Should child support be illegal?

BuckShadaCaster · 2023-01-31T13:11:51+00:00

Men should have the right to a financial abortion if they do not want the child.

Cybralisk · 2023-01-31T08:09:50+00:00

I don't think it should be forced. A woman having a child is completely her choice, If the man doesn't want it and she goes against his wishes then she shouldn't be entitled to his money if he doesn't want the child.

DeweyCheatemHowe · 2023-01-31T07:58:02+00:00

I believe that child support should be illegal in the sense that I think both parents should pay 50/50, but to go with that I believe shared child custody should be 50/50.

The fact that the system rewards mothers financially by denying the father's access to the child is criminal.

I also think that child support should be in a card based system that can only be used on approved things to ensure the money is going to the child.

Regarding abortion I believe the father should have the right to financially abort within a certain period.

le_flapjack · 2023-01-31T10:29:51+00:00

The eighth amendment says "Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted". The outrageous payments many men make that are much more than the cost of raising a child violate the eighth amendment.

B1G_Fan · 2023-01-31T14:38:26+00:00

Child support mandated by the government shouldn’t be legal

If a woman wants child support from a man, she can write up a legally enforceable contract that she can negotiate with a man

Neither a man nor a woman should have obligations that are not mutually agreed upon

AaViOnBando · 2023-01-31T08:39:44+00:00

When I was a kid my father barely ever paid child support during the divorce. No it shouldn't be illegal in most cases. But definitely the number shouldn't be insane. The court decided that my father had to pay 350 euros every month which for a man in the balkans it is a lot, so my mom agreed for about over 200 a month and not even that was met.

In case of a famous or rich man the child support shouldn't magically skyrocket to 4000$ a month tho.

Also I don't think we should stop fucking all together bro lol

ElisaSKy · 2023-01-31T17:21:16+00:00

In the current legal climate, men are held legally liable for a series of decisions that they have no legal rights to make.

From the decision as to whether or not to have sex (Hermesmann v Seyer in the Supreme court of Kansas set the precedent that it doesn't matter if the man doesn't consent, he's still legally responsible for the child even if the only reason the child exists is because he was raped), the decision as to whether or not to use birth control (sabotaging birth control is several felonies if a man does it to a woman but does not even rate as a misdemeanor if a woman does it to a man) to abortion to safe haven abandonment, men have no legally recognized decision power regarding the birth of a child. Sure, they can ask politely, but if they're told "fuck you, literally!" there's legally nothing a guy can do.

And yet, despite men having none of the legal rights to make any decision that result in a child, they have 100% of the legally imposed responsibilities.

Does that strike you as a particularly moral system? If you insist on giving men no legal rights on whether or not to have a child, you should give them no legal responsibility whatsoever.

stupid_pretty · 2023-01-31T21:40:15+00:00

I'm anti-abortion. Children need to be raised right whether they were planned or unplanned. Sex equals baby. Like you said, anal, oral and keep possession of your semen, dispose of it fully and irretrievably until you find the right woman to raise a family with.

I'm national socialist on family support. Children should have an income, like a monthly child tax credit and it wouldn't require raising taxes, we just need to stop funding dumb shit. Children benefit all of us, they bring about the next advances, medical and tech, will run our world when we are weak. If we provide better for them we'll have a better future overall. Something like this would negate the need for child support but without child support, would you be less cautious? Does limiting abortion decrease casual careless sex?

NoRange7637 · 2023-01-31T07:18:58+00:00

It should be illegal

TheNerdiestAnarchist · 2023-01-31T07:56:17+00:00

It should require agreement prior to the birth of the child.

penishead694207 · 2023-01-31T16:30:08+00:00

I think it depends before the birth if the father doesn’t want a kid and she does he should be able to financially abort, if the kid is already born and a father leaves he should pay child support

sharksville · 2023-01-31T11:04:30+00:00

With the way things are right now then yes it should be illegal. If women like to say my body my choice and that a man’s opinion doesn’t matter and goes ahead and kills the child that’s also the man’s, it makes perfect sense for a man to say my money my choice. He earned that money on his own without the woman so why should he even be forced to pay for a child. I don’t encourage that type of behaviour that men just get women pregnant and society is filled with bastard children, but if women wants to treat men differently then so should men.

