Argument of male circumcision

gothmommy__ · 2021-12-30T08:04:11+00:00

She’s fucking crazy. Any forced body mutilation needs to be against the law.

AdAcademic4290 · 2021-12-30T10:45:02+00:00

In South Africa alone, over 604 boys died and over half a million were hospitalised after attending the winter initiation schools between 2008 and 2021. A total of 1,139 deaths have been recorded since 1995. Accurate statistics are not available for the number of [Penis] amputations, but their number is roughly twice the number of deaths. So approximately 2,278 boys and men have lost their penises in South Africa since 1995 alone due to circumcision. And don't think it only happens in the bush - men, boys and baby boys have lost all or most of their penis due to hospital circumcisions too. Leave boys and men's genitals alone, as God / nature created them. From a Doctor in South Africa, who tends to the victims of 'bush' circumcision rites- "Frequently you would smell the rotting as they were walking past...I spend many hours cleaning their wounds, struggling to insert urinary catheters into their botched Penis, battling to explain [to] 17 year olds that they had lost their manhood" Additionally, if the young men complain about their ghastly injuries, they are often beaten and made outcasts by the bush circumcisers or their cohorts. Some are unable to marry or father children, and lead sad lives or even die by suicide. Although a number of men have received penis transplants; this is not always possible; and can lead to further psychological and health problems, such as organ rejection. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2014/jan/29/south-africa-doctor-website-botched-male-circumcision-criticised?client=ms-android-samsung Let us stop this diabolical cutting, hacking, slicing, butchering of all people, regardless of gender, age or geographical location.

AdAcademic4290 · 2021-12-30T10:43:42+00:00

All cultures that practice FGM also practice circumcision of males, under the same conditions, using the same tools, for the same 'reasons'. Circumcision puts girls at increased risk of FGM. One of the biggest predictors in the movement of FGM into an area is the previous practice of, and cultural acceptance of, male genital cutting (circumcision) in that same area. Therefore it could be said that the practice of circumcision in western countries gives tacit permission for parents to carry out FGM. The exact same words are used for Female Genital Mutilation (FGM) as for Male Circumcision in cultures such as those below. They see no difference - so why should we?:

"Egypt - Khitan Kenya - Kutairi Nigeria - IBI / Ugwu Somalia - Gudiniin" (Source - Female Genital Mutilation Risk and Safeguarding - Department of Health UK May 2016)

Illegality seems to play less of a role than cultural permission. If parents can take their sons along and have part of their genitals hacked off on nothing more than a 'whim', then they will be more inclined to do the same to their daughters. Illegality just means it takes more effort 😨😨😨

Adeus_Ayrton · 2021-12-30T15:36:58+00:00

You mean male genital mutilation.

Avidion18 · 2021-12-30T11:02:06+00:00

Wait so she says fgm is an attrocity yet says mgm is hygienic? The same belief some countries have with fgm? Fuck the hypocrisy and double standard is strong with that cow

Classic-Discipline-2 · 2021-12-30T08:42:28+00:00

Ask her how she felt about the female equivalent that was introduced in America at the same time, by the same man (dr. Kellogg) this was where women would have acids poured onto their clitorises to try and prevent sensitivity. Ask her if she thinks it was unfair to outlaw that but not the MGM that goes on today.

An argument on the myth about hygiene and STD prevention could be this:

Should girls have their breasts removed when they are babies to prevent the rather large risk of breast cancer. I believe it’s 1 in 4 but I’d have to check, and if she says no, then say “why is it ok for boys to have their body parts removed in an equally barbaric way in a propaganda fuelled effort to stop STD’s and hygiene problems”. If neither of these point persuade her then I’m afraid she’s too far gone.

ImplodedPotatoSalad · 2021-12-30T11:03:21+00:00

you dont argue. You remove such toxic "friends" from your life.

Input_output_error · 2021-12-30T09:40:04+00:00

She got vocally angry that because women around the world suffer the
horrible atrocities of female circumcision, it’s dumb for society to
care and prioritize campaigning against male circumcision in America.

