Toxic Masculinity

2022-06-15T15:55:36+00:00

Amazing.

Ferbuggity · 2022-06-15T16:03:36+00:00

That was excellent.

MadBlackGreek · 2022-06-15T17:40:00+00:00

All excellent points. And to answer the last question, yes

63daddy · 2022-06-15T16:14:43+00:00

“It is not correct to assume masculinity itself increases the instances of men experiencing mental health problems”

So true and reflects the basic fallacy regarding “toxic masculinity”

Masculinity is the attributes associated with being male. Feminists act as if these attributes are the dark side of the force, forcing males to do evil to women and men alike. The problem is masculinity is an attribute, not a force. Masculinity can’t make anyone do anything. Masculinity is a result of being male, not the reverse.

“Toxic masculinity” is predominantly a term used to portray men and manliness negatively.

Masculinity isn’t toxic. As with patriarchy theory, when someone makes an argument based on this nonsense, don’t accept it. If you argue based on a false premise, you are accepting feminist propaganda and are giving them a huge concession right there. Don’t.

regularcomments · 2022-06-16T00:04:11+00:00

Is funny to see how the people defending the use of the term "toxic masculinity" because it is being "misinterpreting" are also the same ones who would deny the existence of female hysteria.

RecoveringCoomer · 2022-06-15T19:38:51+00:00

It is definitely gaslighting and victim blaming, on a societal even global scale.

There is no support structure in society for any male suffering.

matrixislife · 2022-06-15T20:00:39+00:00

It's a catchphrase, invented for the same purposes as all political catchphrases, to be screamed at people with absolutely no thought as to what it actually means.

Four legs good, two legs bad!!

TheSpaceDuck · 2022-06-15T18:45:18+00:00

The Tin Men blog nailing it once again. The analogy with female hysteria in particular is spot on and sheds light on the fact that the current paradigm is not only absolutely ineffective at tackling the problem, it's also harmful to the demographic being affected by it.

If gay people are more likely to be bullied, harassed, denied a job, etc. and adopt harmful behaviours as a response we don't call it "toxic homosexuality" and ask them to change. We place the blame on how others view and act towards them and fix that as a way to solve the problem. When it comes to men, however, we have the exact opposite approach.

ignatztempotypo · 2022-06-15T17:43:41+00:00

Beautifully arranged and laid out graphic interface on mobile. Bravo! Whoever handles your graphics gets an applause.

Of course the content is a perfectly laid out short and simple, talking points that can pretty easily be memorized, gift to the common MRA.

Many thanks!

And to answer your question, toxic masculinity is a feminist buzz word and has no validity. Society has squeezed males to the breaking point, and now we're seeing them break.

Good going, feminists. Hope you're happy with the results you've pushed for.

Puzzleheaded-Heat174 · 2022-06-16T00:41:09+00:00

And that's not even scratching the surface here are some more facts:

Colon cancer killed more men then breast cancer killed women yet breast cancer awareness gets 43% more public funding then colon cancer

Men are the primary victims of violence in every category

Its statically proven that if a man is a victim of any crime it's far less likely to be reported by the mainstream media than a women being a victim of a crime

Men have there lives destroyed by false allegations particularly rape and nobody cares

Its not taken seriously if men are victims of violence of any kind particularly rape and domestic violence

Its perfectly ok for people to start trends like killallmen but we all know if it was the other way around there would be outrage globally

Men don't even have to be fathers for them to be stuck paying child support and alimony and the courts often refuse too relinquished the man from responsibility I even heard a story where a man had this happen to him even though he hadn't even been to the country the mother was living in (the father is Australian & the mother American) but not only that but the child was born when the mother was 35 and the father 10!