2023-01-31T22:31:45+00:00

You don’t want kids and don’t think men should have to pay for unwanted kids and you don’t take steps to protect yourself, like always wearing a condom? No seriously? Oh, and since you clearly missed 9th grade health class, you can get pregnant from anal.

ScottNoWhat · 2023-02-01T01:36:01+00:00

You should be responsible from the moment of conception. The right to abort financial responsibility will just create more fatherless children and deadbeat dads. When a kid is a burden on society we often blame the parents.

The real problem is pro-choice not factoring in the males choice. Because females incubate a person for nine months it nullifies any emotional attachment to that potential person the male also created (not getting into fetus argument).

neveragoodtime · 2023-01-31T15:30:59+00:00

It should be illegal. It’s discrimination based on marital status. Married parents don’t have to pay child support, only unmarried parents do.

Dangi86 · 2023-01-31T17:12:47+00:00

The first step should be to give mens the right to have a financial abortion, you make it very clear that you don't want the child and the mother is the only one responsible for it, the same way a women is allowed to chose how to proceed with the baby, a man should have the same right.

After that, custody time between parents should be split equally so you pay for your child but don't pay your ex for your child.

Stafford0711 · 2023-01-31T12:26:27+00:00

Child support should be in place only in extreme circumstances. Most people who file for child support do because they think of it as a paycheck. It’s not for the parent it’s for the children.

The issue with child support is they don’t legitimately look at the income and record and look to see if it’s needed. Most men struggle to pay the outrageous amount and fall behind in debt. If it’s too much debt the lose their license. Then they can’t drive so they can’t make it to work and if they don’t work then they get a warrant for their ARREST! How does an INCARCERATED PARENT benefit the child? Please explain….

saito200 · 2023-01-31T13:04:33+00:00

Both parents should have exactly identical legal responsibility, no matter the case

JoeyBellef · 2023-01-31T12:27:41+00:00

Short answer.. no. Your kid you pay. However, it should be illegal to use a child in a legal battle with the goal of maximizing the support payments.

mantools · 2023-01-31T07:30:48+00:00

Not illegal, but voluntary especially if abortion is legal.

Regular_NormalGuy · 2023-01-31T13:44:04+00:00

I am ok with the system of obligated child support. It's a little high in some cases but the raising parent can stay off welfare and doesn't become the taxpayer's problem. I don't want to pay for all them chicks that make babies like rabbits and I don't want to pay for dudes that fall for them because they can't control their dicks.

TenuousOgre · 2023-01-31T11:36:01+00:00

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Gucciglaze27 · 2023-01-31T17:59:26+00:00

Yes, screw children let them fend for themselves

AdeleRabbit · 2023-01-31T19:03:58+00:00

Since I'm pro-life, I believe father's rights should begin at conception. Unfortunately, financial "abortion" doesn't solve the issue that men don't have legal right to protect the life of their children.

Also highly support mentioning outercourse. It just makes sense that some types of sex are recreational, and some (well, the specific one) are procreational. And it's 100% effective.

genericteenagename · 2023-02-01T17:21:35+00:00

Neither person should have the right to abandon a child that only exists because they had sex. Take responsibility for your actions or don’t have sex.

RatDontPanic · 2023-02-02T02:29:19+00:00

Only for poked-the-condom situations and paternity fraud, far as I'm concerned. Outlawing mandatory child support outright is far too unhinged an idea. Every day I see feminists proving why I never joined their movement - then I come here for ten seconds and see why I stopped being a MRA, too.

theWolf371 · 2023-01-31T14:39:04+00:00

It should not be illegal and you all know the "rules" before you play.

Women having the choice is known. A pregnancy can occur from sex, that is a known. If that does occur and there is then a child you are responsible, that is also a known.

If you chose to have sex knowing these facts then you should pay if it is required to support the child.