So, she can't care about what is done to men in her country because there are women in other countries suffering? I would tell her to go pack her bags and go fix these issue's all around the world. You'll stay and try to solve the suffering of men in your country.

The cognitive dissonance is astonishing, not only is FGM rather rare around the world (specially when compared to MGM), the men get the similar treatment in terms of hygiene. They too are cut with unsanitary means, just like the girls, but somehow i never hear them complaining about that.

YesAmAThrowaway · 2021-12-30T09:57:57+00:00

FGM is already illegal. Improving enforcement is all that can be done. The excuses for FGM are also the same as for MGM btw, and in both cases the excuses are bullshit. Men face systemic discrimination here.

brai117 · 2021-12-30T13:23:59+00:00

"there are other problems affecting people like me around the world, so your problem is fully irrelevant"

you see how dumb that argument is contextualised?

also, could you imagine telling women that something down to their bodies without their permission or consent wasn't worth arguing about?

that conversation would last 3 seconds before you get told "you are a man, so you get no say"

also, stop being friends with this woman.

Dwoodward85 · 2021-12-30T14:21:49+00:00

I don't. People that are willing to mutilate their new born son aren't the type of people I'm around. My parents never believed in it, their words were "it's not mine to cut up" and my siblings who have had so many kids they could repopulate a small island lol all disagree with cutting up their kid.

There is no religious reason to do it. There is no god that would demand you slice a piece of your child off and more so in religions where the person mutilating has to do a certain act as part of a "tradition" (look it up. It's effing rank and wrong). There is no medical reason why. There is no reason why a new born should be cup up to suit the parent or the parents "tradition" and yes I say cut up rather than any medical name because that's what they're doing. Cutting up a piece of their newborn. If you do it you're a bad parent.

DarkArcher__ · 2021-12-30T15:44:03+00:00

"If some people have it worse, we can't also help other people" False dichotomy fallacy

kandradeece · 2021-12-30T16:39:16+00:00

Had many arguments about this with my wife who is a doctor. We had a son last year, thus the reason for the arguments. she was just didnt believe in any of these "issues" that occur with circumcision. Eventually I just put my foot down on the issue and forced our son to stay intact. Luckily my state requires both parents (if married) to agree to circumcision. Made sure my wishes were know at the hospital. no hospital wants to get involved in that dispute, so if they know one opposes it, they will just leave it alone. It was ridiculous how many times we got asked about it though. My response was always something like "no, I do not consent to the mutilation of my son". Mainly to show them how "crazy" I am about it so they will just stay out of it.

My wife just spouted off the same nonsense like "less STDs and cleaner", but all that is crazy in a first world. Women just care about women issues and pretend that men have no issues in society. we are 2nd class citizens to most of them.

IngoTheGreat · 2021-12-30T08:18:47+00:00

Ablation of the prepuce irreversibly destroys the primary sensory structures of the penis (NSFW), has thousands of years of recorded history explicitly stating that controlling male sexuality by physically damaging the penis is among its primary purposes, can cause problems outside the realm of sexuality per se such as chronic pain, and countless boys, mainly in so-called third world countries but also in so-called developed nations, are maimed (more than intended) or even killed by this practice. Medical and scientific organizations such as the Royal Dutch Medical Association (2010) (PDF) have noted the clear parallels between MGM and FGM and acknowledged that they are often treated inconsistently due to misconceptions that tend to paint considerations of sex or gender as reliable stand-ins for the degree of damage done by an instance of ritualized genital cutting. In fact, as Earp and Steinfeld (2017) noted,

In short, the degree of harmfulness of childhood NGC is a function of numerous interacting variables, such as the level of invasiveness of the intervention, the skill of the practitioner, the cutting instruments used and whether or not they have been sterilized, the type and extent of the genital tissue that is altered or removed, what the material circumstances of the procedure are, at what age the procedure is carried out, whether or not there is cooperation from the child, what the child has been led to believe about what is happening and how this affects their emotional state, how much value the child later places on having intact versus modified genitalia, how closely the child personally identifies with the NGC-practicing culture or sub-culture in which they are being raised, and, in intersex cases, how closely the child identifies with the sex category that has been surgically assigned.