And i'm sure there are plenty more facts that I'm missing here it really goes to show which gender is the privileged gender

DivyanshPanwari · 2022-06-15T20:11:44+00:00

But you can't deny there's gender pay gap, that allows men to earn more than women. Also patriarchy is the main problem of masculinity and feminism. Toxic masculinity is a threat to society. People ignore the clear privilege of being a man, that is premature deaths, alimony, societal unjustified hate. Feminism wants gender equality that's why we promote hate against men and 'women are wonderful' effect. Obviously if women are incharge of everything the world would be a better place. Tbh all men are pigs and deserve to die.

/s (if it was not obvious, that is the progression of feminism)

OutGroupOutCast · 2022-06-16T01:38:38+00:00

This is great. OP is setting out to win!!! I love it.

Advice:

I used to be a very public MRA in college and early in my career and found a useful mindset when entering into discussions. Remember that you have 2 audiences whenever discussing this type of stuff. 1) Your primary audience that is present while you are talking, ie... the friend group, the class room, your coworker you are actually speaking to... etc. This audience may become convinced by what yousay at any time, but will VERY RARELY make that known to you. And, especially not in that moment/conversation. So don't look for that from your conversations. Just present your ideas, and thank them for their time and thoughts.

But there is also another audience. 2) There is always someone over hearing you. there are others in the classroom, on the bus, at the bar, etc. They are your real target audience since they have no emotional weight to lift in your conversation if they do at any time become convinced that what you say is true, like your primary audience does. this additional audience will not have to worry about looking stupid if they admit they're wrong, or looking like a social outcast if they choose to agree with you. Remember them. Speak for them to over hear.

There is an idea of a third target audience, which is the one that is present when whoever you spoke to about MRA issues goes home and tells the story about what you two spoke of. In short, if you argue with a feminist, you are also being echoed to her friends/co-workers/cat after the fact. a fools errand is to try to get that femenist to convey your exact argument to her friends/co-workers/cat in an honest and meaningful way. she'll simply smear you and misrepresent what you said. But, what you can do, is make that feminist look like an idiot to her friends/co-workers/cat by the very thing she choses to smear you about. To do that is control the subject matter of what you say. don't be baited into anything but morally solid arguments. never. Not once. stay on topic. an example is if you want to talk about 6 of 7 homeless being men. make her tell her friends and coworkers that "oh, fucking so what. oh 6 out of 7 homeless are men big deal. fucking grow a pair of balls you privledge babies!". there is no way for someone to overhear a femenist saying that and not think 'wow, that is awful. i cant believe that's true. and wow, FUCK femenism."

best of luck. I hope this helps.

HannibalsProtege · 2022-06-16T03:36:49+00:00

Female Hysteria was treated by giving women a gentle massage on their clits, and thus relieving their stress. Thus yet another invention created by men -- the vibrator -- aided them to this day. There's even a movie about it too.

Funny enough there's nothing that's been invented by women to aid men with their stressors; hell we probably even came up with the blowjob, to which most men are in short supply of! Maybe I missed the point, but this just reads as total gaslighting.

LeaderOfTheBeavers · 2022-06-15T18:00:46+00:00

This is from @TheTinMen on Instagram, I highly recommend everyone to follow his page!

xa3D · 2022-06-15T18:16:59+00:00

this will all be explained away as symptoms of toxic masculinity and the patriarchy.

none of these slides will exist if toxic masculinity is eradicated!! DONT YOU SEE???!!! WAKE UP SHEEPLE!!!

/s

2022-06-15T22:47:39+00:00

This is, without exaggeration, the greatest thing I’ve seen posted on Reddit.

As a man, I knew about a lot of these issues, but this makes it so much more clear

Thank you OP

Njaulv · 2022-06-15T23:52:52+00:00

Yeah spot on! I never thought of comparing it to female hysteria, but very good comparison.

Legitimate-Ad-6267 · 2022-06-16T00:04:59+00:00

I would agree on them about men needing better role models, but I know that feminists have no idea what a healthy masculine role model looks like.

T_Rash · 2022-06-15T21:07:14+00:00

There is nothing toxic about masculinity

Duchat · 2022-06-15T19:54:08+00:00

It's used FAR more liberally than just victim blaming.

