Chivalry gone wrong? My experience at a fancy restaurant

TheMightyCheng · 2014-03-23T16:13:05+00:00

Not really. From where I'm sitting, the waiter was more than a little rude.

Please tell me the ladies at your table took your side. If they didn't I'm going to be very disappointed.

cranktheguy · 2014-03-23T16:18:31+00:00

Rule 1 of waiting tables is to please the most important customer: the one doing the tipping.

intensely_human · 2014-03-23T19:43:47+00:00

As a server, you don't lecture the people you're serving. As a host, you don't lecture the people you're hosting. The guy taking your order broke both those rules.

No, you were not out of line. He may have been right to take orders from ladies first - that's a local cultural thing that doesn't really harm anyone. We have bigger fish to fry than whether people in the south take ladies' orders first.

But he was way out of line to talk down to you.

jugglingisretarded · 2014-03-23T16:22:52+00:00

I have done the same thing but with a female waitress.

My family gave me shit about it.

Bartab · 2014-03-23T16:30:18+00:00

"ladies first, show some respect to the females at the table"

"Get your manager and a different waiter. Don't come back to this table."

armadillo_armageddon · 2014-03-23T19:31:20+00:00

No, you weren't out of line, the waiter was. Even if it's the policy in this restaurant to serve women before men (and I've never been in a restaurant with such a policy) he should have said "I'm sorry sir, I'll be right back with you." He was rude and condescending.

nigglereddit · 2014-03-23T20:19:13+00:00

As someone who has worked in a very good restaurant, you didn't handle that very well.

You should have immediately spoken to the maitre'd - the person responsible for the front of house staff - and explained the server's behavior. The maitre'd would be absolutely horrified to hear any such thing and you'd find a hefty chunk taken off your bill.

edtastic · 2014-03-23T16:33:40+00:00

Forget out of line, you could have went further. Called the manager and insist on a new waiter who doesn't disrespect the customer. It wasn't his place to check you with his outdated notions of chivalry. What's next he's going to lecture you for not pulling out the lady's chairs? That guy needs to learn a lesson.

SockBramson · 2014-03-23T19:46:26+00:00

Waiter at an upscale restaurant, can confirm you take ladies orders first. We're also supposed to give them their meals first. There's also the clearing rule. If someone has finished eating early it's only okay to clear a plate if it's a woman's. Because, "women get self-conscious if they're the only one still eating." I was told this by a female manager.

2014-03-23T17:02:30+00:00

From my experience that is the norm at fancier restaurants and living in the south it seems that they take that stuff more seriously down here than they do in the north.

The waiter didn't need to be a jerk about it but I don't know that I would have said anything unless I was completely skipped over and he went to leave the table after getting everyone's order.

ShutupPussy · 2014-03-23T19:07:39+00:00

His response was in poor judgment at best, but if his tone was belittling/demeaning as well, then i'm glad you made your opinion known.

2014-03-23T21:47:11+00:00

This happened to me one time - I called the waiter (out loud so everyone could hear) I told me to take everyone's order in order or call the manager NOW. I stared him down and he did as I told him. I didn't tip him a cent.

Men need to STOP being afraid !

AlienDays · 2014-03-23T18:59:30+00:00

I have only sisters and have been skipped over many times when we are ordering food. One time I began to order after the person beside me finished and the waiter interrupted me and said pretty much the same thing that was told to op. Recently, a waitress clearly took my order last purposefully then brought out only drinks for the other 3 people at the table(all female). However, she messed up and gave one of them my drink and when she returned with the last one she apologized like she committed some heinous crime for giving a male a drink before a female. Sorry if it sounds like I'm being whiner, I don't really care that much, just find it interesting.

glassuser · 2014-03-23T20:46:47+00:00

Sounds like he's being a fedora-wearing white knight dick. If he wanted to stick to tradition, he would ask each lady's escort first and he would order for her. Otherwise, he'd go in order. Anything else is confusing for the people ordering and confusing for the runners bringing the orders out.

blueoak9 · 2014-03-24T02:20:10+00:00

" I wrote "zero, show some respect to the man buying everyone's food". Was I out of line?"

No, he was, and you did what you could to set him straight.

SHITLORDHERE · 2014-03-23T18:26:26+00:00

No, you weren't.

