standards don’t matter

wtknight · 2024-01-31T13:10:12+00:00

Removed. No non-neutral Discussion posts.

MikeArrow · 2024-01-31T05:21:31+00:00

I don't shame people, but it is depressing to always feel not good enough.

That before I do or say anything, I'm not even in consideration to be on the team, much less actively in the ballgame.

OtPayOkerSmay · 2024-01-31T05:24:05+00:00

I don't really care if a person has standards. What irks me is when a person with unrealistic standards expects sympathy when things don't pan out for them, and this goes for men and women.

SeveralAcorns · 2024-01-31T08:53:25+00:00

You don't understand the purpose of shaming people. It's to change behavior, when it deviates from societal norms. If your preferences for partners go against the norms, you will be shamed. If the way you articulate your preferences go against the norms, you will be shamed. All in an effort to get you back into the line.

caption291 · 2024-01-31T05:58:40+00:00

but if they are able to make it work for themselves why get mad at women for not liking you ??

Why get mad at men for not liking your standards? do you think shaming them will work to change their behavior?

Academic-Map3827 · 2024-01-31T10:10:30+00:00

Men aren't that mad at women having standards that those men don't meet (taller, richer etc). It makes men feel bad about themselves, but not really mad at the women.

Men are more mad at women when women complain how they can't find a man with standards that the men do meet (nice, loyal, patient etc) but they feel invisible to the women.

ZeeMark17 · 2024-01-31T05:33:45+00:00

This started out as a neutral discussion and then became a "hey men, why are you mad at women" at the end.

Anyways,

1 person having high standards, no problem. 10 people having high standards, no problem. The majority of the people you are attracted to having high standards becomes your problem as you will be alone along with them.

If your post history is true regarding your life, do you not think the standards contribute to how you feel? Meaning they do matter.

pop442 · 2024-01-31T06:02:39+00:00

What's ironic is that it was originally women, especially POC women, tall women, older women, fat women, single moms, and trans women who made the biggest deal about men's shallowness or beauty standards affecting their dating lives to begin with on social media.

It wasn't until some men flipped it around to be about them that it started to get considered toxic or a form of "entitlement."

That said, I do agree that nobody's entitled to fitting everyone's standards and that's basically impossible anyway. It's just that there's often a double standard that permits women to complain about standards more than men.

Safinated · 2024-01-31T06:07:36+00:00

They do to the people who have them

boom-wham-slam · 2024-01-31T07:15:04+00:00

Ironically everyone has the lowest standards these days of any time ever. Men don't even care if their gf is a slut. Women don't even care if the man can financially provide for himself let alone her or kids. The standards are so low.

shockingly_bored · 2024-01-31T07:38:54+00:00

I wouldn't say it's shaming to point out that what peoples standards can't be don't match their actions, or match their reasoning, or are inconsistent, or are shallow. That's still fine, but if they were aware of that they may realise some of what they say is rubbish. Like women claiming that physical attractiveness doesn't matter to them.

WilliamWyattD · 2024-01-31T08:36:30+00:00

I shame people for having no idea about their actual chances of landing someone who meets their standards. This is just general stupid person shaming, though.

But I don't make the mistake many men do of thinking that women with unrealistic assessments of their chances will just lower those standards if they come to realize how little chance they have of landing such a man. No. Many would just opt out then. Fuck up when and if needed, and otherwise enjoy single life.

Too many men assume women have bought into the paradigm that we need a high heterosexual pairing level, and thus that women should pair with a realistic option. I think modern women feel that women in general have just recently been freed, and all traditional wisdom about these things is suspect. Open question to them as to whether they ever need a relationship.

YetAnotherCommenter · 2024-01-31T08:59:54+00:00

I agree but this discussion really is fundamentally unproductive.

People ALWAYS complain when their objects-of-desire don't desire them. It isn't a sexed/gendered issue.

And shaming won't work.

Not to mention, a lot of the online bitching is done between men (about women) and between women (about men), so this shouldn't be a "battle of the sexes" thing.

But we should let people vent. If they are sad they fail to measure up to the standards of their objects-of-attraction, why can't they have spaces for commiseration, condolence and comfort? People need to vent, they need to get things off their chest, they need to cry, and need interpersonal support.

