How are you doing? I will cut to the chase.
Opening up to a woman is one of the dumbest things you can do. In my personal opinion it's only a tier lower than taking in a girl that cheated on you.
I was reading a thread on reddit titled "Men who opened up to their SO about their fears and insecurities: How did that work out for you?" It's against the rules to link it so I won't unfortunately.
Those who are familiar with TRP already know what's going down. 90% of the responses were about how the woman left them or cheated on them. Let's begin.
She dumped me. It wasn't right after I told her, but that was when we started to sort of drift apart, and when she ended things she sort of implied that those were the reasons for her doing what she was doing.
Aaand sounds about right.
They drift apart and lose respect for you in my experience. I guess by doing so you shatter that stoic persona. I'm not saying don't share experience with your SO, but never make yourself too vulnerable.
This guy is smart.
And the reply to the one above:
My thoughts exactly. It's unfortunate because normally I am pretty stoic, but I thought that I would need to force myself to be more open in my last relationship if I wanted it to last, which sadly backfired hardcore.
Every time.
She cheated on me 3 weeks later.
Indeed. You are supposed to be a rock that can weather any storm. When you take a hammer out in front of her and show how easy you break she'll wonder if she can find a better rock.
She moved out, now I have my kids 2 nights a week, can't afford my utilities and my depression is beating me.
Jesus Christ of Nazreth.
She suddenly had doubts about us and wanted 'space'. Then used said Space to line up another guy.
Sounds about right.
Bad in almost every instance, but those were either a long time ago or not serious girlfriends in the first place.
Yeah..
I just opened up a few weeks ago to my current girlfriend. So far, while my emotional health has declined, my girlfriend says she just loves me more for it.
This dude still hasn't learned his lesson. I wonder how long until she leaves or needs "space," truly amazing that he actually believes that she "loves him more for it.' Only a matter of weeks until she fucks Señor Thundercock.
Don't do it fellas. Don't you ever fucking open up to a woman. It kills attraction, makes her question you at every turn, and destroys your frame.
If she thinks you have a ton of hot bitches in your circle, would you go "no I actually don't haha, all my friends are guys" and pull out your texts and show her you only talk to guys? She would feel more secure but her panties would dry up like the Sahara. Opening up is the same thing. Why would you show her you're broken when she thinks you're a unmovable rock?
If you need emotional support, consult a close trusted male friend. True brotherhood is out there.
Don't ever, ever do it. It won't work out.
Hope you're having a good night, take care of yourself.
I have to ask is it the opening up that kills the attraction or telling your girl you don't know what the fuck you're doing , what the fuck is happening, expressing a genuine fear or lack of control of the situation ?
I feel like women are ok with men being challenged but they aren't ok with a man expressing that he's buckling under the shitty stresses of life . It's one thing to say " Shit is hard but I will handle it" it's another to say " Shit is hard and I have no fucking clue what to do " even if the second one is true and I'm sure we've all felt it before.
I think this is the bad one.
Shit is hard, but I get stress induced diahreea, so the issue resolves itself
You my friend should get some brown trousers ;)
This guys has the right idea!
Do you ever get stressed about the toilet's accessibility in relation to your proximity? If so, then what?
Yes, I shit around 3-4 times a day, so I have to plan ahead or cancel my plans to shit. But I always have available toilets, the problem is the nasty ones or not having ass water jets
fuck i can never get used to ass water jets shits so nasty imo
it's called a bidet. ass water jet LOL
And that's ok.
If you want a girl that's gonna support you, then she will stay and appreciate the honesty and help you out. If she can't appreciate that we all get lost sometimes in what to do, and leaves, fuck her. Not worth your time. She will marry someone ruling life with their frontal lobe, and marry someone feeling a false sense of happiness.
In agreement with you here. She wants to be taken on a ride, and rides are no fun without ups and downs. The thing to rememver is never to open up about self pity, apathy, and other low level emotions.
The subtext should be "winter is coming and I'm ready for it."
is apathy really a low level emotion?
Yes it is. Anger is higher up than apathy. Anger is toxic but it spurs action. It gets shit done
You're more right than anything.
Both. If you open up of how much you love her and only her and she's your soul mate And yadda yadda. It shows you're more invested than her.
Also if you tell her you Dk what the fuck you're doing or show it. She won't respect you as a man. She wants a man. A leader.
But as far as opening up about personal shit. I do it all the time. It actually creates an emotional connection with them. For example I'm a recovering drug addict. Most ppl don't know that about me. So when I start to get serious. Or even a FB. I will tell them that about me. A lot of other shit they don't know. And I'll let her know. No one knows this about me really. It makes her feel "special" but then it's back on my alpha shit. A little vulnerability is fine, as long as you're less invested and willing to walk away.
This. I can't actually believe how many guys claim they are a complete rock. Never over invest like you said but theres nothing wrong when a man acknowledges the reality and shares it with his girlfriend because it's not a problem that is the problem, it's how a man chooses to act on that problem. Women want words backed up by action.
"You cannot expect a woman to be your true confidant, your soul-mate, and your respite to lean upon during the stormy times in life. That is your role for her benefit. It does not work in reverse, for as soon as you believe it can work that way, she will lose confidence in your ability to lead her and begin to resent you. She will go about illustrating her resentment by making your life as miserable as she possibly can. This may be one of the hardest lessons for a man to learn in life because it turns the whole notion of modern love as an equal give-and-take relationship upon its ear. The implications can be rather depressing, as it means that on a certain level a man will always be alone. A parent who expects their child to also be their equal friend to lean upon for support, will also find himself sorely disappointed with the results. The child instinctively expects the parents to be superior and to cater to his needs. Expecting the reverse will only result in a resentful child and a heartbroken parent. The same order must be maintained between a man and a woman, lest she become resentful and seek out a man who actually will lead her. "
From the masculine principle.
Wow what a fantastic quote I've never read the Masculine Principle but this excerpt makes me want to.
I feel you here, in fact, recognizing that shit is hard but you're confident that you wholehearted it is probably more attractive than pretending everything is easy, then it will seem to them that you aren't challenging yourself
Here is an example, I would drive into a fucking Ravine before I take directions/Advise from my girl. You almost have to be retarded confident in what ever decisions choices you make, it has to be 100% you.
That and maturity. If the woman you're with doesn't know you then why keep it up? It's a partnership for the good and the bad.
as if people are incapable of thinking or feeling so, and then afterwards knuckling down and figuring it out as they go. honestly it doesn't say anything about the dudes, it just says about the women how cripplingly insecure they are about themselves. shit happens and you don't always know what to do about it, but you're still gonna do it at the end of the day like i don't think a single person on this earth with functioning brain cells would just sit there bambi eyed and do nothing because they don't know what to do. there's a lot of shit i don't know what to do just like anyone else, it doesn't mean i can't do my best with the resources and information i have available to me and make it work. this is the problem is women are trained to operate on this delusional level of fear to the point where they are incapable of anything resembling rational conscious thought. in this day and age, we're safe like never before, life is easier and even people who are in poverty live better than kings did 500 years ago. it's all the fear mongering in the media making people think the world is this deadly frightening place. it's the same place our ancestors lived in for thousands of years, i think we'll be just fine especially with all the technology we have available.
That's where unfortunately stoicism becomes quite important right ? Everyone has an internal initial reaction to life or events but the stoic thing to do is to take that emotion , analyze the situation , and then ground yourself.
I'm not saying it's easy , hard , fair or any of that shit but It's hard to fucking freak out when shit goes wrong and then come back peaceful and calm and still hope to be respected just the same.
If that's how women were there'd be no reason for this sub .
Beings who are attracted to and respectful of their partners despite their emotional whims? That definition is typical of a man not a woman .
My one big disagreement with you is this :
Maybe you having with a better quality level of people than I do but this is the definition of a loser , and I live in a world where losers adopt this pattern of thought and behavior all the time . " Women aren't attracted to me and I refuse to change guess I\ll die alone LOL" , " It's not fair I try to lose weight but when I only eat 3,000 calories a day it never seems like my weight goes down , grr people with good genetics and metabolisms are so lucky!" , " I haven't gotten a raise the past 3 years I've worked here but I'm too comfortable to leave, these guys will realize how valuable I am one day and my train will finally come in" .
You know what happens when you try to address the problems of these people " I Shouldn't have to change the girl who I marry will like me for ME!" , " My genetics are just different maybe being severely obese is just my normal weight" , "I don't / shouldn't have to change jobs until I'm completely sure I can't move forward here" .
There are a lot of losers out there man . It's nice to believe everybody figures shit out and take control of their lives but the truth is most people stumble and sleep through everything.
Showing weakness is the problem. Women loathe a weak man.
Simultaneously displaying emotional vunerability and strength by opening up to a woman you've gotten to know about something that hurt you in the past (ex. getting bullied) but overcame with strength (lifting and learning how to fight) is actually a proven panty moistener.
In other words, don't use a woman as an emotional tampon, but you can strategically "open up" when it helps you.
This. Opening up not the worst thing. Opening up while being a loser is the worst.
It's been my experience that when a woman sees you going through a tough time, they've kind of stuck around if you seem like you're still able have fun with it. It's a seductive trait that ANYONE would want to be around. If a girl sees you buckle, sure as hell they will book-it outta there. Even then though, you can still rebound given a little time and cool-headed effort. Nothing is final unless you do something to REALLY fuck it up or you excessively fuck up. Distance is an incredible healer of many things.
