Marriage | MensRights

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[+]emj10141 points 8 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Sexism.

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[+]emj10141 points 7 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

So you want your daughter to meet and marry a "red pill guy"? You're fine with your daughter being treated like property?

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[–]Dorkykong2 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]TheMythof_Feminism -4 points-3 points-2 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Can't a legacy be brought on by a daughter? If you have a daughter, is your legacy lost?

Are men and women the same?

What do you even mean by legacy?

That's easy but will be a long explanation that I know nobody cares about.... that's fine, I will explain; The idea is to know that I have continuity with this world. To know that I will "continue to exist" in a very real way, through my son. My son, whom I will groom to be a great man, by educating him the way my father tried to educate me but couldn't because my mother divorced him and thus , I never got even half of the preparation I was supposed to get.

My father has genius level IQ, but I have learned through him and other genius level IQ people I've met, that these people are severely fucked up with incredibly pronounced personality disorders of some type. I do not have genius level IQ, I am only "exceptional" which is the half way point between genius and average... which is disappointing.

But anyway, like my father before me, I wish to raise a son and give him the training and opportunities that were denied to me. To use an INCREDIBLY clichéd and overblown example; Think Vito Corleone with Michael Corleone in this scene.

I understand it is selfish to place one's hopes and dreams into another person this way, I also know it's foolish to take woman and child on board, I get that and I understand how terrible of an idea it is, but I can't shake this desire to have a proper legacy.

[–]Dorkykong2 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Are men and women the same

When it comes to loving your children, yes. When it comes to carrying on a legacy, also yes. Resoundingly.

Your notion of a legacy is extremely misogynistic. Not just sexist, but baselessly misogynistic. You don't hate women because of what they can tend to do, you hate them for what they are. MGTOW is about realising you don't need a woman in your life, that on the contrary your life may well be ruined. It's not about thinking a son is the only way of carrying on your legacy.

In fact, having a daughter can be a pretty smart thing to do, for someone subscribing to MGTOW type ideas. If you have a daughter, and you groom her well, you may end up with a woman who realised how privileged she is, and since she's not a guy, she'll have quite a lot of influence. If you have a son, he'll just grow up either blue pilled and oppressed or red pilled and hated. That's not the kind of legacy I'd want.

In other words, you can be a father, or you can be the father of one who helped bring about change. Even if she doesn't become that person, you'll at least have tried making the world a better place for men, instead of just adding one more body to the same fucked up society.

Anyway, it's late here and I'm losing interest. Take my comment or leave it, I don't really care.

[–]Strange_Bedfellow 1 point2 points3 points 7 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Dorkykong21 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Strange_Bedfellow2 points 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]TheMythof_Feminism -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

When it comes to loving your children, yes. When it comes to carrying on a legacy, also yes. Resoundingly.

I have found that such statements are grossly false but I suppose it does come down to subjectivity at that point and I can only say, that is not what most people believe. Most especially men.

Your notion of a legacy is extremely misogynistic

That's cute but don't waste my time with your SJW/feminist level drivel. If you have an argument to present, present it without whining. You cucks are desperate for opportunities to virtue signal and it's just the most pathetic thing.....

Your argument , at this point is "You want a son? that's hatred of women!" , that garbage is certainly on the level of the average SJW/feminist, but the added tabula rasa makes it , well a low tier SJW/feminist argument. Spectacular fail, kid.

[–]Dorkykong21 point 8 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]TheMythof_Feminism0 points 8 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Dorkykong21 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

You literally said you want a son to carry on a proper legacy. I'll be fucked if that doesn't mean a daughter can't carry on a proper legacy.

Like a trained victim, you're misunderstanding the problem here. It's not that you want a son. It's that you want a son specifically. You've implied pretty heavily that you'd grow to resent a daughter, which is precisely why that guy earlier was asking you how you'd react to having a daughter instead of a son. The fact you're dodging that question like Trump dodged the draft only serves to add weight to that implication.

The way you're tying gender up into situations where gender doesn't really matter in any meaningful way means you really don't have anything to hold against radfems and SJWs. Now suddenly legacy is tied to gender? Fuck off with that, mate. As any ol' John Smith your legacy is overwhelmingly going to be your descendants' memory of you, and literally anyone can carry that on. It's up to you whether it's a good one or a bad one, and if you stay as insecure and toxic as you've shown yourself to be here, your children will notice and they will judge you for it.

little mangina

beneath me

I doubt even a well salted slug is beneath you, mate.

[–]TheMythof_Feminism0 points 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

You literally said you want a son to carry on a proper legacy

What's your point?

Like a trained victim, you're misunderstanding the problem here

Projection.

It's not that you want a son. It's that you want a son specifically.

Again, what's your point?

You appear to be deranged.....