GojosLowerHalf2 · 2024-01-31T09:04:11+00:00

You can have a type as long as you don't talk shit or make assumptions about people who aren't your type

DarayRaven · 2024-01-31T05:25:28+00:00

I know what l want, and that is this

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cn0lBuYrdmU/

AceOfSpadesGymBro5 · 2024-01-31T05:49:54+00:00

High standards are not the reason women aren't attracted to you. It's because you have bought into the story that you need to earn sex and love through performing or being a good worker bee, which reinforces the idea that you are somehow below women. Because most men behave in a way that reinforces this belief, women who are primarily attracted to high status's automatically assume that the man is lower status than her and therefore of no interest. A man doesn't need to be tall, bearded, socially popular, etc. in order to be high status. He just needs to actually see himself as an equal or even higher status than the woman. How he feels about himself is the only true measure of his status.

Why is that the case? Across cultures you won't be able to find the criteria for what constitutes high status socially. In the West it may be the fabled 6' man. In tribes in the Amazon where people may never grow above 5'5", that standard obviously has zero meaning. It is likely that the Amazon tribe may find a white man to look pale and sickly.

A Korean woman may be super attracted to a pretty, feminine K-pop band member, while a guy like that would be laughed at in a Latin, machismo type country.

See, standards and criteria are all relative across cultures because they are all cultural constructs. Even within the US, in the 70s, hairy men with mustaches were considered attractive, in the 80s, men who wore leopard print tights and more make up than your mom were sex symbols. In the 90s it was rappers and so on and so forth. All cultural constructs.

The only thing that is consistent across cultures is that women are attracted to status. And true high status is determined by how a man feels about himself in relation to others and how he behaves out in the real world in relation to others.

ladyindev · 2024-01-31T10:09:31+00:00

Exactly. Unless someone is being an asshole about it, there’s no reason to be angry with them. I think a lot men here and in the manosphere feed into revenge fantasies about who certain kinds of women can get because it makes them feel better. This corner of the internet feels like one giant coping corner. It leads to irrational attempts at mathematically assessing her desirability and who she should dare to show interest in. Life doesn’t work like that. People are really complex and men who have the things at least some women value most (whether looks, height, personality, money, intelligence, what have you) are varied in their own preferences and may have a wider range of what they can accept beyond ideals (as we all should imo). The bitter and sometimes sexist men don’t like that, so they go off about how men shouldn’t be lowering their standards because it messes up the dating pool, which is crazy. Whether people are enjoying casual sex or serious relationships, those are their moments and periods of time together to enjoy. Who angrily goes around telling people not to enjoy their time together in pleasure because they want someone to think they don’t deserve access to the other person? So much bitter entitlement! It also doesn’t make sense to be as jealous as men here are of women because we engage totally differently than men in modern dating. It would be more rational to be jealous and angry toward other men but misogyny/sexism is easier and more acceptable probably. Meh.

As a “pretty but fat” girl, I feel this especially. So many different kinds of guys have been into me irl - I don’t chase them. I don’t think I’ve ever chased a man except once and he rejected me, but he wasn’t nearly as attractive or high status as other guys who have chased me. (I also dodged a bullet - he was broke and I think jealous of me - constantly tried to compete with me) These guys have into me for different reasons. My bf (and future hubby it seems 💕) is similar - handsome but/and overweight, and some people here think he’s still out of my league because he’s in the top 5% of income earners and 6 ft. tall. They don’t know anything else about him but those are the things men are traditionally valued for, so they think he’s out of my league. He feels very differently about me. Ladies, live your life regardless of what any bitter losers online have to say. People half the time are speaking from unaddressed pain, feelings, trauma. Their anger at your standards in life really has nothing to do with you - it says everything about them though.

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Cool_Ranch_2511 · 2024-01-31T06:27:58+00:00

such an original insight!

Mocha636 · 2024-01-31T07:38:14+00:00

Standards don’t matter to me because the standard someone is at won’t make me attracted to them haha

NSFWork69 · 2024-01-31T10:30:20+00:00

Having standards is fine. But you need to be careful about how your choices can affect your perceptions. Ie if you sleep around loads you can set a standard that most men would never reach meaning you will have to settle. And settling might seem a fine thing to do but that one person you do find and that is perfect in every way you won’t love them as much as the one that got away.