You know how we say "Don't listen to her words, watch her actions instead"? Well, women don't do that. Unconsciously they are looking for their LTR's weakest moment, whether that is an verbal admission or an act (or lack thereof). Once that is done, they are off to the races of hypergamy.
"She loves an idea of you - not you". By opening up you kill the kind of hamster which is actually working for you satisfyibg her hypergamic need.
It's the vulnerability and any modicum of sense that you are anxious or somehow weakened by the situation. You can say, "big meeting tomorrow, going to be tough, but I'm going to kill it". You can't say,"oh my God I'm so stressed, this job is killing, and there is this big meeting tomorrow".
This completely destroys the captain-first mate dynamic because you're supposed to lead and know how to traverse rough seas and hazardous shoals. She's there to do little things to help you, make dinner while you're at the wheel battling the elements, but under no circumstance is it 50/50. She ain't going to man the sails or anything else major. You must succeed, not be under deck crying.
Women are disgusted on a visceral level by weakness in men. If your opening up means coming clean about how awesome you are and how many hos at work want your cock, you're probably safe.
you didn't get anything, did you?
Great question, it's the latter
it's this. Exactly this ... in a way, "what she doesn't know can't trigger her", that's why it's best left "unspoken of" .. becoz every guy feels this way at times, it's a part of being alive, being uncertain
Yeah I lost a girl by opening up. At the time, I fell into bullshit victim mindset and thought I had anxiety and I fucking told her that. Looking back I realize I was an idiot on both fronts lol but water under the bridge
This same thing happened to me, my oneitis opened up to me about something really traumatic about her childhood and kept pressuring me to open up to her, when I fell into bullshit victim mindset and told her I had really bad anxiety. She probably didn't feel safe in my arms anymore after I showed all that weakness which is why she started fucking Señor Thundercock a week later.
Good call. To keep a woman your mindset needs to be "I can handle anything, motherfucker."
Hang this on your fridge and start living by this code. It adds value to your life.
I'd say don't just do it for the sake of attracting women.
These kinds of mantras can make you feel more sovereign and not dependent on the acknowledgement of other people, i.e, in this case, the opposite sex.
Edit: Replying to month old posts ftw.
Moving on is the best solution in those cases, as hard as it may sound.
Basically because the rest of the world, including her, also moved on.
Water in the fridge.
Real case Ontario.
*water under the fridge
*worst case Ontario
Get it right, for fucks sake!
My god, I wish this bullshit epidemic of "anxiety" would just fuck off already. I hear it all too often; guys that don't have the balls to be social, "I have anxiety..", or girls desperate for attention on social media, "Guys help! I just had an anxiety attack..".
I blame the doctors for actually making them believe it. How big does their fuckin' yacht gotta be anyway?
Well a generation of people investing more time in social media than social interaction is bound to end in a mental health crisis, no need to downplay things which are obvious.
I didn't think I had social anxiety. It was more of extreme performance anxiety that was spilling into my everyday life.
well i kinda lost a relationship by not being able to open myself up to her.
This is not an issue that is simple enough to be answered by opeup or do not open up.
What did she end it for exactly?
she didn't, i did because we distanced ourselves quite a lot towards the end. In the Retroperspecrive, I now know, that it was partially because I couldn't open myself and therefore she also distanced herself unconsciously.
So you broke up with her because you couldn't tell her how you felt? Wot? That makes no sense.
You need more men as friends.
no i broke up, because it was no good relationship anymore, i just realised months later, after i changed myself to the better, that that was one of the reasons why the relations got worse
You need to put your hamster on medication.
Women will let you know when a relationship got worse. Stop bleeding from your vagina for them.
Its about connection so u try and stay at the same pace, like if she says she's annoyed that her cat pissed on her bed dont say u feel suicidal in that moment 😂
Thinking ur an idiot is still victim mindset. You're not an idiot, if someone leaves its cos they had to go, its not about you 😊
what really irks me is how this is true, yet girls TRULY and honestly believe that they would not be like this with a guy who opened up to them
This is a perfect add on. Every woman believes she will be the caring nurturing mother. . . Until they get a good look into the dark, empty pit that is your soul.
Hence why women like bad boys, they believe they can "cure" him. But once that starts to happen they get cold feet, turn tail and swing to another branch that looks stronger.
Men shouldn't be seeking a mother for themselves in another woman anyway.
Agreed. It's a lot easier to fall into that trap for guys who never had an emotional connection with their mothers
Wow this just sparked an epiphany that's causing a chain of mini epiphanies, kinda makes me sad. Thank you.
Damn you got me right there
Agreed, no man should be looking for their mother in another woman.
But many women try to be that replacement, and or at least a similar figure, trying to cure the bad boy mentality.
lmao if your soul is a dark empty pit, then sort that shit out. that ain't her fault, it's yours bitch.
This is because women really wants a man who open up, but when he opens she finds a man with troubles but with confidence to overcome it, not a bitch who doesn't know what to do.
Kinda like most men want a whole in bed but not a whore in past experiences
"Not opening up" is one of the very first principles from here I applied in real life, and it was a peach: she seemed to respect me more and started making sneering remarks about emotional men in the weeks after I laughed off her attempt to get into my soul.
Save it for the sweat lodges - women can't handle and don't want to see the abyss that is your "inner self".
Its not what u say but how u say it. Anyone with an understanding of life who wants something real canappreciate its not all smiles and rainbows every day. Theres alot of power to being able to be in your 'downs' and your darkness. It just depends on how much superficiality you can take, there are ways to open up that make the connection stronger not weaker but its about how u frame it
Thus the assbackwardness of marital therapy.
The therapist and wife doubleteam the interrogation and coax out the mans insecurities and cement the end of the marriage.
The viability of the whole marital therapy racket is that it gives hamster food to the woman who files.
Now she has social proof that "she tried". Listen in on any brunch full cock riding divorced women. They celebrate how shitty their husbands were and feel zero guilt about estranging him from his kids or robbing half his net worth because "Muh Therapy"
It's also been my observation that if a man makes the mistake and opens up to a woman about hie fears/hurts/issues etc, she will absolutely at some point use that weakness or vulnerability against him in a fight. By you showing your kinks, she will be ruthless and stabbing right for it whenever she is mad. Regardless of how much she supposedly loves you, or that that issue should be off limits in a fight, she will intentionally work it in. What's amazing is that they have no concept of insidious evil, yet they will revert to it in a heartbeat when they hate you. You can see this played almost daily. It's sad cause men are generally not allowed to have any outlet for their emotions.
agreed. women are emotionally violent which is why TRP pushes men to become their own mental point of origin as this disarms most womens attacks
Wasn't married, but my ex and I did couples therapy (messy situation, we have a kid, she was from a town 4 hours away and was threatening to move back and take our child, blah blah, all worked out fine with the kid in the end).
Anyway....
My ex is such a cunt that the therapist actually told her that she was really mean.
It was glorious.
minus cash the only reason a relationship with a woman is complex is a kid
And mental illness. She had plenty of that. Current me has learned a lot compared to 22 year old me. Of course had she not gotten pregnant, we would not have lasted nearly as long as we did.
They literally cackle like harpies when they talk about denying visitation to Beta husbands. It gives them a warm fuzzy feeling of power. Weirdly they usually don't laugh when talking about denying visitation to Alpha husbands. For them they whine and bitch about how he is a terrible father who never visits.
See how it works? If the man wants to see the kids, the wife withholds the kids. if the man doesn't want to see the kids, the wife blames the man for not spending time with the kids.
There is no winning. If the wife cannot get the man to open up about his vulnerabilities she will make it the focal point of the relationship and complain incessantly. If she does get him to collapse she will lose attraction.
Lost a plate last year by opening up when I got too drunk. It was going to end eventually anyway as she had a history of cheating on her boyfriends (with me). Once things ended she was sweet about letting me know that one drunken night gave her some misgivings. Wished her well and learned my lesson. Be sober and be strong.
FR.
OP is right. Guys I cannot state this point as important enough! Seriously. Here is why.
Been with my wife for 16 years, she was a virgin too. So as the years go by all is well and we do have our fights but with a little dread game everything was fine.
Then 3 months ago my business almost went bankrupt, 3 days and I would have been done for. So I made the mistake and told her all about my fears and anxieties. And guess what, she had an affair within one month while I was stressing my balls off about my business, while she was using my money to pay for shit for this guy, while she sits at home all day and I play Mr. Good Beta Boy Provider. Mr. fucking white night, I was even proud of being the provider until I came here (TRP).
After the whole thing she even said so herself: "it was fucking unattractive, you were moaning and complaining. And you just pissed me off". Here I was thinking that because I am such a good provider for over a decade, I get to have some support. Wrong.
Lesson learned the hard way. If a 16 year virgin relationship, "soul mates", fuck we even attended the same preschool - if that all can break down in less than 2 months, do what OP said. Also, this is the main thing as there are not much other problems, I am fit, I lift, I am well dressed, attractive, fun to be around; the point is I did not become a fat slob, I simply showed weakness.
