan Bilzerian. He's definitely following the provider archetype, but by virtue of the abundance he has manufactured, he can keep himself from the beta pitfalls of over-attachment and being exploited by women.

The flaw inherent in being beta, i.e. trying to use socially currency and value to leverage women, is ultimately also the potential freedom of the beta. By ascending to the pinnacle of social value, he gains the leverage he needs. In other words, the weakness of each archetype is its strength. The obstacle is the path.

[–]trtanon0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

> IMO, whether you are alpha or beta is biologically determined.

Alpha just means to have sexual abundance on-demand. All these definitions are stupid. Pickup taught us the very defined behaviors necessary to become sexually successful. You can learn them from a single book.

I'd agree that taking action may be biologically determined though. Plenty of guys in this sub know all the theory and would be superstars in the field if not for the fact they play video games all day.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Alpha is a really broad term and lots of people use it differently, so I'm not trying to say that anyone's definition is wrong or right. In the context of what I was discussing above though, I used Alpha to refer to a specific personality archetype that is biologically determined. Just like some people are tall and some are short, some are alpha and some are beta. Both personality archetypes have different needs and desires, and both have different mating strategies.

means to have sexual abundance on-demand.

This is certainly available to both archetypes, so its not like your biology will limit you in achieving this if you want. I disagree that having sexual abundance on demand will make you biologically more alpha or beta though, just like playing basketball well won't make you taller.

[–]trtanon0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Any man can have any type of mating strategy. That's not biologically determined. No clue what you mean by archetypes in this context. Sounds like astrology.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yea its hard to find the right words to express what I mean. I just view some people as alpha naturally and some people as beta naturally, based on their hormone levels and inclinations.

[–]SKRedPill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

What in the world are you talkin' about?

[–]TheReformist94-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

At least they get are invisible.

[–]1redhawkes93 points94 points  (20 children) | Copy

The golden rule is just another form of covert contract, that's why it fails.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon99 points100 points  (17 children) | Copy

It fails because men are told to give and women are told to take.

The golden rule works with men dealing with other men (if you're careful who you apply it to). Women however exploit it by simply taking. Men give and are grateful for her company, women take and are never satisfied. The cleverer ones pretend they are entering into a fair and equitable contract and thus get an easy life or a profitable divorce - they win either way and the man pays either way. Men are told to do this, repeatedly, and then blamed (you should have seen this coming) when it fails. Then are told to do it all over gain, because somehow this is "the right thing to do".

[–]Kindredvodka36 points37 points  (13 children) | Copy

Its so strange to notice how men treat other men, most of the time, with a certain code of honor or sense of duty because they expect the other men to treat them the same because every man still has that hardwiring. Hardwiring in the sense staring a man down will most probably get you fucked up, its a challenge. Men assume most men follow a code of unspoken honor and being noble because its the right thing to do, a man has his words and his actions as his definition of his core and going against what you represented causes irreparable damage to your reputation. I think most men fail because you are 100 percent right, they apply this thinking to women, that they won't cheat or lead on because it would damage their honor and cause them guilt, instead the hamster in women kicks into overdrive and rationalizes any remorse or guilt away. Of course not all men follow this mantra.

The way I see it, it makes sense in why swallowing the pill is so bitter to so many men, because how can they think and do these things with no remorse it seems? Such wanton callousness? When in reality those rules never applied in the first place.

[–]Endorsed ContributorKeffirLime17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

Those were the men of old. The rise of the "strong, independant woman" is in tandem with the shunning and shaming of masculine traits that goes on in today's climate.

Even men are starting to hold eachother to a feminine standard.

Women, however, still crave the masculine man you speak of. The honorable(not to her), built, take no shit badass. The man the modern media tells you not to be. It's engranied in her biology to get the tingles when she comes into contact with him.

[–]SKRedPill12 points13 points  (1 child) | Copy

Masculine trust was an essential survival tool - that's why men have honored trust. The feminine really doesn't have as much of it at all - that's only reserved for her kids.

Check out the differences between male and female friendships.

[–]Guardian_of_Justice1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

The way I see it, it makes sense in why swallowing the pill is so bitter to so many men, because how can they think and do these things with no remorse it seems? Such wanton callousness? When in reality those rules never applied in the first place.

