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PuroPincheGains · 2021-09-14T22:30:21+00:00

You can do whatever you want. Asking for consent is never wrong. But, you'll probably turn a lot of girls off and it will probably make you less successful with women in the long run. We communicate with more than just our words. If you get good at kino escalation and body language then you don't need to verbally ask. Knowing the right time to kiss is 100x more attractive than asking. I can't say anything about your specific situation though. All girls are different, you know this girl better than anyone on Reddit so that one's all up to you.

Bruucex · 2021-09-14T22:16:16+00:00

Hard bro

MmmNeapolitan · 2021-09-15T00:15:31+00:00

I usually ask, never been told no. Sometimes it happens naturally. Most of the women that i've been with have said that they liked that i asked because most or none of the men before me had and they appreciated it. As long as you can recognize a good opportunity to ask or naturally fit it into a conversation, go for it. Don't ask it out of the blue or you might catch them off guard and they may react defensively. Pick up on ques that she's into you if you can. A favorite of mine is to steer the conversation towards suggesting different activities that we could do next, she asks what i would like to do, i say i'd like to kiss her, we bang.

fallingbutthole · 2021-09-14T23:55:58+00:00

Bruh, I always considered asking for consent a total power move. In a sea of dudes searching for the right cues worrying about fuckin up, you're the guy making your intents and wishes clear. I also give girls my phone number instead of asking for theirs, and tell them the day I'm free to take them out.

OneThousandYardStare · 2021-09-15T01:33:23+00:00

Alright lemme speak directly to your questions. Did you mess up your chance with her? No. It doesn't appear that you have. Time will tell. You're still in the running, just keep going forward running the best game that you can.

"Is it wrong to ask a girl for her permission before I go for a kiss?" Morally? No. In fact that's the most explicit way to receive consent. But I would be remiss if I didn't admit that explicitly asking for a kiss can have a detrimental effect on you success with that girl overall.

During my tenure in my PUA community the problem of consent surfaced in the public mind as a serious question and we wrestled with it. We really really wanted explicit consent to not be detrimental or at least be viable. We did extensive field testing over a long period of time and the results were disappointing. In an effort to stay within the scope of the post I won't go into depth here but if you are interested in the minutiae of the research then let me know.

Its possible to explicitly ask for consent in a sexy and attractive way but these are rare, context dependent occasions and are still being explored. What we found to be a much better strategy is to use "Incremental Escalation". Very briefly, incremental escalation is a way to get from opening to closing by breaking up the process into smaller steps. Allow me to explain. It is awkward to walk up to a stranger and immediately ask her to go home with you. But if we work up to asking her to go home with you in smaller, incremental steps then you can build up to that. In other words, its difficult to get a girl to go from point A to point Z. But its easy to get her to go from point A to point B. Then, once you're at point B, its easy to get her to go to point C and so on until you do eventually reach point Z.

So the virtues of incremental escalation are myriad. First of all you can comfortably and naturally work towards closing in a smooth way. You'll have a much higher chance of reaching closing if you work up to it incrementally. But another virtue of incremental escalation is that it provides room for tacit consent. For one, there are many stops along the ride in which she is welcome to get off. But more importantly, if you are coming close the line she has drawn then incremental escalation will ensure that there will be a point that is extremely close to that limit in which she can express that she does not feel comfortable going further. If you escalate in large steps then there is the possibility that you might blow right past her limit before she even has the chance to tell you that you are approaching it.

One of the most astounding virtues of incremental escalation is the capacity for them to be turned into expressions of consent in and of themselves. Allow me to explain.

Breaking the touch barrier is difficult to do. Often this step is puzzling for guys. However there is a move that I want to explain to you that will revolutionize not just the way you break the touch barrier but also escalate and gain consent. If you want to break the touch barrier try this: Say to the girl "you wanna do a shot with me at the bar?" and hold out your hand. With a high rate of success she'll put her hand in yours and you can lead her up to the bar. Its tacit consent for handholding but by all measures its as good as explicit consent.

