I don't understand how you can be an MRA and be homophobic.

Reddit1984Censorship · 2022-10-17T13:32:26+00:00

Of course, im bi and i dont think MRA are homophobics, although difference is found between gay/bi men and the actual lgbt movement wich stems from intersectionality wich is fundamentally antimale, so thats where i think some conflict can come up.
One thing is to support non traditional gay/bi expressions, and another thing is to demonize traditional masculinity and heterosexuality, wich intersectioanlity loves to do.

ZekalMacabre · 2022-10-17T16:51:45+00:00

Personally, I don't care who someone sleeps with. It's none of my business and I don't care to know.

That being said, I look down on anyone treating ANY man badly.

TrilIias · 2022-10-17T15:02:06+00:00

I haven't kept it a secret here that I'm a gay MRA. I've never encountered anything other than full support from other MRAs.

TheChipster91 · 2022-10-17T19:02:35+00:00

Completly agree, recently one of my close friend who is MRA told me that he was gay. I was happy he trusted me enough to tell me.

Sometimes i think gay are the only people on this planet that genuinely love men.

Arzakhan · 2022-10-17T22:27:53+00:00

I’m bi myself (humerus double meaning intended) and I’m a very vocal MRI AND I find gay jokes to be hilarious. Don’t be like a feminist and let your political/social beliefs get in the way of a good joke

cyruszane · 2022-10-17T23:43:05+00:00

Completely agree, the two are in conflict. One can not stand up for men and forget many of their brothers!

Stand for all men's rights, or stand aside.

ActPsychological8189 · 2022-10-17T13:28:54+00:00

I agree, homophobia has no place here. Their struggles are our struggles.

I would note, however, that a good amount of gay men are supported and accepted by feminists with open arms, which tends to make them fall back on it, causing derision.

sgt_oddball_17 · 2022-10-17T14:01:57+00:00

If what I've observed in 30 years of office work is any indication, women treat gay men worse than straight men. (Caveat: that is my "outsider" observation as a straight man.)

Mens Rights and Homophobia are diametrically opposed.

Crypt_Ghast · 2022-10-17T15:45:30+00:00

I never understood that either. Gay men are our brothers too and misandry stops at no one. We are in the same damn boat and whoever dares to discriminate them is a real f*cking hypocrite and a servant of misandry. (Sry for my English, it's not my first language :P)

Pasolini123 · 2022-10-17T15:49:19+00:00

First of all gay men have all the problems straight men have, apart from those strictly related to heterosexual relationships (like the bias against men, when it comes to child custody after divorce).

I'm gay and no one is going to ask me whether I like cock when my country decides to draft me, just like I'm not gonna get special resources for treatment of gender related diseases if some of them don't get enough attention by the scientific world and by the politicians. This list goes on.

And to those bigots who say: "sex between men is disgusting": Nobody is forcing you to peep when men have sex or to watch gay porn. But if you perpetuate the stereotype that male bodies are disgusting or objectively less attractive, you are part of the problem. Just like all the other tradcons, tbh.

duhhhh · 2022-10-17T13:46:50+00:00

Bigots can believe all sorts of things that don't make sense. That said how much homophobia do you really see around here? Most bigotry posted on this subreddit is from troll accounts less than two weeks old and most only have another day or two between being banned from here and banned from reddit entirely. The overwhelming majority of regulars are for equal rights for everyone.

angelojann · 2022-10-18T06:34:28+00:00

Thank you for this, I felt seen and validated as a gay man.

bruh_bro_dude · 2022-11-06T09:10:11+00:00

Feminists hate gay men who adopt or have surrogates. They constantly go after gay dudes. Gay men by definition love men, they're the perfect MRAs. We need gay-straight bro solidarity. 💪🏽

Net_Flux3 · 2022-10-17T14:15:34+00:00

I think you are conflating true MRAs with tradcons who larp as MRAs. There are a lot of those. Tradcons don't just hate gay/bi men but also most straight men except themselves and maybe their family/friends, though they probably would still put a random female ahead of a male family member.

