Woman denied haircut at barbershop. Claims its a human rights issue.

Apellosine · 2012-11-16T05:02:35+00:00

Great story... the last guy made a great point regarding the whole double standard ideal. Because if a man tried to go into a womens only spa he would most likely be refused.

sirhotalot · 2012-11-16T06:21:39+00:00

Her claim is clearly on the periphery.

OK, so one of these two people are going to have their rights denied. If it's the barber, then he will have no choice but to go against his religion. On the other hand, if it's the woman who gets denied right to a haircut at a barber like this, then she still has a thousand choices. For example: She can go to a different barber.

I think this woman is being extremely intolerant.

ajtexasranger · 2012-11-16T09:47:31+00:00

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TheDarkHorse83 · 2012-11-16T09:09:06+00:00

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TheDarkHorse83 · 2012-11-16T06:05:13+00:00

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Maschalismos · 2012-11-16T08:12:07+00:00

For the love of FUCK! This is a BARBER SHOP. A facility that specializes in the grooming of male hair/facial hair. Would she walk into a urologist and make a stink because she couldn't have her prostate checked?!

Chyrch · 2012-11-16T06:56:15+00:00

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Funcuz · 2012-11-16T08:06:25+00:00

I would agree with her except for the fact that nobody seems to find it sexist or discriminatory to ban men from entire floors of hotels , charity runs , and the like .

Anyway , there are obviously a great many more ways to view this case than simply through the lens of gender rights . Religious freedom , property rights , business law , constitutional law and so on .
If we're going to try and make this solely into an MRM issue , we're going to have to come up with something better than our feelings on the matter .

I personally have no sympathy for either of these two people . Unfortunately , I'm being forced to choose between something that is fundamentally wrong (refusing service to somebody based solely on their sex) or defending dogmatic religious beliefs . As far as I'm concerned , it's not a choice at all : I have to side with this lady . I mean it when I say I feel dirty about it but what choice do I have ?

We CAN'T complain about this stuff when it happens to US and then pretend that it's somehow different when it happens to a woman .

2012-11-16T09:59:47+00:00

This is one of the most ridiculous human rights complaints I have ever seen and we have lots here in Ontario. The only human rights violation would be forcing these men to violate their religious beliefs so that a women can get a haircut that she could easily get anywhere else.

2012-11-16T20:47:05+00:00

She clearly only tried to get her hair cut there so she could throw a fit. Why the fuck would you want to get your hair cut by people who have absolutely no experience with female hair styles? Why the hell can't she just go to a salon or another barbershop?

2012-11-16T09:15:46+00:00

I think this is just somebody who wants attention. Not only that but I bet you she has a particular axe to grind against muslims.

2012-11-16T11:58:28+00:00

If the woman identified as a man but was female, how would the story be different?

2012-11-16T11:26:30+00:00

For as long as there are women-only facilities that are legit, this woman has no right to complain about this male-only facility.

radamanthine · 2012-11-16T13:03:12+00:00

He should call his wife. She will cut one hair. He will charge ten thousand Canadian pesos.

2012-11-16T15:15:46+00:00

Well I will gladly call the human Rights Watch next time I am not let into a bar because there are "too many dude in there".

Vamperous · 2012-11-16T11:01:39+00:00

Oh, I would've given her a haircut alright -- one that she wouldn't forget... :-)

Roddy0608 · 2012-11-16T09:30:43+00:00

Well, hair is the same stuff on men and women. If the shop only specializes in shorter hairstyles and she's happy with that, I don't see why they should deny her. Being a private business, though, I think the barber has the right to turn away any customer they want for any reason they like.

iMADEthis2post · 2012-11-16T17:23:10+00:00

I'm kinda wondering if she didn't like being reminded she was a woman.

Looks like religiose intolerance to me or just selfishness.

Interesting point about there being woman only gyms and the like, if one is not allowed neither is the other.

SCCROW · 2012-11-16T17:27:26+00:00

What the article fails to mention, is that she requested her beaver be trimmed.

Hell, I'm not a Muslim, and I would have told her to get lost after a request like that,

2012-11-16T17:46:16+00:00

this is less a gender issue and much more a crazy fucking muslim issue.

Beatsters · 2012-11-16T18:26:36+00:00

With regards to women's only fitness clubs, I could only find one case: Stopps v Just Ladies Fitness

The Tribunal ruled in favour of the gym because the complainant failed to demonstrate that he was adversely affected by being refused membership and could not prove that his dignity was adversely affected. Among the reasons listed, I find this one to be relevant to this barbershop case:

Although ultimately he was denied a membership, seen in context, the denial did not adversely affect Mr. Stopps in his ability to participate in a fitness program close to his home at a fee that he could afford. Mr. Stopps was, and is still, able to participate in the social and cultural life of British Columbia. He is able to meet his goal of being fit and join any number of fitness facilities that would serve to meet his particular needs. From a purposive perspective, the Code’s protections are not engaged in the facts of this case.

Now, I'm unaware of the differences between the Human Rights Codes in BC and Ontario, but I reckon that they are similar enough that this point will be relevant in this case. The complainant will have to demonstrate that being denied service at the barbershop adversely affects her and I just don't see how she can do that. The shop is located in downtown Toronto -- there are tons of other options available to this woman to get the haircut that she wants.

However, in the case of the gym, they were able to present expert evidence supporting the need for women-only gyms that the complainant was unable to refute. I can't imagine there being the same kind of evidence available to demonstrate the need for a male-only barber shop, unless they can demonstrate that providing the types of cuts that they do for men would require different training or expertise to provide them for women (which is unlikely).

