Virgin women are massively overrated by Red’s. Lets debate.

-TheGreasyPole- · 2019-02-21T19:58:15+00:00

They don't want the virgins for their sexual skills.

They want them because (either on a rational or instinctive basis) they see them as less likely to be promiscuous... and more likely to be a faithful long term partner.

They're not seeking virgins or low N count girls for ONS and FWB scenarios, they're looking for the easy girls there.

What they are doing is looking for low N girls for long-term deals.

They say they're doing so "rationally" because these girls are less likely to cheat. And they'll happily link you to $study_that_shows_this .

I say they want this because instinctively/genetically they're predisposed to seek out low-N women for LTR scenarios.

Guys with the genes for finding promiscuous LTR partners "icky" in the past left more direct descendants genetically related to them than the guys who didn't care about promiscuity (who raised some kids of their own, but ended up raising some kids sired by other guys).

As a result todays men have a genetically evolved "ick factor" for promiscuous girls when assessing LTR candidates (but not when assessing STR candidates, in fact easy girls are rated as slightly more attractive for STRs). And who triggers that "ick factor" the least ? Virgins.

They then go on to try and justify their instinctive "icky feeling" with rational study mumbo-jumbo.... you can see it IS mumbo-jumbo as 99% of them already felt "icky" about such girls before they went off to google the study into existence and they're just using the study to justify the feeling they already instinctively had (I feel "icky" about wifing up a slut).

Seeing as this is the REAL reason they want them.... they aren't overrated. They're satisfying an instinctive desire. It's rated exactly as correctly as reality weights the likeliness of any chick to be promiscuous. Because the resulting instinctive feeling is calibrated to hundreds of thousands of years of "genetic experience" of the evolutionary environment.

brodudedoggman · 2019-02-21T22:23:09+00:00

This post is almost entirely about sex with a touch about relationships. Even when you mention relationships, it’s about how “boring” it can get. Typical degenerate millennial talking points.

People that want virgins understand that it’s not about the sex. It’s about the relationship and establishment of a stable, proper family. Once you get that through your thick head you might understand what we are talking about.

Dash_of_islam · 2019-02-21T19:56:16+00:00

Why do women need different dicks to learn what they like? Why can't it be done with the same dick?

Besides, all else being equal, I'd rather take a virgin. Would rather be the only man than the latest man

Virgin women have lower divorce rates and higher marital happiness so I don't see how you can cut this and make it a bad thing.

As long as she isn't a slut, I'm game. But I'd rather take a virgin than slut if for nothing else that I won't lose half my shit 30 years from today

PMmeareasontolive · 2019-02-21T22:33:06+00:00

I'll provide a minor counterpoint. I've occasionally dated shy women with little experience. I sometimes find that their imaginations have been working overtime and they are very sexual because they've been fantasizing about it so much. They get excited and into it very easily and it never seems too far from their minds. All of those things are positive characteristics.

exit_sandman · 2019-02-21T22:38:58+00:00

Okay, I'll CYV.

Virgins (unless we're talking about girls of an age where virginity is the norm, which I hope we don't) have one perk that sets them apart from the rest: they're far more likely to be loyal.

They don't make better partners per se, aren't less demanding or entitled, possibly have a low libido, may be clingy etc. ... but if there's one thing about them, it's oftentimes that they stick to the guys they're sleeping with, because if they weren't the type for that, they would have lost their v-card long ago.

caseynotcasey · 2019-02-21T22:56:36+00:00

Sex is a non-factor. Anybody can learn it. Anybody can also not learn it. Having sex in and of itself is not learning it. You can have awesome sex with someone who was a virgin just a month ago compared to horrible sex with someone who sleeps around like crazy.

People in general usually want someone with not many partners in their past. Once you start churning through people you almost always grow cynical or 'bored' or whatever else. There's a reason relationships that start with inexperienced peoples are statistically the strongest ones out there. Anecdotally, this is strongly reflected in my own experiences.

