Men should underachieve to get what they want

owta_this_world · 2021-07-05T12:13:59+00:00

Looksmaxing has its limits as much of what makes you attractive is genetic and can only be improved so much. Even plastic surgery has limits. Worst of all personality is even harder to change than looks so if your personality is not attractive you got a steep hill to climb.

While a woman paying everything for you sounds nice, it doesn't happen for most men. Most men are expected to work otherwise you a loser. But men shouldn't slave their guts out to climb a corporate ladder when few will ever reach the top. The ones who do either have the correct traits (intelligence, personality traits) or connections (mostly nepotism) to make it to the top. If you don't have those you will plateau like most other men in some Office Space like job, a pointless existence but someone's gotta do it.

reluctantly_red · 2021-07-05T05:08:52+00:00

The guy working 60 hours a week is not going to have the energy to hit the gym

This is very true. After I got married I worked my regular job and took extra cases that I worked on at night. Given it was the middle of the Great Recession I was thankful I still had a decent job. My wife, however, had expensive tastes. I failed to meet expectations and she bailed (but not until she'd lined up a much richer beta chump).

Between work, stress, and lack of exercise to was a wreck when my ex left. Took several years to work my way back to health.

In retrospect, I would have been far better off if I'd invested my energies elsewhere.

SaBahRub · 2021-07-05T18:03:17+00:00

Only if they have a pickme wife willing and able to support them

DplusLplusKplusM · 2021-07-05T14:57:43+00:00

Yes, hobble the rest of your life and be willing to live in poverty just to appeal to a certain sort of women for the decade or so of life when you're super horny. This tactic doesn't take into consideration that generally speaking women would rather be alone than to be forced to date someone they're not attracted to. Guys choosing this option would only hasten the growing education gap between males and females.

NarniaFox · 2021-07-05T04:54:02+00:00

Balance and prioritizing are important.

I'd say that underachieving in career and education that you want to have in order to chase women is a pretty stupid idea. If that's what you want to do, you do you of course. The issue is that women generally aren't into men who "live at home with no responsibilities". That's a turn off, no one wants to be a nanny or a mommy to a grown up man.

Look at Japan. Although quite a big share of men describe themselves as herbivore, women don't want to settle for them. They just live their own lives.

Edit: also some men just want to have a comfortable lifestyle and quite expensive toys. Others actually like their job. It's not about getting women for a lot of them, but rather they pursue their own inspirations. And it's great.

AngryNurse2019 · 2021-07-06T07:55:53+00:00

Ah yes, the classiest MGTOW “Biting off your nose to spite you face.” Women DO have choices instead of settling, you know.

WhiskeyOnASunday93 · 2021-07-05T05:37:44+00:00

I don’t want to be a broke underemployed manchild playing video game all day for my own sense of dignity, not to get pussy.

Local-Coast3182 · 2021-07-05T19:38:53+00:00

The guy working 60 hours a week is not going to have the energy to hit the gym and go out and meet women.

I cannot stress this enough. While I was much younger I worked 50-70 hours a week, long grueling hours. By the time my shift ended I just wanted to sleep. I actually had a good amount of female interest but I was literally too tired to notice since my days off were catching up on sleep, doing any errands, and watching Netflix because I was still so tired. Meanwhile, the part-time guys at my work were getting laid and getting girlfriends. Unless, you need it to survive or it's only going to be for a few weeks nobody should ever work that much because you will have no life outside of work.

Genetic_Prisoner · 2021-07-05T17:56:38+00:00

Is it purge week already?

Historical-Agency334 · 2021-07-05T16:45:17+00:00

as a guy if you aren't either going to the gym (with steroids) and benching > 225 for 10 reps or becoming a deca millionaire then you are failing in the current marketplace unless you have a celebrity-level face.

4everrekt · 2021-07-05T11:34:49+00:00

Isn't it accurate to say that these men should set and strive toward their own standard of achievement?

NarniaFox · 2021-07-05T05:34:30+00:00

Considering your last paragraphs...most women aren't interested in dating leachers and they'd prefer to opt out from dating and being single and celibate rather than to have relationship they way you do.

