Real talk?

lalicat · 2013-12-24T11:56:16+00:00

I hate this double standard. My dad went to prison when I was very young and I was raised by my mother while he was in prison. We were dirt poor and I spent most of my youth in homeless women's shelters. Eventually when I was 11 years old I stood up to my mom's new abusive boyfriend and was beaten severely. My dad was released from prison and I ran away to live with him. We were dirt poor once again because he was a felon. He had made some contacts in prison who dealt in real estate. He kept in touch and gambled everything on a business venture when I was in 9th grade. I was always being picked on for not having new clothes and couldn't identify with anyone because I didn't have any video game systems or anything the other children had. I lived off of top ramen and packaged meals as it was all we could afford. My dad's real estate business took off like a rocket and by 1999 we had gone from dirt poor to millions in a period of 3 months. It happened so quick, my dad came home drunk one night and happier than I'd ever seen him. He had stopped to buy groceries and he cooked me a full meal with steak and eggs and was so giddy. He told me we'd finally made it and we were moving out of this shit hole next week. Don't bother packing anything we're getting all new stuff. I couldn't believe it.

When I tell people that no matter how poor you were raised you can still make it they tell me it's because I'm white, because I'm a male .. because society gave me a leg up and a black man would never have that chance ... it's bullshit I saw my dad go to work every morning and save money, we had nothing for Christmas, nothing for birthdays ... he worked like a dog to pay off this massive loan he'd taken out to invest in his real estate startup and when it finally paid off we made it. My dad isn't even white, he's half Italian half Palestinian and darker than most Mexicans. I look white so people assume he is too .. it's like nothing we achieved means anything because 'privilege' ... fuck that.

dakru · 2013-12-24T05:45:13+00:00

The problem is that a clean, easy, black-and-white analysis of a problem like sexism or racism where you can identify a villain (men! white people!) and a victim (women! black people!) has a ton of appeal to people. This is awful not just because it's usually inaccurate as an analysis, but also because it colours your perception of everything you see. Everything has to fit into your black-and-white schema of "these people are victims, and those people are villains". You see someone in the "villains" group doing something bad? "Ah, this is exactly what I was talking about!". You see someone in the "victims" group doing something bad? "Well that's, uh, that's different because, well, it's just different". It doesn't matter if the bad thing they did was the exact same thing, "it's different" because it doesn't fit into your narrow analysis (in this case the narrow analysis that sexism is something that men do to women).

stemgang · 2013-12-24T09:46:51+00:00

Because the law has established 'protected classes,' and it is a crime to hurt their feelings. However you are in an unprotected class, so there are less consequences for targeting you.

VortexCortex · 2013-12-24T09:40:44+00:00

Well, I'm not saying the offended caused the offensive words, but we could teach people how to reduce their chances being offended as a preventative measure.

Teach folks not to give a fuck.

kencabbit · 2013-12-24T17:20:27+00:00

This is somewhat simplistic, I think. Sometimes people cry sexism and racism when it's just a plain old insult. But sometimes there really is racism or sexism behind it. Telling a black person they are worthless isn't necessarily racist.

Telling a black person they are worthless based on your own prejudices against their skin colour and ethnicity, or referring to black people in general as worthless. Obviously that would be racism. I'm sure the author knows this and isn't intending to deny it. But the way this is presented makes it really easy to think otherwise.

The sexism example is more on point, I feel. I say that because people will claim it's a joke and not sexism, even if the girl is referring to all men when she says "you boys are stupid." There's a much clearer double standard in this scenario.

AlphaWookie · 2013-12-24T08:51:23+00:00

If we do that my tax dollars might be used to fix real problems. Then what will the professional gievance industy do?

einexile · 2013-12-24T09:58:12+00:00

What gets me is that they fret so hard about someone they don't know potentially having an anxiety attack; but they are perfectly okay with attempting outright to cause breakdowns in people they do know, often for what they're fully aware was a lapse of judgment or simple ignorance.

MrMudcrab · 2013-12-24T16:31:47+00:00

I just really hate double standards no matter the situation..

OldZippo · 2013-12-24T19:34:15+00:00

It depends on the context.

If the white person is calling the black person (or vice versa) worthless because they believe they are innately worthless because of their race, it's racist.

Same goes for the gender thing. It's sexist if you believe that the entire sex is innately stupid because of the bits they were born with.

ILoveHate · 2013-12-24T06:37:12+00:00

Obviously the "patriarchy" is feeling the pressure and wants us all to go back to the "good old days". Keep fighting the good fight feminists! This is proof that we're winning! /s

Hurikane211 · 2013-12-24T09:41:13+00:00

The realist of talk.

Reddit1990 · 2013-12-24T18:52:46+00:00

Well, the label that gets applied has to do with intentions and preconceived notions.. but I do get your point. Its situational and sometimes a person isn't sexist for calling a woman stupid, etc.

2013-12-24T19:09:33+00:00

I think the first one is useless without context. I could tell someone black that they're worthless, or I could tell someone black they're worthless because they're black. Racism and sexism are both motive-relevant ideas

Sugarspy · 2013-12-24T20:04:03+00:00

I have a friend that loves to talk about women's rights, gay rights, etc etc, but doesn't realize at all when he's being rude to his friends. Like, saying that we should be more accepting of others a sentence before saying that my opinion on a topic is wrong and I should recant. He was super abused when he was a kid, so I try to be nice, but it's fucking hard when he's being belligerent.