Also, a lot of gay/bi men who subscribe to the LGBT ideology tend to be misandric and feminist lapdogs so I wouldn't trust gay/bi men who calls themselves a part of the LGBT.

IllegallyBlind69 · 2022-10-17T15:54:36+00:00

Yes it's way the fuck more accepted for women to be some flavor of LGBT, where are more likely to be stigmatized for this

somethingneet · 2022-10-17T14:21:27+00:00

If you're a homophobe, you're a bitch regardless

Drakethepirate · 2022-10-17T14:05:08+00:00

I'm a hetero MRA and I support gay men rights, I think it's necessary to defend all men's rights, no matter the sexual orientation. I also support transgender rights and detransitioners who are represented by nobody. There is no place for homophobia in MRA

Wadeem53 · 2022-10-17T22:06:00+00:00

The fact that some people hate you for something you dont choose is absolutely ridiculous, many of us gay men had some mental struggles after realizing we are different from the 'majority' (many of us never even wanted to be gay ourselves in the first place before realizing our sexuality during puberty), and to add some of gay men being bullied just for the fact they are born like that. We just like any men should have rights and be free from discrimination of any kind. And yeah if someone hates ALL gay men for just being gay while defending (straight) men's rights, you dont really care about all men as a whole and you are not male rights activist but more like straight male supremacist activist

The_Namez_B · 2022-10-18T01:40:09+00:00

Are you talking about on this Subreddit or elsewhere or just in general? I’m a gay dude and haven’t really noticed anything.

I’m sure there are some, somewhere. Idk

Angryasfk · 2022-10-17T15:08:02+00:00

It comes down to disgust at gay sex, and above all else, fear that you may be gay, or perhaps worse, be THOUGHT OF as being gay. That’s what I’ve seen anyway.

CawlinAlcarz · 2022-10-17T18:34:11+00:00

My father used to say: Opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one, and they all stink.

The thing is that you can't regulate opinions. All you can really do is regulate the way people are treated, and regardless of your opinion, you shouldn't really treat people with anything short of basic human decency.

As an MRA, I can certainly recognize that gay or bi men may face challenges related to being gay or bi that I don't face, but I can recognize that being gay or bi might exacerbate some of the specifically MALE challenges we ALL face as men. I personally try to be sympathetic to that.

At the same time, I have no interest in sex with men, or trans women, and that doesn't make me homophobic. I think it's everyone's right to have whatever kind of sex they want to with whoever they want to (assuming consenting adults), but it's not all for me and I don't look down on you about it.

I think the whole woke agenda has gone off the rails because it seems that "woke" people are simply trying to force everyone to have the same opinions. Not only is that unrealistic, it's incredibly divisive. People will be into or not into whatever kind of sex, regulating the way we treat each other should not be dependent on what kind of sex we like. Regulating peoples' opinions about what sort of sex people have is a non-starter.

elebrin · 2022-10-17T13:53:40+00:00

My only real opinion for the alphabet soup people is they can be who they are, but I don't want to be included in it. I'll do my best to be civil the best I can, but ultimately I find what you do somewhat repulsive. I'm not particularly religious, I don't hate anyone, and I realize that it's my own failing. I absolutely have worked with and had friends who were in various LGBTQIA+ categories. But to watch something like Brokeback Mountain, or my gay roommate going to town on his boyfriend... nah. Can't do it. I don't think less of anyone for it, but it's gross to me, and this is with a LOT of exposure.

Regardless of how I feel, though, you got my support. I don't have to like what you do, for you to have rights. I don't like drugs or guns either, but I don't want them banned.

Lecomodore · 2022-10-18T02:47:47+00:00

There is always constant hate. Every group you can name except for buddhist and another group similar to them are hated and are haters in one sitting. Its the whole teeter totter effect.