Torsten_Das_Toast · 2023-02-01T00:03:12+00:00

gotta be honest. bitches trippin i know. but single moms struggle in rl. theyre at poor and the men need to take responsibility. out of all the options, this is least bad. if there is another men in her life, its a different story.
in the same breath i want to have some words for men to say when it comes to abortion and in court cases on who gets the child.
most of the single moms ive met in rl are good women who work and struggle hard with the father not giving a fuck, even if the child was wanted.

squirrelfoot · 2023-01-31T13:27:46+00:00

I'm wondering how many of the people on here had deadbeat dads who didn't contribute to their upbringing? One of the main reasons men fail in life is because fathers abandon their children, something that has a higher impact on boys' life outcomes than it does on that of girls. If we want men to do well in life, we need to shoulder our responsibilities and be good fathers.

Learning to use a condom correctly will significantly reduce your chances of having an unwanted kid, and avoiding vaginal penetration will reduce the risk to zero. If you don't accept the risk of having a child, don't have vaginal sex. If you and your sexual partner make a child, you have a duty to raise and care for your child. It's better to advocate for shared child custody that for deadbeat fathers.

kyraniums · 2023-01-31T18:09:22+00:00

I'm always conflicted on this topic. I think it's unfair for fathers to spend a large chunk of their income on an unwanted child. It's even worse when they would love to have an active part in their upbringing, but mom and the judge get in the way. But I think it's just as unfair for children to grow up poor and without a father. They are the true victims in this scenario, and the system isn't built to provide for them. Speaking of a shitty system: Abortions are actively discouraged. In many places, they're not even legal anymore by the time many women find out they're pregnant, especially if it's unexpected. And if they are legal, there's still a social taboo on abortions. That's a huge part of this problem.

Accidents happen, but I did read a study that only about 8% of men reported a condom breaking over the course of a year. Getting pregnant isn't that easy, so the chances of pregnancy via this scenario are pretty slim. Also, condoms don't break that easily if you put them on carefully. Some guys just never learned how. Bring your own, learn how to put them on, and throw them away yourself to avoid getting baby-trapped.

In the end, many unwanted pregnancies are the result of people just being dumb. Refusing to use a condom, forgetting the pill, even trusting a girl you just met when she says she's using contraceptives. It's a fuck around and find out situation, literally. Should you be 'punished' for years for making a horny mistake? That's excessive. But I do believe in being held responsible for your actions. Don't want kids? Get a vasectomy. Reverse it when you're ready. There's a 90 to 95 percent success rate on that procedure (for those saying it's really difficult to undo them), and it's a lot cheaper than child support.

If we're going to change laws, make contraception free and widely available, give kids proper sex ed, make getting an abortion easier, make sure no child has to grow up in poverty, make daycare a lot cheaper so single moms can work, and give dads who want it shared custody. If we make some significant progress there, I'm all for 'financial abortions'. And giving men who are paying child support the chance to have that re-evaluated.

cabsmom2020 · 2023-01-31T23:59:17+00:00

I'm not pro- choice, but if abortion is legal then I think men should be able to opt out during that time period also.

If a man decides he wants to parent his child, then cs should be in the table. It should be reasonable not solely based on either income.

DeweyCheatemHowe · 2023-01-31T16:40:19+00:00

I used to have a similar mindset (not that it should be illegal, but that it's unfair). My thoughts have changed. Our society has deviated as far as possible from personal responsibility with respect to sex and I think we need to push back the other direction.

If men are afraid of having a child, or don't trust a particular woman to not fish a condom out of the trash in an attempt to impregnate herself, they shouldn't have sex (or have sex with that particular woman). It's not complicated.

Yes, use birth control. Yes, trust your partner before having sex. Yes, sometimes shit happens. But at the end of the day, the natural goal of sex is a child. That's something you need to be aware of before jumping in bed.

And I think the same logic applies to women, for what it's worth. I do think abortion should remain legal and there are certainly times when I think it's "justified." But I think our casual approach to abortion and sex in general should be reconsidered.

There's a lot of stuff that's unfair in this world. But child support laws exist for the well fare of the child, not to punish men.

Bring on the downvotes

OldTrapper87 · 2023-01-31T14:32:24+00:00

Your so worried about getting her pregnant that you won't fuck her pussy !?!?! Yet you won't wear condoms?!?!? That's literally ass backwards why not get your tubes tied it's very easy to have undone years from now if you ever want kids which doesn't sound like it will happen.

I recommend fucking a guy if you only like ass and mouth.

What your talking about is financial abortion and has been talked about for a few years now but will never become law.

