Is it wrong to want what The Red Pill supposedly promises, or is The Red Pill simply the wrong way to get it?

SmallSituation6432 · 2023-01-07T00:45:14+00:00

The problem here is that the promise is so limited in scope compared to the infinite ways humans interact that it's almost offensive. The defining part is "You want women to not waste time with small talk and see you purely for your sexual value and little else." What? why do you want that? I noticed your argument that its a reaction to what women value. "The red pill thinking is that women aren't really interested in nonsexual men." You also define "sexual men" so broadly that it has nothing to do with sex. "Be a purely sexual being. It's not just about being desirable, it's about not being the kind of supposed "loser" who gets stuck being an "emotional sponge."

My point here is that you are not comparing alternatives, you're reducing every other alternative to red pill language. If being a sexual man means being someone that women can find interesting and might want to have sex with, guess what? you already qualify. Nearly every man that engages in society on a meaningful level qualifies. What do the women you're interested in value? I seriously doubt its telling them they only like alphas and that guy friends are losers and emotional sponges.

As for guides, again this is a result of your reductive language. There are plenty of guides to help people become more interesting and sociable. "but that doesn't address guides to achieve sex" you may respond. No, they won't but they do address all things you use to defend you're language about "sexual men".

TL:DR If your looking for alternatives actually treat them as alternatives, not just imperfect forms of arguments you are already familiar with.

nemma88 · 2023-01-07T00:06:04+00:00

"If The Red Pill is wrong, how come The Blue Pill doesn't offer an alternative guide?"

BP doesn't need a guide for it. They either don't want it, or don't have trouble attaining it without having to refer to a guide.

BP as 'not RP', spans the most successful to the least successful guys in the world on any metrics you want.

CruelAngelGradThesis · 2023-01-06T23:03:02+00:00

You're tired of being the man that women will only talk about their feelings or hobbies with. At best. You want to exude masculine sexuality. You want women to not waste time with small talk and see you purely for your sexual value and little else.

All of this just sounds like a weird, loaded way to say "I want to have casual sex."

From a purely secular worldview standpoint there is nothing odd or objectionable about that.

Safinated · 2023-01-07T03:45:44+00:00

the only way the red pill is wrong is that they think it works on every woman, not just susceptible women, and their general air of “only women do bad things/society is against men”

CurrentInteresting32 · 2023-01-07T03:45:24+00:00

Women think that a man wanting to be more sexually attractive is gross, and they find the discussion of it misogynistic. I don’t quite understand why.
Women also think it’s perfectly normal for women to try to become more sexually attractive to men. Reference every issue of cosmopolitan and the 100 billion dollar make up and plastic surgery industry.
Women think it is highly manipulative to learn conversation starters and tips on how to flirt.
Changing your entire appearance artificially perfectly normal and acceptable.

The blue pill guide is be yourself and eventually results will come. It is a prison sentence meant to keep you out of the dating game so they won’t waste time on you.

vapordaveremix · 2023-01-06T22:53:53+00:00

Disclaimer: I'm not BP. I am ex-RP.

There's nothing wrong with wanting to be seen as sexually desirable. Most everyone does.

But if you zoom out, get some life experience, and look at the Red Pill, it's a view of status and masculinity as seen through the eyes of teenagers and young men. It's immature and lacks wisdom.

RP measures men by sexual worth so they can get women, but men can be measured countless ways. TRP doesn't talk about what makes a good man, an honorable man, a leader, a father or husband. It's basically bravado and pickup techniques - a narrow slice of the human condition.

That's why it's kind of ridiculous to ask for alternatives, at least in my opinion, because the rest of human existence is your alternative. Being a person with character is what gets you real attention.

jonascf · 2023-01-06T23:36:06+00:00

"You're tired of being the man that women will only talk about their feelings or hobbies with. At best. You want to exude masculine sexuality. You want women to not waste time with small talk and see you purely for your sexual value and little else."

I wouldn't say it's wrong to want this, but it's certainly misguided and I don't think it actually makes any man happier.

Being sexually desired is nice, for sure, but I can't see how sex without a personal connection can be anything but empty and bland.

Ohyarlysmiles · 2023-01-07T00:14:00+00:00

The Red Pill is the wrong way to get it.

My issue with the Red Pill has nothing to do with it being misogynistic and hateful (which it is). My issue has everything to do with the most manly concern of all: results.

There is no short term mating bag of tricks that will get a woman to be attracted to you who was not otherwise already attracted to you.

Read it over and over and over and over again.

The only context in which your personality can --- and does --- make you more attractive, is over a long period of time, which is outside the purview of what the Red Pill promises.

The alternative guide is to know that anything short-term comes primarily down to superficialities --- looks, her mood, what she ate that day, etc.