I am now eating bags and bags of symbolic dicks every day as I am trying to cope with this, while trying to swallow the red pill. AWATS, even your virgin goody two shoes wife.
16 years and one mistake leads to this, my condolences .
Thanks, I will pass on the good will to the beta turd who lives in my house. Oh wait...
This is how it is. Women live in the moment.
This, this, this, this. I've witnessed a similar scenario, and been a part of one myself. It doesn't matter what you look like, what car you drive, or how chill you are 99% of the time, as soon as you start opening up, complaining, and bitching, even justly so, it's a panty dryer, and she will stray, even if loyal to a T for years.
I'd like to add, money is only the issue in our minds in a stable LTR. Most women seem to be ok with finances going under if it wasn't blatent stupidity and you've shown the ability, history, and mindset of being able to correct the issue.
The hardest is the mindset, women simply cannot fathom the loads of mental and physical stress money has on us, especially when the government plays stepdad betabux in our stead.
If you show a strong mind, confidence, and an ability to bounce back, a lot of women will gladly hit rock bottom with you and come out the other side. If you show the stress getting to you, she'll swing branches even if there's millions in the bank. BELEIVE THAT. Ask divorced retired athletes.
Briffaults Law - Past benefit provided by the male does not provide for continued or future association.
I never thought about it but Briffaults law must still apply even in marriage or truthfully the effects of it are probably more visible in a marriage . How awful to build a life with someone for over a decade and because of sharing your thoughts on a truly stressful time she feels driven or enabled to fucking forget every other facet of the life you've built together and go pursue someone else for her own selfish reasons.
It was easy for me to accept this in terms of plates because the emotional investment and mutual commitment isn't there or particularly deep but in a wife? Just when I think I've swallowed the whole pill I get surprised again.
Nothing to add, just loved bags and bags of symbolic dicks. 10/10 will use again.
Dear god. Thanks for sharing buddy. That's my red pill for the week.
The slide to beta does not rest on one bad turn of events. Consider this, there are many women fucking and sucking losers without jobs, houses, or cars. What makes a man attractive to women has nothing to do with what we as men value.
A woman in an LTR will only value that which she fears losing.
As for you sir, I envy you. You have the opportunity to be a truly free man. There is an ocean of young hot puss, business opportunities, and experiences open to you. Be happy women are generally incapable of making good long term decisions in their mates.
There's a difference between opening up and falling apart.
Yes there is. But you will fall apart at least once in your life: a cancer scare, tragic death of a family member, home invasion, affair, etc.
A home invasion would not be an appropriate time to fall apart.
Those other scenarios? Perfectly fine; though with the affair - if you fell apart at that moment, I would imagine that would be indicative of a number of things you did before then for her to not want to remain faithful to you.
The problem is that you can't "open up" about what's going on with you and then not have some plan of action to deal with it. You can't wallow in self-pity and expect her to still be attracted to you.
Whining and being ineffectual are the least attractive traits regardless of sex/gender.
No your problem was you were a pussy whipped little provider for years and years and once the business started failing there was nothing left for her. It had nothing to do with one moment in time it has to do with a long list of behaviours that slowly eroded her sexual desire for you
Yes Mr. Smarty pants. You are right.
However did you honestly think I was studying RedPill and PUA when I had a virgin wife and I myself only had sex once without her? Things were what they were and we were "committed" too each other for life. You know, "soulmates". Why would a soulmate cheat even in the trying times.
Now I know the truth.
Yea, I feel you. Recently opened up to an HB10 and now she won't even open my snaps. This is after a year of being an oak. Never let your guard down, or she will climb on top of you to reach someone else.
Well said. I hope you are not beating yourself up too much, you learned your lesson. You are the number one priority. Wishing you well my friend!
Thank you! Taking TRP starts with a choice, but the true test is upkeep. Wish you well too my dude!
Don't snap her like everyone else does.
You're right. Face-to-face or get erased.
If it were me, I wouldn't erase her or any other woman from my contact list unless the relationship is thoroughly over. Just don't send her snaps unless she sends you one first meant only for you i.e. not a mass snap sent to everyone. Snapchat is a nudes goldmine if you play it right. My favorite plate and I will snap back and forth and I'll even go first but it's because I've known her for years. Short term plates NEVER receive snaps from me EVER.
Good advice. Definitely need to play around for nudes.
Red Pill Rule, if she's not a famous instagram model or actress she's not an HB10, max you can get without notoriety is HB9.
I don't think the famous level matters just the looks
Meh, the 1-10 scale is subjective anyway. Someone with lower standards will consider an 8 a 9, or an attraction to a particular feature (i.e. tits versus ass versus hip-waist ratio or cute face) will add or take away a point depending on the guy doing the rating. And for what it's worth, I know a pretty well known Instagram model who I consider only a bit above average overall, but someone who fawns over a baby face and nice ass may rate her an HB10.
Actually in the old days of PUA there is a HB11. A HB10 would be a girl who looks like Taylor Swift. Taylor Swift herself is a HB11: Not only does she look very good, she is rich and famous.
It's subjective though. And honestly the scale became useless because of delusional guys overestimating people. A guy here claimed that his mid 40s asian single mother plate was a HB7. Yeah right...
Can you give us a general idea of what you revealed that was the issue?
You want him to open up to you but he will not because you will dry up.
Showing vulnerability. The way that we met was that I got mini-famous on YouTube and she reached out to me. Then I pinpointed all her dark secrets on the first day. From then on we became closer to the point where she said "I love you" first. But those were all manipulation tactics of course. Then I got sucked into it and transformed into betatude and when I felt that she was pulling away, I pushed harder instead of just saying FUCK IT and leave it alone. The last paragraph I sent her was the axe that killed it, but lesson learned and I'll be back in 2 years as an even better man for a P&D. Got so much opportunity now that I'm back in school.
If you're sending paragraphs at all, you're likely fucking up. Showing vulnerability isn't the problem, as long as you're dealing with it.
Example: I got a real depression, and I told my gf. Everyone could see I had a problem anyway. She started asking me all the time how I was feeling, going into caretaking mode, but I rejected that.
I said my brain was temporarily sick and it will pass soon enough. I told her never to ask again how I was feeling. I'd tell her if I wanted to. With some SSRI and time off work, eventually it passed and she was still as attracted as before. My attitude was that I didn't care if she left me or not, no neediness.
Own your flaws and vulnerabilities, and it becomes a strength.
Very true. The paragraphs I used to send her were reflections of her paragraphs to me.
But then I had to go on and basically say "boo hoo, I'm so hurt by you and you should feel bad. Boo hoo."
Now I see the truth. For what it really is now. I thought taking TRP as a teen was just a choice. And part of it is, upkeep is more important. But there is just something even more peculiar that occurs when a boy grows into a man. It's never instant, but to that man, it feels like it is. Like the world he saw before is no longer really there. All illusions shattered. The manipulation that mother did out of "love."
I wonder how many snaps a 10/10 gets daily. So many betas trying to get your attention.
Dude it's like 100. Some days better than others, but she's got multiple phones. It's that bad. The worst part is that she stops seeing these as human beings after it all begins. At first it's a flood of dopamine, but evens out as a new "normal." It's terrible because she is afraid that everyone will give up on her and leave, despite many trying to be the one who stays. The totality of it all is that she has a part of her that wants attention from one guy for X amount of time, but then gets the feeling that she just wants to run away. This is literally how she told me how she feels at times and so definitely a plate and not a LTR.
I disagree to a certain extent. My gf started to think I was a robot. So I opened up a little and she loves it. It doesn't mean dumping all your shit in her. It means being able to communicate and showing that you face challenges as well but you always overcome them. If you turn into a soft mopey rag and you are done. It's all about being honest yet maintaining frame.
The voice of reason. The problem isn't opening up, it's that likely these dudes that did were wet blankets already. I rarely meet men who are stoic anymore and when a stoic man lets his girl look in a little bit, it can provide a panty wetting experience for her. Bitches love when the guy they're crazy about has a moment.
But they don't love when a dude that's already a pussy has a moment.
I mean, having an emotional moment where you show you are under stress but have the power to handle it IS attractive. Opening up completely to a girl, letting down all your walls, and asking her to mother you and share your burden is unattractive, because a girl can't be in mothering mode and attraction mode simultaneously.
However, what I've found is that the less emotional of a guy you are, the more leeway you have in expressing yourself, because most of your emotions are fake anyways. If you aren't actually emotional, you can use the girls mothering tendency against her, make her feel guilt, push/pull her emotions, etc. Basically, modelling the behavior of a sociopath.
Fair enough, but I'd have to agree with OP here whole-heartedly. I can see this working for you short-term but not long-term. She loves it now cause she feels like she's making progress with unwinding/breaking you (as all women are programmed to do). But imho, she will get bored of it eventually and consider it a weakness. Chad doesn't open up to women because he's never concerned with that validation or soothing emotion. He doesn't need it. He just needs her pussy to be wet and fuckable whenever he wants. It's all fun, light, and smirks for him. This is at it's core what all women want. It's the realest version of romance it gets for them. I think it's easy to forget what it must of been like for our ancient ancestors.. The men saw their women as a series of holes and reproductive organs, and the women relished it. Just my two cents.