PilotJosh727 · 2024-05-06T11:40:32+00:00

I agree with child support - but it has to be done very carefully. Many people use it to trap their partner financially, and spend the child support money on themselves and even their new partner. If a child is to receive support, it should be done such that frequent checks are carried out to ensure that not a cent goes to the parent who is managing it. It should go into a bank account in the child’s name and the parent managing keep receipts such that any money spent from that account can be accounted for if investigated.

Leading-Profession95 · 2024-10-04T05:18:49+00:00

Why is nobody talking about this in politics on CNN etc. during a presidential race.

Adventurous_Peace674 · 2023-01-31T17:22:24+00:00

women deserve the right to abortion and opt out of motherhood. However, the man also should be given the right to opt out of fatherhood and the 18 years of childhood support incase the women says she wants to keep the baby. Thats all.

Brockzerock · 2023-01-31T14:28:10+00:00

If the man gets raped ya.

I’m against abortion so it’s easy for me. If woman can abort a kid a man should be able to financially abort a kid but I don’t think either should be able to do that.

If both parties consent to sex they both consent to possibly having a kid. That’s just how sex works. No one’s forcing you to have sex.

Bravo_Juliet01 · 2023-01-31T17:49:49+00:00

The mothers can abuse the hell out of the payments they receive

hawkeyepitts · 2023-01-31T18:33:27+00:00

Mothers can abort their parental status during the pregnancy by having an abortion. Fathers should also be allowed to abort their parental status during the pregnancy.

Child support will always be a thing, because if the father isn’t paying, then the state would have to pay - the state will always find somebody else to foot the bill if at all possible.

As far as child support after divorce one the child is x years old, and the parents split up, financial support of the child should be 50/50.

Dustball414CA · 2023-01-31T20:03:03+00:00

When the law states that up to 65% of your pre-tax income can be used as C$ (55% if you are supporting a second family - ie, you remarried), and that law is based upon biased data that no one can duplicate (you can thank Lenora Weissmann who refused to release her "findings" while claiming men enjoy an income increase (20+% on average and women lose out on 30+% - even Weissmann couldn't recreate her ownfindings!). Exactly how is any of that even remotely legal??

ChaosOpen · 2023-01-31T23:03:56+00:00

Children should go to the parent that is most able to take care of the child without the other's assistance. If for some reason the breadwinner cannot take the child(be it domestic violence, history of mental illness, etc) then it should be only enough to supplement the needs of the child and not based on a percentage of the parent's income.

John2H · 2023-02-01T02:51:28+00:00

It should absolutely be illegal.

I have full custody of my kids and am STILL paying child support to my ex while she sleeps around and cheats on her new man.

Infuriating.

Impressive_256 · 2023-01-31T07:35:23+00:00

No, you make unwanted baby, you have to pay your due.

It should be a fixed amount across the board, that is the one thing Andrew Tate and I agree on.

You are supposed to tie condoms after use, and throw it out at a place of your choice, this should be common knowledge at this point, i think it's even part of some IFU's. You don't wash them.

yolo_swag_tyme · 2023-01-31T14:42:06+00:00

I think it should be capped at a reasonable amount of money required to raise a child. None of this $100,000 a month because he’s a millionaire. It should be based on income but capped at like $1000/m. If the guys rich and the kid wants to go to university then he can pay that directly too.

tthechosendummy · 2023-01-31T17:46:52+00:00

“If women have the right to kill them then men should have the right to abandon them”

tthechosendummy · 2023-01-31T17:47:42+00:00

“If women have the right to kill them then men should have the right to abandon them”

Angryasfk · 2023-01-31T16:57:48+00:00

No it shouldn’t be illegal.

The issues with child support are as follows:

Men lack the opt out of parenthood that women have (and don’t go quoting the whole Roe v Wade stuff - that doesn’t apply outside of the US and abortion is legal for the majority of the population in the US without having to move states).
Paternity fraud is way more common than many people are willing to believe. And the way many guys are “named” and hit up by the government for a kid that’s not even theirs because the women put their name down is criminal!
Child support goes straight to the mother, who can spend it on whatever she chooses. There is no accountability.
From what I can see, in the US it privileges children from earlier relationships.
Rape victims (in the US anyway) get hit up for it. I’ve little doubt that many of those justifying this on the basis that the “child itself is innocent” would be screaming about how evil it is that in some US states rape victims aren’t exempted from abortion bans. A clear double standard based upon the sex of the victim!
Again in the US you have to go to court (and spend huge sums) to vary the amount if you lose your job.