What a brilliant statement reflecting many men's thoughts. I learn from The Pill every day. Every new popular post has something that i learn. Wisdom of the ages, wisdom of the enlightened ones sinks in me and i radiate it back, ever brighter and ever harder, ready to fill womens holes with my godly seed.

[–]untonyto1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your username is congruent with the highfalutin ideals of the earlier parts of your statement but you did get exceedingly carried away towards the end to great comic effect

[–]PessimisticMushroom0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

For me I will still be honourable and a decent person, but with this extra redpill knowledge. I won't become a dick or Fuck girls over or any of those sorts of things, ya know.

[–]1empatheticapathetic9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

Look back at this comment in a year or two and laugh.

[–]PessimisticMushroom3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

It's worked for me. I don't buy girls drinks at bars or worship them. None of that sjw stuff I just treat them like people. Redpill has definitely opened my eyes to a lot of things. The same way I wouldn't change myself for a girl, I will use this knowledge but not loose "myself" in the process.

[–]untonyto0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Your fear of other people's subjective negative judgments is the handle that will steer you into servitude. But experience will allow you to test your values and own them for yourself. Resume red pill dosage.

[–]PessimisticMushroom1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I believe you are somewhat correct in your theory, that I am scared of being judged negatively by others. I also believe some of it is, my own idea of morals and fairness. I don't like cheaters, uneven playing fields, people who don't keep their word...etc.

Thanks for the reply. With experience I will adapt and can only get better!

[–]Pictoru5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Men give and are grateful for her company, women take and are never satisfied.

If I were to ever boil down the difference between men and women as a general attitude towards life, this would be it.

This eternal lack of satisfaction is my biggest gripe. And i would clearly distinguish it from 'ambitions', cause those you've got to accomplish yourself...whereas being 'satisfied' (at least in this context) implies a third party that will accomplish that for/with you.

[–]averis10 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This eternal lack of satisfaction is my biggest gripe. And i would clearly distinguish it from 'ambitions', cause those you've got to accomplish yourself...whereas being 'satisfied' implies a third party that will accomplish that for/with you.

I agree 100%. Why do you think that is?

It's such a passive, cowardly attitude.. waiting on someone to do something amazing FOR you, instead of doing it yourself.

[–]alias_guy881 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

No more mr nice guy reference. Liking this

[–]SKRedPill36 points37 points  (1 child) | Copy

Women treat men like men treat jobs.

[–]TheTrenTrannyTrain9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women love men opportunistically; they love what men can do for them.

[–]headbangerJd14 points15 points  (3 children) | Copy

A bit off topic, but where would one find one of these $50/hr shit wage jobs? I'm currently working on RN prereqs to get out of retail.

[–]bl_12 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

50 an hour is far from a shit wage -- OP is pretty delusional in that regard.

[–]blkMGTOW071 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I was thinking the same thing. I'd take 50/HR over the 21/HR I'm making now anyway of the week. That comment made his argument look slightly weaker. As much as I agree that pursuing to become job free is the ultimate freedom, $50/HR is still really good money.

[–]jetspeed_7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Depends on the location in which you live. 50$ an hour might be great in the Midwest but it’s terrible in San Fran. As far as the job hunt try contacting your local library to explore career options/find somebody who helps adults get jobs, google what the top employer is in your region and see if you are qualified to work for them or want to, network with peers.

[–]Nega-Chin27 points28 points  (43 children) | Copy

Why do so many women saddle up with rich betabucks cash cows then? Simran Pradeep Gupta giving a shit job offer is the equivalent of treating you okay. If he offered you a 1 million dollar salary to sit around looking nice 20 hours a week you might be more receptive.

Women can be bought, which is the sad truth. If you want to keep one around that is a SMV worth anything, you better be ready to be betabucks otherwise they'll find someone who is.

Of course there are exceptions to the rule. But I think anyone who is redpilled has a disadvantage playing the long game

[–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours72 points73 points  (33 children) | Copy

Yeah, fuck that. I'm old, not wealthy, not tall, but apparently good looking and I'm thick with muscle mass. I'm not going to be bucks for anyone, that's obvious by the way I dress and to some extent what I drive. Even if it's an old muscle car worth $30k+, you don't have to be week off to have one in decent shape, you simply build it like I did.