So you can explicitly as a girl if you can kiss her. I will applaud you for it. However if you want to cultivate great game then you should probably incrementally escalate instead. If you are at the club/bar instead of "lets go do a shot" try "you wanna dance?" and hold out your hand to lead her to the dance floor. Once there start dancing of course, if you're behind her then while your dancing very casually lean forward and kiss her on the cheek. Then asses. Then maybe spin her around and kiss her on the mouth. Work up to it so theres not a huge awkward jump but rather a smoot build up, a natural progression. This will also give her a chance to express herself (before its too late) if she feels she's uncomfortable going further.

prettydirtyboy · 2021-09-15T00:38:39+00:00

Sometimes I’ve asked and sometimes I’ve just went for it. It’s all about how you read the energy. I can say asking never hurt me and sometimes I’d get an excited reaction.

gbizzle2 · 2021-09-15T00:53:40+00:00

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ThatGuy_Nick9 · 2021-09-14T22:19:38+00:00

It’s not wrong, no. Sometimes girls just wanna go on dates, though. Nothing wrong with that. Tbh sometimes I’ll [M24] use tinder to strike up a date just to practice dating and romance game.

Rude-Kaleidoscope-58 · 2021-09-14T23:06:58+00:00

Flirting is a good tool to detect attraction. I personally dissociate indices of interest in two : Passive IoIs and Active IoIs. Passive IoIs come from her alone and are not directly triggered by your behavior. They tend to often either be really subtles and can easily be misinterpreted or not detected. Active IoIs are triggered by your behavior, either it's using words or physical communication. They are a much more powerful interest detector because they are polarizing the girl while indirectly providing you a response on what she thinks about you. As an example, next time a girl owes you something, you can say that you want a kiss as a reward. That's playful and flirty, usually will lead is a simple laugh but if done correctly you could extract some hints about her attraction level. Depending on her reaction, you may know if she's into you or not, and sometimes you'll feel it's time to take charge of the kiss.

unisol84 · 2021-09-15T01:00:49+00:00

Yes, read the interaction first obviously but asking to kiss her makes you look indecisive and soft.

what-diddy-what-what · 2021-09-15T04:23:37+00:00

I've done this once before and never again. I was on a great first date, everything was spot on. I asked her if I could kiss her. She immediately looked turned off and said "why are you asking me?" Then she said "Nobody has ever asked me that" and the entire tone of the date shifted. Basically it destroyed the attraction. We still kissed but it wasn't the same afterwards.

PaqS18 · 2021-09-15T05:51:23+00:00

You turn girls off. Just go for it when it feels right and 99% of the time she wants too if you are not totally awkward in reading situations.

traybro · 2021-09-14T23:12:37+00:00

Ideally you escalate and it happens naturally without any verbal permission. That said, I don’t think it means you completely fucked it up that’s an overstretch.

xbluux · 2021-09-14T22:23:59+00:00

Never ask for a permission to kiss, go straight for it and if she stops you then play it off and don't make things awkward. Show some confidence ffs, you fucked up

2021-09-15T04:33:58+00:00

Timing is everything. Wait for a quiet moment, look into her eyes and move in slowly for the kiss. If she’s into it you’ll know and if she’s not she’ll turn her head or pull away.

tidder8888 · 2021-09-15T05:15:40+00:00

Nah. Consent is sexy

TheSunshineMan · 2021-09-15T02:51:59+00:00

Asking is always a turn on. If I was interested, ready to kiss him and he wants me to make a conscious decision is always good. To add also I don’t kiss on a first date, maybe she was the same way

2021-09-14T23:17:50+00:00

Just kiss her. It’s a bold move and shows you don’t really care. It’s the only way to really find out what’s going on.

Worst case scenario is that she rejects your advances. Which doesn’t even feel that bad. I think being rejected by passively asking for a kiss is much more of a knife to your manhood.

The more experience you gain with women, the better your social intelligence will become and you can make better informed decisions from your own understanding of when to kiss her.

Narcan9 · 2021-09-15T05:17:13+00:00

In my experience women don't like being asked for permission for a kiss. Just go for it. With sex you can ask for indirect things like "can I take your pants off"?

Honestly, a Kiss is pretty low stakes. If you're rejected for a kiss, just move on. I can handle waiting for sex, but waiting for a kiss...I'm way too old for middle school.

SexualGoodGirl · 2021-09-15T05:57:04+00:00

It's not wrong it's just not a dominant characteristic to ask a girl, I would honestly be more turnt off by someone asking then someone saying "your lips look so good right now" "god you're sexy" while looking at my lips "you're a beauty" while looking at my lips.👄

Don't ask... it would make me feel like you don't have the confidence or ability to know you're doing a good job to deserve a kiss.👄 I would feel awkward someone asking instead of acting dominant and wanting too.

