Why is there so many "crazy" mother-in-laws? (Let's discuss from the perspective of FDS)

clytemnestra_23 · 2022-01-16T16:30:15+00:00

I come from a conservative patriarchal culture. MILs are known for basically hazing their DILs. You’re right that it’s pickme behavior, but it’s also a toxic assertion of control in a culture that gives women no power/control except over younger women.

LadiesOpinion · 2022-01-16T17:46:02+00:00

In-laws are only ever as crazy as your partner allows them to be.

I have an extremely toxic mother. I protect my partner from being subjected to my mother's crazy, by never introducing them to her. That way, she can never make a scene, be inappropriate, or ruin our evening. She has no power over me or my partner.

Don't subject me to 'meeting the parents' if your parents are a pain in the ass. Don't mix me into a toxic family dynamic. Don't put me in a position where I have to 'be approved' by your family, because you never severed the umbilical cord and their opinion matters most to you.

I will not allow myself to be collateral damage of others' weak boundaries.

melympia · 2022-01-16T16:26:47+00:00

I think that, in their hearts, JustNoMILs (see the respective subreddit for countless stories about evil MILs) are pickmes.

Only with a twist. Okay, less of a twist for some, as quite a few MILs around want to be their baby boy's top priority, whether he's married with half a dozen kids or not. But the others are probably trying to pass on their pickme legacy. Now it's their son's time to have a wife, and wifey needs to take proper care of him, fulfill all the scrote needs she instilled in him (and then some).

I mean, at age 19 or 20, I had my then boyfriend's mother trying to "teach" me just how her widdle boy likes his bread for his lunchbox... Never mind that he always complained that she did it wrong and never even thought of the possibility to prepare his own lunchbox as an option.

Kerrypurple · 2022-01-16T16:53:53+00:00

The opposite treatment can also be a red flag. I got the "thank you for taking this boy off my hands and sorry I didn't raise him better" vibe from my 2 ex MILs. They're both still very sweet to me.

thinktwiceorelse · 2022-01-16T16:42:19+00:00

They are pickmes. But they want to be picked by their sons. Women should unlearn their pickme behavior before having kids.

herbivorouscarnivore · 2022-01-16T22:26:57+00:00

The majority of my relationships have been with HVM. I believe healthy family dynamics lead to a higher probability of raising a HVM, so most of my boyfriend’s mom (and my late husband’s mother) were wonderful people who respected others.

When I think of monsters-in-law, only one comes to mind: the mother of the man who drove home that taking me on elaborate vacations, buying me expensive gifts, owning property, and a high income do not a HVM make! His mom simply wasn’t nice. And that’s putting it mildly. I don’t know where her ego came from, but she looked down on everyone except her kids. She was passive aggressive as f-ck and would either give me the silent treatment for I don’t know what, or have her son tell me about my “shortcomings” weeks after the fact. Said shortcoming included not smiling the way she thought I should, and not being cheerful per her unspecified requirements. She also nitpicked her son-in-law for not being a college graduate, despite the fact that her daughter wasn’t either, AND her son-in-law earned twice as much.

She was full of sh-t, and so are her kids.

pickmieshaexorcist · 2022-01-16T16:41:30+00:00

It’s funny because the old boomer jokes of the horrible mother in law was always about the wife’s mother making things hard for the poor husband, like on Bewitched. The Flintstone’s had jokes about Wilma’s mom. IRL though, it’s much more pickme moms of golden sons. When I was a kid those old MIL jokes irked me because it didn’t line up with what I was seeing in my own family and neighborhood. My dads mom made things infinitely more difficult for my mother than her mother ever did for him, for example. My moms mom was barely around as she was jet setting and living her life (although we enjoyed her visits) while dads mom would cause drama and act so enmeshed that she demanded we visit every weekend. No surprise that my dad was her favored son and he did what she wanted.

My own mother and I have a very close relationship of two adult women; the mother-child dynamic is very muted at this point. She only acts like Mother when I really need her. She’s never made any problems in my marriages and has been warm and welcoming, never interfering. My ex MIL was a narcissistic nightmare and my ex husband had no spine. He passively avoided her attempts at enmeshment but wouldn’t directly state boundaries. And if she causes issues with ME he certainly wouldn’t have my back. “Well that’s just how she is, there’s nothing you can do. You should take the high road” yadda yadda. Unsurprisingly he was the golden child in a particularly nasty but classic narc family structure.