Considerations of sex or gender, by contrast, are at best extremely unreliable proxies for the actual degree of harmfulness of any given instance of NGC.

I would suggest reading all the articles linked to above to get yourself more familiarized with this topic. Best.

ImpossibleAir4310 · 2021-12-30T12:36:41+00:00

“It’s more hygienic” is totally debunked, and was incredibly stupid to begin with. That’s like shaving your kids head bc it’s healthy for their scalp - it’s not total BS, but you are totally missing the point. Foreskin is functional and has nerves who’s only job is to send pleasure signals, similar to a clitoris but much more spread out. Having sex is a different experience, for both partners, and circumcision changes that before you even know what it is.

Sure, cultural norms change how we view these things, but they are cutting off part of your genitals permanently and without consent, that’s the same. If your friend cannot separate the normalization of circumcision in society enough to see that they are as similar as they could practically be, there is no point in discussing it further. Without factoring in that normalization I see nothing that could possibly support a gendered stance on this - we are talking about CHILDREN here.

Maybe remind her that the “men” she is overlooking were all actually newborn babies.

biff64gc · 2021-12-30T12:51:32+00:00

You have to first keep them from derailing the discussion with red herrings.

"Does the human rights violations in other countries make male circumcision good? Is it not possible to support and advocate for more than one thing at a time? Those things are horrible, but are not relevant to the topic of the legality of male circumcision in developed nations that value equality."

advocating to make male circumcision illegal in no way detracts from other issues. It's a straightforward argument that can be fixed with a stroke of a pen.

McFeely_Smackup · 2021-12-30T17:47:43+00:00

She got vocally angry that because women around the world suffer the horrible atrocities of female circumcision, it’s dumb for society to care and prioritize campaigning against male circumcision in America

this tells you that she actively supports male genital mutilation. Pretending you can't care about both when it's literally as easy as "don't cut ANY baby genitals" tells the entire story.

Based_Hootless · 2021-12-30T14:45:16+00:00

“My body my choice” is an idiotic axiom in its pretense, and no one actually believes it. It’s really just a platitude. For example, would anyone in his or her right mind claim that a pregnant mother should be allowed to smoke crack? Should pregnant women be allowed to drink a fifth of vodka every night? I actually support reproductive rights and I’m against genital mutilation (read: “circumcision”) but it has nothing to do with “choice” and everything to do with informed medical reasoning. It should never be one person’s choice.

Die_Before_I_Wake · 2021-12-30T20:07:42+00:00

Funny how typing "genital mutilation" in Google only links sites regarding female genital mutilation.

Yet in my country, circumsison is widely accepted as a nessecity into manhood.

Seeker-of-Sacred · 2021-12-30T10:24:35+00:00

If a person wants circumcision then they can decide for themselves when they're an adult.

LetTheRainsFall · 2021-12-30T08:21:36+00:00

Remind her that she should ask a child for a hug rather than just demand one because the child's consent matters. That she dhould never touch a kid, or anyone, without consent. That a child should not have a medically unnecessary procedure as they can't consent to it.

If that fails, insist she get a new piercing or q tattoo if your name, because consent doesn't matter, does it?

SteveWozHappeningNow · 2021-12-30T14:39:57+00:00

Ask her how she feels about prioritizing women's rights in the US when women are so oppressed across the world's especially in Muslim countries.

Kaylarmagic · 2021-12-30T15:53:39+00:00

Right, cause two wrongs make a right. Your friend sounds really stupid.

Souseisekigun · 2021-12-30T18:43:24+00:00

She got vocally angry that because women around the world suffer the horrible atrocities of female circumcision, it’s dumb for society to care and prioritize campaigning against male circumcision in America.

This is just "why feminism in West when Saudi Arabia exists?" in reverse.

HeterogameticHuman · 2021-12-30T21:19:31+00:00

Misandry is alive and well. I care for boys and men, the way feminist care about girls and women. I will fight for baby boys, because nobody else is.

the-first12 · 2021-12-30T12:16:27+00:00

Personally I believe it is more important to get our house in order, then try to spread the word outward.