SexualGoodGirl · 2021-09-14T22:46:55+00:00

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Wonderful-Wolf-3856 · 2021-09-15T02:47:37+00:00

I think it’s sexy as hell!

Taro8383 · 2021-09-15T03:54:14+00:00

Yes, it is wrong.

Grow a pair.

Undercovermother19 · 2021-09-15T05:05:27+00:00

You should not have to. You should create the atmosphere where doing it would feel natural and not forced. If you feel scared to go for the lips try kissing her neck first!

Necessary-Hand-929 · 2021-09-15T01:11:02+00:00

ALWAYS ASK! Unless she’s pushing herself on your lips, you always ask. Girl here and the most gentlemen I’ve dated always ask, if they don’t they’re usually bad in bed. Lil secret to guys, first sign we girls notice that you’re bad communicators in bed is that you don’t communicate before the kiss. If you too scared to ask to kiss us, odds are you too scared to ask if we really like that. Always ask gents.

Apprehensive_Bar_587 · 2021-09-14T23:26:35+00:00

Just show her how hard you are through your pants and the rest will be history

BON3SMcCOY · 2021-09-15T05:16:31+00:00

You should be getting consent every time you touch someone

bigblackshaq · 2021-09-15T05:17:11+00:00

Ignore every comment that tells you to keep asking for permission to kiss. You are never going to succeed if you keep doing that. Sorry to be blunt.

Instead, learn to read the room and particularly her body language. It’s very hard to miss if she’s into you as she will make it extremely obvious and easy for you. It gets easier with experience, but the moral of the story is never ask to kiss a girl; it absolutely kills the vibe and fire of what you would have had with her.

princelydeeds · 2021-09-14T23:35:26+00:00

Don't ask never do it...

2021-09-15T01:28:14+00:00

Wrong no, unsexy yes. If the moods right and she seems comfortable go for it, she’ll pull away if she’s not ready and then you decide if it’s worth Pursuing

Hot-Construction-811 · 2021-09-15T04:57:59+00:00

Some people think asking for a kiss equates to no experience in dating and it is a turn off. Same goes with the stigma of being virgin. Whatever, dude. You do what feels right to you. And sometimes, you just need to read the situation with the girl you are with. I have found being playful with her helps ease the situation somewhat so rather then posing it as a question. You can do something playful to let her know your intentions.

OR you can just straight out and kiss her down there. This I did with my ex gf when she had come over my place for a "massage." No explanation there what it unfolds afterwards.

SwitchEm0 · 2021-09-15T05:23:48+00:00

It really depends on the girl, from my experience one of my ex girlfriends really appreciated that I asked to get consent first but another ex said asking was a turn off for her. I'd rather ask first personally because it makes me more comfortable but you really won't know til you talk to them ig

No-Teacher6071 · 2021-09-15T05:42:16+00:00

Bro, the girls are different with us. You might like to have sex with her in the beginning let alone a simple kiss but this is not how they think or believe. Men selects and girls are being selected. So when they see you on the first day, they might ghost you later or reply back to you longer that what you expect. This is because they are thinking deeply on whether they choose you or someone else.Dating a random girl is different with chatting a girl for hook up. Dating either takes a long time or right after the first day you are done! Kissing or holding hands are not those things happen in the first meetings. When girls accept you after a period of time, then they try to approach you physically. You will notice that. Then either you or her will start kissing. So calm down, keep dating until chemistry begins between you and her. Remember dating takes a huge portion of your time and your money. This is how it works!

recyclablebanthas · 2021-09-15T07:16:14+00:00

This post had to be taken down because it breaks Rule #1: it concerns a specific girl/situation and such things belong in AskSeddit. Don't sweat it! But please check the rules before posting or commenting.

EDIT: Clarified the rule number. Shouldn't be controversial. It's in the sidebar, everyone.

Brilliant-Fig847 · 2021-09-15T04:23:20+00:00

It's appreciated!

Kevin3362 · 2021-09-15T01:13:56+00:00

She'll let you know.

2021-09-15T01:29:50+00:00

Seems like she’s waiting. Now you wait for a good time to make the move but don’t ask, make it natural.

gbizzle2 · 2021-09-15T02:14:16+00:00

Asking implies lack of confidence and fear of consequences for not asking.