My current husband’s mom is an absolute gem but he told me there was a time when he was young that she attempted to overstep and be overbearing and he shut it down ASAP. By the time I came along nearly 20 years later she was a normal helpful mom who is great to me but she might have been a “just no mil” if my husband hadn’t established boundaries early on.

Elise10018 · 2022-01-16T20:16:48+00:00

I had a boyfriend whose mother told me I had stolen her son away from her. It was so cringe. She was always desperately trying to get attention from him to the point it seemed really inappropriate, things like, “look at my lovely new boots, aren’t they lovely, look at them, don’t my legs look good in them” etr. He had very poor boundaries with her.

lilarose8 · 2022-01-16T17:35:25+00:00

I’m almost grateful that my ex MIL was cruel to me so I could then be more aware of how damaging that is to marriages and make sure to never ever treat my sons’ partners that way.

My oldest son has possibly met the one and I do everything I can to make her feel welcome in my home and to support her. She has on more than one occasion told me I raised a good man which just makes my heart so happy.

We want our babies to always be our babies, and it’s bittersweet to see them grow up and move on, but ultimately isn’t that what we want for them? Don’t we want to see them independent and happy? The way my MIL treated me wasn’t what caused me to leave my ex but it certainly didn’t help things. The fact that he never once stood up for me and dismissed my feelings over it caused a lot of problems in our marriage. I can’t imagine ever wanting to put my child in that position. Do these moms have no self awareness? I just don’t understand.

Witchthrowaway4 · 2022-01-16T16:10:59+00:00

I used to think mama’s boy was sweet, and it can be to a limited extent. Now I run for the hills.

I would love to hear some perspectives from moms who have MILs.

candyfox84 · 2022-01-16T18:03:11+00:00

This is definitely a thing. My former JNMIL was a big part of why the relationship ended. She was very against my ex spending any money on me. Every JN has some tool for controlling her son’s relationship. In this case, it was a fixation on our money and how we were spending it. I’m sure there are about a million ways this unsolved dynamic between mother and son plays out though.

Now I’m better at spotting problematic mothers, I count it among other fed flags. For example, I almost dated a good friend of mine but over the years I met his mother a few times. She said something quite passive aggressive to me the third or fourth time I met her, and mentally I nexted him. I’m not a strong, self sufficient 37/f so I can bow down to some psycho MIL at this point in my life, lol nope!

Anonimica_X · 2022-01-16T18:43:50+00:00

I really like Chloe_ videos. She's the only hypergamous coach who explains things from a progressive viewpoint (atleast 99% of the times). I love how she has called out manosphere idiots on her channel and advices women not to date them.

FDS-GFY · 2022-01-16T20:02:14+00:00

Way too many women are over protective of their precious sons. You can see it all the time and Facebook in terms of how much shit they let them get away with. If the mom has bad boundaries, the boy gets away with it and no one ever teaches them not to.

Moms often act like their sons’ shit don’t stink, meanwhile they talk about and treat their daughters pretty badly too

anothernewyorklady · 2022-01-17T03:41:21+00:00

Mother-son dynamics are fascinating to me after seeing my ex’s toxic relationship with his mother. I never paid much attention to this before but having seen what covert emotional incest and mother enmeshment does to a guy has completely changed the way I examine these relationships now.

I wasn’t married, but my most recent ex’s mom was the sort of example that I wish I had been warned about. It was pretty clear to me that she violated her children’s boundaries to an extreme throughout their lives - from placing all her needs on them in childhood, all the way to divulging extremely personal stories about herself and their father in the midst of their divorce just a few years ago. The result? Both of her children ended up with addictions, and I’m fairly certain her son (my ex) has a cluster b personality disorder as a result of her parenting in combination with his narcissistic, philandering father.

She always made me feel extremely uncomfortable. Just being in her physical presence felt unsettling to me, though I could never pin point why. She doted on her son to a degree that almost felt romantic, it was so weird and gross. I remember once, when she and I were alone together getting lunch, she tried to warn me that her son had “co-dependent tendencies,” which seemed so odd to me because he wasn’t really co-dependent, he was actually predatory when it came to relationships. He’s the classic addict - abusive, narcissistic, exploitative, entitled, yet always plays the victim. It seemed like she wasn’t able to see him as a separate person and didn’t really even know him well enough to see how full of anger and rage he actually was. She would throw these emotional tantrums when she wasn’t able to successfully manipulate him into giving her attention when she wanted it. He was hardly ever able to maintain healthy boundaries with her. It was all very dramatic and exhausting to be around. When we broke up, his mom sent me this multi-paragraph long text like a month after the split that was so icky - it felt like she was breaking up with me, yet putting her son down at the same time.