Christian_Kong · 2019-02-21T20:39:38+00:00

These are the girls ready to settle down and be a GF because they develop a been there done that mentally towards ONS

Until they develop a been there done that mentality with their LTR or marriage.

I think the main draw of virgin women is the idea that they will be more likely to stick around during the rough patches than a woman who has seamlessly jumped from relationship to relationship with men where things didn't work out.

I've slept with some mega sluts I know and some were just awful in bed. A virgin guarantees they will be awful in bed, and I think the people looking for one know that.

NeedingAdvice86 · 2019-02-22T00:02:47+00:00

It must be an even day of the month because here comes ANOTHER PPD "relationship up a slut" post....or is it odd days of the month?

It isn't TRP that is averse to sluts and high n-count women, it is the wider community outside of reddit. Reality is that regular people with options avoid sluts because of seldom, if ever, meeting a emotionally stable, well adjusted mentally healthy slut.

And there are real consequences to letting emotionally damaged and unstable people into your world that go beyond some girl's ability to suck a tennis ball thru a donut hole....and those people who base their relationships\sex partners on nothing but how well a girl rides a dick ALWAYS comes back to regret it through a litany of problems.

Playing Russian roulette that one is going to find the unicorn very high n-count slut who "JUST LIKE RIDING DICK" and not one of the garden variety emotionally damaged sluts is not a good life choice.

sadomasochrist · 2019-02-21T20:05:13+00:00

Almost zero people on here care to have a virgin to mold. The purpose men are looking for n=0 women is because they haven't experienced the lifestyle inflation that comes with a high partner count.

They tend to overvalue the men they're with which makes for a stable relationship since men have wide arousal windows. There is strong empirical evidence and studies to back this up. Whether or not you want to agree with the studies, I don't care.

Plenty of guys here that have learned the hard way.

Is a guy pure of heart for not getting his dick wet?

If he did so intentionally and had options he's probably more stable and a naive romantic. That's the point.

And that's even outside the fact that men and women are different.

This entire OP is so bazaar I have trouble believing you're not a woman or a man with any sexual or relationship experiance at all.

-TheGreasyPole- · 2019-02-21T19:56:19+00:00

I've had tons of experience; I prefer virgins and lower n count girls because higher n count girls give me viscerally disgusting and basically involuntary images of who they've been with before that make me feel icky, while lower n count and especially virgin girls make me feel special .

Yeah I'm a hypocrite, insecure, whatever. I don't care. I'm not going to sacrifice my contentment out of some attainment of objective consistency. Not my problem.

Anyway, yeah, virgin girls are way, way more valuable, and low n count girls are more valuable, in my book.

OverWatchIsAShitGame · 2019-02-21T19:48:14+00:00

Girls are shit at sex anyway. Doesn't matter whether she's an uber slut (they generally suck and expect the guy to do everything) or a virgin.

itiswr1tten · 2019-02-21T20:02:30+00:00

Virgin women are a preference. Low n count women are a preference. "Reds" absolutely don't agree on this subject, but generally lean towards a position of "too many partners fucks pair bonding" which has some sociological backing.

Fundamentally, women with lower partner count are less experienced. Thus, the significance of engaging sexual relationship is almost certain to be very high, and absolutely certain to be materially higher than a woman for whom sex is "no big deal".

Therefore, it's an incorrect generalization on "Reds" and mistaken to state the preference can be characterized a problem, you simply don't share the preference

SupremeMystique · 2019-02-21T20:49:07+00:00

It's about not wanting a used up women who slept with all the jocks and now wants an unfortunate provider

CamoWoobie10 · 2019-02-21T21:19:15+00:00

It's a matter of taste. There is no objective "right" or "wrong" when it comes to this.

A woman being sexually inexperienced turns me on.

Also, High n-count doesnt necessarily= good at sex either.

[deleted] · 2019-02-21T22:02:56+00:00

Most men who claim to want virgins mean that they want a woman with lower n count than theirs.

iLLprincipLeS · 2019-02-21T20:05:13+00:00

These are the girls ready to settle down and be a GF because they develop a been there done that mentally towards ONS

Yeah, after they hit the wall and can't ride the CC anymore they're ready to settle down because they got no other choice.