NotReallyTired_ · 2024-01-31T11:38:00+00:00

The problem with most people’s standards is that it’s based off of negative experiences meant to place future partners in a test that wasn’t placed on past partners. Also most rules and standards are relative, if someone is placing a bunch of rules and tests on you most likely you’re not attractive.

darkwindhowls · 2024-01-31T12:26:44+00:00

This OP assumes so many premises, ugh...

The anger isn't at women for not liking anyone.

Women are propped up with policies that burn the tax dollars of men. Women are a net negative for society in a tax revenue sense. Men pay for government. All of it.

This inflates their standards. Literally imagine paying to help someone view you as "not good enough."

Women are not punished for very damaging lies they frequently tell, eg paternity fraud aka 18 years of extortion and emotional damage (if discovered). AFAIK no penalty exists for paternity fraud, despite it hovering in the 3-10% range.

The standards women have and enforce mirror all the worst oppressive hierarchies along race and class lines. And they aren't limited to just being enforced in dating (where people like to pretend these prejudices somehow don't exist and instead are preferences that just sprang ex nihilo into their brains). They're enforced socially. "Karen" is just a liberal young white woman making her internal monologue external.

Add to this the phenomenon of pussy osmosis --- whereby women believe their personal standing and status is tied to the best man they've fucked --- and you have a pretty valid basis for annoyance or frustration.

The problem is that women expect to be treated well regardless of their choices or decisions or treatment of others. Try calling a woman out about objectively shitty behavior. See how far that gets you. Lord help you if you are in a group setting. You will be immediately greeted by agents of the system there to make any and every excuse for objectively shitty behavior. Whether it''s ghosting, lying, cheating, abuse, etc.

So when you say "they're able to make it work," I don't know what you mean. Women are less happy now than they were 60 years ago. It's not working. Women who choose to remain single are just choosing to have NSA with some guy they can't lock down.

There's also a big media effort or push or bias or whatever to push being single as "empowering" and most every other dismal status quo status as some species of "fine." When by the metrics of mental health, fertility rate, and happiness --- it is quite clear that none of this is fine.

Standards matter.

Because fundamentally standards cut to the core of who is worthy of being seen as a fully realized human and who is not. Who is worth making it to the next round of human society and who is not.

It's strange that people trivialize things that they don't experience. People who experience near universal rejection from the opposite sex are being told that they're not worth saving for the next round of humanity. Literally the message. And they express frustration and people say "who cares you can't get laid!"

It's such ugliness.

People refuse to believe or accept that but the world is vapid to the point of not even being shallow. It's easy to predict interactions, opinions positive and negative based on a fairly small set of stats attached to each of the participants. No need to hear words, see body language, or any of that.

It'd be fine if these were hierarchies predicated on immutable biological merit or something. They aren't. It's cultural conditioning. Cultural conditioning that is failing to even serve the culture.

So yeah, they matter. A lot.

SeveralAcorns · 2024-01-31T12:46:40+00:00

but if they are able to make it work for themselves why get mad at women for not liking you ??

I am not quite sure how you can argue like this when your situation is the opposite. As far as i understood from your profile,you are a 17yo transwoman who is ugly on top of that, posts on suicide watch and is overall lonely with zero friends and nobody being sexually or romanticallly interested in you. Are you REALLY not mad that people have their standards which work for them, but which result in everyone rejecting you?

waffleznstuff30 · 2024-01-31T13:07:01+00:00

I agree with this.

I think people get so caught up in not meeting stranger online's preferences that they internalize it. Or feel resentful because they are not THAT person's type. So much so they have revenge fantasies of women failing to meet the good men. Or looking at the people with those standards through a critical lens. "What do YOU bring to the table". Are you a 10? And what not. If you know what you are looking for you are going to seek that. Water will find it's level.

Also I think a lot of people confuse preferences with standards. Standards are a lot more broad and like your non-negotiables. Preferences tend to be more nitpicky and can be negotiated. Standards would be like core compatibility things. Like finding someone attractive. Or how you are treated by someone. Preferences are like bonuses.

Title	standards don’t matter
Author	Ok_Repeat_7347
Upvotes	4
Comments	66
Date	January 31, 2024 5:16 AM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1afa29m/standards_dont_matter/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/standards-dont-matter.1244238 https://theredarchive.com/post/1244238

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