There is no problem to open up, really. You just need to have the background sentiment of "yes this is fucked up, really hard, but I will handle it".
this is all what needs to be said about this topic
Yeah a lot of the advice here is like be a fucking robot - what a person to be around and be in a relationship with /s
yeah and to that most advice indirectly conditions you to start hating women subconsciously
I think dick size has more to do with it. If these poor souls had more than a Tootsie Roll in their pants, the ladies wouldn't care as much about emotional mommy issues.
What exactly do you guys mean by opening up? Do you guys mean spilling your heart out to a girl you've known for a few months?
I've been in an ltr for a few years now and I open up occasionally but obviously I never have a victim mindset and I never open up more than she already has to me and I make sure opening up doesn't devalue my SMV. It doesn't really affect our relationship much but I could see how opening up and saying I'm a former incel who was mentally abused by my family and didn't get my first kiss till I was 20 and I hate everyone would dry any girl up.
It will dry anyone up. That's why it's so important that you know who you're with well enough. As well as yourself, so you won't say more than you feel fair to share.
So, when I finally had enough of the fucking bullshit, I straight up told Legal Cohabiting Female this: "Talking to you involves me being vulnerable and you just listening, then you use that information against me. I'm done doing it."
It was that direct and confrontational as you could imagine. She did not even blink. She didn't argue it. She didn't even huff. Nothing. Bullseye.
Ask yourself: are you telling her how you feeling about your life? And is she saying anything about herself? No? Then shut the fuck up.
Interestingly, talking with her about issues got a lot easier after that. I just stopped talking about how I feel and instead about how I saw things around me.
Opening up is like date compression. You want to use it to maintain interest, not gain it. It's classic cat-string theory. Most important part is that you have to show that you are unaffected by the trauma you once faced. Instead, you own it. It's your bitch, because you're awesome. Fuck feelings, all that matters are results.
Shit I'm 19, will telling a girl you haven't kissed someone really dry her up?
Yes, unless you want to be a kisses virgin at 20+, don't mention it. She'll assume you already have.
Omg that is what exactly happened to me. The girl I was talking to was all cosy and comfy taking to me and I felt that we might be heading towards a stable relationship. We sat under the night skies and talked about the kind of shit that I hadn't talked to anyone about. About my insecurities, why I fail and why sometimes I feel miserable and lo, what I see is that she started distancing herself from me. I had always been sad since that day because I was unable to contemplate the reason for her absurd behavior until today.
To me it still doesn't really make any sense because everyone is vulnerable, our bodies are quite weak, its actually quite powerful to share the thing you're terrified of yet still working on resolving it especially it should be easier with a significant other there on the journey with yet if thats said it turns the other person off and she leaves you lolllllllllllllll
Signal weakness and you are no longer attractive. In other words, no one cares about your problems. Don't be boring. Don't be a pussy. Definitely be a dick.
Never reveal everything. Reveal just enough to keep her hamster spinning.
Don't do it. And frankly it's something I have come to learn is ultimately unhealthy. Like I feel some guys (I would include my former self) view women as a place to vent their feelings. Because women are viewed as more sensitive yada yada they feel it's appropriate. Also, for men, women's advice is generally crap but that's another issue
In my last relationship I remember chilling with my girl watching Netflix while her room mate had a dude over on a 2nd date sorta thing. I remember listening to their conversation through the wall and him spilling his baggage about his ex and why that ended. Basically him saying he let her walk all over him and 'she always expected me to pay for drinks when we were out together' basically admitting he was completely unable to stand up to girls. Just generally one of those overly deep chats I've been guilty of having a thousand times in my BP days that resulted in always getting friend zoned.
I said to my girl 'he's not getting any'. She giggled and agreed. Her room mate had a new guy over the very next night.
Damn it. As a man, you can't show any weakness and have to keep this stoic persona up all the time. Which is exhausting to do for long periods of time. What's the purpose of having a girlfriend at all?
I enjoy myself chilling with some dudes over a few beers and games. Yet with a woman, it's a conscious effort to keep up that image by watching what you say and do all the time. It's a waste of energy and not too enjoyable either.
If you need sex, you can PUA. Or just buy sex if you want. Less strings attached.
you can open up to male friends, your priest, your school counselour. Yes, its good to share things after a good sex session, but imagine if you are about to jump out of an airplane and your parachute says: listen, we are real close right now and I want to tell you something, I may not open, ok? Of you are going into battle and discover your rifle is loaded with blanks. You still go ahead? That`s what goes on on womens heads if you show fragility.
I mean i get what you are talking about. But anyone can tell that it's so ridiculous. No one is a 100% strong rock. Even a real rifle fails sometimes and that is to be expected. You get one that has the lowest failure rate possible, but getting rid of any gun that has a failure rate above 0% is crazy. That's basically not being a gun owner anymore, because every gun has a chance of failing.
I have a rational brain, and so does every other person on this sub. All of us can see how flawed that requirement for an invincible man is. Yet women are the bunch that are still looking for superman. However, everyone knows women do in fact, have a rational brain. There are women in STEM fields, valedictorians and scientists. There is no doubt that women do have a functioning rational brain that can do logic thinking.
What exactly is causing them to pursue this imaginary figure? Or should I say, impossible standard in a man? Is their brain actually different? Is there another goal or another concept that is causing them to override their logic and reason? If I directly mention it to a woman, will she get it? Hypergamy doesn't explain why a woman discards realistic thinking. Perfection just really doesn't exist on Earth whether you like it or not. If you have a rational mind, you should know that, no excuse.
We all know how unfulfilled desires makes you miserable. If most women are really looking for superman, there must be whole lot of misery just from being born female.
Perhaps, perhaps there are a minority of women out there who do realise this flawed logic. To be a rational thinker is to be able to figure out your own cognitive dissonance. Perhaps some intelligent woman can sit, think, and rationalize away whatever it is that is blinding her. I really want to hope that what we are talking about (bratty girls) are a bunch of non-intelligent women, and intelligent ones exist. Is intelligence even the difference between a gamey shit tester girl VS a less bratty one?
Intelligence is one factor i haven't seen mentioned on the side bar.
Her intelligence isn't going to overcome her instinct in the area of sexual attraction. It is true no man can live up to the superman ideal of women. But you don't have to. You just have to be stronger and more of a rock than other men she knows/has access to. We aren't judged based on an ideal; we are graded on a curve. To succeed you need to just be better than the competition.
When you enter a plane, you are aware that the pilot might crash that thing. However, if the pilot goes to you and says "I might crash this plane", you probably would want to get the next plane. They know that the man next to her isn't invincible, but they don't want to be constantly reminded of that.
You're slowly realizing that women cannot be kept longterm...just enjoy her while it's your turn.
That is the realisation that brings lots of guys to MGTOW.
Though they are actually a defeatist ideology. I still want to succeed. That's why I'm taking time out to run and lift. And try to increase my value as much as I can. MGTOW sees the same problems but gives up in the face of it.
i think the next step would actually be buddhism, realizing the impermanence and suffering of this life and just being at peace with how things are rather than causing more misery trying to chase after more things which just causes more suffering
Glad you bring that up.
My way to make it work is to actually be the rock naturally. Sounds hard, right? Yes, it is impossible. Then I realized that only something supernatural could be a Rock for me all the time and went back to Church after 18 years of atheism. I am married for 3 years now and doing fine, because my wife knows that I am just a dirt piece of crap, but a piece of crap that is leaning on a Rock and is not scared of dealing with anything that life throw at us.
this is exactly I was posting on TRP about 2 years ago but those bluepill faggots give me minus points..
80 percent of people don't care about your problems
20 percent of people are happy for your problems
so now, if I have a problem, I talk to God (and fuck religion, any religion is just for children and women to behave good)
It's just the mindset, me I don't see what or why I would ''open up'' about my few weakness, this is stuff that we fix on our own anyway.
OP, I can more than relate. This happened to me recently. I was seeing this girl, albeit for a short while, who was rather obsessed with me. I quite liked her too, just not to the same extent (I've, frankly, rarely seen a girl who was so into me so quickly). We went out one day, had some dinner, then went back to my place to netflix and chill. We both netflix'd and chill. But I never saw her after that. The problem is.. I was having very much an off day, I was short on sleep, and I confided in her about some things that have been affecting me. When I dropped her off, she texted me that she thought we shouldn't be seeing each other. She made some good points about how we were into different things and how I was a bit self-centered. She also recently divorced and has been going through drama and admitted that maybe she used me to go through that phase. But the timing - me admitting some personal insecurities, for the first time ever, and her deciding "we're too different" - that is hard for me to ignore.
I can't say for sure if it was that which caused our break-up or one of the several other factors, but it has been quite a lesson for me and I won't repeat the same mistake again.
If a girl leaves you for opening up to them you were already coming off a weak person. You just didn't realize it. Telling her your insecurities was just the icing on the cake that yep, he's a little bitch. Everyone has insecurities and issues. Any person with half a brain and maturity level beyond highschool will understand that. Having insecurities doesn't kill attraction. It's how you express them and handle them that kills it. It's not so cut and dry or either y'all are fucking with some seriously shallow dumb bitches.
many guys can't differentiate or take a stance against these type of women because of thirst and not enough sex in their life. so they try to wife the first bitch they come into contact with. then they end up in this sub.
