Be a fucking value giver

SartorialFresh · 2013-07-29T17:57:32+00:00

I agree to give value, but it depends to whom and when. Don't go telling a hot girl that she's hot, she's heard it a billion times. probably within the hour. The girl you were talking to sounds like she was at least a bit insecure, which means you obviously you shouldn't neg her. If I make out with a hot girl though and she makes some sort of smart ass comment about how good she is, or how it was, I'll usually reply "meh you passed" but with a genuine smile, so it's a bit of both and push-pull works magic.

huphelmeyer · 2013-07-29T17:15:33+00:00

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KitsBeach · 2013-07-29T18:50:44+00:00

Also known as the campsite rule.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Campsite%20rule

As a female, this is a quality I hold higher than attractiveness in men. This one belongs in your notebook.

Dokubi · 2013-07-29T18:14:01+00:00

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krypto1339 · 2013-07-29T16:56:28+00:00

Hear, fucking hear.

the_brick_attack · 2013-07-29T19:50:25+00:00

Teasing is not necessarily negging or taking value. It is often a showing of acceptance in a group. Teasing is meant to actually be affirming. It should not actually cut someone down.

itsmevichet · 2013-07-29T18:52:09+00:00

I should also note that when we began hooking up on the beach, the first thing she said was "I've had sex in the ocean before. I'm not having sex with you though". I smirked and replied "Ok". I didn't push things too far in that hookup because a friend was waiting on us. However, after that meetup and a few texts exchanged, she texts me out of nowhere (completely irrelevant to the conversation): "I want to have sex with you".

You have no idea how many times this has worked for me.

When I'm single and spinning plates, I just take the 'ole "I'm not having sex with you" at face value.

"Okay, sure," I say, and just continue whatever else we were doing. It literally doesn't even affect me. Then before the date has run out of steam, I call it a night - leave at a high point.

The girl is always surprised, even when she tries to hide it, that I'm totally cool not having sex with her. It helps that I'm known to be a horn dog - thing is, I got my shit under control, and I'm at the mercy of no particular girl about my sexual fulfillment.

Because I'm in a position to actually be totally okay not having sex with a girl, 9 times out of 10, the same girl would be making plans to ride Space Mountain later that week. It's amazing.

Completely negates any shit-test aspect of it, if there are any to begin with.

2013-07-30T01:15:36+00:00

You have the right idea in what you're doing but giving value is about so much more than treating a girl well and being a great, genuine, and confident guy. It's a change in lifestyle and a change in perspective in everything you do. With your perspective now, I bet you will be a tremendous value giver to the friends, family, and females in your life someday. But that will be only once you actually HAVE value to give. Unfortunately, at 18, there isn't much.

Also, I hate to be THAT guy and say it, but you're 18. Pretty much anything you do with females your age is going to work so long as you're interesting and reasonably attractive. Girls your age are going to be pretty damn immature on average. Once you have more experience with women who've matured, you'll find a noticeable change in your maturity and adjust your approach accordingly.

Keep doin', what you're doing and you're gonna be the fuckin' man in college. I may get downvoted for this opinion (as the demographic of Seddit has become a bit younger), but it's just kind of annoying to see posts by those with little experience framed and worded as if OP is an expert.

davidtee69 · 2013-07-29T17:15:11+00:00

Mark Manson's book is absolute quality. Open up, show your vulnerabilities, stop trying to come across as the "perfect man" all the time and women will love you a whole lot more. Nice work bro.

Night-watcher · 2013-07-29T17:22:45+00:00

Isn't it pretty standard that women who get compliments all the time (i.e. hot egotistical ones) need negging/teasing to attract, and ones that feel insecure needs compliments/respect to attract?

fragglemook · 2013-07-30T09:15:50+00:00

and had had decent success with all of it

What do you mean by success? Did you fuck them all? How many?

Also, you're 18. You have a limited frame of reference.

Value giving is just one way of looking at things. While you're "giving value" and engaging her with dancing monkey syndrome, someone like me is coming in behind you and AMOGing her away in the blinking of an eye. Grabbing her and walking out the door.

The only value I give her in that event is in my pants.

Motherfucker.

doubledip10 · 2013-07-30T12:24:50+00:00

Be careful with that. You still have to adhere to cat-string theory. I was pretty good at seduction before I met my last girl, and the first six months we dated I really fell for her but I was cautious and kept up the negs and played hard to get. After that I found so much joy in making her feel good I turned into the classic knight in shining armor. Bought her nice things, told her how much I loved her and how pretty she was every day, I fucking wrote her a song, and I thought this was it for me, Game over, and I started saving up for a ring... Very AFC.

Fast forward six months and she said that she had anxiety and needed some time off, within a week she started dating a new guy who was a total tool. When trying to figure out what I did wrong the only thing I could think of was that I was not challenging her. She got what she wanted and I kinda turned into a bitch. Its fine to compliment and play the put up game but be careful letting a girl get her way too often. Cat string theory is essential to maintaining a successful relationship. If she knows she has you in her pocket she wont want you any more.