FDSDedicated · 2022-01-16T21:30:55+00:00

I have a friend whose MIL literally told her that her marriage was unhappy but it was OK because she had her son (my friends husband) as a backup.

To his credit her husband's response was that they didn't need to see the mom ever again.

randomgirl34861 · 2022-01-16T17:39:39+00:00

My first boyfriend was a mama’s boy and it was hellish. He was one of 4 brothers, and 2 of them lived very close to her (he lived an hour away.) She would call him up for the stupidest things, like help removing the pool cover even though her husband could do it. Also, the other brothers were often there that same day because she watched their children?? She clearly did it just to get him there. Then she’d complain that she never saw him and take him on a guilt trip. Beg him to stay for dinner and stay the night even if we had plans.

She had diabetes and would skip meals, get dizzy and then go to the hospital! She would then call everyone, leaving vague messages that she was hospitalized and very sick and he would drop everything and rush there.

She fostered a lot of kids, and one of them got pregnant, ran away and left a baby with special needs on her doorstep. So she adopted the baby (which I really respected her for). However, the girl would need lifetime care. She was struggling because she was growing older while the girl was growing bigger, stronger and was now a teen. She would always say that my boyfriend needed to take her in when she was too old to care for her because his other brothers already had children and the one didn’t want children. But I’m not entirely sure I want children. To take her in would mean having no privacy in my home, as health aids and all sorts of therapists came by for multiple appointments every single day. Taking her in would be a full time job and I felt like it would end up falling all on me. That’s not the way I’d like to start a marriage. I can’t accept that level of commitment and responsibility (especially when it’s pushed on me and not my own choice). He has a new girlfriend now and about a year ago I saw his email was still logged into a tablet I have… so I checked out of curiosity before logging out.

The new girlfriend is on the mother’s payroll as a home health aid. She Venmo’s him 50/50 for rent. They go to tattoo conventions together and I don’t like tattoos. They’ve adopted 2 large dogs with a bite history. I’m unsure about wanting children, but a pet is a lifetime commitment and I won’t commit to an animal that would need to be rehomed if I had a child. (I’m also really passionate about under-socialized cats and they can’t live with most dogs. I have been bitten before and am afraid of dogs now.) Him and his mother are always liking pictures on Facebook of newborns next to big dogs and I think it’s the most irresponsible thing ever. I’d be afraid he’d put my baby in that position. It doesn’t matter how much you love your pet, they’re an animal and they can be startled by a baby’s bloodcurdling scream and react in a way that will cause a child a lifetime of complications. Even a kitten can sit on a baby’s face and suffocate them. It’s just not safe. (Also, how are you going to have a low-functioning special needs teen with those dogs?! She can’t understand how to interact with them appropriately and read their subtle body language so she’s at risk of being bitten!!)

Our state is expensive (and I can’t live in a one bedroom one bathroom with a man) so I’m down to make a rent contribution, but it’s not gonna be 50/50 or even close to it. He acted like I was an evil witch for ending things, but it was the best thing I ever could have done for him (and most importantly, myself.)

NonaOrganic · 2022-01-16T17:40:50+00:00

JMO, a lot of these women commit emotional incest w/their sons, and make mini husbands out of them due to the fact that the fathers are LVM/NVM. And yes, many are OG pick meishas for reproducing w/those LVM/NVM in the first place.

So then you get these MILs competing w/their daughter in laws or the other opposite end of the spectrum, mothers trying to convince women to date their “nice guy” sons.

gingerwabisabi · 2022-01-16T20:52:02+00:00

My MIL probably has the excuse of CTE for her aggression, memory issues, and pandering to terrible people. She has sadly been physically abused her whole life including strangling, so I feel sorry for her while also being angry that she not only allowed but also participated in abusing my husband so much. We are very very low contact with them. In her case, her crazy mother in law antics do involve some jealousy of me but my husband is very firm with boundaries and she seems scared of me, so we've been lucky. She did do some low level sabotage stuff on our wedding day, and has gossiped about us CONSTANTLY to other family members, but fortunately we haven't had to navigate grandkids yet. I think in her case and in most cases of "crazy mothers in law" they are miserable with their own life and jealous of the new wife and that's pretty much it.