So I totally sympathize with the above comic. I really just want everyone to treat people, as individuals, with love and respect.

Highspeed_Lowdrag · 2013-12-24T21:02:38+00:00

Blame the patriarchy

August-West · 2013-12-24T21:50:52+00:00

A black guy can be as useless as a white guy. It's only racist if hes saying he is racist because hes black.

TheEthicalMan · 2013-12-24T21:59:39+00:00

The solution isn't to toss out considerations of racism and sexism. The solution is to not be racist and not be sexist, and to call it out when it occurs, in whatever direction.

I_Am_Okonkwo · 2013-12-24T22:38:54+00:00

This is our agenda in one image

RoyalKai · 2013-12-25T00:15:13+00:00

I've actually been trying to get to the bottom of this for awhile now.

Turns out we've all been talking about two different things.

The real meaning of racism is to think or act against another person because of their race. Sexism is the same because of their sex.

But that's not what the "OMG dat's racist/sexist/homophobic/islamaphobic/anti-whatever" crowd is referring to. What they are really getting at is the majority vs the minority. But even that goes a little bit deeper because its not purely about numbers in any given location. What really bothers them is the group of people that control the status quo.

They feel that because this group can determine among themselves what is normal and what is expected, other cultures, genders, beliefs, etc are forced to either assimilate or be ostracized. This is the mentality that leads to the discomfort they feel when they observe a negative remark from the 'controlling' group to the 'subordinate' group.

Now whether you like it or not, if you're in that group (say a white male) you receive the benefits of being in that group even if you disagree. And therefore should volunteer to step back and allow the less privileged groups to take the opportunities that wouldn't have been available to them if you took them.

Obviously this mentality is wrong. But it's important to understand where they are coming from if we hope to advance this conversation any further than "You're racist!"; "No, YOU'RE racist!!!!"

McSwaghetti · 2013-12-26T08:57:54+00:00

Thank you for posting this the 100th time

Twitcher77 · 2013-12-27T01:26:41+00:00

If race, gender, religion, or sexuality is a factor in determining the worth of a human being, you are a bigot. If race, gender, religion, or sexuality is a factor in determining the worth of someone’s opinion, you are a bigot and a moron.

Hmwcompton · 2014-01-07T05:42:31+00:00

I would for a second like to point out that, the top part isn't racist unless the person calling the other man worthless is because of the fact that he is black which is not indicated by the comic making it simply not racism.

LuciferRatcliffe · 2013-12-24T19:39:41+00:00

Obama has made it his job to divide the country. When he said "change" he meant it

tsunade202 · 2013-12-24T23:29:38+00:00

america is inherently and systemically racist. if you cannot admit that to yourself. then i have no words for you

More white people use drugs but Black people are sent to jail for drugs at 10 times the rate that white people are

Black people receive much harsher sentencing than white people for the same crimes

White people literally can not associate positive words with Black faces because of racism

The Silent Genocide - Facts about the Deepening Plight of Black Men in America

Saudi student is literally surrounded by FBI for cooking rice under terrorist suspicions

Defualt · 2013-12-24T23:00:28+00:00

Or maybe stop being worthless and stupid whatever your identity

kinyutaka · 2013-12-24T19:39:41+00:00

Obama has made it his job to divide the country. When he said "change" he meant it

cri_nge · 2013-12-24T14:25:55+00:00

[permanently deleted]

joedude · 2013-12-24T18:44:37+00:00

cringe

huisme · 2013-12-24T15:02:17+00:00

Annnnnnd unsubscribe

andreasvastolorde · 2013-12-25T00:53:49+00:00

Agreed. But the reason bring that sort of thing up isn't because they don't understand that it's to point out someone's privilege to them. Silly thing, I know.

CosmicKeys · 2013-12-24T09:38:40+00:00

If you think comparing men to whites is a good idea, you've already swallowed a bad frame hook line and sinker.

harryballsagna · 2013-12-24T13:13:40+00:00

The fact that you even own the software to make this shows your privilege. I can't even....

EDIT: Really? You need a sarcasm tag for something this obvious?

tsunade202 · 2013-12-24T10:15:19+00:00

now tell me what was the constant in every hypothetical situation? they were all white males. white males are the dominant standard in western societies. a man obviously has it better society obviously when it comes to job opportunities and such and you are white which gives you privileges a person of any other color does not have.

so when a person that has both of these privileges chooses to say something to a black person or a women that can be considered insensitive or demeaning even when it may not be racially motivated. It will be perceived as such because it comes from a person in a position of privilege. that's all that matters. if it comes from a person who is perceived to be as "dominant" you are just susceptible of more backlashes and rightly so imo.

you have better chances of success than other people. so you gotta understand the privilege white males have compared to everybody else and then decide from an objective empathic level if you are being insensitive and maybe unfair . This is coming from a black guy who frequents this sub a lot.

Lolworth · 2013-12-24T16:16:34+00:00

+fedoratip 100.00 fedoras

Merry Christmas!

xXxCREECHERxXx · 2013-12-25T02:10:09+00:00

Black men and women are equally worthless. ;)

notimeforname · 2013-12-24T14:36:35+00:00

If you have to argue about it being sexist/racist than its not. Sexism and racism are the most obvious things in the world.

Title	Real talk?
Author	C0ltFury
Upvotes	1454
Comments	154
Date	December 24, 2013 5:17 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1tl5ic/real_talk/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/real-talk.1155289 https://theredarchive.com/post/1155289

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