MoHelio · 2013-07-29T22:52:18+00:00

Might be a novice question but - how do you become a value giver? Could some one go a little in depth on this? Examples?

animaniatico · 2013-07-29T22:56:42+00:00

And how would you do to give value while on interactions?
Any reading place you'd point me at?

FountainsOfFluids · 2013-07-30T00:01:50+00:00

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thedizzle11 · 2013-07-30T04:12:29+00:00

that last piece of advice really hit home. Thank you.

Tropicalsloth · 2013-07-30T05:41:27+00:00

compliment an attractive girl on her little creative things, not just the obvious shes heard time after

curiousbutton · 2013-07-30T06:00:11+00:00

Sorry my question doesn't really relate to the story, and blame my pedantic anal-retentive ways, but the girl you mentioned, did she have any children? (I'm just trying to make sense of the last sentence of your post)

Good post by the way. Calibration is the key. In this case value you discovered that giving value worked, and you've calibrated to the situation.

TLAdaptC · 2013-07-30T07:41:20+00:00

Value as a person > seduction tricks to pull

rmbarnes · 2013-07-30T12:23:39+00:00

Guys need to be careful of drawing too many conclusions from one lay.

theshaynee · 2013-07-29T20:12:55+00:00

I've felt that before. It's a strange gut feeling. And you're right, there's no value in those exchanges. The trick, in my little opinion, is to neg to demonstrate value/humor and then, layer by layer, open up. Gives more meaning to the whole process and it feels like you get more out of it.

asad16 · 2013-07-29T20:09:27+00:00

I think you're mixing up two completely ideas and trying to form it into a theory/motivational post. I appreciate the sentiment, but you're off-base and it's quite ridiculous this got +90 upvotes

Gelnn · 2013-07-29T18:04:39+00:00

Teasing is fun but nobody ever said it helped you connect with another human being. Ultimately, if you want to analyze things to death, as far as we know, OP's target could be a genius supermodel yet her relationship with OP and how she sees his value is the key to how the genuine compliments or negs will affect her. If you haven't read the material, then you really can't comment on it. All of the big books are out there for everyone to read and everyone should go read them right now, if just for academic purposes.

Lough5280 · 2013-07-29T21:57:49+00:00

Control your ego guy. The timing of the story may have taken away from the legitimacy of your theory. Teasing women and making them feel insecure only works on a very shallow level, I am sure that is the emptiness you felt.

The summer between high school and college was the best summer of my life. It is a magical time because you are around people who have built a reputation over the last 4 years that are going another direction with a fresh start. You can bang the dorky girl because the popular girl won't find out, even if they did who gives a shit you're going to college.. right?

I am not trying to burst your bubble but don't think that your one night stand will mean more than any other relationship this girl has

6mexicans · 2013-07-29T20:19:29+00:00

It's helpful to relate their best qualities to the women that people generally view as attractive.

n1cey · 2013-07-29T22:28:02+00:00

As everything else in life. Rewards and correction are given when deserved.

I use negging as a part of showing playfullness. In other words, only very little.

boxofcookies101 · 2013-07-29T23:02:36+00:00

Dude this is my motto. Makes life better.

m0pi1 · 2013-07-30T00:31:31+00:00

Addressing to why you didn't feel that emptiness is from the cliche yet true phrase: "it's better to give than to receive."

When you encourage others, you yourself get encouraged. Everyone should try it, especially when you are feeling rotten inside.

davidd00 · 2013-07-30T02:02:56+00:00

IMAGINE THAT.

racetored · 2013-07-30T02:26:57+00:00

Really great post, definitely could have used this before my date earlier. Thanks bro!

yea_tht_dnt_go_there · 2013-07-30T03:25:30+00:00

insecure girls are the easiest to hook up with. in my personal experience. some have proven to be the most loyal I've ever come across. some have been utter heartache.

superchibisan2 · 2013-07-30T04:04:32+00:00

being nice is actually a great way to make friends, and women LOVE compliments, irregardless of how cheesy they are.

otherworlds · 2013-07-30T04:06:39+00:00

My biggest problem is I just can't get myself to act like this super confident "I don't care about you" alpha male type person that seems to attract females.

FountainsOfFluids · 2013-07-30T05:20:26+00:00

This is so fundamental to seduction that it is easily overlooked, and then when some kid "discovers" it for himself, he thinks he's a genius. Well, you are smarter than many, so I'll give you that.

Think about it for a second. Every seduction tactic and piece of advice (that is not some form of deception) comes from a place of value giving. It is foundational to being a self-assured guy, and everything you want to do while interacting with a woman is either value giving or an indication that you have value to give when you wish.

ContemplativeOctopus · 2013-07-30T06:06:16+00:00

Guys I'm feeling all tingly inside...

hamster_of_war · 2013-07-30T09:56:56+00:00

Can anyone elaborate what being a value giver exactly is? I actively be nice to people around me but I feel that this part is missing.

Sergnb · 2013-07-30T10:02:01+00:00

As someone that has been on the other end of this just recently, I can definitely confirm it really feels like fucking bliss to be treated seriously and with respect for once in your life.

It's ok to game and be playful, but I am a firm believer that once things get intimate, there's a window of opportunity to make that "opening" step and I find it really sad that not many people are willing to take it or are even aware that they could.

baldrad · 2013-07-30T13:18:37+00:00

here is my view on all of this.