MadBlackGreek · 2022-06-15T17:43:44+00:00

Growing up without my father (met him a month before my 20th B-day), and with my mom’s common-law “hubby”, I developed an actual shame of my masculinity, basically adopting this very mentality decades before this phrase was even coined. It took a lot of work (and a failed marriage), to work through it.

vhisic · 2022-06-15T20:46:21+00:00

This is a good one.

I hate the phrase so much, it is just a cop out term. They say things like anger are toxic male traits, but everyone gets angry women, men, children, animals... its a perfectly natural emotion.

FriendlyButton6970 · 2022-06-15T18:54:11+00:00

I got told in a uk office to not spread my legs so far when sitting on my chair not even next to another worker, I want off this planet

AverageHorribleHuman · 2022-06-16T01:04:09+00:00

I can't get this to play on my phone, pls halp

No-Knowledge-8867 · 2022-06-16T03:11:05+00:00

I remember reading at the end of Carole Hooven's book Testosterone that something like 99% of awards for bravery are given to men. When the sh!t hits the fan men step forward.

SadPatient28 · 2022-06-15T20:12:19+00:00

agree to all of this. there's also a race element that can be piled on to this. if you're a WHITE male i feel like there's even more of a target on your back right now.

I feel it living in a blue state where METOO began and where BLM riots flourished. first there was METOO and then BLM, both assaults on males (white).

i know in my industry women have taken over the workplace. there has been a wild overcorrection in diversity mandates by media corporations, where they actively seek BIPOC, (so if you're a white male, don't bother applying). i feel like i'm constantly in survival mode.

Consequently, i am certainly not benefitting from any white male privilege in my area.

Hadasschatool · 2022-06-15T20:28:10+00:00

Yes! I know I’m in the minority, but if I’m going to date, I’m looking for a toxically masculine man 😂 I am woman enough for the both of us!

forthereadingg · 2022-06-15T20:33:32+00:00

10/10. Very well done.

kenek60 · 2022-06-15T21:13:54+00:00

The uber feminist believes that "toxic masculinity" is the same thing as masculinity.

This is equvalent to a Liberal saying that Botswana is the most "diverse" country in the world because there are NO white people there. (I do not really know the racial components of that country)

It is interesting that it is often the same people who hold these views.

yassichi · 2022-06-16T00:30:51+00:00

I absolutely loved it

GlitteringGas9130 · 2022-06-16T02:29:35+00:00

Toxic MASCULINITY doesn't exist.... it's either masculinity of insecurity

MezzaCorux · 2022-06-16T03:24:39+00:00

I never thought of toxic masculinity being the modern equivalent of female hysteria. But it makes perfect sense.

2022-06-16T04:28:49+00:00

I think u should Also Add Credit

AndyBrown65 · 2022-06-16T04:52:33+00:00

Yes, cultural gaslighting.

It's all about controlling behaviour so telling someone that "normal" behaviour is "toxic" is gaslighting and bullying

Man_of_culture_112 · 2022-06-16T07:48:19+00:00

🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

TigPlaze · 2022-06-16T18:00:29+00:00

The expression is a form of man-bashing hate speech used by feminists to change the narrative in a dishonest way. In reality, toxicity has no gender, and both men and women are capable of being toxic, and do so just as often. Women are often cruel in non-violent ways, but are still cruel. When a wife sleeps with her husband's best friend for revenge, that hurts her husband at least as much as a hard slap across the face. Both are wrong. Both hurt people, but women's bad behavior is much more likely to be excused.

"Toxic masculinity" is just an underhanded attempt to paint all men with the same brush. If someone gets raped or harmed in any way by a man, they bring out that expression as a sneaky way of blaming all men when in reality the man who committed the crime is the one responsible.