ThePigmanAgain · 2014-03-23T21:55:40+00:00

Are you fucking kidding me? You should have told the asshole to go fuck his mom and then you should have taken your guests elsewhere, and you should have let the manager know it -- 11 meals is a lot of moolah. Seriously, why is this shit any better than taking the white people's orders before you get round to the blacks and the browns?

ThatWeirdMuslimGuy · 2014-03-23T22:32:33+00:00

Well if the guy wants a tip he should be respectful to the guy paying for the food. I mean, there is nothing wrong with the whole ladies first attitude, nothing wrong at all, however to act degrading to a customer is a really good reason not to tip. What restaurant you go to by the way? I'm from GA and have heard good things about Texan cuisine.

Exactly_what_I_think · 2014-03-23T23:08:48+00:00

The "ladies first" is a policy but his attitude should have cost him more then a possible tip.

My similar experience.

That automatic 10% gratuity can be removed.

ManUpManDown · 2014-03-23T18:15:34+00:00

No. I would have pushed back, at least quietly by leaving the table to talk to the manager. I actually had a waitress at IHOP explain once, when I objected to her "ladies first," that "women always come first, just like when a ship is sinking, because they need to be protected to care for children," etc. She was dead serious. This was the overarching philosophy of hers that inspired her ordering policy. It sounds like the kind of thing an MRA would make up just to make a point, I know. My wife and I were just stupefied.

2014-03-23T20:44:18+00:00

Wouldn't chivalry be taking only male orders, and expecting the men to order for the women? I don't know about the South, but the Cordon Bleu teaches no such policy, and so the comments claiming this is normal in fancy restaurants are erroneous.

2014-03-23T21:18:05+00:00

You certainly could have handled it far worse than you did. Heh hell I wouldn't be surprised if we see your bill pop up reddit here in a few days telling us how rude you were.

Koalachan · 2014-03-23T22:01:36+00:00

Were all the people on the side of the table he took first women? If there were any men there and he took their orders before coming to you, then something is amiss.

Most waiters will typically start at seat "1" and work their way around. Its a simple way to know whos order goes where, as it moves around in a circle. If course, some waiters may deviate from this and work whats best for them. So there is nothing wrong with taking "ladies first," but he didn't need to be rude about it with a snarky comment. Really, I would say it would depend on how the rest of the night went to determine the tip and all.

UglyNeckBeard · 2014-03-23T19:24:55+00:00

Should have only put down enough money to cover the meal and 75% of the 10% automatic gratuity and wrote that in his concern for the ladies he could take the pay cut necessary to mitigate the (fictional) wage gap.

Ketsa · 2014-03-23T22:31:54+00:00

You were right. I would have had a chat with his boss before leaving.

FG3344 · 2014-03-23T22:44:15+00:00

Chivalry is dead. If any waiter is short with me and dares to say something in that tone of voice I would certainly not only say something back but ask to speak with the manager. Saying what he said was clearly disrespectful to YOU...something he def. would not have done had he realized you were the one paying for the whole check. I'm personally glad that you did what you did. Had it been me though I would have called him out directly. Chivalry is showing preference to women when everyone feminist preaches equality and empowerment to them. I'm all for holding doors and paying for the people I care about and I'm with. That's because they are people not just because what they have between their legs.

Hungerwolf · 2014-03-24T00:46:53+00:00

Nah, he was being a bigot. I'd love to see the feminists complain about this one, though. The doublethink would be impressive.

warspite88 · 2014-03-23T23:36:53+00:00

lol if a waiter did that to me i would loudly call him sexist and tell him he wont see a tip, instead i want to see your manager.

also that is not chivalry that is white knight grandstanding, there is no reason for women first in ordering that is just stupid. call them on their bullshit sexism..

memetherapy · 2014-03-24T01:49:24+00:00

The attitude was the problem... the "chivalry" is totally excusable. He's just trying to make the customers and his boss happy. Can you blame him for not knowing what's sexist or not anymore?

richardnorth · 2014-03-24T02:31:01+00:00

That waiter is a dumbass

lurb · 2014-03-24T08:45:25+00:00

Nice one. It takes a lot of inexperience to criticize a customer in such an abrupt fashion. You gave him a lot of experience in return, very generous.