And for the guys who say virgins are pure take the pussy off the pedestal.

It's not all about sex. Virgin females are more pure mentally and spiritually, in history they were always valued as a prize, only recently with all the degeneracy are sluts being put on a pedestal artificially.

poppy_blu · 2019-02-22T00:14:39+00:00

I’ll play devils advocate. There are plenty of women who aren’t virgins who don’t know what gets them off, who have baggage about sex, etc. Of course there’s a much higher correlation between this group and virgins. But I wouldn’t say to write off the idea that a virgin can become a good partner any more than I would say a very experienced woman is sure to be great in bed.

Not sure I even want to go there but the vagina is elastic. What makes it permanently looser is childbirth and age.

[deleted] · 2019-02-22T00:39:47+00:00

This is like trying to sell someone a shit sandwich with the logic of "but this sandwich is really tasty! Sandwiches that haven't been shat out of an ass yet don't have that unique nutty flavor."

So what if it IS tasty? It's fucking shit, it already went through someone else's digestive tract. I can't un-know that and just judge it on taste alone.

I like food other people haven't touched or eaten. I like underwear that wasn't worn by a dozen people before me. And i like fresh pussy.

It doesn't matter if this pair of pre-worn undies is more comfy, it's just gross thinking about all the other people who wore it. Doesnt matter if its been laundered or whatever.

Same goes for a pussy. Something in the heart of man wants to be the first one into a womans soul, heart, but especially pussy. And that's just the way of the world.

darksoldierk · 2019-02-22T03:09:27+00:00

Virgins for relationships, experienced women for ONS's.

Every man I know who married a virgin has a very active sex life. Every man I know who married a woman who had a active sex life before the marriage, ended up getting less sex than he would like. LTR a virgin because she'll want to explore, she'll want to learn about her sexuality and yours, and that curiosity could last years. ONS a woman who already had years and already knows what she enjoys because in a ONS, you don't have time to explore, you just want to get off.

SpecialSpnk · 2019-02-22T05:19:17+00:00

As far as the virgin thing goes as well... It is nearly impossible to find a girl that is a virgin. Most girls nowadays are not even legal before they have sex. What I myself love to do is have them explore things that they have not been introduced to before so in a sense it is an entirely different experience, kind of like losing their virginity. On vday I took my gfs anal virginity. She had one anal experience that lasted prob 5 seconds maybe enough to get in the tip before the pain had her stop.

So after about 20 min of warming her up and 5 different attempts she finally took about 50% of my cock and within a minute of extremely light thrusting she came so hard she said she saw stars and felt like she was loosing consciousness. I prefer to fuck girls in their ass and turn them into anal sluts. It's my thing and I'm really quite good at it. It turns me on more than anything else. So I take their virginity one way or another.

md8716 · 2019-02-22T02:02:45+00:00

I've always believed, and still believe, the true appeal of virgins is that they are easier to control and their personalities easier to dominate in a relationship.

Women tend to lose their virginity by their early 20s. If a guy is over 30 and somehow marries a virgin, most likely there is a large age, experience, and maturity gap that he can exploit to exert maximum control over the relationship. I see it as a coping mechanism for low-confidence men who lack power in their lives, to feel powerful.

rabbitholemystery · 2019-02-21T20:01:24+00:00

Can’t turn a hoe into a housewife. There’s a reason you fuck sluts and then date/marry a nonslut. Best of both worlds.

In my experience girls who slept around and were great in bed in had nothing else going for them or had too many issues I couldn’t be bothered dealing with to stay sane.

Taipanshimshon · 2019-02-21T21:05:35+00:00

Virginity without context is meaningless and not valued or under / over valued by “reds”

TH26 · 2019-02-22T00:26:05+00:00

This is useless anecdotal evidence but fuck it- I haven't had a lot of sexual partners, but with the experience I do have, I haven't found any correlation between experience and good sex.