My mother has a lot of issues of her own, like a lot, but she has never been the "crazy mother in law" to my husband. She likes him a lot. She DID try some shit with one of my first boyfriends but I was SO mad that I think she learned her lesson.

I think the less misogyny in the world, the easier in law relationships will be.

P.S. Some cultures had rules like the husband was never ever supposed to look at or speak to his mother in law. I find that amusing, for some reason.

greeneyesrosylips · 2022-01-17T00:59:00+00:00

This is a topic that speaks close to me (and I assume it's the same for a lot of you ladies here). My mom got her life (literally) ruined by a mama's boy and his mother. I almost made the same mistake, but I learnt from her experience. I'm still trying to navigate the grief of losing him though, because if it weren't for his family in general (not only his mom, although she plays the bigger part) and his small hometown we would have been truly happy :(

annie222222 · 2022-01-16T23:01:26+00:00

I do think it is from a basic need for men to protect you in this world from other bad men. We learn this from our dads. A good strategy for being safe from all the bad men (which is like, almost all) is to have a good man. Now a mothers son is the ONLY man she doesn’t have to worry about raping her, beating her up, yada yada. Her special status is confused with the fact that she’s does something for him: laundry food love etc. She fears the new wife in his life doing the laundry food and love and will get the protection and she looses. So no woman can be “good enough” They do this instinctively as most women now don’t see themselves signing on to do his laundry and pack his lunch, and mothers don’t have romantic feelings towards sons thus the ick factor in this conflation. I also think damaged women not only don’t trust LVM but probably only know LVW and want to protect their son from a LVW. What would drive one of these MILs crazy is to lose her sons protection to a LVW. It would drive her CRAZY. I have a son and he’s still little but maybe after he gets weaned off of me caring for him on a day to day basis I could go insane? I hope to god I never become this woman.

Constant-Wanderer · 2022-01-17T04:22:53+00:00

I’ve been lucky to have never really had bad MIL or FIL issues, although they haven’t all loved me.

I know how to be charming when it’s needed, but also - I just never gave a fuck who liked me or not. And never had an issue with telling someone my boundaries, even if they were 30 years older than me.

Current SO, he’s told me how his mother has always, always, given his gfs a hard time, she never liked any of them, she HATED the kid’s mother, and she’s apparently a holy terror for everyone.

Me, she likes. Nice as pie. I’m not entirely sure why, and it doesn’t matter. I tell her when she’s overstepping boundaries, I tell her whatever I need to.

She got sick recently, and I’m devastated by it, because I want her around for longer.

My SO? He manages her, he tells her when to back off, and takes away privileges when she gets out of control, like we recently had plans for a family holiday, she gave him a hard time about something a few days before, and boom, no family dinner that day. I don’t have to worry about her at all.

Same with my mom. She would be all over the kids if I let her, she’s been dying to be a grandmother, and tries to pretend that she is. I don’t let that happen, at all. I will throw myself in that grenade whenever I need to, but I will not let my mother make either my partner or his children uncomfortable for a moment. This is my job, to make their lives better, not let my mother have her way.

We protect each other.

One MIL (of an ex bf, not married) lawd his mother hated me. I never cared. If she would get snotty with me I just laughed or ignored her.

You give people power when you ask them permission to exist. I’ve never asked anyone for permission or approval. None of this “maybe we can work it out” or please like me, or if I bring a pie maybe his mommy will suddenly stop hating me, if I bend over backwards, “maybe she’ll magically be a better human being, or realize how much I do for her son” fuck that lol.

No one who is free asks for permission to be free, no one who is independent needs approval, and approaching anyone with the attitude of “how can I make you happy” sets the dynamic permanently to putting all of the power in their hands.

I have my power, I give my approval, I don’t ask for it. I’m nice to whomever treats me with respect, I will happily get along with anyone who isn’t a dick. Take liberties, fuck around, find out.

I am not argumentative, confrontational, or in-your-face about who I am, but I am unapologetic as fuck, and I don’t care if anyone doesn’t like it, or me.