The biggest issue is that MGM and FGM should not be mutually exclusive.

bob4256 · 2021-12-30T13:39:04+00:00

Just show her one of the thousands of infant male circumcisions on the internet.

BuckyShots · 2021-12-30T14:39:37+00:00

Her argument is like saying “all lives matter.” No one is saying female circumcising isn’t terrible, but here we have a male circumcision problem.

JustSomeYukoner · 2021-12-30T17:04:32+00:00

Genital mutilation is genital mutilation. Make it female, it doesn’t matter. Both are atrocious and should never happen without that person express permission.

TyrosineSimp · 2021-12-30T17:14:52+00:00

Why is there this weird dichotomy? ¿Por qué no los dos?

rahsoft · 2021-12-31T00:44:27+00:00

She got vocally angry that because women around the world suffer the horrible atrocities of female circumcision

my ex wife has been circumcised as a baby and complained to me about it.

I asked her how far it went ( and confirmed with one of her friends) that it had only been a nick and that it was done in her own country to every woman as a tradition ( I also found out it was also done to the boys). in modern times it done with a laser at the hospital.

so when I pointed out that it was appaling to do that to her and likewise where as she had a nick, the boys had a piece of tissue cut off.

"but it violated me !"

Yes, i agree , but it also violated the boys and you cant use religion( islam) or culture to excuse it..

There are many reasons why i left her, and one of which was the vile behaviour her of telling me that if the local authorities( we were living in the gulf as expats) told her to circumcise our daughter, she would do it.

When I asked why , especially given her own complaint, she told me she was worried that she would lose her very well paid job as an international lawyer, and we would be deported.

So I then told her then that would be good because our daughter's bodily integrity is worth far more than any job and certainly has no price on it..

My point is that some people can be serious hypocrites about MGM and FGM when it benefits them, such as the "my body, my choice" which means "some bodies are more equal than others"....

barnagotte · 2021-12-30T11:43:56+00:00

Thing is, female circumcision is NOT an issue in the US, or very marginally so. While male circumcistion impacts millions baby boys a year, maims thousands and kill hundreds. The priority should lie where it should lie : MGM is the more pressing issue in the western world.

MysilOil · 2021-12-30T11:43:30+00:00

There is no benefit of male circumcision. It’s not more hygienic and it does absolutely nothing other than reducing your weight with 5 grams or so

15squareinches · 2021-12-30T12:13:48+00:00

reasons used to justify male cutting are being adopted for those who want to cut females. If she wants to end female cutting, supporting the end of male cutting would help. All people with healthy genitals have the right to avoid forced genital cutting.

StinkingDischarge · 2021-12-30T12:23:00+00:00

She got vocally angry that because women around the world suffer the horrible atrocities of female circumcision, it’s dumb for society to care and prioritize campaigning against male circumcision in America.

If she really feels that strongly about what is being done to women in other countries perhaps she should give up her cushy, sheltered life in the West and go crusade for women's rights in the shithole countries where this is actually happening. Except we know this is not going to happen.

Andrew_Squared · 2021-12-30T12:24:52+00:00

Ask how she enjoys having her genitals intact, and if she thinks boys should be able to enjoy the same.

OctaviaPinfold · 2021-12-30T13:51:02+00:00

You can't argue with people who can't see the forest from the tree.

2021-12-30T14:04:43+00:00

As a guy who already has a smol pp, why'd you have to circumcise it. I'm insecure now. I thought it was normal until.. It's smaller i don't like it. What the benefit i don't even know

Sea2Chi · 2021-12-30T15:31:36+00:00

I've used the analogy that it's like a gunshot victim and a stabbing victim arguing over who has it worse. When in reality it doesn't matter who has it worse because neither should be happening.

makosh22 · 2021-12-30T15:32:28+00:00

No way to make such ppl think about others. so i just say smth like "I don't argue with narrow-minded egocentric ppl" and quite.

flip69 · 2021-12-30T17:12:34+00:00

She like so many others are, in a word:

Hypocrites

This is at least in part due to the "Them vs Us" mentality... that all men are "others" and not due to same rights as they're all guilty of crimes and oppression - that they can't be abused.
I find that this is the subtext of all feminism.