Now the way I act and look tells girls that I'm not anything long term, I'm the fun, get fucked by a silver back gorilla, and go on adventures that soy boys can't even contemplate, option. I'm almost 50, but you'd never know it by the way I act, speak, and move. I'm accomplished, capable, and everything about my body language says "I'm the baddest mother fucker in the valley" because I've been through hell already. More than once.

That is the man you want to be when you're 50. You don't get girls looking at you like an open ATM, they look at you like a steak and they've only eaten shriveled peas for months. You don't have to be rich, tall, flashy, or a peacock. You do have to be an unrepentant and overwhelmingly masculine man. You will not get there by coding. You get there by doing shit others fear doing. Not by making the peace, but by being the man who ends conflict like the alpha gorilla does, by crushing it.

If you think having money will get girls, you're doing it wrong. Very fucking wrong. You get girls to hit on you in public like I do by being a man who is sociable, but has shit to do so girls are far down the list of priorities. Sounds like girls are high on your list. Fuck that.

[–]ApexmanRP7 points8 points  (4 children) | Copy

"I'm almost 50, but you'd never know it by the way I act, speak, and move."

I am with you on this one. I am 49, not a beast but 6'1 200lbs and low body fat.

One of the things the younger guys need to disabuse themselves of, is this idea that after 40 they are fucked. Nothing could be further from the truth.

[–]rationalityiskey0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

I have but one question: Aside from muscles, is it possible for males past 25 to physically grow? In terms of height, dick size, etc.

[–]ApexmanRP1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy


Yes, it is totally possible. Not so much height, but certainly dick size.

I now have an 18 inch dick. It just keeps growing. Do you wanna see it?

[–]rationalityiskey0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

What's the growth rate per year and how dare you lie to a kid

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (7 children) | Copy

be an unrepentant and overwhelmingly masculine man

Take it from an even older man than that. Want women to hit on you in public and follow you around like puppy dogs? Want women to smile at you so widely they look like a clown? Want women to do double takes when they see you coming? Do the above.

[–]Older_Miggy0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

I need a couple examples of what he's referring to in the last 2 paragraphs. I have no clue, and am also older than him.

[–]pineapple_wizard245 points6 points  (4 children) | Copy

I'm curious what car do you drive. Old charger? Camaro?

[–]drpeppersucks3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

This man is absolutely correct. I am nearly 50 myself and have been pulling in younger, more beautiful women than ever by doing the above.

[–]Swelfie 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

50's are prime male years. Most of your biggest Hollywood male sex symbols are in their 50's. Chicks dig a man with the cock sure attitude of a 20 year old but who actually knows what the fuck he's doing because he's been around the block.

Picking up chicks at 20 is convincing them you are interesting. At 50, you ARE interesting. The chicks pick themselves up. You just have to beat off the swarm of desperate 40+ divorcees trying to get in your bed to give the younger ones a chance.

[–]nhlfod212 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

At 53, I slept with a 26 yo co-worker on my last business trip. It can happen. I just followed TRP principles and it was shockingly easy. I started lifting in November. Shit works.

[–]EumenesOfEfa0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

What kind of things do you do then for a living? and for fun?

[–]seducter0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hey man this is an awesome post. Can you provide any more input on how to dress like you are the alpha.

[–]futianze0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

What type of stuff would you say falls under the "You get there by doing shit others fear doing" ? Curious as an early 20s lad.

[–]nhlfod212 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

At 53, I don't even know where to begin. At 30 I couldn't believe I was so dumb in my 20s. At 40 I couldn't believe I was so dumb in my 30s. At 50 I can't believe that I was so dumb most of my life. You get the idea. We men just get better over time.

To give an example, I was 40(?) before I asked a girl if she would like to be handcuffed to the bed or if she would tickle my balls as I get close to coming. (Not the same session, obviously). Now I always ask. Girls like when you say what you want. It gives them purpose.

[–]nhlfod210 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The fact that you even ask puts you ahead of your 20-something friends.!

[–]BewareTheOldMan-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

This guy "gets it."

[–]Codrean 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

How can I be an overly masculine man exactly? Besides muh lifting?

[–]CSEtheDeusExMachina 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

stop talking like a child. "muh lifting?" mockery is for the weak.

[–]Avesatanie6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

in this context, mr. Gupta offering 1000000 for 20 h/week to a woman will result in the woman starting to do side jobs because the nice one is not rewarding and there is no "chemistry" and is mr. Gupta fault. When mr. Gupta discovers this, she will be fired, but not without half of the company as liquidation.