If I haven't met my husband, I'd be pretty comfortable with living on my own. Or I could have tried dating a girl who expressed her interest in me later on. I believe that relationships make sense only if they make your life better. Not worse. And I consider having your life turning around a guy a huge downgrade comparing it to being single and enjoying yourself.

souredskittles · 2021-07-05T10:00:56+00:00

If men collectively keep lowering the bar women won’t settle. We just stay single. Sometimes I wonder if you’re a man or just hardcore pandering to get men onto your nsfw shit. Either way 👀🤮

Edit: lol it IS a ruse to get these poor saps on your OF 😂 that’s messed up, as you can see some of these guys are at their very low and here you are trying to sell them shit lmfao

headguts · 2021-07-08T20:56:29+00:00

On an individual level, people are a spectrum. Not everyone works 60 hours or gyms 4 hours a day. You've got a few false dichotomies going on there.

kissmetilyouredrunk · 2021-07-05T05:41:27+00:00

It benefits men in general if they 'unionize' and collectively decide to be losers. The individual man, though, will always benefit from being a scab

Uglinessisreal · 2021-07-05T10:36:42+00:00

Why do we assume that women will settle for men who offer nothing? In my extensive experience of being a guy that offers very little (lol), women are much happier being alone.

Most high achieving men end up finding the time to date despite their 60 hour work weeks, if anything the being high achieving at work means they have to put a lot less effort into finding a partner than more ordinary men.

just_a_place · 2021-07-07T05:35:54+00:00

The guy working 60 hours a week is not going to have the energy to hit the gym and go out and meet women."

Wanna bet? 😎 I have that type of energy.

Say I agree with everything you say. I quit my job I move back in with my folks, I stay to play some vidya (even though I wouldn't know where to start since I haven't played games since I was 13) I do minimal effort and just concentrate on looking good - although I already naturally look good. What in all honesty would you expect out of a guy like me now? For argument's sake lets say I am not abusive or anything towards you, I am just a very chill guy who enjoys very simple pleasures.

What would you then expect out of a relationship with me when you have to be the one who works while I stay home and maybe clean the house a little and just chill with leisure activities. Would that be ok with you? What are your expectations? What is it that you would desire from such a guy, how do you envision that relationship?

The porn hypothesis is intriguing since it does in fact seem like a growing number of girls are doing porn just to stay ahead of the desirability curve. The only men deriding women who do porn (record themselves having sex or giving a blowjob on pornhub or have OnlyFans accounts etc) are men who aren't even getting any pussy to begin with. It is incels who squeal the loudest against women doing porn even though they are the top consumers of it and they don't actually date girls at all. But the rest of us normal folk we really don't care much if a girl has done porn because honestly who the hell hasn't done porn nowadays? If you record yourself getting - or giving - a blowjob then guess what? You're a porn start now buddy.

There are videos of me out there on the internet and some of my girl friends have pornhub accounts where they upload their stuff, I know 2 girls who have onlyfans accounts and no I am not a star in any of their videos. I don't want to get too deep into that greasy world.

Are you saying you are happy being a pimped out bangmaid working to make that money for your man and give him your paycheck next to his steak ? 😳

Or is this more of a kink?

happygone25 · 2021-07-06T23:37:33+00:00

more time to looksmax and chase women

AFAIK looksmaxxing is pretty expensive and rather limited... in this day and age atleast

So hows a man to get the money to looksmax?

helloiamheretohelp · 2021-07-06T02:14:59+00:00

Take it as someone who has ‘looksmaxxed’ extensively:

Generally speaking leanness+muscularity is necessarily but not sufficient for most men to be considered ‘hot’. They also need a fuckton of cosmetic facial procedures that cost a lot of money. If you’re going for bimax or extensive eye area surgery plus other things like filler and cosmetic dentistry, you’re talking 50k + USD total easy.

That’s not even mentioning things like hair transplants/medication (dutasteride costs me a pretty penny), any extra facial implants, surgery revisions, and PEDs/steroids should he so choose to take his physique to the next level.

Improving your looks to the degree you are a catch for most young women is not a poor man’s game.

makinganimerealer · 2021-07-05T05:22:33+00:00

The sarcastic troll has a point, guys

TheDevilPutD · 2021-07-05T08:50:58+00:00

I personally wouldn't go that far, but you make a good point about breaking the work=sex equation that men are raised with. This equation says that unless you have something to contribute to society you are a worthless piece of shit undeserving of a woman. It forces men to overachieve, overwork, spend money on women in the hopes that one day they will be good enough to date a hot one.

Instead, I bypassed all of this and chose to feel good about myself and deserving of lots of women. Working and having a decent career was a plus to allow me to do whatever I wanted. Maybe I should have been pimping women out?

GrandRub · 2021-07-05T19:56:03+00:00

very true.

men that flaunt money,wealth just present themselves as "valuable tools" ... and tools will be used... not loved.