Old-Acanthaceae6226 · 2021-12-30T18:53:51+00:00

How do you argue with these people that “my body my choice” isn’t exclusively a female right?

Say exactly that.

Usernameforgotmine · 2021-12-31T10:15:52+00:00

Woman here; it’s absolutely still mutilation and should be treated as such culturally and in law. Your bodies are no different in value.

Borne_in_oz · 2021-12-30T11:32:10+00:00

Yeah they should really make the age barrier for that at least 18. If you’re old enough to make the sex, you’re old enough to decide how to experience the sex.

Embarrassed_Ant6605 · 2021-12-30T11:34:30+00:00

I’m not campaigning to end circumcision, I personally am not cut and here in the uk it’s more common for a man to be intact. But I do believe it’s a barbaric act of mutilation and should be outlawed.

I also believe that a women isn’t allowed to voice an opinion on this subject.

pargofan · 2021-12-30T11:41:29+00:00

Why not throw the women are sexist card?

barnagotte · 2021-12-30T11:45:07+00:00

Also, there's nothing you can do about FGM in thirld world countries in a distant continent that is so deeply ingrained in their culture and religion. While in the USA, people just need a gentle nudge of EDUCATION to abstain from mutilating their sons forever. That's where activism should lie!

Bone-Juice · 2021-12-30T12:40:19+00:00

How do you argue with these people that “my body my choice” isn’t exclusively a female right?

Anyone who thinks this is exclusively female is an idiot and likely the type that would cut off their own nose to spite their face.

I do not understand why she would think that people are not able to support both causes.

Keats852 · 2021-12-30T15:19:15+00:00

Don't argue, there's no point. Unless she's a fwb or a potential long term marriage candidate, you have 0 reasons to be friends with her, especially when she sounds crazy. Also, you can't win with people like that.

MezzaCorux · 2021-12-30T18:26:36+00:00

It's also more hygienic if you cut off your arm cause now it won't get dirty.

hifi3xx · 2021-12-30T18:57:09+00:00

You don't they are dumb narcissistic hypocrites that will never admit that they are wrong. Or what they want for themselves should also be given to those that they try to demonize (ie men should not have the same rights to their body that women do)

Fast_Box_8509 · 2021-12-30T20:56:27+00:00

If you engaged the same woman in an argument about women's rights in the States/the Western World versus the rest of the world, and brought up that women in the rest of the world, but specifically in the Indian Subcontinent, Africa and the Middle East have it harder than women in the west (a group that includes HER), I would be willing to literally bet money on her accusing you of using a red herring. I'd bet literal money on it.

compmanio36 · 2021-12-30T22:55:05+00:00

I ask them "Why are you a sexist bigot?" and make them defend their position.

A rule of thumb for whether or not something is wrong, is to turn around the position they take against their gender/race/etc and ask them if it's OK then. If not, then you tell them "Congrats, you're just like those misogynists/slave owners/etc in the past that justified their bigotry and hatred."

They probably still won't accept it, but at least you might plant the seed of thought into their minds.

reddut_gang · 2021-12-31T01:54:02+00:00

It saddens me that Americans care so much less about their own brothers than their sisters from afar. Of course it's important to care about both, but if there's atrocities going on in your own damn home, shouldn't you focus on fixing those first?

xSmokingBarrelx · 2021-12-31T04:26:28+00:00

It might be archaic in the cultures you interact with. But I have been to a lot of places on this planet and let me tell you... it was a struggle to convince some cleaning staff they should not clean the kitchen counters with the same rag they cleaned the toilets. That is not an exaggeration.

Algiz56 · 2021-12-31T09:22:21+00:00

She has no say in it, because it is not her body part that was cut. So she should politely shut the fuck up.

AdAcademic4290 · 2021-12-31T11:35:59+00:00

The 'hygiene ' arguments are absurd. All mammals throughout history in all climates have foreskin, aside from the duck billed platypus and the echidna. Strangely, they all manage to live their whole lives without 'needing ' to be circumcised. And they don't even have hands!