[–]Nega-Chin-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

LMAO good point, but I'm sure Guptabux is fine with that. It is hard to win against the cucks, because they have no shame or embarrassment about being cucked. It should be easy to be redpilled and lock a great woman down for life, because let's face it, at least a few people on this sub will eventually want to fulfill their biological imperative. Unfortunately in today's times, while not certainly not always, it is becoming increasingly fall in line with the cucks or suffer.

[–]AshyLarry273 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

For some reason you equate Beta Bux = ALWAYS your turn. TRP is not a disadvantage, it is nothing more then a pair of glasses that allows you to see the real world.

You think there is long game in Beta Bux book of poon? Go ahead then. Be Beta Bux. Don't get mad when you open the door to the bedroom one day and see me and your purchase together as I gather my clothes for the exit to avoid the inevitable anger blow up of how this incident is still somehow completely all your fault. This type of long game is as long as until she's so bored of you, then she will just take the rest of the money she needs from you in court.

[–]untonyto1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

not a very long long game then huh

[–]newName5434560 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Why do so many women saddle up with rich betabucks cash cows then?

And then cheat on them with Chads...

[–]TrustTheGrind0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good thing I'm not interested in the long game!

[–]ApexmanRP0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

"But I think anyone who is redpilled has a disadvantage playing the long game"

The game is the game, whether you want to be armed (RP) or not (BP) its still the same game, you had better get used to that idea.

Women will saddle a beta because she wants resources and the only men who negotiate with resources are betas. Women can be bought, but it won't last, her biology will take over at some point.

[–]Nega-Chin1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

It might not be what people want to hear, but I think women's biology draws them to beta providers more than we'd like to admit. There is the reason society idolizes the image of a family man who is willing to work hard and do anything for his wife and kids. Do I agree with it, hell no. I don't want to sell my soul out to enter a LTR. I'd rather just do my own thing for now. But given that OP was talking about courting women, I was just pointing out that courting and BP go hand in hand. You don't court a fuckbuddy, because you don't want to marry a fuckbuddy.

If someone expects to apply TRP to a relationship that they want to be long term, it is either become betabux to some level and hope she doesn't cuck you, or leave her unsatisfied and cucking you for a betabux which is truly horrifying.
Women are becoming increasingly unsatisfied with their status, and won't be satisfied with just a man who only offers his strong frame and sexuality. In this way, I believe men who want a LTR are truly screwed: either submit to the queen of selection who has betas waiting on her hand and feet ready to replace you, or stay strong and risk never fulfilling your biological imperative.

The game is definitely the game, I agree, but when an extremely vocal portion of both sexes are trying to change the rules, they will eventually succeed. Society is pushing for a more subdued, tame, gentle male who is willing to step aside and leave his partner in control. While I will stand by TRP in most ways, I believe that it is naive to think a RP mindset is a magic fixall for dealing with the modern woman.
I could very well be wrong and just a bit pessimistic. I really hope that everyone else is right, and TRP works for the long game as well. While I don't want to play the long game, it is still very important for society. If nobody settled down, we'd be fucked. But at the same time, I don't want betas being the father figures of future generations.

TL;DR, I think courting/the long game is in most cases incompatible with TRP in today's society, and that worries me

[–]ApexmanRP-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

"I think women's biology draws them to beta providers"

No, its their biological need for security and resources. they look around at the best they can get and who is offering resources and its the beta.

But this isn't the same as sexually turned on by an Alpha.

"There is the reason society idolizes the image of a family man who is willing to work hard and do anything for his wife and kids."

Yes, now because it helps to churn out lots of docile betas.

The way through this, in terms of relationships (its still potentially just your turn) is to improve yourself. I go by the "build it and they will come" mantra, to a certain extent. I am quite a good mix of Alpha, I am fit beyond most men half my age and am quite successful.

I am at the moment 1 year into my first LTR for 4 years and she sees me as the Alpha, but I do inject some Beta as well for comfort. But yes, you are right, if some high beta came along and offered her the world, she might take it.. for now..

"Society is pushing for a more subdued, tame, gentle male who is willing to step aside and leave his partner in control."

Don't believe this is what women really want for a minute.

"I don't want betas being the father figures of future generations. "

Too late.

Focus on yourself and have some fun.

[–]develop_rp8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

fifty bucks an hour is a shit wage.