No-Ad-5825 · 2022-10-18T11:06:53+00:00

I have noticed that feminists seem to want to divide straight men and gay men now I’m drawing from experience here but I have a feeling straight and gay guys might relate to this. I’m Egyptian but I moved to Australia I was aware of gay men beforehand and I was and still open minded despite my background and I didn’t view them differently however gay men viewed me differently. Let me elaborate further, gay guys hang around girls all the time and when me or my group of friends consisting of about 6 guys one of them being bi try to strike up a conversation with gay dudes they treat us with aloofness or give us the shoulder (I’m note trying to vilify gay dudes or anything). I was curious to why that is the case so I hanged around a the group of girls and gay guys for a bit. At first nothing too serious just friends talking to each other; then It got to them talking about straight guys and toxic masculinity. The girls were going on about how toxic masculinity is inherent to straight guys and it makes them hurt gay men and what not and my personal favourite straight guys are afraid of gay men because they will be objectified the way they objectify women. Girls seem to just feed that to the gay dudes and they naturally become hostile or scared of us straight dudes for no good reason. Now I obviously don’t have to explain why that is retarded and hurtful to us men as a whole, straight or not men are in this together the problem that men suffer from don’t discriminate based on sexuality all that much.

crz8956 · 2022-10-17T17:47:57+00:00

but men have never been able to do that and when they do it in the same way women do, like gay men, they're shamed and called disgusting.

Bisexual here. Nothing have changed. Even with gay men being more accepted, most of bisexual guys are still in the closet.

Even more. Guys began to police friendships and other stuff not to be seen "gay". It is extremely toxic situation. I am not out precisely because of this attitude. And do not know if I will ever be. Or if I will ever be able to tell, atleast closest people.

And, of course, hompphobia/biphobia is just a facet of misandry.

Platnium07 · 2022-10-17T17:10:26+00:00

I've honestly never met a genuinely homophobic MRA.

taven990 · 2022-10-17T19:29:21+00:00

At school I had a crippling fear of being perceived as gay. There was a definite atmosphere of fear. It just was not talked about, ever. Three lads came out as gay on the day they left for good. They felt the same way and that school was not a safe place to come out.

I believe regret is worse than fear. Regret lasts for life but fear is fleeting. Advice I'd give to my younger self: be yourself. You might crash and burn. You might be accepted. But you will at least know, and won't carry around the regret of not knowing/trying, and your mental health will be much better if you're truly yourself, not hiding major parts of you.

For the record, I'm not gay but slightly bi. But in some ways it's worse, especially for a guy because we've historically been expected to pick a side, and we've had to deal with people believing that male bisexuality doesn't exist and female bisexuality is more common. I wonder if their response is due to their own fears and fantasies? Maybe they're in denial!

I believe it's not misandry that causes people to hate gay people, but visceral disgust. I have read that conservatives, especially the religious variety, automatically have their mind jump to what they think "those people" get up to at those orgies they always have. (Their ideas are hopelessly wrong and offensive but it explains why they are so venomous - they conjure up something disgusting, feel sick and blame that feeling on "the gays" even though it's a product of their imagination. Some people would call this a part of "toxic masculinity" but I find that term offensive as it seems deliberately chosen to be misunderstood and needlessly offensive - to provoke the opposition into making themselves look bad. I just call it societal expectations placed on men.

CheesyCharliesPizza · 2022-10-17T14:30:51+00:00

We're tired of hearing about it and people getting silenced or fired for saying anything about it.

There's nothing wrong with it.

What we don't like is how people abuse its existence to hurt and punish people.

Seafly42 · 2022-10-17T15:06:15+00:00

So far I love every comment in this thread. There is no place for homophobia here. Your sexual orientation has nothing to do with men’s rights. I have nothing to add. I just wanted to show my support for these ideas.

TAPriceCTR · 2022-10-17T15:13:45+00:00

Mostly because homophobe is used with no more accuracy than misogynist.