The way you're tying gender up into situations where gender doesn't really matter

You SJW/feminist types love your tabula rasa myth, don't you

if you stay as insecure and toxic as you've shown yourself to be here

That's funny.

If anything you have come across as insecure, defensive and highly deranged. The extent of my argument is, I wish to have a legacy, continuity with this world. In this case because I am a man, that means a son.

You can pretend men and women are "the same" but reality does not bend to your emotion, little one. Your cutesy filibustering drivel is dismissed , as are you, you have nothing of substance to present.

[–]Dorkykong21 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

What's your point?

That you have extremely heavily implied that you don't want a girl, for no other reason tha because she'd be a girl.

Like a trained victim, you're misunderstanding the problem here

Projection.

How?

You SJW/feminist types love your tabula rasa myth, don't you

It must be so nice living in a world where everything you don't agree with is a myth. In the real world, no debate-ending evidence has been found against the kind of tabula rasa that is relevant here.

I'm neither an SJW nor a feminist, by the by.

If anything you have come across as insecure, defensive and highly deranged.

Again, class A projection. You're highly insecure, so you think everyone else is too, and read that into everything they say.

Look mate, your infantilising of any opposition tells me all I need to know. Calling people kids and little 'uns to make yourself feel just a wee bit cooler and mature, when in reality you feel you haven't matured past high school. I'll let you in on a little secret, mate. We all feel that way. Most of us just don't let that go out on our fucking kids.

The extent of my argument is, I wish to have a legacy, continuity with this world. In this case because I am a man, that means a son.

Except it doesn't. In any way that actually matters in the real world, that is. What matters in the real world is that you will treat a daughter like shit, and she'll hate you for it, or you'll give your son one of the most unhealthy kinds of upbringings there are.

You can pretend men and women are "the same" but reality does not bend to your emotion, little one. Your cutesy filibustering drivel is dismissed , as are you, you have nothing of substance to present.

Yeah, fuck you if you think you can 'dismiss' me, like you're the bloody Queen. You sound like one of them living failures that live with their mum at 32. I guess that's a good thing. At least I won't have to worry about you giving any kids a horrible upbringing. If you actually manage to have any I'll be fucked if the mother will let them stay at their nan's wi you.

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[+]vincentbriatore1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Living together over a year (first mistake). So what?? What’s the point of getting married? I promise you things will change for the worst once you get married.

If you get married that’s your choice but you’re not MGTOW!!! You’re already in a prison cell, and this sub is the window you’re looking out.

🤷‍♂️ Why get married???

“Because she won’t be happy otherwise.”

Who cares?? If jumping off a bridge made crack a smile would you do it??

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[+]smfuel871 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (7 children) | Copy Link

Dude, if you have a kid, you may as well just get married. Your not going to be spared anything not being married to the mother of your child when she walks away as opposed to being married.

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[+]wrenchinthecogs1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

No, you're right. The legal benefits of marriage that are generally applied can be counted on hand and everything else is extremely situational.

Honestly in this day and age I wouldn't suggest any man marry a woman unless he stands to gain even if a divorce happens later; or they've already been together 10 or more years and there really are no signs that the relationship has a chance to fail.

[–]aych001 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

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[+]TheSelfishGenie1 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm witnessing this now with a friend. He seems to be very willingly choosing it, though. He has to ask permission to do anything. He also immediately drops whatever he's doing if asked. He has basically zero time for himself between work, wife, kid. Yet he seems pretty jolly.

[–]techemilio 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (51 children) | Copy Link

As a married man I love marriage. Be strong and love strong. marriage is great

[–]Vektor0 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

My mom and stepmom were both awful wives to my dad. They insulted and emotionally manipulated him, and they never admitted fault or any sort of wrongness ever. I see that commonly in wives: they often treat their husbands with so much disrespect, yet it seems like everyone thinks it's socially acceptable.

That's why my wife feels like a unicorn to me. She apologizes for offending me or treating me poorly, and she cares when I am upset.

But that's not always her first reaction; her first reaction is sometimes "toxic femininity": emotional manipulation, insults, disrespect. I have had to really fight for myself.

Likewise, I have offended her in other ways, and she has had to fight for fair treatment as well.

I think both men and women have similar negative tendencies; they just manifest themselves differently. Men lash out physically, and women lash out emotionally. Men can be domineering to women through intimidation, but women can be domineering to men through emotional manipulation. Men might ignore their relationship with their spouse by staying out with friends late or playing video games, but women do the same by spending money on themselves and leaving nothing left for their husbands.

The reason subs like this exist is because while mens' negative tendencies are plastered everywhere, few people think that womens' negative tendencies are worth a second thought. Calling a woman "fat" is a huge no-no, but insulting a man's masculinity is NBD.