Katrina_Starr · 2022-06-26T06:32:15+00:00

This is EXACTLY why we must not use this phrase. So grateful for this!!

happyness423 · 2022-06-15T17:40:58+00:00

This is MAGNIFICENT!!!

nigerundayooosmokey · 2022-06-15T18:39:46+00:00

one of the most summarised and informative posts ive seen in a while! i am from a country that has forced military conscription, on international mens day this year i shall post smt!

dmann27 · 2022-06-15T18:54:48+00:00

Great info. I'm curious about the "men dominate 2 of 15 job categories that are projected to grow most". This is a stat I haven't heard of before. If anyone has source information I thank you in advance.

SadPatient28 · 2022-06-15T20:17:11+00:00

sorry to go tin foil hat here, but is there any reason to think that this toxic masculinity movement is being seeded fomented by foreign countries to make this country weaker. if so, it's totally working.

offtable · 2022-06-15T19:44:47+00:00

Perfect presentation

EdziePro · 2022-06-15T20:23:22+00:00

@thetinmen are a great instagram page for these types of posts. I think this is one of theirs since it looks so similar to their typical post.

lostbuttplugs · 2022-06-15T23:21:10+00:00

Amazing how everyone wants to define masculinity these days. As a man I can recognize other men. not a boy, not a male, A man. And between men we acknowledge each other with a silent nod. It’s a club that isn’t defined by age, but experience and maturity and respect.

AverageHorribleHuman · 2022-06-16T01:13:20+00:00

I wish our culture would stop with this contest of "who is more hurt" and look toward looking toward solutions for these problems on both sides. We need to stop looking at each other as enemies, and look at each other as humans who need help, with an empathetic and patient lense. As a man, I feel my exsitence demands justification. I feel like I'm in a crisis with my identity, race, and purpose. I need help, but know no government or person cares.

Overall I feel abandoned and scared.

Deleted_-420_points · 2022-06-15T17:55:55+00:00

Spot on

National-Aardvark-72 · 2022-06-15T21:12:10+00:00

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

MNCPA · 2022-06-16T01:48:04+00:00

Is this real?

hifi3xx · 2022-06-15T21:07:08+00:00

The answer to the last slide is both. Also I love when women start spewing the toxic masculinity bs. As if they are in any position to even have the most simplistic understanding of what Masculinity really is. Its not a coincidence that young men who grow up with out a male role model or father figure are significantly more likely to end up in jail. When an older man isn't there to show a young man or boy what it means to be a man, they struggle even more in life, and are highly likely to end up doing more illegal and dangerous things

tater_69 · 2022-06-15T22:26:32+00:00

Guy here. I believe toxic masculinity is a thing, but it’s detrimental towards men. The societal expectation to be financially stable, never cry, be strong, be tall, etc

heeroena · 2022-06-15T23:48:05+00:00

Doesn't exist.

djinthesmokys · 2022-06-16T05:39:16+00:00

The interesting thing about this feed is the complete omission of any information that places responsibility of the issues discussed with us. In order for a discussion to have any semblance of credibility there needs to be balance, context and some factual information to create a framework. There is a such thing as toxic femininity and the manipulation that comes from it. God forbid that’s mentioned

Yamochao · 2022-06-15T21:23:21+00:00

Toxic masculinity suggests the problems men face or not systemic within our society, but in their heads, solved by a mere change of male mindset.

I always hear this from people who haven't bothered reading about what the term toxic masculinity actually means. From wikipedia:

The concept of toxic masculinity is used in academic and media discussions of masculinity to refer to certain cultural norms that are associated with harm to society and men themselves. Traditional stereotypes of men as socially dominant, along with related traits such as misogyny and homophobia, can be considered "toxic" due in part to their promotion of violence, including sexual assault and domestic violence. Self-reliance and emotional repression are correlated with increased psychological problems in men such as depression, increased stress, and substance use disorders.