Ctrl_Alt_Abstergo · 2022-10-17T18:37:15+00:00

I want to add one to this and say transphobia has no place here either. A lot of hateful rhetoric towards trans women is based on the belief that they're men, and that men are inherently more dangerous. And a lot of the rhetoric towards trans men, even the positive rhetoric, is based around the idea that they're not "real" men, as if there's a wrong way to be a man (i.e., all men are bad except trans men because they're different).

ChequerMate · 2022-10-17T16:15:12+00:00

I... have not come across homophobic MRA

This post sounds like someone trying to creat and issue to rally against

Ragnarok-On-Substack · 2022-10-18T01:26:07+00:00

This whole thread is a whole bunch of yikes. OP had a point… and all of the homophobes in the comments are highlighting why it’s important to have discussions like this.

Maddog_The_Madlad · 2022-10-17T20:24:17+00:00

What MRA are you referring to in specific? I’ve never actually seen an MRA not be supportive of other gay men. Seems pretty much like upvote grab(Clickbait title) to me. Although I pretty much completely agree with your point.

Anih1list · 2022-10-18T01:12:19+00:00

Real Men’s Rights Activism starts with the fundamentals: Bodily autonomy, life satisfaction, anti- work/consumer culture due to capitalism objectifying men as laborers. Men’s Rights is a left-wing project currently helmed by rightists.

Some MRAs are really just conservatives. Their conception of “Men’s Rights” is nothing but “protecting masculinity” from feminism and other forms of degeneracy. If you are gay, then you are an affront to masculinity, and therefore don’t fall under the umbrella of “Men’s Rights”. This is how you get people like Andrew Tate who don’t actually do anything substantively helpful for men but do teach them to insecurely lash out at everyone else. If anti-feminism is the focus of all our energy we’re bound to get sucked into the alt-right vortex. Feminism is an obstacle, not the final boss.

ChadWolf98 · 2022-10-17T15:25:24+00:00

Lot of redditors, especially liberals, confuse homophobia with bejng against the LGBTQ movement, ehich is a political movement, thus its criticism is the same as criticising the republican or green party.

I know liberal and conservative people, and the vast majority, (read: 99%) have 0 issue with gays existing. Or having rights. Or not being beaten.

However, a lot of conservatives do have an issue with it being overbearing and the grave violation of freedom of speech/work opportunities if you dare to criticise a political movement.

And some people are against gay marriage for ethical/religious reasons or find 2 men having sex disgusting. Deal with it.

kamyarni · 2022-10-17T19:01:34+00:00

I think MRAs are on straight men issue more than gay men because there are some other movement which support gay men but we don't have any movement to support straight men!

It is only matters of working on the gap exist due to ignorance which happened agains men! The gap which no one care about only MRAs!

But i don't think so we can generally related to homophobic!

Some people can be homophobic even feminist but it doesn't make the movement be homophobic!

Prairie_Strange · 2022-10-18T02:10:08+00:00

I absolutely agree, MRA's are not the ones I see that are the most homophobic in the manosphere, PUA's and INCELS tend to be, MGTOW and MRA/MHRA's the least.

LeNightSkye · 2022-10-18T05:49:30+00:00

Homophobia is so unmanly

Annananas · 2022-10-18T07:47:14+00:00

I’ve always found it kind of interesting how gay men specifically don’t really have a singular term. Gay, homosexual, queer are all words used by other sexualities or women. All I can think of is the ubiqutous F-slur, but even then, it’s also just in general towards queer people.

Mostmodsaretrash1 · 2022-10-17T14:41:14+00:00

What you consider homophobic probably isn’t homophobic. I can morally disagree with what you are doing and still think you should be able to do it

Popular-Spirit1306 · 2022-11-15T07:58:59+00:00

This comment section makes me happy

Obarak123 · 2022-10-17T15:53:13+00:00

True, especially here in Africa. Black gay men or Trans Women (not sure if they're covered in MRA) face prejudice. I think in the male community, those two need support the most.