In circumcised cultures only humans are targeted for cutting, not other mammals. Goats, for example, I've in jungles, deserts, mountains and moors. They don't suffer from the mysterious foreskin maladies of the American male human.

ProfitHour4768 · 2021-12-31T12:00:20+00:00

You dont. You don't argue because it's a waste of time you will disagree anyways just focus on other topics. But if it makes you feel better I personally am against any kind of circumcision male and female and advocating for one does not negate the other. In other words making awareness in the USA about male circumcision and how unnecessary it is (unless medically required) does not take away from the severity of female circumsisions in the rest of the world.

xcheshirecatxx · 2021-12-31T17:17:10+00:00

Fgm is illegal everywhere except 7 countries, and has campaigns against it since years Feminists care

... Mgm is legal everywhere. J's complain as soon as a ban is discussed so we withdraw... And no one cares

Wolf_Man_Boy · 2022-01-01T18:49:10+00:00

Funny how “my body, my choice” is only used when it’s convenient for feminists.

Technic-AL-26 · 2022-01-10T23:12:17+00:00

I always tell people that if a Mother is okay with male circumcision because of the aesthetic, she should be circumcised right with him because of equal rights.

Silly-Leg-1124 · 2021-12-30T08:02:25+00:00

You don’t argue

Substantial-Hold-851 · 2021-12-30T22:18:24+00:00

My big point I make is that the male foreskin is removed to “help prevent HIV/ AIDS transmission along with other STDs”. The clitoral hood is foreskin, why is it not removed? Are women incapable of passing STDs to others? No? So why are we only removing boys foreskin?

You can also bring up the amount of times parents weren’t even asked if they wanted the boys foreskin removed, they just did it. I don’t know it for certain, but that may be in violation of medical ethics and potentially the law since you did something that major without so much as asking.

Xx24reminder · 2021-12-30T20:37:55+00:00

She's not your friend. She's your enemy. Do everything to rally people against her and be malicious. Leak all her embarrassing secrets if you know any. She just declared war.

GrandpaBRUH · 2021-12-30T18:54:09+00:00

My friends son had to get circumcised a few months ago for genuine medical reasons. While forced circumcision is wrong don’t blanket cover circumcision.

Itrusttheinternett · 2021-12-30T15:06:45+00:00

Unless I misunderstood, she is arguing that women should take priority because they are most affected.

And I can see the logic - 2 million girls and 13 million boys are circumcised every year.

Of the two million girls, they can suffer very detrimental effects, by a percentage I would say that women have worse outcomes for their health and sexuality.

However, I would also say that 2 million girls is 11 million less than what is happening to the men, and by sheer numbers alone I would guess that the quantity of death, disability, and disfigurement is higher for men, considering that 1000 men are meant to have died in south Africa alone from ritual circumcision, and that 2000 men have lossed their penis since 1995.

https://en.mercopress.com/2021/12/20/23-south-african-teenagers-killed-in-initiation-rite-this-year

The other arguments as to why we should start here, on home terf, is that we are going to have the biggest impact. We can fix these issues much more easily than sending funds and missionaries over seas.

It's great saying we should fix the whole world, but you should start with your own country because it's a lot more practical.

Would you say that stabbings shouldn't be looked into until all murders are solved? Or is it the case that only a certain number of officers can be enrolled on each case and it would be over-encumbering and impractical to do that.

Would this person recommend sending police officers from one country to investigate murders in another country, because murder is the worst crime you can commit and so it should be prioritized? Or do they see the impracticality of that, the lack of benefit vs cost, and the waste that would be involved?

MarBitt · 2021-12-30T12:12:37+00:00

It is not either a male circumcision in America or a female circumcision in the world. The most effective is clear and loud resistance to any circumcision, anywhere.

The more people feel that the campaign protects their interests, the more support they will have.

The time you argued, you could work together to do something small against circumcision everywhere. That's how it works - the most effective is the cooperation of men and women with the same goal in unity.