If you want more in the short-term game, then there's no shortcut beyond making yourself look better.

If you want more in the long-term game, it's infinitely better to just be yourself because your personality will attract the right person for you.

You want women to not waste time with small talk and see you purely for your sexual value and little else."

Gross. This is how we know the people hooked by this 'fantasy' or the people who concocted it really have never meaningfully experienced it.

It's not a pleasant feeling.

96tillinfinity_ · 2023-01-06T23:18:46+00:00

Rollo Tomasi has the best view on it

SoldierExcelsior · 2023-01-07T10:16:23+00:00

The red pull is about making men aware of female nature what you do with this knowledge is up to you.....You can go MGTOW you can Follow PUAs you can be Black Pill ...the thing is now that you've awaken from the matrix you see the world for what it is..you understand female nature and why they do what they do...and you deal with them in the way of your choosing.

Green-Quantity1032 · 2023-01-07T04:25:17+00:00

So how do you compete?

You go to the fucking gym, you eat and sleep right.

You groom, you take daily showers and you dress well.

Then you go out and you stop being a bitch and you start talking to women.

You initiate being physical (light touching) with women.

If they seem to reciprocate you initiate more intense physicality with women.

Rinse, repeat.

As time passes you'll be better socially, and you'll look better from the gym, eating, sleeping and fashion habits.

When you feel confident in your looks, get some (professional but candid) dating pictures taken, and install OLD, but expect OLD to suck - you can however supplement dates from there.

You'll get rejected, you'll be told to fuck off, you'll come back again the next night.

After 6 months of that you should see significant improvement*, keep going.

That's what it takes. Ready to compete?

*Improvement caveats:

- Don't be a dwarf (check average height in your area, don't be shorter than average by more than 1std) - the dwarfier the harder you'll have to work

- Don't be ugly - the less handsome the harder you'll have to work.

- Don't have low T - the less T the harder you'll have to work (at the gym).

- Don't be neuroatypical - the less socially savvy you are, the harder.. yeah, be socially savvy (see "go out and stop being a bitch" section), or be really fucking hot.

ZealousidealAd7191 · 2023-01-07T00:46:09+00:00

The Red Pill doesn’t promise anything. The Red Pill is just truth…

Lift_and_Lurk · 2023-01-06T23:24:14+00:00

I’ve said it before “a shitty plan is better than no plan at all” The only thing is all I see most dudes do with the RP is say “I have a plan now! And now I won’t get fooled by the womenz!” Then do nothing but talk about the RP, post about the RP watch YouTube content on RP and do zero self improvement.

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2023-01-07T08:20:16+00:00

I think being seen purely for sexual value is a bit fucked up, although I get the appeal.

The blue pill has an alternative kink and BDSM. Same thing, same energy, connecting to that submissive female, reaching in and pulling dominance, it's just framed in a PG-13 way with rules and cosplay.

NJFlowerchild · 2023-01-07T12:31:25+00:00

The redpill says you can become more sexually attractive by being fit, having status, and having money. It doesn't say you will become sexually attractive and get opportunities with women you want. The red pill is supposed to be about self improvement and fixing your shit to be worth it. There's no promise.

Flightlessbirbz · 2023-01-07T17:37:51+00:00

There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be seen as sexually attractive, obviously. The issue tends to come about with the only wanting to be seen sexually by women part… why is that? Well, seems like that would be because you don’t see any value in women for anything else. When having to talk to women and pretend to sorta like them before getting in their pants is portrayed as some kind of awful chore, I don’t think anyone would be wrong to assume you do not like women.

Imagine reading content for women who are gold diggers, and their stated goal is to get men to see them as someone to give money to and nothing else. The less pesky small talk the better. Everything is intended to get him to hand over money and gifts ASAP. Okay, you might say, if that’s their goal, that’s their goal. Maybe you see that as amoral too. But do you want anything to do with these women? Do you think positively of them? I’m gonna guess the answer is no. And that’s how most women feel about RP men.

Lyzard96 · 2023-01-06T23:45:26+00:00

It's stupid to want what the red pill claims to promise. Some people don't get casual sex, or even need or actually want it for that matter. It puts the unrealistic standard on all men that they HAVE to be Alpha chads who fuck young hotties and have Bugattis or they're losers.

Title	Is it wrong to want what The Red Pill supposedly promises, or is The Red Pill simply the wrong way to get it?
Author	FrothySolutions
Upvotes	5
Comments	155
Date	January 6, 2023 10:37 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1057ulh/is_it_wrong_to_want_what_the_red_pill_supposedly/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-it-wrong-to-want-what-the-red-pill-supposedly.1146710 https://theredarchive.com/post/1146710

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