A good wage in Sweden is about $22/h... $50/h is at the brink of CEO-level here.

[–]Dmva100 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

Same with sacrifice and honor, yes, especially 'Honor' when it comes to women.

Honor has no place in a man's life.  It's the number one thing used to manipulate us.  Women do it constantly.  Hell even the fucking army does.  Stupid 'honorable' men eat that shit up.  A man who touts honor as a point of value yo attract the opposite sex knows that what he has between his legs and his ears is already inferior so he has to fabricate a sense of self worth through virtue signalling while seeking confirmation bias.

You know, like Ned Stark.

Bunch of guys get angry at this response, failing to realize that only guys care about honor. Even then, you shouldn't give a fuck what other men think. Honor is simply a feminine social convention disguised as masculinity, and our mothers are the main source of its inception. Honor is an extension of praise; that of which we learned to appreciate from our mothers at our youngest, most influential years.

Men who think Alpha is honorable have only been told so and valued by those women in the epiphany phase who find this non sexual (BB) quality attractive, as they can successfully use it to their advantage.

[–]TRP VanguardWhisper[S] 27 points28 points  (0 children) | Copy

Honour is a hypothetical imperative, not a categorical imperative.

It is useful to be honourable with those who will reciprocate honour. Women will not.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly how many CEOs do you know you can look at and go oh he's so honorable. You look the private-equity guys on Wall Street do you think honorable of them. Nope, but they're also 29 and bringing in 450k a year.

Do what works for you, fuck everything else.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (1 child) | Copy

DO you live by any codex, you do know that honour is the feeling you get when you complete your duty (raising your family, being a positive force), if you are looking to achieve the feeling of Honour from women you have fucked up realllll bad.

[–]Satisfaction-3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

In short, focus on yourself, your career, your lifestyle, and once those things are at least somewhat in place, women will take notice.


[–]1sezamus3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Real life example: I had a in-field military training last month. A new, hot girl joined my team. Many guys from the whole company were jumping around her without much luck. She is a very strong and disciplined personality (hits the gym more than me). Anyways, I was focused on doing my stuff, but also helping her and some other newcomers with typicall issues like blisters, diarrhea, equpiment tips, etc. As a more experienced soldier I was just much better prepared, knowing, that other people will need my help as always.

The days went by and she was starting conversations, talking about music. I was keeping cool, not counting on anything and not giving much attention. I was just thinking she just want to be around someone who is not akwardly thirsty. We got back home and she started texting me oftenly. "Oh, she is trying to make me a move... adorable." - I thought. We started dating and today she apologised for not returning my text back, good girl.

While we were talking, she told me about other guys' akward attempts and how they were constantly writing and looked desperate. And me? I did nothing... well I told her I like drum'n'bass once. Oh, and I have the second biggest arms in the company (the first guy is going to SF).

Lessons learned? Keep cool and lift.

[–]wannabethinker 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

If you're in the top percentile of literature graduates, you will not be desperate for a "job", opportunities will come your way. For that matter it doesn't matter if what you're studying is literature, but that whatever the fuck it is that you're doing, as long as you're in the top percentile, the struggle will be relatively easier.

[–]A_confusedlover0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Preach. There are extremely successful people in extremely obscure fields.

[–]Endorsed Contributorredpillcad2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I know a guy (wink) who got caught in a marital affair. He didn't deny it. He apologized for hurting his wife but kept frame and was open to therapy and trying to fix things or separation. Said either would work out great.

Wife fucked him like a porn star for months

[–]CSEtheDeusExMachina 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

that's called hysterical bonding. It comes from a place of pain, not devotion. I think that instinctively, the woman is turned on by 1) the sudden realization that her man and his mistress are above her, and 2) she is at real risk of losing her security blanket, so she desperately clings to it.

I got caught cheating more than once. I held my frame. I did not grovel and beg for forgiveness. I told her that cheating is a symptom of a broken marriage, not the cause. I told her what things needed to change from both of us. My wife fucked me like a champ for a while too, and I did so many of the dirty things to her that I had been doing to the hot little 20-somethings.

Holding frame here means that if she wants the marriage to work, she's going to conform to the type of partner I want - devoted, loving affectionate, prioritizing my happiness. Unfortunately, that is not the woman I married. She signed up for locking down a devoted pitiful little man who scurries around to please her, which is exactly who her dad is.