That’s my 2¢

myeggsarebig · 2022-01-17T11:35:56+00:00

Queen, my SO and I are 💯 NC with his JN. Long story short - when I had a very young close family member die by suicide and then only 6 weeks later, my dad died, this interfered with SO ability to be at JN’s beck and call for an elective knee surgery. She threw a major temper tantrum. When he explained - “my SO comes first, and while she’s in mid crisis, I’ll be holding her, and only her up, so sorry Mom, you’re gonna have to find someone else” she told him that…wait for it…”she’s overreacting because het Dad is not my bio Dad, and the suicide was not her bio son, and shes just a girlfriend (we’re engaged, waiting for Covid to pass).

We will never talk to that woman again.

BedazzledSwashbuckle · 2022-01-18T19:55:09+00:00

I think it's multi-faceted.

First, I think we're conditioned from birth to compete with other women. When we adopt more feminist viewpoints, etc., we have to rewire those neurological circuits and re-route that emotional energy and a lot of us (me too) still jump on any societally acceptable (or feminist-approved) short cuts like: mother-in-laws, "Karens", pickmes, or other women grouped by race or politics or belief system, etc. That's not to say that there aren't horrible women out there, or that we don't have legitimate complaints about some of these labels. But I can always tell I'm rechanneling my patriarchal conditioning if my level of sneering fury against [[insert female-dominant group here]]] is entirely disproportionate to the specific name-able act(s) that a specific name-able woman committed intentionally against specific me.

If I'm feeling a tsunami of dismissive anger against an entire group of women whose names I do not know, I'm probably playing directly into patriarchal hands. And that likely means it's a fairly safe anger, in that it won't upset any men and there won't be any negative consequences from them for my expressing it.

Second, I think we tend to devalue mothers and their sacrifices for their children. If I ask you to value a man's sacrifices for his family (let's say he's a HVM): my own dad worked daily for myself and my siblings, came home, cooked supper for us every other day, did laundry (mom hated it, so dad did it), did our homework with us, took us to neighborhood events, encouraged me to aspire to higher education and worked overtime to pay for it .... we'd all feel a glow of warmth, of respect. What a great dad (he was, truly). Let's say in adulthood, my great dad showed concern over a few of my adult decisions or asked to be included in my adult life in a fairly moderate way, this kid's birthday party, that trip to whale-watch in Alaska with me and my husband, and maybe we don't always agree ... he gives the kids the occasional ice cream a little too late in the evening. Do I hate him? Do I challenge him for overstepping into my adult life? Do I demand that he leave, clear the way for my husband - HE CHOOSES THE DESSERT NOW!

Of course not. A parent's relationship with their child doesn't end at adulthood or marriage ... it changes, sure. I see a lot of MIL complaints that expect the MIL to vanish, really. And I think that's unrealistic. A parent who loved their child enough to do a good job isn't going to flake entirely when that child marries - they'll be around. I see perfectly functional parent relationships compared to "emotional incest" a lot, but only where mother in laws are concerned (even where the father in law is oggling the new wife and living out of the guest room). When that happens, what I hear is that old patriarchal conditioning to be competitive with other women ... and it's coming from the new wife.

That said, I've only ever had one "mom" in law who I didn't get along with, and she was technically his stepmom (and just generally hated anyone who got along with his biomom). Every other mom, as soon as I made it quite clear that I didn't think our spheres overlapped (I'm here to get physical with him, not do his laundry) and that I didn't plan to fight her presence in his life, has turned out to be a lovely woman who poured her heart and soul into raising as good of a man as she possibly could. I'm still friends with more of them than I am the ex-boyfriends. :D

Finally? The idea of a "pickme" mom who leans on her son instead of her husband ... this (a) is rare IMO, and (b) is easy easy easy to vet for early in the dating process. She's not going to suddenly become wildly enmeshed and start living in his bedroom 3 years after you met him and one year after the wedding. That stuff has been there since day one and you just gambled that you could bully it out of existence and lost. Choose better.

Title	Why is there so many "crazy" mother-in-laws? (Let's discuss from the perspective of FDS)
Author	SayNad
Upvotes	372
Comments	47
Date	January 16, 2022 3:55 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/comments/s5eo5e/why_is_there_so_many_crazy_motherinlaws_lets/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/why-is-there-so-many-crazy-mother-in-laws-lets.1095848 https://theredarchive.com/post/1095848

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