When it comes to negging, if its done for the pure intent to get something, it is purely putting someone down to put yourself higher on a pedestal. I don't think that is the exact complete purpose of this.

Do it in fun, laughter and smiles. If done right, she doesn't feel like a piece of shit at the end of the night, filled with even more insecurities and you seem like a lot of fun and those can turn into a game.

neg something, jokingly, and then when she tries to say it isn't true or what not, tell her to disprove it.

at the same time, do not drown her in compliments She hears that stuff all the time. and while she doesn't believe a single one deep down, save that stuff for trying to build a real connection ( like this person did )

Nutz76 · 2013-07-30T13:59:26+00:00

No, you don't give value. It has to be earned and something people get from being around you as a part of who you are. If you have to "give it away" then you're no different from the chump who over-invests by buying flowers, candy, and little stuffed animals by the 3rd date.

When you ARE high value, someone of status, then they'll get benefits of being around you as happenstance. That's what it means when people talk about value--it's just part of your identity. By virtue of them being in your life they'll gain some form of benefit from it.

A lot of guys are going to read the OP and take it seriously and completely misinterpret it, which a ton already have, evidenced by the large number of upvotes.

know_comment · 2013-07-30T14:30:02+00:00

Your success could have been based on anything. She probably just really liked you for you.

That said, what you did was call her out on her insecurity. It's a step in cold reading. Negging is playing to their insecurity, but this is a step further. Women love it, because it puts you in the driver's seat. Telling someone about themselves is an instant intimate connection.

Dbossman · 2013-07-30T15:12:49+00:00

I drive a Ford! Flex!

redboat · 2013-07-30T16:00:22+00:00

Was the attraction mutual? Could it have become a relationship?

MistaFANG · 2013-07-30T16:43:32+00:00

Tell smart girls they're hot and hot girls they're smart.

YMMV

Sev7enEleven · 2013-07-30T18:28:28+00:00

Wow, man. I wish I knew what you did at that age. I'm not much older (21), but I feel like having that tidbit under my belt early on could have changed things in in a big way. Awesome stuff.

megustaelgato · 2013-07-31T19:08:26+00:00

How would you neg girls and turn into a positive thing for you?

pj-021 · 2013-08-02T12:20:23+00:00

dude this post made me so happy & put a genuine smile on my face! you know the thing with this subreddit that i personally don't really like (and i understand why it's like that) is that it's like all guys on here get in the game so much that they forget about real emotions and feelings, but this was a nice change, and i'm bout to turn 19 & you're almost 2years younger but you sound like a fuckin g bro, tippin my hat to ya lol, nice post.

DeltaCypher0 · 2014-01-03T02:50:13+00:00

Hey man, this is some good stuff. I've been lurking on the red pill for a few days, and this is one thing I haven't seen much of. Back in high school, I wasn't smashing girls left and right, but I was definitely closing with girls on the regular. Looking back, I was pretty alpha in my approach on women. Fast forward a few years, after a shitty end to an LTR, due to becoming pretty beta.. I've spent the last eleven months mostly in solitude, and have fallen out of social gatherings almost entirely. Now this was all by choice, for I was spending all of my time on introspection and reestablishing myself as a single man, honing in my interests, etc. Me time, whatever. Although I become a total loner and have suffered some of my "alpha edge" and my psychology has changed quite a bit, I definitely learned a lot of very valuable information. Most of it was spiritual, and one gem I took away from this time was that you have to treat people well. It's one thing to say nice things or talk about being a good person, but when you truly take action and express kindness, love, peace, etc, it is really powerful and is highly effective for any sort of relationship with other humans. Strengthening alpha attributes and such are all essential, but don't forget to be genuine with people and raise them up. Good stuff man.

Was_going_2_say_that · 2013-07-29T23:55:11+00:00

Ok stop swearing at me

K_131 · 2013-07-30T03:31:42+00:00

You'r halfway there--serious kudos. However, be cautious: there's something very benevolently sexist about heralding yourself as a "value giver." A true women of value (or one on the path towards being someone truly valuable) will not be oblivious to this.

Try seeing these women as intrinsically valuable, not as something that needs you to grow--the reciprocity is where you find yourself growing in the process. You're young, and you'll be doing a lot of growing over the next few years.

charmingwit · 2013-07-30T08:31:38+00:00

"Be a value giver" would had been just fine. But seriously being genuine always works. What you were doing before was something you thought was cool because maybe a pua said it was cool. But it was not the real you. Thats why they say pros don't need negs, pros can take their girls out for expensive dinners and give them expensive gifts while maintaining attraction, its because they are being genuine and doing what they genuinely want to do.

dalviel · 2013-07-29T20:10:57+00:00

That story warmed the cockles of my heart man. What a sweetheart.

Title	Be a fucking value giver
Author	brb_gym
Upvotes	552
Comments	126
Date	July 29, 2013 4:26 PM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/1ja8tp/be_a_fucking_value_giver/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/be-a-fucking-value-giver.1356075 https://theredarchive.com/post/1356075

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