You're an idiot if you think intelligence somehow supersedes sexual attraction.
It has nothing to do with being shallow and everything to do with evolution programming humans to want the best possible mate so as to have superior offspring.
I never said a single thing about intelligence. The entire rhetoric behind the commentors here is a victim mindset. When really your moves are weak.
Intelligence is that which allows the female to tell herself "him opening up to me is perfectly okay!" Your argument necessarily relies on intelligence to work, because instinct and sexual attraction are telling her "this guy is weak and a potential liability that may fail miserably and get us all killed."
Of course, that last quote is my intellect paraphrasing what instinct makes one feel in a mere instant.
Your weak moves superceding her intellegance is the issue.
Any type of move that generates or destroys sexual attraction will supersede intellect.
As I said in my other comment, it depends on the insecurity. The type of insecurities one has are linked to how strong or weak one is. And many weaknesses (not all) kill or lower sexual attraction.
And if your insecurity is so minor that it doesn't matter anyway, why even open up about it? Opening up will never increase her sexual attraction, so it is a pointless endeavor.
Exactly. If you open up to a woman and she flees, you didn't deserve her because she wasn't getting enough value from you. All of the examples in the OP are of weak men.
I have both lost and strengthened relationships from opening up.
If you are weak and you open up, you are displaying weakness. If you are strong and you open up, you are displaying strength in the face of your insecurities and fears.
It really depends on what you insecurities are. Most are automatic sexual attraction killers because, by definition, an insecurity is a weakness.
Everyone's got weaknesses bud. So your telling me that if you tell a girl you're insecure that your not good at football and aren't in the NFL her pussy will automatically dry up? That's your logic.
I literally said most and that it depends on the insecurity. Learn to read before misapplying 'my logic.'
You're are exactly right mate, there are a lot of retards in here.
Women really do want you to open up, but follow it up by, "it will be fine I'll figure it out" or something along those lines. Communication is everything to a woman its so important to understand that.
Alot of you idiots are saying you opened up and took a victim mentality, that was the fucking reason they lost attraction not the opening up part.
How can you be so unaware.
It's posts like these that give this sub a bad name. It's posts like these that make theredpill a laughing stock. I'm glad there's a few of us here that appreciate the information in this sub but will actually step up and call out the bullshit that can actually ruin some man's entire perception of reality.
I like the intro. Every post should be like that.
Because your life story or how you explored some RP theory doesn't matter, if not essentially for the meaning of the post.
Also the info is good, thanks.
Ive been with my s.o. 7 years. Right now im unemployed since March, bills and child support stacking up every month.....While in an argument i told my s.o. that im stressed out and under pressure about how shit is for me and she told me she has no sympathy for my situation and fuck my pitiful ass life. Havent spoken to her since Saturday morning.
Point is when the pressures on and no matter how bad you want to get it out, keep it to yourself until you have some1 you can trust with your thoughts.
Women who are insecure about themselves need their man to be infallible. Modern Women are spoiled children that never grow up and never learn how to handle their emotions. If your feel depressed and anxious she will picked up on those emotions, panic, and seek comfort else where. In short, these women are weak willed.
A couple living on a mountain (or other remote location) far from civilization doesn't have a choice to be so weak. There are no other men to run to nor women to comfort her. She needs to support her husband to strengthen him and she needs to be strong of spirit herself to deal with shit when hes not around.
Modern women are lazy spoiled brats.
Fantastic post. Stoictism is the basis of all strong men. Few are emotionally sound. Like where's opening up to a women going to get you exactly anyway?
Holy fuck this hits so close to home.
This post just confirms everything. I also made the mistake of opening up to my current girlfriend (you can rip me a new one, lord knows I need it). But before opening up every fiber of my being was screaming not to but I ignored it. Blew up in my face almost immediately. The post said it and I'll reiterate: DONT OPEN UP TO A WOMAN. Now, tell me im dumbass.
Edit: currently counting the days till the relationship goes sour
Mine left me after I was in a hospital for 2 months from a tick-borne illness.
She also had borderline personality disorder.
Fucked me up real good, boys.
You wouldn't divulge your thoughts to a child, women are the same.
Lol, I said basically the same thing
This reminds me of an episode from Friends where Rachel is dating Bruce Willis, a tough guy with a strong frame and doesn't take bullshit from anyone. She likes that he's a tough guy but tells him to open up, which he refuses. She nags him endlessly until he gives up and opens up to her. After opening up, she loses respect for him and thinks of him as weak then she leaves him.
a man needs to share and express his feelings, unless he wants to go crazy.
aaaaand thats what your male friends are for.
and maybe your sister or mom, but this one is not guaranteed to be a good idea.
Having a group of men to emote to is so key. I have a few guys that i can reach out to. Men process emotions differently and can both hold each other up and kick each other in the balls as needed.
true! to have such friends is truly a blessing
Take it with a grain of salt. I have a really fucked up family(and gets worse day by day), my background is fucked up, my childhood is fucked up, but i overcame most of it by myself because i have to be the rock of my family. When i tell my Gfs my background and show them that despite all of it, i am here, stronger than ever and i am handling this shit, they will have massive respect for me. BUT the trick is if you need a hug or cry on someone shoulders, DONT FUCKING SHOW HER THAT.
The only 'feelings' you should share with a woman are the ones which come from your ruthless side. For instance "I feel like I want to choke you while bending you over the sofa tonight" or "I feel like every once in a while you need to shut your mouth and let me relax."
Nice post OP, I enjoyed the humorous delivery a lot. For those members who want to know how to talk to women, here are some tips. If you want to talk about your past you can do so, you can also talk about traumatic experiences from your past if you follow a few simple rules. First, keep the emotion the fuck out of the story. If you are emotional about it (including angry) then do not even tell that story. Example, your ex fucked Chad while you were at work. You can tell her your ex cheated, but make it clear that you simply moved on and act like it didn't bother you (even though you cried into your teddy bear every night for a month).
Second - You can use other examples from your past to show what a stoic mother fucker you are. Family member died? - you have such great memories of them and you were there for the family in the aftermath. Got hit by a car? - cute nurses at hospital and plenty of time to read your favourite books. Got fired by a nasty boss? - learned a lot about people and went on to the next step in your career. You can talk about your past experiences, but do not get emotional. Women are emotional creatures, she has more than enough emotions of her own. Pouring your own emotions onto an illogical creature such as woman is like pouring gasoline onto a raging fire.
You talking about funeral reminded me something, she cut all the contact with me when someone from my family died, off topic but brings back memories .
I was going to write something among these lines, did a search and found you already did. It's fine to "open up" about challenges you have already surmounted, it could be fine to talk about current challenges you are facing if you have the right attitude and if they are major challenges (eg. Do not say "I was diagnosed with cancer, I'm going to be depressed and cry until death comes to my doorstep", do say: "I was diagnosed with cancer, things will be tough for a while, but I can handle it and things will be back to normal in the foreseeable future").
It's definitely not cool to open up about small issues that shouldn't bother you that much in the first place (stoicism and similar concepts in eastern philosophies).
Great post and I totally agree. It continues to astound me how backwards I've had it for so long. I used to always pride myself on being in touch with my emotions and being unafraid to share my sensitive side. face palm
Tbh, I think this sub has a 'broken boy' problem
Why is it that no woman is worth opening up to?
This just mathematically does not make sense
You're telling me there is not a single woman on Earth that is quality enough to open up to and she will not become endearing and supportive?
I'm calling bullshit on you
If anything I think it's all these guys in here (trp) have hurt egos and they just find equally broken girls and just blame the girl when they just do what broken girls know to do
Newsflah: If you meet a hot chick at a club/bar who's willing to dress that way or even get near you the first time she meets, obviously she is a slut and only knows one way to interact with guys: be abused
Sleep with her if you want, but when shit hits the fan (you open up because life), don't say we didn't warn you
If anything, that makes more sense then what you're saying
I'd suggest investing in something to raise my self esteem before I start pointing fingers, just sayin'
No, I don't think we're saying exactly that. From my personal experience, it's okay to open up to a girl.. eventually. The main danger is if you get emotional and reveal too many of your insecurities too early in the relationship. That's when the girl is likely to get cold feet.
This makes sense
This seems reasonable
I think you have a good point, because any woman who senses a gun shy man will begin to question him and them if get doubts are more significant then the confidence he has demonstrated--this is just human and true elsewhere such in business, too
Much more astute then OPs blanket statement
I see that shit way too much here
Actually "opening up" as a term does imply a supplicating/ emotional delivery. The post did not say "do not talk about your past", it said "do not open up". So long as you can keep the emotional victim puke out of your stories, it is fine to talk about your past experiences. OP probably should have made this particular point in his post.
I would like to point out that during a low point in my life i opened up to my sister. Whom i previously didnt open up to. I trust her more than almost everybody. The way she reacted to it was almost sickening. Not only was there a clear lack of empathy I also noticed her respect for me dropped off instantly. Shes a very empathetic person. Dont open up at all. Women dont have empathy for men. Doesnt make sense but its true.
This sub has a broader readership than you seem to imply. I found TRP after marriage. I had followed all the rules and advice, and my wife was a harpy. It took a long time for me to understand, but a huge part of the problem I had was that when she asked a question, I answered it honestly and completely, to the best of my abilities. Owning your shit is a prerequisite, but things that are necessary are not always sufficient in lifei--more is sometimes required.