I've never heard anyone (except MRA) argue that 'toxic masculinity' means that men are intrinsically toxic or individually wrong, it's always referenced as a harmful set of cultural expectations, which seems like exactly the kind of thing a real MRA would be interested in combatting.

TheSovietRaccon · 2022-06-16T00:18:25+00:00

toxic masculinity is the idea that society doesn't want men to feel emotion or act contrary to how society thinks men should be. it's not saying that masculinity causes the problems within men, it's that we should break down the borders men face rather then continue to instill them saying that it's part of manhood.

Various_Strain5693 · 2022-06-16T04:16:55+00:00

I've only ever heard that toxic masculinity is a social and systemic thing, however I have also only basically heard that it's men who pressure other men to act in a hyper-masculine fashion.

FlutterCordLove · 2022-06-16T15:52:57+00:00

Yes, but no.

Toxic masculinity can be this, but it can also being forced into masculine stereotypes which can harm people

_BeefJerk · 2022-06-16T16:17:46+00:00

Downvote for a meandering, shitty slideshow.

NotTheBestLooking · 2022-06-15T16:17:08+00:00

This shows a lack of understanding of what toxic masculinity is. Toxic masculinity is not the concept that masculinity is toxic. That would be offensive.

Toxic masculinity is the concept that many traits taught to men in our society by movies and role models actually have negative effects.

Action stars saying 'it's just a scratch' when they get shot because only a weakling would admit when they are hurting is pushing toxic behaviours onto men.

It's not that men are toxic. It's that men are taught in our society to have traits that are harmful to them and others.

The solution of course, is to stop pushing gender roles on men. Something we all want.

rabel111 · 2022-06-15T19:54:49+00:00

Oi mate, hang on.

I'm not discrediting your post, as it brings a real issue going on.

Toxic masculinity DOES exist. It's not a matter of debate. Men tend to have bad masculine examples growing up, and have to later deconstruct a lot of systemic sexism we absorbed throughout our childhood - or be damned assholes their whole lives.

That same sexism hurt us too. We're taught to suck it up, be overly aggressive towards emotional openness, we blocked opening up to our best friends, create emotional stunting to even explaining what's going on inside, we sometimes even have problems separating platonic intimacy with sexual intimacy. We literally go to women to talk about our feelings, for fucks sake.

That is, when we're not sabotaging our chances of getting help. Therapy? Gay. Talking with your bro about violent relationship? Gay. Sexually assaulted by a woman and you didn't like it? You're definitely Gay. Only valid way to let shitnout is through violence, working out, rough sex and competition.

Which takes us to the worst part of it, when you're not just taught shit that'll fuck up your psychological, you're also taught even worse shit, like all women want is your money, so treat them like garbage, gay people bad, trans are weirdos, and all that other bigoted shit we're still seeing today. And those two combined makes it the problem we have today.

The problem is people use toxic masculinity to anything negative men do, and while sometimes they aren't wrong, that doesn't help rooting out the issue.

However,

It should be men spaces like men's rights that work on it the hardest, in order for us to get better. We should create spaces to talk about that shit and deconstruct it, it would make our group better and stronger, would give men options on how to get help without them feeling bad, and we'll have something to show for when people accuse someone of toxic masculinity, or the men's rights movement of being a sexist sphere.

Ok_Designer_Things · 2022-06-15T19:25:34+00:00

My friend killed himself because his father would tell him his problems aren't that big, get over it, it's nothing.

He ignored his son until it was too late. He NEVER cried before in his life, when his own father died he was afraid to shed tears "because my wife might leave me"

His son killed himself soon after this. Gun shot to the head.

That man cries everytime I see him now, sometimes me, him and his wife will cry in a hug when I see them...

He has completely changed his entire outlook on emotions for me, but FAR too late. My friend is dead.

Why? Because of toxic masculinity.

If you think it doesn't exist then you don't have anyone in your life pushing the bad ideas to you and that's fine. My Italian friend was a second generation immigrant, his father a first gernation immigrant.