I'm not part of MRS btw. I don't want to advocate for this group as I'm still trying to figure out if they're truly about what they say they are about.

UncoolAsACucumber · 2022-10-17T14:16:13+00:00

Yeah man I don't understand how anybody who claims to be a MRA can be homophobic. I'm in quite the predicament with my sexual currently but after middle and high school where mob mentality can make you act homophobic, I don't understand homophobia. I'm a bisexuality dude who likes guys more and the only reason that I'm against certain things like the fed legalizing gay marriage is because I am also a states rights activist. I think there is a healthy middle ground between being a homophobic bigot and a pride activist who demands correct pronoun usage. Let's all just chill out, stand up for our fellow man and at the least, be civil to each other. Men are biologically the minority of the two sexes and we are treated terribly by most women because of the misandrist thought contagion found in media and organizations like Hollywood so we should all stand up for each other even if we disagree with a particular lifestyle or actions.

ggleblanc2 · 2022-10-17T15:44:20+00:00

The homophobe slur is thrown around too casually.

What is your definition of a homophobe?

MrRonchito · 2022-10-17T14:52:15+00:00

No sense, you're trying to mix things, your sexual orientation has nothing to do with men rights, since said rights have nothing to do with your sexual orientation.

TDG0922 · 2022-10-17T17:42:54+00:00

Being repulsed by degenerate behaviour is not a phobia, it's a perfectly natural and healthy disgust response.

You also make a lot more friends when you don't accuse them of a phobia for not cheerleading the gay lifestyle

Black-Patrick · 2022-10-17T18:03:08+00:00

Why use a pseudo-phobia buzzword? Words have meaning and it’s not unimportant. Phobia means fear, not aversion, or disapproval, and it becomes an echo chamber of bullshit when nuance is abandoned.

Positive-Ad-1859 · 2022-10-17T21:27:23+00:00

You can stand up for the gay men and I'll stand up for the straight guys.

rickmackdaddy · 2022-10-17T17:46:21+00:00

Gay men are the best. For every gay man there is one extra woman for me AND the dude takes another guy with him. I wish all men were gay, except for me. I’d hold a pay-to-enter contest every month to see which top 10 women will get to be my love slaves.

ANUS_CONE · 2022-10-18T01:26:37+00:00

So part of this is caused by the fact that actual straight women don’t exist any more. It seems like most young women (whether they identify on the alphabet or not) have some kind of sexual experience with other women.

PactScharp · 2022-10-18T11:22:31+00:00

I completely agree... at least in the sense that gay men (or people in general, don't care about gender really) should be supported & welcomed, including these types of communities.

I'm not sure I would say that homophobia & misandry overlap "quite a lot" but that's beside the point. The point is, bigotry against people on the basis of sexuality is highly idiotic.

That said, what does bother me about many gay men is that it's quite typical that they only/mainly befriend women (which is completely fine, no issues there) & as a result, are far more likely to adopt this radical woke, anti-male ideology (which is where I have a problem).

A lot of gay men will blindly adopt this ideology, shit on straight men, call them violent, clueless, aggressive, toxic assholes, with all the praise from their "healthy" female friends.

The amount of times I've seen gay men on Reddit specifically post on female supremacist subs & unironically trash men is truly disheartening. Just pushing the same garbage I've heard a thousand times before: "Oh, when men *are* (sexually) assaulted by women, it's only women who care, and all men laugh & dismiss". No buddy, and for most male victims of that nature, it's very clearly the opposite. They make all these sorts of attacks against straight men, when in reality, they don't even fucking deal with straight men. Their friends groups are either entirely female or other gay men (again, which is completely fine in and of itself). But it just exposes their ignorance even more.