I was in a 4+ year relationship with a woman who was very "sex positive" and had had somewhere around 40-50 partners. Sex with her started off good but was weird in a lot of ways. She had good knowledge of the mechanics of things but often seemed quite emotionally disconnected. She was probably the hardest women to turn on via foreplay I have ever been with. One thing that was very noticeable was that she didn't seem very turned on by passionate kissing or anything like that- it was as if she was always waiting for me to properly execute "moves". Overall, she acted exactly like someone who was an "expert" on sex and was treating it like a "skill" or a "game" as opposed to an expression of "feelings".

I have had great sex with women who have had a relatively small number of partners (definitely not virgins). I can think of 2 or 3 in particular who were not exactly conservative or religious per se, but were somewhat picky about who they slept with. Building up to sex with them, you could tell that it meant something to them and they were very turned on by the fact that they were about to have sex. I found I didn't need to show so much "skill" because our mutual passion/excitement about what was happening was enough for them to be very aroused. There wasn't so much of a been there, done that feel about it.

I dunno what my point is. I've never slept with a virgin so I can't advocate that. I guess I've found that if you want to have passionate, intense sex, the biggest slut isn't going to be as "good" as someone who is basically "sex positive" but inherently considers sex a big, intense experience and an expression of strong feelings. Each to their own, probably.

AstuteBlackMan · 2019-02-22T00:30:53+00:00

Something rare is hardly ever overrated.

TheDicDoc · 2019-02-22T01:29:33+00:00

anything that everyone has had/ can have has less valuable. think about water in a most of america and then in an African village

Black_m0ngoose · 2019-02-22T02:47:17+00:00

There is no question of paternity when having a child with a virgin. From a purely biological standpoint this makes sense.

Also, female sluts are fun but disgusting. It's like going to McDonalds. Yeah, it's not good for you on any level but the food tastes so good.

SpecialSpnk · 2019-02-22T05:01:08+00:00

You are missing the point entirely. Let me try to help clarify. We as red pulled dominant men want to own our partner. It is like owning a car that has never been driven by anyone else. We put every single mile on that car it has ever seen. Can you really call that car yours when 10 other drivers have driven it hard af, mashed the gas peddle and whipped it in and out of traffic?

It is an ownership thing, a possession. Yea she is not mine but it is my turn. When it is my turn I am going to drive that car so well and beat it the fuck up however I please. If a girl has never had other dicks in her that is ur pussy, you own it.

Ricolapanda · 2019-02-22T07:13:05+00:00

It's totally fine to fuck whores, but you want different qualities for LTR's.

Zero_The-Hero · 2019-02-22T07:22:05+00:00

Humble bragging, nice. Also propping up the strawman. Low n-count != virgin.

And you're probably the kind of guy whom life has afforded him to be a bachelor up to his 50s.

Lots of virgin women aren't pure by any measure of morality.

AYellowPigeon · 2019-02-22T16:38:46+00:00

Why does this discussion have to revolve around two opposites instead of also including those in the middle. I don't know any man in my group of friends that wants a virgin woman, but they do want a woman with a low number of sexual partners and I don't think that is too much to ask especially when several of those men including myself have a low number too.

happycheese86 · 2019-02-21T20:32:49+00:00

Purity culture, they are told that virgins have value, that things that are 'theirs' and only theirs are special, and especially that the best way to have a dutiful wife is to get her young and bend her to your will. Young female virgins are the RP version of getting a puppy vs. adoption a shelter dog. I honestly think the human race is simply doomed due to the fact that men want to do nothing else but reproduce and prove they are 'winning' at who has the best wife/life. Just like there is an overpopulation of pets due to humans being picky, greedy overproducing little shits, there's an overpopulation of children due to men and women being unable to move past their most base and animal instinct.

meomeowmeoww · 2019-02-21T20:33:27+00:00

They want virgins because virgins have never experienced Chad's huge cock and she will therefore not know how useless and tiny virgin-lover's penis is.