I don't suspect that the religious rights argument will stand. In BC, a gay couple that had been refused service at a bed and breakfast won their case against the owners that had discriminated against them because of their religious beliefs.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

LeSpatula · 2012-11-16T18:49:24+00:00

Sure, the reason the doesn't want to cut her hair is ridiculous, but there are for sure others who gladly take her money.

ohgeronimo · 2012-11-16T23:20:08+00:00

Salons (places specializing in women's hair originally, now serving both men and women) are not allowed to cut a man's beard. Barber shops are.

I think that's an important fact. I expect barber shops to be full of trained people specialized in catering to men, and I expect salons to be full of trained people specialized in things that more women consume, because of this fact.

Not that it doesn't suck when you get told the people there won't help you, but businesses can turn clients away if they feel they can't help them.

xendylu · 2012-11-17T16:28:28+00:00

he should say that yes she can get her hair cut there. but they would have to hire a special barber just for her and she would have to pay the special price. I bet she would change her mind real quick.

2012-11-16T10:06:07+00:00

It's a difficult one, because I'm all for religious tolerance, but I believe that gender equality is more important. Being banned because of her gender (and regardless of reasons, that's what this is) is wrong and it's something that happens to us lot. We KNOW it's wrong, not least because we're usually on the receiving end.

I can go into any hairdresser and have my hair cut. I realise I'll probably pay more for it and be less happy with the result than if I went to a barber, but I could. If I had long hair (and I used to) I could go to a hairdresser (or a hair stylist) and get exactly what I wanted.

She wants a short cut that is traditionally masculine, she should go to a barber. Blatant sexism isn't less repugnant because it's "us doing it to them" for a change.

oneiorosgrip · 2012-11-16T12:38:29+00:00

This woman is obviously very tall, to have tripped so disastrously over such a huge, looming mountain and suffered such terrible injury. :P

2012-11-16T13:13:50+00:00

I know for a fact that my hairdresser doesn't want to work on the hair of black people. I asked her once and she just told me the hair was way too difficult and she didn't have the skills to do a nice job. So if a black person comes, she just warns them that it will cost them a ton of money. I guess the barber could just do the same thing, charge a silly amount for the woman to get her haircut.

KINGCOCO · 2012-11-16T16:15:52+00:00

If you look at the report you notice that she filed the complaint herself. That is because she doesn't stand a chance, and no lawyer would represent her. It might be illegal or unethical for them to do so. -soon to be lawyer.

BrotyKraut · 2012-11-16T09:04:32+00:00

Lesbians...

MADBARZ · 2012-11-16T19:31:49+00:00

I don't know about Canada, but I know that in the USA, I'd side with the woman in this case. You can't deny a person service based on color, creed, or sex. This guy shouldn't be running a barbershop if he can't cut a certain person's hair due to his personal religious beliefs. Or maybe someone else working there could do it instead. And if no one there is not muslim, hire someone who isn't for these situations.

javitee · 2012-11-16T11:33:12+00:00

I can't even make myself care. If the dude doesn't want to cut her hair, I guess he doesn't want her money. Sorta like the "female only" taxi service. Let the free market kill these dumb ideas.

AloysiusC · 2012-11-16T06:54:39+00:00

Religious freedom consistently takes priority over gender equality when men are the affected party. It'll be interesting to see if this is the case with women too or if they'll gran t special privilege.

In either case, I think religious freedom should never take priority over any other human right. Therefore I fully support her.

m9bearmanpig · 2012-11-16T13:10:47+00:00

There are thousands of Hair Salons, Barber Shops & Spas here in Toronto.. So this woman is just pushing two areas of Canadian Law together in conflict. Her motivation is dubious. If the man has some kind of ritual for religious cleansing (1,000 Hail Marie's & a bath in Tomato Juice) then I would like him to go ahead & cut her hair. I would suggest a #1 clipper across the bangs & a Mohawk turned 90 degrees, with the word CUNT carefully done with clippers across the back!

I have gotten my own hair cut at Women's Salons, usually because of expedience & convenience (while taking my daughter in for a doo). I ask "do you cut men's hair" & have been told no. So lets give this woman a unique cut & televise it, it is obvious she just wants the attention. Maybe an orange & green rinse while she is there & a bikini waxing?

2012-11-16T12:42:34+00:00

The barbershop I go to is just one old guy. He has one rule for clients: I only cut hair for men or boys, or people who want to look like men or boys.

That being said, if Canada allows for women only businesses then they have to allow for men only businesses. If Canada opens the women only spas to men then the barbers should have to cut a females hair (in the styles that they are comfortable with)

ajtexasranger · 2012-11-16T13:11:30+00:00

Does this mean we can take out women's only gyms?

2012-11-16T15:04:41+00:00

Well... if it's any consolation, she does look like a man. Just give her a shave and call it a day.

hoobazooba · 2012-11-16T04:31:14+00:00

Slow news day when this is a story.

Edit: So you guys think that this woman deserves air time on tv for something that isn't news? How many of you are getting a victim mentality jeez!

Title	Woman denied haircut at barbershop. Claims its a human rights issue.
Author	bridgecrewdave
Upvotes	157
Comments	185
Date	November 16, 2012 4:02 AM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/13a51o/woman_denied_haircut_at_barbershop_claims_its_a/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/woman-denied-haircut-at-barbershop-claims-its-a.1009107 https://theredarchive.com/post/1009107

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