It is a form of submission. So if you know without a shadow of a doubt that she is into you whats the point in asking. If the sexual tension is there why would she say no? Just do it and worse case scenario she runs from the situation while yall are both feeling the moment thats a good grounds for punishment by not talking to her after that. Thats just my take on it

2021-09-15T02:26:27+00:00

Its not wrong but if you’re both feeling each other then you don’t need to ask, it just happens in the moment. Next time just go for it and if she turns you away then she’s not really into you, and even less if she doesn’t talk to you again or rejects a second date. In your case go out with her again and try to create a moment where you’re both relaxed enough to make out. Then again sometimes the first date is too soon to kiss for some people, so give it another shot.

ambushn · 2021-09-15T02:58:02+00:00

if you have to ask for the kiss is because is not the moment, trust me

5_7pickup · 2021-09-15T03:04:27+00:00

Lmao these flairs. How the hell is this a logistical question

Wonderful-Wolf-3856 · 2021-09-15T03:29:57+00:00

Just kiss her. Do u know this woman. Go for it, as 54f I don’t have success with men. I’m told I’m cold hearted (I’ve invited men over, to my home 98% never come. So if your this close to kissing and Good Sex, go for it. A grown woman will let ya know quick ( if sex is in the cards) let’s be honest most of us adults once the kissing starts , well then the lights go out & it’s bedroom time😄begins( I don’t know how well you know her), but go for a kiss ,, Ask or try with no words, either way, you will be fine.

TheSunshineMan · 2021-09-15T03:32:09+00:00

Never ask a girl if you can kiss her - that's super beta and shows a huge lack in confidence.

Look for the signs she's open to it.. but you can't just go from 0 to kiss.. you need to have been flirting, sexually escalating from zero towards the kiss.

make_me_a_good_girl · 2021-09-15T03:39:34+00:00

I think it would be a really nice gesture. But I'm also a sentimental sweetheart, below the slutty exterior.

I think it also depends on how you make your move, and obviously the woman in question. I can't help with understanding each woman's desires, but as for the how? Well...

Saying something mild like, "May I kiss you goodnight?" after a successful date may seem too meek for some, and for others it will feel very rushed.

But. I think everyone loves someone that can advocate for their own needs and clearly express their desires.

So something like, "I really want you to kiss me right now." while holding her gaze (in a confident, not creepy way) establishes what you are thinking about, and also respectfully puts the ball in her court because you're saying you want her to kiss you, not that you want to kiss her (which might seem more forceful or like a trap she has to agree to, depending on the woman and her experiences with forceful men who don't take no for an answer).

Maybe that's just a thing that appeals to my inner switch, maybe I especially like the gift of control in an emotionally vulnerable situation in ways other less femdom prone women would not appreciate. Hard to say.

But, I think you are safe that she wants it and that she consents to it if she kisses you. And gaining consent before that attempted smash is, to loads of women, actually really fucking sexy.

ForTheLoveofGeese · 2021-09-15T04:07:42+00:00

If you’re unsure and feel like you need to ask, then you really probably should. Forget these folks telling you it “kills the vibe”. In life, everything is about your approach - for me, I know my niche. I’m awkward and I make it fun, I make it a joke or I blather on, on purpose. Seriously, if you’re already on a date then they likely find you attractive anyway, one small question won’t change that. If they say no, they say no. But, if you think the answer is no before you even ask, just don’t do it man, read the room.

2021-09-15T04:38:47+00:00

You messed up and it’s okay. Consent is important, especially when you escalate past kissing but here’s my experience dating women..

There’s been times I was new to dating and nervous. I could tell the girls I was with were into me but I was scared to make the move to kiss them because of a silly fear they might reject me. So I would ask them or tell them that I wanted to kiss them. It instantly kills the tension but they always let me kiss them anyways. It wasn’t hot and usually just a few soft kisses. Once I built up my confidence I realized how I was destroying the vibe by being insecure and not confidently going in for a kiss. They love the tension we build and she is just as excited for the moment to kiss as you are. When you go right in the mood is intense and you’re more likely to make out rather than just one little kiss. I’ll even joke with women now and ask them what if I would have asked for the kiss first. Which usually gets a laughing response like, “OMG I’m SO glad you did not do that!”

Props to you for being self aware and recognizing you possibly made a mistake. This is a lesson you and I and everyone eventually learns through experience. Now next time you know the right way to go about it.

burncushlikewood · 2021-09-15T04:52:35+00:00

Yea man don't ask, and girls go cold on guys they don't no too well. You have to gauge when it's the right time, after you've built comfort and shes attracted to you. Don't pursue her too much if she's not replying, on to the next one as Swizz Beats and Jay-z would say. https://youtu.be/9jRKsH8_OWQ

Weary-Experience-149 · 2021-09-15T05:45:33+00:00

In my novice opinion, I think that was a shit-test to see how would you react. Always brush it off and laugh and don't lose your cool no matter what.