RoyalAugur92 · 2019-02-21T23:00:28+00:00

I don't think RPers actually want virgins, they just want women with less or just as much sexual experience as they.

rus9384 · 2019-02-21T22:50:45+00:00

"some girls are better at sex than others, hint its not the virgins." Give an award to that man for his bright intelligence.

My friend told me that as women have more partners their vaginas are not less tight, but are more "relaxed" and thus feel not as good. Sounds odd, of course.

I'm not sure RP is much pro-virgin-females. Might be tradcons who overwhelmed the community.

Edit: also, one TRP thread mentioned the issue of 30yo female virgins. Most guys told they did not see 30yo female virgins more valuable. I'm not sure I accept your premise.

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Littleknownfacts · 2019-02-21T19:52:43+00:00

This thread is being tagged CMV because it makes an affirmative claim. OP, please familiarize yourself with the rules of CMV as they are modded a little differently from other threads.

planejane · 2019-02-22T10:14:46+00:00

/u/-TheGreasyPole- I want you to see this even if you don't respond. Please don't be hypocritical and hold yourself to a different standard than TRPs when it comes to science and genetics

poppy_blu · 2019-02-22T12:56:03+00:00

Does anyone else find it completely hilarious that the pillosphere is full of TRPs and stemlords bragging about their superior intellect but every time a discussion of actual science comes up, they get so easily taken down by non STEMs?

Zero_The-Hero · 2019-02-22T21:19:05+00:00

My view has been changed. I know I think red’s want a girl with a low count for various personal reason ranging from insecurity to merely wanting a girl with less experience than they have and many other reasons.

Going to ignore the guys who were flat out sexist because they seemed damaged and I don't want to pin the actions of crazy people on the reds because I don't know if damaged people can represent red pills unless reds are sexist. Don't know yet.

I'm enjoying reading all the debates.

Kratom_Dumper · 2019-02-23T00:16:04+00:00

"You want a girl who knows her stuff because ONS get boring and lonely after a while. These are the girls ready to settle down and be a GF because they develop a been there done that mentally towards ONS."

I keep hearing this all the time and it is complete bullshit. Studies has shown many times that girls that have higher n-count are much worse compared to virgins for a stable marriage.

It is kinda the same logic that former criminals wouldn't do any criminal things anymore because "they develop a been there done that mentally towards crime".

Once a hoe, always a hoe.

blackedoutfast · 2019-02-21T20:33:39+00:00

I think the guys who really want a virgin don't have a much sexual experience.

I think the guys who think virgins are overrated don't realize crazy porn star sex isn't everything.

or they married a skanky hoebag and they're trying to convince themselves that it's no big deal that their treasure was a lot of other men's trash.

or they don't know how to really dick down a girl, so they have to rely on a very experienced slut to make it go well.

MrEctomy · 2019-02-21T21:15:02+00:00

Why would you care either way?

NewYorkJewbag · 2019-02-21T23:26:15+00:00

Tight vaginas are from nervousness, not the number of penises. A woman who has had sex many times can have a tight vag in a case where she’s not comfortable having sex.

Zero_The-Hero · 2019-02-22T03:49:32+00:00

I've noticed that a lot of the reds refer to women who like sex as sluts. One sign a guy isn't getting laid is calling women who want sex sluts.

Seems a little immature to be calling these chicks ”megasults” meanwhile y’all wanna go balls deep in a virgin.

Can men be sluts or are you all the sexest blue pills say you are?

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2019-02-21T19:57:36+00:00

where in "the Red Pill" are virgins mentioned?

Zero_The-Hero · 2019-02-22T03:23:56+00:00

So many people to respond to so little time.

Title	Virgin women are massively overrated by Red’s. Lets debate.
Author	Zero_The-Hero
Upvotes	39
Comments	350
Date	February 21, 2019 7:47 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/at7if9/virgin_women_are_massively_overrated_by_reds_lets/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/virgin-women-are-massively-overrated-by-reds-lets.257079 https://theredarchive.com/post/257079

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