And how to argue? She is your female friend, trust her and lead by example. Show her that female circumcision really bothers you and that you're willing to do something against it.

BasedHeretic89 · 2021-12-30T17:36:26+00:00

You don't. You separate yourself until society starts doing the same. Then they either fall in line like they did originally, or get exiled.

2021-12-30T17:56:20+00:00

Let me guess, she's pro-abortion. But they want to mutilate boys without giving them any choice in the matter. Also no, that vile, evil, piece of crap is not your friend, if she's advocating for mutilation of men while bitching and moaning how the same procedure makes her kind suffer. She's a feminist hypocrite, NOT your friend. This alone should prove that you're nothing more than a disposable tool in her eyes. She's blind to yours and your brothers' pain, because she doesn't see you as human.

flancocho555 · 2022-02-17T09:33:23+00:00

These are probably the same people that are okay with people transitioning from one gender to the other and by that I mean a full blown operation 😭 at least a circumcision is just a little piece of skin… anyone like to buy boneless skinless chicken?😅

Anna0303 · 2022-03-06T23:24:28+00:00

Cutting of kid genitals should be illegal. Male or female.

Lexitorius · 2021-12-30T11:11:14+00:00

I still don’t see a problem with male circumcision from my own experience. I was circumcised and I don’t remember a damn thing

Jotnarsheir · 2021-12-30T10:25:19+00:00

Never bring up MGM when somebody is ranting about FGM. They want to be heard; to feel like they are a good advocate against FGM.
I'd you are not able to validate their conserns, before you say say MGM is also a problem, it will come off as dismissive, or as you are arguing "We need to fix MGM, before we do anything about FGM."

Obviously, it's not a zero sum game. No person should have their genitalia permanently altered with out their consent for cosmetically or prophylactic reasons.

FlatspinZA · 2021-12-30T11:45:24+00:00

To be fair:

Women getting mutilated because of a crazy religious belief is not exactly the same as men losing their foreskin.

For women, they lose all pleasure from the act of sex (as intended), while men might lose some sensation, but not the ultimate pleasure.

I don't think it's remotely reasonable to conflate the two as equal measures of harm.

_Maxie_ · 2021-12-30T22:18:48+00:00

I'm going to be real with you Chief, a small cut that is done for cleanliness and appearance isn't really on the same level of what many Eastern countries put women under - with them being whole ass adults.

This comes across as men trying to bandwagon onto an argument about.... abortion... using our dicks and would make any woman reading this immediately lose any support they had for men's rights.

It should not be mandatory, but thing is, it isn't - it was a choice your parents made. Circling back to "my body, my choice", the current narrative is that a woman has full rights to do whatever she wants to her baby while still inside of her with some wanting that to extend right up until birth... so the topic of circumcision won't be one we're going to win on until pro-choice arguments die down.

Off topic though, as a gay man, circumcised looks so much fucking better so please don't shame yourself, most sexual partners prefer it and there are benefits to it unlike something along the lines of female circumcision which is done solely as a punishment to prevent them from sexual pleasure.

dtyler86 · 2021-12-30T16:31:55+00:00

I think it's fine to oppose male circumcision on ethical grounds.

I think it's disingenuous and immoral to conflate it with FGM. It's no different than PETA's "Holocaust on your plate" campaign.

usku · 2021-12-30T15:32:02+00:00

It’s about consent. In this case your mother and father consent for you.

And since when did mensrights become all about circumcision? It seems like every three days we get a new post full of rabid vitriol.

Perhaps we need a mega thread. This way those of us who don’t give a shit about circumcision can ignore it.

Jethr0Paladin · 2021-12-30T21:56:30+00:00

Male circumcision is the correct thing to do.

Individual_Recipe_83 · 2021-12-30T20:14:12+00:00

Circumcision is for prevention of diseases in the penis.

Title	Argument of male circumcision
Author	dtyler86
Upvotes	683
Comments	195
Date	December 30, 2021 8:01 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/rrwamo/argument_of_male_circumcision/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/argument-of-male-circumcision.1089965 https://theredarchive.com/post/1089965

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