LONG_CUT_GRIZZLY · 2014-03-23T21:37:40+00:00

Not at all

scanspeak · 2014-03-23T22:12:07+00:00

Great job! We need to stand up to these sexists.

scanspeak · 2014-03-23T22:16:24+00:00

Moral of the story - don't date, don't pay for others, don't frequent those types of restaurants.

Pecanpig · 2014-03-23T23:40:41+00:00

You were perfectly in line.

2014-03-24T02:38:23+00:00

awesome

MockingDead · 2014-03-24T06:26:57+00:00

Nope. You did exactly what you should have. Had he explained the convention to you, maybe then he ought get a tip.

The convention was from a time when people waited for their host to eat. Since no one does that any more, it's time it be scrapped.

miroku000 · 2014-03-24T06:47:21+00:00

You should have protested giving him the automatic 10% tip too and complained to the manager.

avantvernacular · 2014-03-24T12:44:13+00:00

I have never seen a waiter skip over people like that, but what should really bother you is the rudeness. Anyways, that's what the tip line is for.

AptCasaNova · 2014-07-02T19:51:01+00:00

If it's that many people, the whole 'ladies first' thing seems redundant. The only time I expect that is if I'm in a group of 3-4 people.. and even then, don't really care.

It's easier to just go clockwise (or counter-clockwise) around the table and take orders, for everyone, including the server.

For him to correct you like that was... out of line. He risked his tip and lost it.

rightsbot · 2014-03-23T16:08:17+00:00

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Endless_Summer · 2014-03-23T18:52:21+00:00

Out of line...not necessarily. A bit sensitive, yes.

pizen992 · 2014-03-24T01:29:59+00:00

Yes, you obviously don't eat at good restaurants often. Not only are ladies orders taken first but if the waiting staff know who is paying then that person's order gets taken last- this is so you can bask in your benevolence and also so you have the waiter's full attention should you have any special requests.

CaptainChewbacca · 2014-03-23T19:43:50+00:00

I never question how a waiter takes orders, they may have their own system. Nobody is 'skipped' until the waiter starts walking away. They were rude in their response, but I would have waited to see if I was 'actually' skipped.

damac_phone · 2014-03-23T20:29:25+00:00

He handled it wrong, but the waiter did what he was supposed to do. Orders are taken and served to women first, starring with the oldest and working down in age. Then the men in the same order. If you are the host of the party then you come last.

intensely_human · 2014-03-23T18:59:09+00:00

Yes and no. Consider his position for a second. You WERE at a fancy restaurant, not a pizza place.

Part of the point of a fancy restaurant is the service, and people expect certain ... traditions in that service.

Like it or not one of those traditions is waiting on, taking orders from and serving females first. It doesn't make it correct. But from his position, his job is to know those traditions. The vast, vast majority of people will be upset with him if he doesn't observe them.

Now, I know that this is undoable, but if you had pulled him aside and pointed out that you were not a traditional group of people before he sat everyone, then you would have a gripe.

But you kind of caught him off guard.

So I guess, no it wasn't really fair.

rogersmith25 · 2014-03-24T04:55:26+00:00

I know you were pissed off, but I think that sounds like you were being a dick.

It is seriously not the end of the world to take the women's order first. He shouldn't have said that you should show some respect, but if you were that upset about it you should have just said so to his face, rather than writing a little passive-aggressive note like a grouchy old lady.

As I understand it, waiters have a system for remembering who ordered what... and if he always takes the order in a certain way, then just fucking let him. Jesus.

TL;DR - Listen guys... we can't make fun of social justice warriors for being a mob over hypersensitive cry-babies and then upvote this shit to the top of the subreddit like it's the end of the fucking world.

nick012000 · 2014-03-24T02:40:26+00:00

While the waiter was being rude, keep in mind that he's making less than the minimum wage, because of the expectation of tipping; as a result, he needs the money from the tips to live on.

Title	Chivalry gone wrong? My experience at a fancy restaurant
Author	notipforyou323
Upvotes	129
Comments	153
Date	March 23, 2014 4:07 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/mensrights/comments/215ktb/chivalry-gone-wrong-my-experience-at-a-fancy-/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/chivalry-gone-wrong-my-experience-at-a-fancy.1615653 https://theredarchive.com/post/1615653

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