I am now about to get divorced. Are you telling me that for 25% of my money paid in child support, I get to spend the other 75% on myself? Holy shit, what a deal. I will probably end up paying out more than 25% voluntarily because I still have a lot of devotion to my two daughters, the only women I will ever be truly devoted to.

[–]Endorsed Contributorredpillcad0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Did she try and fail to be the woman you want?

[–]h0tB0xing3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I graduated in CSE and these Patels won't fuck off.

[–]TheTrenTrannyTrain3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women instinctively know that a man's devotion is worthless, because it automatically puts him beneath her. That's why boomerang game works, because an Alpha displaying a hint of beta quality will always be more genuine than a Beta displaying a hint of alpha quality; women will always want to win the devotion of an Alpha.

[–]Morningsun921 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can’t agree more. I’ve had way more success being indifferent and casual in new relationships than when I was clingy and always available. I thought growing up that if you do everything you can for someone, they’d appreciate it and be receptive. It’s so annoying that I wasted so much time on fruitless endeavors with crushes that went nowhere and strung me along. I’m glad I learned the hard way that extra invested time doesn’t = better rewards.

[–]dragondoot3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't normally comment here but this is the best advice I've seen and I wholeheartedly concur

[–]SpiritualPride1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Extreme alpha levels detected! [SMV+5]

[–]OskarDarkness0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

50 bucks an hour is a shit wage? Damn.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Great post. Would love to see some kind of follow up about what it means to be awesome and how to properly show it!

[–]Dark_Lord_A0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is off topic, but I work at the supreme court of my country, and $50 an hour for five days a week nets you 4 times my pay every two weeks.

[–]redpilledcuck0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

fifty bucks an hour is a shit wage

$126,000 a year is a shit wage?

[–]Bshenron0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Like the saying goes, show don't tell.

[–]primatepicasso0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Im devoted in improving my self every single day though

[–]dialecticwizard0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hahahahaha. Fuck man. You have a vivid imagination. BUT. WTF is awesome in your universe?

[–]TheStumblingWolf0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

So far I still kind of apply the golden rule. Because that's who I am at the moment. I don't expect to gain anything from it. One important thing TRP has taught me though is that the rule cannot be applied if it would be at my expense.

In my most beta days I didn't even apply the golden rule. I did everything for other people's needs, subconsciously thinking they'd like me more.

Whether I'll abandon the golden rule in the future we'll see. I'm open to it if experience shows it would make sense.

[–]Swelfie 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

I like to paraphrase Jesus when he coined 'the golden rule' in context. He was asked point blank, if the entire old testimate with all its rules is now moot, what are the new rules in this new philosophy you are spouting? To which he replied that it's simple. There are only two rules. Love God and stop being such a fucking was home. This is the whole of the law.

[–]Incel98760 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

He was asked point blank, if the entire old testimate with all its rules is now moot, what are the new rules in this new philosophy you are spouting? To which he replied that it's simple. There are only two rules. Love God and stop being such a fucking asshole. This is the whole of the law.

Don't confuse a summary of the whole Law with "the whole Law," clearly not how Christ Himself meant it nor His Apostles interpreted and applied it. Thus, commandments against abortion, sodomy, bestiality, incest, adultery, etc, were seen as fully operational, and therefore no New Testament passages saying "God is love, all sex/love is love, and being anti-love [sodomy, etc] is hate," but rather warning not to be deceived by such.

[–]Fedoteh0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Men who court women by telling them how devoted they are making this same mistake... men's devotion is worthless, because girls have been swimming in a sea of constant male attention, love, and devotion since they were old enough to recognize emotions in other people.

Damn, boy. This is fucking true. I mean, high value is often assigned to scarse things, like diamonds. If there's something that women has, is devotion. How could they possible value it? This is great thinking, right there

[–]kylerosa21-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

First 2 paragraphs were brilliant. Well done bro

[–]Kobe_curry24-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

Great thread it sucks because the golden rule much similar to golden means applied by Socrates it what’s right for you isn’t right for some one else . Most are looking for that perfect place and time and it doesn’t exist ,Almost do to them as they do to you . But imagine a school or a parent telling you this? How unwise we are

[–]OilyB-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

Jeses, thanks for the discernment of 'honor' and 'bad ass'. Both are impressive traits in men, but only one gets the girl.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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