Remember, your wife doesn't want to hear that you're nervous at the law firm where you work. Even if she asks you about your first failed relationship in college, she doesn't want the answer. If you're struggling to fix an appliance, keep it to yourself. Part of becoming a man, not merely of being male, is being your own judge and arbiter.
Juzeza, in this wide word, there are certainly women who you can share with. But you'd have to find them. And the odds are not in your favor. One in ten? One in a hundred? I don't know where to begin the calculus on this one. Perhaps many of us here have bruised egos or something to validate or excuse. That does not make careful observations less true.
Yes but broken inside and succesful outside, plus great bodied and muscled, men... do NOT want to be into a relationship with ugly women.
Even tho equality is impossible, I really couldnt stand beig into a relationship with a girl who is less attractive than me. I dont work out so much just to settle for so less.
Just my opinion, anyways. Although I do agree with the majority of what you say, but i had to point that out.
Just like women like good men, men like good women, attractive but also mentally reliable.
Proverbs 31:3 "Do not spend your strength [aka give your strength] on women, your vigor on those who ruin kings"
The hurt ego thing in this sub rings true to me as well. There's definitely reasonable people here and some good ideas. In some relationships shit just happens too fast, but in most cases I would definitely say a combination of fear, anxiety and narcissism on both ends are what make the relationship crumble after you leave a good phase and start hitting wall after wall. If all you're gonna do is point fingers and blame (both yourself and your SO), you're better off just blocking that person on every social media and avoiding her. At least this way you won't say shit you might regret real hard later, neither hurt the other person directly with it (though ignoring someone can be real bad as well). If you don't feel ready about opening up to someone, it might be just a question of time, with that person or with yourself.
Those few quality women you are referring to gets close to the belief of unicorns. Got to be careful. Remember AWALT
I mean, yes and no. In my case everytime I found that unicorn (in my perception), that woman I knew wanted and had to be with for more reasons than I could possibly count in a lifetime, I held on to them strongly. Other women I wanted to be with, in a less intense manner, I just let them know its physical and there no feeling of possessiveness involved. If a friendship develops between us, and I feel like opening up, that's up to me and how I'm feeling about my self. If I'm confident, I'm just giving information in hope of a feedback from another person I grew to like, that's what I'm gonna. Now, if I'm confident I'm being a victim, that's probably all she's gonna hear. Those unicorns may be rare, but 100% of the times I truly wanted to be side by side with someone, I was with them. The time you spent looking for them, contributes just as much to what you're gonna feel when you find it. There's some relevance to AWALT, but I believe it might be a matter of phenotypic and genotypic differences thrown into the middle of society. The same as all men are probably all the same in some manners as well.
Point being, I'm completly satisfied with where all my relationships put me. I felt like I was growing as a part of it, and even more so after they ended. But thoses changes were more significant after I stopped blaming everything, and tried to understand it better.
My mom a gurl, i tell her shit somtime
I'm laughing at that! Hope everyone is doing well. Peace be with you.
But it really isn't. First thing to define is what "opening-up" means. There is a huge difference between factually stating something along the line of
"I'm a bit down/sad right now and for some time to come because my father died. please keep this in mind."
Why would you state that? If she says you are distant, you are less stoic maybe snap at her once or twice,...
Huge difference to breaking down and crying in her lap for minutes.
Shut the fuck up. Don't talk shit unless you've been through this and lived it.
lol man you are so bad it's funny
Your exactly the guy I'm taking about in my post, but do go on how I don't have a right to share my opinion on a board on the Internet dedicated to us being able to exchange ideas freely
You da man, Internet her0
PS, 'badboy': I've opened up to plenty of high quality women who didn't feel the need to leave me thereafter because their self esteem wasn't rooted solely in me
I'm glad you realize everything you said is just that: an opinion, and opinions mean nothing next to facts. But by all means, keep fishing.
You seem overly upset by his quite rational response to a post blaming women for your self esteem problems
Have you lived everyone's life to know that in every possible situation it won't ever be worth it to open up to someone? That to me seems much more like fear, and a desperate attempt to hold on to a girl you know is too much for you because you're too scared of who you are.
Literally no one here is saying this about EVERY girl or thinks that way. Which is why what he said is such b.s., he's taking advice and exaggerating it to a ridiculous point. Here, I can do the same: a girl once asked me for help so I can logically conclude that every women is a damsel in distress and needs a white knight like me to save her.
See, it's easy. Not only is it untrue, but people fall for crap like this.
Your dramatic and irrational response says a lot about you. Think about that. Maybe you're the problem.
So you're natural response to hearing b.s. is to encourage it? Idk what problem you're referring to but my life is swell.
my best friend married a virgin, he has 2 kids with her now, she is young women (about 25)
a few months ago we were talking and he was like I cannot tell anything bad to my wife when I have a problem it makes problem even bigger and she is disgusted.. I need to solve everything on my own, it is exhausting..
she is VERY RELIGIOUS and DEFINITELY NO SLUT...
*A. W. A. L. T. *
No, she and he are just poor
Betcha
Anyone who believes in awalt is a numbskull
It's intellectually lazy
I gon't get your idea - like what if they are poor?
Well every time i said that i like the girl it always backfired. So i guess the key here is to say you don't like her? I have no idea to be honest.
Why the fuck would you talk about your feelings to another person, let alone a woman?
Don't you know what happened to Bluebeard?
I gave you a point, but, I surely do not know the Bluebeard of whom you speak.
Needing things from a woman kills her attraction, even though she finds it emotionally reassuring.
As always, her AF and BB strategies are in opposition. She wants security, but you giving her that security kills her attraction for you. (Don't worry fellas, she'll still be super attracted to other men while she's telling you she's "not in the mood tonight").
She's along for the ride, not to support us. The sooner we all learn this, the longer we can maintain attraction and the happy sexy times.
The other day my girlfriend told me she was going to tell my mom I cut myself and send her my nudes if I didn't block a girl on Snapchat. I've dated her for 3 years and she even wants to get married and live happily ever after. All women will do this. If my girlfriend will do this to me while "loving" me, then any random woman will definitely do it to you.
One of my current plates (let's call her Sandy) is bombarding me with questions at every turn. About my ex. About my past choices. About my life. About my other ex. Truly as 16 commandments of Poon says - questions she really does not want to know the answer to. Shit tests galore. That's what they are. If I make the mistake to open up (made mistakes in my life thousands), I just know she'd be turned off. It helps that as we hang out around my house, my cock in and out of her mouth (first time i ever had to turn down blowjobs .. Sandy is insatiable), she sees a card written by another past plate, a nice note she sent me for Fathers Day back in June - now THAT made an impression on Sandy - deep deep inside, she sees and smells the competition!
That's what you want gentlemen. Never take a woman for granted. Always be ready for her to walk away. Always keep her as one of the many (even if you think she's more special), and competing for you.
Just remember what are the qualities that women don't find attractive. Like low self-esteem, neediness, etc. And don't ever open up about something tgat shows you have these qualities. Everything else is fine.
For e.g.
Telling her you had a rough day, or things didn't go as you planned and don't know what to do next at the moment -> you're fine
Telling her you're sorry for something you did that she didn't like. ->ok
telling that you're afraid she'll leave you. -> not ok (even if you feel like she's leaving you).
Telling your fears -> ok
Not facing your fears -> not ok
I think there's a very fine line between opening yourself up and being needy; not being in control of yourself in the latter one is the difference i feel.
Thank you for making me aware.
Damn it! Mistake i was doing all this time. Mistake was to not find the difference between opening up and spilling like honey.
But i cannot understand that if women crave so much emotional suppport from men then why they turn a cold shoulder when men open up to them? Is it like they don't wanna support and just get it? I mean if a girl opens and cries and we behave like they do? Are girls so selfish?
And not only this, 1 night i was feeling upset and i told this girl which i liked some philosophical things about how we are alone in this world. I told her i am having mood swings but i will get better.
Her reply?? GOOD NIGHT :/
WTF??? Yeah i was stupid, instead of sending some raunchy texts at night , i told her how i was feeling a girl on periods. And no text messages since then.
This might seem very cold guys but yes don't tell your insecurities to a girl! They can't do shit about it anyway, It's you who has to fix your shit ;)
This sort of thing is why I buy into the Renaissance/Humanist concept that true love can only exist between men.
I would also mention that I hate being anyone's rock, male or female; friend, coworker, or lover. I don't know if it's true for other people, but I resent people who try to tell me about their problems. I only have so much empathy-juice to go around. And I don't like telling anyone about my problems either. It would take a lot of time and patience to explain because the situations are probably not just one sentence issues, they have a lot of nuance, and I get frustrated having to explain things to people. So... I don't.
I think I might tell my problems to my best friend sometimes, but even then only if there's entertainment value in them.
EDIT: Honestly probably the only people I tell about actual problems for the sake of telling them problems are anonymous people on the internet. And I do that mostly to see what crazy shit they say.
Yeah it's a nasty catch 22. They always want to see our emotions until they do. And they wonder why HV men are stoic and stone faced.