But I don't think the best answer to that isn't to write marriage off completely, but to be very, very careful in choosing the mate. Both people need to be willing to admit wrongs, willing to value the other person's wants and needs at least as much as their own, and trust that the other person is doing the same. If both people can do that, the marriage can be great. But if just one person isn't pulling their weight, isn't doing enough for the relationship, that's where things can go awry.

[–]Aeponix 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

The thing about good marriages is that, yeah, they're good. The bad thing about good marriages is that pretty much every marriage is good to start, otherwise you wouldn't have gotten married in the first place.

Good marriages also have the tendency of occasionally going bad, and, unfortunately, the government doesn't care why or whose fault it is, they only care that the primary earner balances the scales for the other partner.

Women aren't dependents anymore. There is absolutely no reason why they should be considered such. I love my fiancee, and she does make my life better, but she has not put in the work I have to improve my earning potential, and she shouldn't be given privileges to it just because I want to have a relationship with her.

We keep separate bank accounts, and will continue to do so when we get married. But even that doesn't matter to the government. If she decides to get vindictive, and, let's be honest, people change, she can take my money if our relationship ends. Especially if there's a child involved, even if I want shared custody.

Marriage is a raw deal for the majority of men. Unless your wife is the primary earner, marriage is like giving your wife a loaded gun and asking her not to shoot you.

[–]tenchineuro 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Well it’s a good thing that my wife is none of those things

[–]nikdahl 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]SailorAground 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]TheSelfishGenie1 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

I would hope as a community of intelligent and rational men, we could avoid up-voting such meaningless platitudes as "be strong, love strong".

[–]Gamer_Koraq 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

It’s the truth though. Called a healthy relationship. I know it might be new stuff to most of the men here

[+]TheSelfishGenie1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Annnd welcome to my block list

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[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (12 children) | Copy Link

Well duh I’m not stupid. Won’t always be sunshine and rainbows but it’s never gonna be bad to enough to where it wasn’t worth it

[+]GoodDayToLie1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

Separated six months, six to go before divorce. Anecdotally, I can say it wasn't worth it.

[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

I never said it worked for everybody. I’m loving it though

[+]GoodDayToLie1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

"but it’s never gonna be bad to enough to where it wasn’t worth it "

Yeah dawg, it's my fault she left me for Jody. You're a piece of work.

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[+]supaswag691 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

That’s called an opinion and I respect it but I believe the benefits absolutely outweigh anything else. Getting to do everything with your best friends and the person you love is amazing. Every new experience with them. It’s truly amazing and fun and the tax benefits are also there which is just a bonus. Marriage is awesome.

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[+]tritt1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Well, being married not necessarily needs to be an advantage over those who are not.

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[–]Rolten 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That way, the women were taken care of if the man wanted to leave them.

There is no benefit to marriage for the primary earner in the relationship, who is usually a man. Therefore, it is anti-men.

If we're looking at it this way, there's the benefit that someone else can take the risk of staying home and taking care of the home and the children.

My mom did that. My dad had had great chances abroad when we were young and the family moved with him. She couldn't practice her profession there and hasn't worked since.

His benefit through marriage? A wife who could take care of the children and the home. She wouldn't take that risk if not for marriage.

Her benefit? Part of the wealth if somehow the marriage were to fail. If not for marriage, him breaking up with her would mean she would have no career at all and no pension and would have to take a minimum wage job at age 60.

My dad always wanted a (relatively) big family and a successful career. Thanks to marriage, my mom and dad could work as a team and he could succeed in both.

It's a path I wouldn't mind following. Courts have to be just though. No excessive alimony, no wives living in mansions while husbands live in shitty apartments. No children who only see their moms. Luckily I live in the Netherlands where courts are rather just.

[–]Bibiloup -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]duhhhh 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

She had other childhood baggage with the mother that raised her. Before it just came out as some occasional odd insecurities. This caused it all to let loose as something else.

After about six years of abuse I finally said I wanted out. It was finally worth it to me to give her a million dollars, lose half the time with my kids, not pay for the kids college, and further risk their mental health (I'd spent about $15k on therapy to try to undo the damage in my daughter). The marriage counselor who eventually understood, agreed that separating would be better for the kids. My wife fell apart in a different way that night, woke up the next morning, and started working on her issues with her individual therapist instead of blaming EVERYTHING on us. She continuously improved over the next 18 months. She's ok. The trust is permanently broken. We're still together. It's not a perfect situation but better than the mental/financial costs of divorce on me and the kids.

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[–]ChadWilliam1[S] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]Fuzzyhammers1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

Jesus, when did this sub turn into /r/MGTOW?? This is pathetic.

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Title	Marriage
Author	ChadWilliam1
Upvotes	1870
Comments	224
Date	July 28, 2018 4:39 AM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/92ji26/marriage/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/marriage.897136 https://theredarchive.com/post/897136

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