For the gay people who reject this woke insanity, I don't have any problem with them whatsoever.

b12b3b · 2022-10-21T05:41:58+00:00

As long as jokes are made in good fun and everybody understands that you’re still friends I don’t think that there’s really any way to be homophobic and get away with it in modern society. What of my good friends is gay, I make a joke to him and he makes jokes at me about being from Canada. I live in America by the way. We both know it’s in good fun and we’re both good friends.

rochesterslim · 2022-10-17T20:20:59+00:00

right i agree but gay men can be very misandrist and make generalisations and be prejudiced about straight men. and nobody calls it out.

ehhhnowwhat · 2022-10-17T14:52:59+00:00

So you have to force people to like your disgusting & gross act ?? Like if someday the liberals decide that human trafficking is okay but I find it disgusting & if I hate them for this horrid act, I'm not a decent person?

GeheimerAccount · 2022-10-18T00:32:56+00:00

Im not homophobic, but I dont think there is a contradiction in being MRA and homophobic.

Nathaniel66 · 2022-10-18T06:22:18+00:00

Define what you mean "homophobic". I don't like seeing 2 guys kissing each other, or raising a kid, but i will not be agressive towards them, chase them with torch and shout "sinners!". I just don't think this is normal, not good for society long run.

I do have gay college at work, great guy, completely no problem with him. I like to work and socialize with him, but i wouldn't support his petition for kid adoption.

So, am i homophobic being truly neutral in gay community causes or not?

KochiraJin · 2022-10-18T08:17:34+00:00

I don't think the two views are incompatible. They could take instances of gay men with deplorable sex lives to cherry pick and paint all of them in a bad light. Or they could also take the view that decoupling sex from reproduction is wrong as the reason gay men are wrong. There are many ways you could logically support men's rights but not gay rights. You just have to start with the right assumptions. Oh and those assumptions can be wrong, the resulting bigotry will still logically follow even if it's built on a falsehood. Just remember if you run into this hypothetical homophobic MRA the solution is going to involve talking them and understanding their point of view. You won't change their view without getting them to re-evaluate those base assumptions.

Starrk71 · 2022-10-17T23:00:52+00:00

MRA so far deal and talk about legal issues with father's and the problems we face as men because of feminism.

I've not once encountered homophobic content in any post so there aren't any issues.

I do not support LGBT community because of their hatred and disrespect towards heterosexuality.

Though I do not have a single issue with gay or bi men. That's not even a conversational topic, it's not something I think about nor is it something I strive to talk about as those are not issues to me. It's the blatent disrespect towards men in general that I have issues with.

Mierdo01 · 2022-10-18T03:45:36+00:00

MRA?

RainoRK · 2022-10-19T17:31:28+00:00

Male homosexuality (homosexual lifestyle in general) physically, mentally and of course sexually hurts men and especially young guys and boys, leads them into promiscuity and social decay. Male homoeroticism is a huge gaze for women, because most women love having fantasies about men being sexually submissive, because many gay men and guys ARE submissive. If you sincerely care for the future of men, think twice before complaining about so called homophobia. If you are a homosexual, you cannot be an actual MRA. The founders of the MRA movement and their first followers were against any form of homosexuality, and most of the gay men gather with misandtrist feminist and LGBT groups. Gay MRAs are oxymoron. The calls for supporting gay men simply because of their sex are ridiculous, we don't prioritize the gender or sex of male child predators or any other male criminals simply because they are men.

2022-10-20T10:35:53+00:00

I don't thinks it's that MRA are homophobic alot. It's more that alot of gay men identify more with women and side with women a lot. Most women are much more loose with gay guys and even love having gay guy friends so they don't get treated half as bad as heterosexual men a lot of times

RoughLoud1422 · 2022-11-02T14:53:58+00:00

this is such a shit take

Title	I don't understand how you can be an MRA and be homophobic.
Author	boomboxspence
Upvotes	298
Comments	221
Date	October 17, 2022 1:25 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/y6b8lk/i_dont_understand_how_you_can_be_an_mra_and_be/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/i-dont-understand-how-you-can-be-an-mra-and-be.1136065 https://theredarchive.com/post/1136065

Comments