I can get behind ideas, this is a wrong idea. Sure let's talk about how women view men and how thay affects us and all that jazz but MEN THEMSELVES are also needing change as well..

If you've never been hit and told "men don't cry" thats fine dude. I WAS. Everytime I want to feel emotion my body reacts and I hear my father "men CONTROL their emotion, we sre NOT WEAK".

Just because you lived a perfect pampered life with amazing patents doesn't mean everyone else did.

There are beautiful parts of masculinity. Some AMAZING parts of what it means to be a good man. Ignoring your feelings and all the wrong things is NOT a thing we should allow around us anymore.. and for you to blame it on anyone else is NOT a masculine thing to do. A man takes it upon himself to be the change he wants to see, and does it for those he loves including himself.

Edit" if you're downvoting this, just comment with a "I LOVE when men kill themselves because they can't talk to people about their problems" because that's what you're supporting. This sub is QUICKLY becoming another fucking incel sub where men are just mad at women. BE A MAN AND COMMENT HOW YOU FEEL IF YOU DOWNVOTED THIS. LETS HEAR MORE ABOUT HOW YOU WANT DEAD MEN IN THE STREETS YOU COWARDS

Bas14ST · 2022-06-15T18:16:40+00:00

you rlly dont know what people mean when they say "toxic masculinity", do you¿?

DandyDoge5 · 2022-06-15T18:37:43+00:00

When people talk about toxic masculinity, generally they don't encompass ALL of masculinity with it. If someone is, feel free to point out their bs but like honestly this is ridiculous.

MelodiousTones · 2022-06-15T16:21:44+00:00

Toxic masculinity is part of a patriarchal system. We who use the term do not blame individual men for it in any way.

Kandidog1 · 2022-06-15T18:52:05+00:00

Total bullshit!

narwaffles · 2022-06-16T00:39:21+00:00

toxic masculinity is the pressure that society puts on men to act a certain way. It’s when men are expected to “man up” in ways that are toxic, like suppressing emotions or starting fights. To be against toxic masculinity isn’t to be against men, it’s to be against the expectation and pressure on men to be toxic.

LolnothingmattersXD · 2022-06-16T12:53:50+00:00

I thought that toxic masculinity refers to the things that society expects from men. It's what society thinks is masculine, rather than what actually is such. I would have never interpreted it as something to blame men for. "Toxically masculine" men are victims of being raised to e.g. suppress emotions and take lots of responsibilities, which in turn leads to mental health issues. And this is how I use that term - as an argument for the necessity of the men's rights movement, not for "men bad".

Comfortable_Ad868 · 2022-06-16T01:14:18+00:00

“Female Hysteria” was probably accurate pre 1400. If I’d had 14 kids and zero orgasms, I’d be a fuckin wreck.

ArmGaymer69 · 2022-06-16T09:52:32+00:00

Idc too long no read🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓

wingknightx · 2022-06-16T12:10:26+00:00

Toxic masculinity.. great guy i met him yesterday 🤗

rabel111 · 2022-06-17T02:53:32+00:00

Toxic masculinity is a term used by people who have no empathy. It has been subject of numerous discussions and academic research, with only one agreed fact (not it's definition): it is a term that is offensive to many men, not useful given the confusion about what the term means, divisive given the demeaning language embedded in the term and damaging given the term is frequently used by radical feminists as hate speech directed at men.

To those people who continue to use the term despite it's obvious problems. You are tone deaf sexist pigs with no empathy who either carelessly or deliberately intend to offend imposing language on men and boys that is widely believed to be offensive. You are the same bigots who use offensive terms to refer to LGBTI+ people, people of color, and jews.

Title	Toxic Masculinity
Author	Automatic-Shelter387
Upvotes	925
Comments	276
Date	June 15, 2022 3:47 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/vcxizl/toxic_masculinity/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/toxic-masculinity.1119627 https://theredarchive.com/post/1119627

Comments

Four legs good, two legs bad!!