Back in college I was dating this girl and we got engaged with the agreement we would get married if we still wanted to after graduating and getting our first jobs. The last year was hard and some serious family stuff and deaths and I broke down and she came home and saw me a mess. She comforted me and listened to my woes but later told me to never let her see me like that again because she could not handle how it made her feel. To say the least things got rough and testing and just before graduation we split 'as friends'. Less than a year after we split she married the youth pastor at her church then they went into real estate just before the market imploded ;p
Her friend has recently appeared in my sphere and probing me about my dating life and happy to see I am doing so well. I got to tell you guys its not a myth. I have had many exes or girls from high school that shot me down reappear since my mid-late 30s and confess they liked me but did not know why we never dated. I am not a big advocate of revenge but watching karma play out and saying no to alpha widows does make me smile.
This is BS. Its more as to 'why' you open up to a women. Vulnerability is a very powerful tool for charisma. Everyone likes an underdog story. Its a question as to why you open up.
If you open up to a girl so she will forgive you or take pity on you than thats the least attractive thing you can do.
If you do it to show a challenge you overcame than thats slightly better.
If you do it to build a deeper connection, its quite literally the most attractive thing you can do outside of sex.
In Models its paraded around to not be afraid of being vulnerable. Being mysterious is sexy but too much is frustrating. You got to show that who you are as a person is very valuable and only open yourself up to people who matter and when they've actually earned it.
This is hilariously similar to my reaction when I find out a girls actual cock count or weird fetishes (gangbang, dp, blacks). I think that both my reaction and the girls in those posts can be traced back to the same principle. That people bond with a partner whom they believe is above the flock. They want the person they are with to feel good. Women want to be able to submit to a guy and this is impossible if he's mentally submissive himself. Men want to dominante, conquer and control a woman and this is again, impossible when she's conquerable by anyone.
The symbiose shatters and the primary source of good vibes gets shut down the moment the other partner fails to measure up. You might try but you will never feel good about being with a whore. And women will never feel submissive with a beta. It's impossible.
P.S: I agree with your statement OP although i'm wondering if you can helpe me out with one thing. I never open up, thought it was gay from day one. I did forcefully trip for it once but the damage was minor. However my occupancy and job in the military put me in some unique and sometimes deflating moments.
Would it be considered opening up if I shared the shit I knew about and saw? I would obviously tell things from a stoic point of view but I will also state that it's harsh and challenging. That things are not always roses and rainbows in this world. Should I keep this serious part hidden from women and pretend everything is super-duper fun or can I let them in on the red pilling?
Of course this gets voted down because you guys all believe in pseudo-scientific bullshit to justify your lack of social skills and ability to get laid. Go to the gym and stop whining on Reddit
I've always had my own perspective on this. I agree that if women spot a weakness in your 'opening up' it is a turnoff for them, but the real reason she soft nexts you or tries to branch swing is because in her mind she thinks you have fallen in love with her. The ultimate leverage a woman can have over a man is his emotional investment. Case and point, her orbiters. When you open up to her, you show all your cards. It's the equivalent of a woman saying 'I love You' first to Chad. You are no longer a challenge to her. The repulsion she feels is her disappointment of evaluating you incorrectly all this time. Her using those feels to trade you up is the hamster food she needs for plausible deniability and correction of this 'stupid' mistake she made by considering you as AF. To her, your emotional outpouring relegates you to the 'other guy' status, and then she's back on the hunt.
This is complete bullshit. Imo there should be an age control for people posting things like this. Like at least 25. I would prefer 30 and up tho.
I agree. Never had this problem.
It doesn't fucking matter. If you're less invested and not a complete beta bitch. You can open up. I do it all the time. It creates an emotion in them and they feel connected to you. But after you open up its back on your alpha shit.
Unless I'm misinterpreting your definition of opening up. Do you mean you're feelings towards her. Or your demons?
Like when I start getting serious with a woman I'll tell her about my addiction and a lot of other shit that no one knows about me. Makes her feel "special" that no one else knows.
Pessimism isn't necessarily "red pill". You'll get upvotes from other pessimists and that doesn't mean you are right.
No offense gentleman but if the woman you are with is so fucking shallow that you can't ever have a bad day, you need to find another woman.
If you open up and she changes - you should start looking before she does.
Have been fucked before - had a fiancé kick me while I was down even after years of supporting her. Now am married to a wonderful woman and have opened up when I needed to and she has given me the support I need. I'm not a bitch about it and im still the man and still take care of shit and she knows it. And sex is still good. Turns out - my wife isn't a piece of shit.
Talk to any single woman - there are a hell of a lot more good women then good men out there - you have your choice. If you're in a non permanent relationship where the woman doesn't meet your emotional needs (if you have them), fucking bail.
It's a numbers game. Further, the rules of attraction are immutable. Good to see a man found his unicorn.
It's a numbers game. Further, the rules of attraction are immutable. Good to see a man found his unicorn.
I don't find it all very convincing.
First of all, why do you even NEED a girlfriend who leaves you once you admit you have some sort of problem? I mean, as life progresses, you are bound to encounter difficulties, accidents, traumatic events, illnesses and so on. How can you even feel comfortable if you can't be confident your SO will take care of you in those times?
And two, all those "I opened up and she cheated on me" are pretty suspicious to me in the first place. Maybe she lost interest in you once she realised you were dishonest with her all the way. Hiding serious stuff is almost like cheating, if you ask me. Maybe you are super whiney and negative and she had enough of that (but that definitely wouldn't happen after opening up once). There really could be tens of explanations, as long as there is even any connection between the two in the first place.
I just found this sub and it's hillarious. I never realized there were so many sad fuckboys out there who don't know how to talk/interact with women.
I honestly couldn't be in an LTR where I couldn't open up or show some form of vulnerability. I'm not one of those feminist faggots that act like boys crying and being emotional betas are some form of virtue though I can't act completely stoic throughout the whole lot. From personal experience, I think some women have this whole "fix him" complex about them, how many badboys are women drawn to with mental health issues and whatnot and those that break down. I think it's just all part of the halo effect where certain personality flaws are overlooked.
This is absolutely the truth. My ex wife started shit testing me and my blue pill reaponse was to open up emotionally. Be vulnerable to other men. Women will run if you fall apart.
Women, in my experience, haven't the moral fortitude to understand a man's mind and heart.
More or less, a gf or wife is like adopting a child. Just like you have to be the rock for a child, you gotta be the rock for your gf/wife. In fact, you might start out with a dog or a cat and see how it goes.
Despite the noise you hear saying otherwise, it's a man's world and it always will be. Before you even get a gf, ask yourself: "Do I even have room?" Statistically, you probably don't.
As lonely as the radio silence is without a gf, that's not gonna change once you get a gf. You'll have all of the same problems plus a bunch of new ones that come with the gf.
In fact, that is a great mindset to have with women. Do you have room in your life to support a child? Because that is what a lot of modern women are nowadays, children that need daddy's emotional support.
Men need to learn to vet the emotional fortitude of women. They are not all the same, some are better at handling their emotions then others.
made this mistake while being on steroids but my girl didn't really change attitudes, maybe she knew I was like that due to hormone changes, shes fine with me being on roids and knows that shit makes me unstable lol
Personally after reading Models, opening up to girls about your passions and what you love or hate creates a great connection with them, and they're more eager to share themselves to you.
Of course If in reality you are weak as fuck and you are stressed and with low self esteem she will next you cause you show unattractive signs. So it's not that opening is necessarily good or bad. Opening when you are a high value man disarms the target very easily.
There's a difference between being vulnerable and emotional vomit.
It wasn't a dig but that kind of misinformation can be detrimental to newer members. To think one or two drops in frame will result in their partners losing all faith in them completely. There will be times everyone falters but if your overall game is strong you will come out on top. Learn from the mistakes and grow.
Models by Mark Manson. If she's your partner you should be able to open up to her. If you open up to her like a bitch and she leaves you, it's probably because you're a bitch. If you open up to her like a man, she'll love that such a strong, firm man was willing to show a little vulnerability and maybe even seek her input on his life. If you open up like a man and she still leaves you, she sucks and saved you the trouble of leaving her ass down the road. Long story short a real man can open up to his girl and a real woman will stay by his side and support him. If anything else happens someone's not being honest with themselves about who they are as a person.
Energy is infectious. She is with you because of the way you make her feel. If you feel uncertain or scared she will be uncertain and scared. She doesn't want to feel like that. Do your worrying the gym or when you run. If you need to talk to solve your problem get a rubber duck
More stupid advice, as long as your SMV is high you'll get useful emotional support. I've never been in a relationship where this has tanked it.
These guys didn't open up to their women; they fucking fell apart in front of their woman's eyes and completely shook the foundation of her view of them.
A woman wants to know that her man has courage - the ability to act in the face of fear - and that he's not going to surrender and succumb to fear.
A woman doesn't care that her man gets knocked down. Just as long as he continues to keep getting up and trying again.
If you're going to pretend to be a rock - whatever the fuck that means in this subreddit - don't blame women for leaving to find the real thing when rough shit happens and you reveal yourself to be a fraud.
Weakness is never rewarded.
Yes. I essentially fell apart as well. There is a deep amount of codependency that comes along with blue pill. And yeah. I agree , be the rock. Don't pretend.