Estimator1313 · 2021-07-05T14:29:54+00:00

This feels like if someone wrote an opinion piece for The Onion...

bathwatermerchant · 2021-07-05T13:48:08+00:00

On a collective level hell the fuck yeah. If 50% of men were hitting the gym and the rest won't, it would make a difference, but since gym now is a go-to panacea for male lack of sexual success, it turned into a prerequisite to be dating at all. Women didn't follow the same craze, they just said "any fat gurl is a qween deserving a fit dude, so we won't lose our weight" and if you just manage to stay mildly fit as a women then you DO make the difference among hoards of landwhales and gym DOES work for you

Women's hypergamy doesn't want a good man, it wants the best man, so any time men as a collective do some kind of improvement then their smv resets and what was a positive characteristic is now a prerequisite

On a personal scale, its not all white and black. An average man is in a lose lose situation because he need both moneymaxx and looksmaxx to compensate his averageness. You can't quit job because you have to feed yourself and no women needs a broke average dude,you can't quit gym because no one needs your average ass even slightly chubby. You can't do something 40% and something 60% when you need both 102%.

Also talking about extremes,you should consider how your job can worsen your looks and your health. Extremely harmful working conditions may lead to rapid looks decline due to physical and mental stress, sleep deprevation, extreme temperatures, inhaling harmful substances etc, so what would be the point of earning more money when you turn into a saggy depressed amorphous sack of flesh in 5 years? Also if you become disabled by losing your limbs or becoming chairbound your life is over as a man, so I feel like men opting out of traditional role will lead to sharp decline in miners/factory workers/etc because it has no sense to kill or cripple yourself over some bleak hope of being a provider for non-existent family.

gunbusterxl · 2021-07-05T13:24:15+00:00

Nah, I'd rather make that $$$. I'll just use some of it to buy some cats, and the rest to have a better quality of life.

poppy_blu · 2021-07-05T11:45:14+00:00

demands that women look like bikini competitors

So he is also blind?

Weary-Fuel9174 · 2021-07-05T10:39:02+00:00

Sure, then all the immigrant guys from Middle-East will work even harder and educate themselves so that they become the ultimate catch. Also the Indian/Asian guys. The average white guy will lose this one, but sure go ahead

Eastuss · 2021-07-05T08:30:38+00:00

You should do the 20% efforts that yield 80% of the results. More is useless.

NockerJoe · 2021-07-05T05:13:25+00:00

Honestly I managed to figure this out and it works pretty well. I've always worked the fewest hours of my friend group but always been the one with the apartment who lived alone. I could try to work for promotions and I've been retraining on my own time for an adjacent industry during the pandemic, but thats because I enjoy the process and trying for a linear promotion means like an extra ten bucks a day for like double the working hours, which is absolutley not worth it.

I will say though there's a threshold. Earning a decent amount of money and having a space thats yours is essential because then you can live life on your own terms. But past that point being able to get a balanced amount of sleep and do things you personally enjoy blows the shit out of killing yourself to hit someone elses benchmarks, regardless of if thats a demanding boss or demanding partner. Life is way too short to waste jumping through hoops.

TheDevilPutD · 2021-07-05T04:56:02+00:00

I like you.

TomorrowsWar · 2021-07-05T05:35:16+00:00

Lol I feel like most guys I’ve seen on tinder already do this

stats135 · 2021-07-05T04:59:21+00:00

On an individual level: less time spent on education and work means more time to looksmaxx and chase women. The guy working 60 hours a week is not going to have the energy to hit the gym and go out and meet women.

So the options are:

1)Time>work, money, etc>sex

2)Time>going out, haircuts, fashion, chasing women, etc>sex

All men pay for sex one way or another. Which method is the most efficient is the eternal debate. I personally think paying for it is actually the cheaper option. A standard workday of 2 hours of work and 6 hours of pretending to work while surfing reddit basically guarantees sex. The same time commitment going out chasing women does not.

On a collective level: if men live up to women's standards, then women will just raise their standards. Because they can get even more out of men.

Totally agree here. The problem is that its game theory and we are already at an equilibrium. Great if the collective change happens, but hard to get there.

Third, underachieving is a guaranteed payout: entertainment and comfort. Living up to women's standards offers no guarantee. So if men fail, they have spent all that time and energy for nothing, while they could have been having a good time instead.

I guess its a matter of what type of achievement we are talking about. Going back to the first point, financial achievements guarantee sex and comfort. Looksmaxxing is only useful if women find you attractive enough to fuck. If looks fail to get pussy its all wasted time and energy.

SuperSupremeKai · 2021-07-05T07:22:00+00:00

Hypergamy will easily counter this.

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Title	Men should underachieve to get what they want
Author	gimpgirl555
Upvotes	12
Comments	195
Date	July 5, 2021 4:38 AM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/odzurn/men_should_underachieve_to_get_what_they_want/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/men-should-underachieve-to-get-what-they-want.788998 https://theredarchive.com/post/788998

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