If you reply with something like "well, next time I you'll be the one asking for permission and I'll think about it" ( along with a big smile ) your chances will greatly increase if she agrees to see you again.

Next time if you're having a blast, just go for the kiss. It's always better to apologize than to ask permission if it's just a kiss, so don't over do it or step out of line.

ruswal3 · 2021-09-15T06:20:58+00:00

You should not ask before kissing. Just lean yourself.
If she accepts it, bingo. If she doesn't, it won't create any awkward feeling, but I think it's probably that she is not attracted enough and she will be never be.

helpmylifeis_a_mess · 2021-09-15T06:24:41+00:00

I wonder if maybe its how you asked her or if it was simply wrong timing/vibe to ask?

My ex asked for my permission if he could kiss me the first few times while we were dating and let me tell you, i absolutely fucking loved it! That stuff had me smiling for dayssss on end! No one else has ever done it since we broke up and im slightly peeved about that but i wont ever admit that out loud and i absolutely love my current relationship.

I guess it really depends on the type of girl she is. Does she like a more dominating man? More chivalrous? Softer? Traditional? Religious? Every girl is different op, dont lose hope! I dont think you screwed up or ruined your chances, but take things slow and go with the flow :)

mohanou · 2021-09-15T06:30:33+00:00

just follow the body language if she looks on your lips go for it dont overthink stuff

loosetingles · 2021-09-15T06:40:49+00:00

Instead of asking just say "I'd really like to kiss you", most will say yes

CheekyBurgerr · 2021-09-15T07:02:13+00:00

In the long run you turn off a lot of women. Also in the same run you'll avoid a lot of scandals.

Miguel_Legacy · 2021-09-15T07:17:33+00:00

Very wrong because it's a turn off. If your concern is the consent aspect, you need to let her know it's coming in a confident way that gives her time to react. (Assuming you can't obviously tell she wants you)

You can say something like this line I got from a dating coach:

delivered confidently with good eye contact and body language:

"I'm going to kiss you now. 1, because I know it will make everyone in here super jealous of us and 2. Because I think it will be fucking awesome start to lean in slowly and read her

Or some variation. Confident tone, deep voice, very important.

recyclablebanthas · 2021-09-15T07:23:07+00:00

I thought that she forgot about me but yesterday she texted me asking me I wanted to go on the date, so I went there and we ate and laugh.....

First off, it's obviously a very good sign this year remembered who you were and texted you to ask if you wanted to hang out.

.....at the end of the date I told her that I wanted to kiss her, she laughs and she told me maybe in the future.

Based on what you've said of her response, it seems pretty likely that she found your question charming even though it was a little awkward.

For future reference, it's not bad to ask for consent but a lot of our social interactions are built on nonverbal communication, and because of this it can be a little awkward if someone ignores that and bluntly asks.

For example, in this case, during the date she would have been showing signs as to whether she was comfortable with you and her personal space or comfortable with physical touch.

Reading these cues would be the next level for you. And it doesn't really need to be that complicated. We're talking about paying attention to what her physical response is whenever you come into contact or come into her personal space.

Does she pull away and discourage physical contact or you coming into her personal space bubble?
Or does she lean into contact and do things that encourage the two of you being physically closer?

Paying attention to these things is the start of learning to understand how to navigate these sorts of interactions better unless awkwardly.

Basically, if she's pulling away and discouraging physical contact, then you respond in suit. And if she's encouraging physical contact and leaning into it, then you go with that, if you're interested anyway.

GuldursTV90 · 2021-09-15T07:23:27+00:00

Dude, women prefer confident men.

Crypto_279 · 2021-09-15T07:55:54+00:00

Instead of bluntly asking, try something like - "Hey you know tongue is the strongest muscle in our body, wanna wrestle? " Make it smoothly explicit.

P.S. - I read that line somewhere, don't remember exactly

humptyone · 2021-09-15T12:40:17+00:00

Lift her chin, and go in for the kiss

Title	[deleted by user]
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	122
Comments	130
Date	September 14, 2021 10:10 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/pocvh6/is_it_wrong_to_ask_a_girl_for_her_permission/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/deleted-by-user.1276103 https://theredarchive.com/post/1276103

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