Bruh, about half of them were negative, half were positive. I looked up the original post, you are just cherry picking. If you SO does this to you, it just makes them a shitty person.
Wow! I guess dick size does have a lot to do with it!
How do you go about not answering the questions when they ask them though?
Like I really struggle with not answering questions in a way that leads into deeper questions etc etc.
This is fucking stupid and it's more of the "it's not your fault girls are eviiillll" bull shit the more angry side of TRP is infamous for.
First off, you should not be going deep on any level for at least 6 months.
And secondly I have a feeling all these dudes opening up are true betas at heart. Low self esteem. No inner game. Insecure. And when they open up about having deep seated insecurities, self loathing, how their ex hurt them, whatever, any facade of not being a beta bitch is gone and of course she wants out. You fucking tricked her and now your true self is out. And he's a weak emotional little bitch.
The fix? Fix yourself so that when you open up and show your true colors, they aren't the colors of Billy beta. No chick is going to run because you let it slide that your worried about your father getting older. Or because your boss is riding your ass, it's tough, but you've got it handled. In fact, if you don't throw in some non beta emotional nuggets you're not going to be able to maintain an LTR with a quality woman.
How does opening up make you beta? Do you even see women nowadays? They are like robots, they despise everything that comes off as weakness, and opening up is in the list of things.
I didn't say opening up makes you beta. But if you're beta and open up, you're gonna get nexted. Do you see the difference? Did you even read my post?
Seems like you did though, as majority of guys out there are in fact betas. Your post says that in fact betas have to pull their shit together, as in they are to be blamed if relationship fails. Never is it fault of woman.
Don't be dense. If you are beta and open up about your betaness you're gonna get the ax. This isn't that complicated and don't twist my words. Opening up is not beta.
Do you blame bears for eating salmon? It's AWALT dude. Learn to accept it and adjust accordingly. It is your fucking fault, most the time, if you lose a chick.
Finally, somebody fucking said it. Minus the whole "alpha/beta" bullshit, this is spot on.
I don't like alpha / beta either really but alpha / beta is the simplest way to describe a pattern of behavior that everyone in this sub recognizes.
Understandable – I get that it's a shorthand. Where I think the massive breakdown occurs is this idea that all one has to do is model "alpha" behavior and some how that fixes everything.
When what one really has to do is be real and be authentic. And that doesn't mean oversharing and laying everything you got out on the table and then asking someone else for their approval – that goes for other red pillers too.
Right, you can't model "alpha" behavior and get away with it. You have to actually be a self confident man that has learned how to be himself and shed his insecurities.
My point is that if you're beta, or really, truly insecure, no focus, internally lazy, etc, and you open up about that shit you're fucked. But when a confident man opens up about his mission and dreams it's attractive.
The op is trying to blame chicks for not accepting a piss poor internal structure. It's like blaming water for being wet. What the fuck do you think is going to happen.
"Blaming water for being wet" - flawless analogy.
What if fixig yourself is opening up to a woman and her accepting you and fuckinh you?
If you need validation from a woman to "fix yourself" then you actually haven't fixed yourself.
While I can see the objective facts from where you are coming (yes, lots of posts have been written about your stance explaining in full detail why one should seek only personal validation)...
I do believe every person needs some kind of "link" with the others, some way to show your inner darkness and receive support, because if we lack that, we would become totally narcissists who cant and wont trust in other.
This reminds me of Aynd Ryan, and her moral objectivism.
Although I really do agree that one must seek only its own personal interest, and judge on's self personally, we as humans are social creatures, amd we thrive in social communications, which include expressing negativity too.
Without those, we would become disturbed things.
I agree with you. I'm not advocating being a narcissist. It is healthy and needed to enjoy the company of others and know that you are liked. However, IF you base your self worth solely on the validation of others, that's when you get into trouble. That should only be a small fraction of your self esteem.
Open bit by bit. Stay with her range or you push her away. Let her know you're human and you are aware of yourself but you don't expect her or anyone else to 'fix' you. If you can't open enough to connect in the relationship then there will be nothing keeping u together but she doesnt need to know your every fear and insecurity u ever had. We have privacy for a reason but the person best suited for u is the one who can actually SEE everything about you without judgment or needing to run away.
The problem is not that opening up causes women to leave you. The problem is that you guys choose shitty women. Relationships have to be balanced out to work
I don't get it. Like is it really worth holding on to a woman if you're going to be so stressed to be something you are not? This just feels so sad and desperate.
It's not about being something you're not. Would you tell children your deepest fears about life? Would you tell a potential employer in a job interview the worst shit about you? It's about context and clearly understanding your role. I only tell myself certain things. At some point whether you knew it or not you became the gods of our society. You don't break frame whatever the context and that's not inauthentic. It's knowing your role.
I apologize. I'm not a redpiller, so I had no business throwing this out there. And I know there's like other places to debate this shit. But honestly, I don't consider my partners children. Or my potential employers. And I'm a woman. So I'm sure that discredits me here. But for me, I think it's important for the man I'm in a relationship with (in order for me to be attracted to them) to be sturdy on his or her feet, in a malleable resilient way. Not a rock. Not a role. Or let me try again... Here's a super turn on for me. My husband is feeling insecure about something. I can tell he's bothered about something. We talk, and he explains his problem, like anyone would. Next day he goes for a jog, puts his clothes on, and goes to work; but with his shit a little more together. So maybe I'm not saying I disagree that men who act pathetic and weak all the time or for long periods of time can be a turn off. What I'm saying is that being open can help some men become stronger. And if they pull their shit together without embarrassment for their openness, then it's a gigantic turn on for me. And it makes me want to stand next to him with more pride than I did before he talked to me. A man who can stand up to his demons is infinitely sexier than one who buries them deep and becomes emotionally fragile because of it.
I didn't say anything about partners being children. I was trying to build up the idea of context and proper amounts of disclosure.
I think it's funny that you didn't have anything to say about how much hurt was being expressed in ops post.
Guys are here trying to figure out how to be more successful in general and it's great that you're a snowflake and a unicorn and in a solid marriage. Most people here aren't happy with their lot by a long shot. So saying things like all women are like that or don't tell women about your feelings are true enough statements. They are heuristics that create more success in more situations over a period of time.
I gotcha. So often on this sub, people put kids and women in the same category so I interpreted "Would you tell children your deepest fears about life" to be more of that. Sorry for the misinterpretation, and I get that you are talking about proper disclosure.
There is a lot of hurt in op's post. There's hurt in like almost all of these posts though. And it's not just heuristics. It's often anger needing to be expressed, and then cloaked in advice. I was replying to your comment, so why was it a prerequisite that I deal with op's emotional pain?
Also I get the "true enough" thing. That these are "heuristics" vs scientific truths that all people are the same all the time. Like an ever growing how to manual. What I was doing is disagreeing with the new advice on its own terms. Like I'm not going to try and discredit the AWALT shit (I don't agree with it). But what I can do is give a different perspective with the aim of trying to aid in that journey towards success. Putting a footnote in this book.
The point was that when it comes to finding a man attractive, there is a not a dichotomy between a rock who never shares his feelings and is a specific role, and a man who languishes in his self pity and becomes unattractive (I'm admitting the unattractiveness). In fact, the actual sexiest a man can be to me, lies not in either position or in between. It's the process of him "putting his armor back on" that is so sexy.
I think there are a lot of men out there who get into a relationship and use that as an opportunity to be as pathetic as possible in this everlasting game of "would you still accept me like this?" And then their partner gets naturally less attracted to them, and the dude then goes onto message boards and gets angry (it's a shitty world). And they mistake being continually pathetic as the same as opening up, trusting, and then building back up stronger and with less fear and in the process making their partner want to fuck them when they get back from work.
society tricked you into thinking that you think that. you feel like you should because society tells you to. but deep down inside you want a rock.
This is just protecting your epistemology. I think in all encompassing shitty systems of thinking, people will always find a reason for how there can be nothing wrong with their system. People will do whatever mental gymnastics they need to protect it. So it's easier to tell a person they aren't feeling what they feel, then to adjust their own thinking. And in my case, I'm actually trying to give advice on how to be a sexy dude. Not to make society better, or to hope to get brownie points.
Again, I find men who act like rocks, genuinely become fragile and weird and untrustworthy. Not strong and sexy. But more importantly, I was explaining that the strength that I and many women find sexy isn't explained by stasis. It's not a role, and using a rock as a metaphor is like the worst one. Strength is like time based. Is a sequence. That's why I mentioned putting the armor on. A man wakes up in his boxers, he sits at the edge of the bed, you hear him take a breath and he walks away into his day. Its just sexy. I dunno. And I think many dudes forget that important step. It's not about opening up. Or being a dumb rock. It's about something else.
Lol opening up only kills attraction if you are unattractive. The men who "opened up" were just totally beta but managed to hide it, when they finally did open up the woman left in a rush.
I am open 100% of the time against my gf, but my mindset is one of a attractive man.
Might be I'm just misunderstanding what you mean with opening up though..
not all looks it's a mentality that women are attracted to. an aura of success.
That's what I said right? If you read attracting women through honesty by marc manson you understand what Im saying.
Btw weird I essentially said the same as the top comment but I get downvoted, guess people are butthurt I called them beta because they know that if they showed honestly who they are to a girl they would get rejected.