All of the above can be significantly reformed. But making it illegal? No, don’t agree.

tthechosendummy · 2023-01-31T17:49:04+00:00

Child support is a “traditional” family policy but we no longer live in traditional times 🤷‍♂️

Caity-nerd · 2023-02-01T06:30:48+00:00

No, but it should deffo get changed

Calculate the cost for raising the kid (food, diapers, clothes, etc) and each parent pays 50% no matter what.

If the parents who has custody of the child is proven to be taking from the child support money for their own gain, they auto lose custody of them due to inability to take care of the child

People seem to be missing the whole point of child support. It’s not for the parents it’s for the child, except that’s just mere concept with the way things are going currently and is just being as a way to milk the other parent of their money.

Medusas_Kiss · 2023-01-31T21:17:41+00:00

UK here.

Slightly off topic but still on target!

I think the system definitely needs an overhaul.

For context: I have him 3 days a week. I buy all his uniform. I buy all his clothes for over my house, he wears them over mine and wears them home and there is a 60% that they will come back. I take him on holiday every year (his mother haven’t taken him away) I take him out every weekend while he tells me his mum just tells him to go on his PS5 (that I bought him)

Anyway….

I don’t understand how they can just decide that a specific % of your wages is owed no matter what.

My example would be my current situation.

For 11 years £198 a month was perfectly fine for him to survive and help his mother out but over many years of hard work I have landed a great paying job and now because of this I pay £806 a month now…..tried to question why they can do that and just got “it’s just the way the system is, you earn that much and his mother is down as the main career”

I have asked to see proof that the money is either being spent in his needs or going into a savings for him but the CSA has told me it’s none of my business….so….it’s sad to say but I can’t wait until I no longer have to pay it and because I’m used to that amount leaving my account now just put it in savings for him until he is 21.

gruden · 2023-01-31T22:19:53+00:00

The Father should be able to abort his obligations and rights to an unborn child the same way the Mother can choose to abort the unborn. File the claim with a local city clerk or court.

After the child is born, the assumed Father should be allowed to request a paternity test to confirm he is actually the Father before any payments are ordered. If the Father is required to make child support payments, some visitation and ability to be around his child needs to be allowed.

2023-02-01T02:00:07+00:00

If abortion is, then yes. It isn’t “equal” that a woman gets all the choice, especially in this modern world where everyone preaches “equality” but they don’t actually give a fuck about it

2023-01-31T15:05:46+00:00

As a collector of child support from a child's Mom, I ask for it to keep her in line. It cost us a lot financially due to the Mom's mistake and continue lying. I think child support is a reason not to screw around with a girl. If one, is stupid enough to be trapped they should pay for it.

Mechanik_J · 2023-01-31T20:29:04+00:00

Maybe, but I think the incentive should be taken away.

It should be a program where both parents put money into a spending account for what the child needs.

The amount of money put in by both parents isn't dictated by how much one of the parents makes. It's based on a study for the living expense of a child for that select year.

The program then is allowed to dictate what the money can be spent on. We, as a society, can then vote on what the account money can be spent on. Or whatever plan you guys come up with.

wildKarenusedscREEch · 2023-02-01T00:50:54+00:00

And outside of life threatening instances. Abortion too. And "taking half" after a divorce.

Signal_Pattern7869 · 2023-02-02T10:04:26+00:00

I fathered 4 kids by now from 3 women. First one- we divorced and remained awesome friends - I spent as much time with the kid as I wished. She never legally requested any money for the kid, and the kid had everything he needed.

Second wife basically ran away from the USA, hid my daughter and I never seen them again. I transferred child support to her BA until my daughter turned 18.(wrote about my situation here bout a month back)

Third wife is mother to my young son and daughter and we’ve been together for 5 yrs now.

And even considering all my situation- I’m still probably the most prolife redditor one can meet on this r/

Child support certainly has to remain legal. It’s the societal bias that single dad - bad, single mom - good, that is the problem.

JGoonSquad · 2023-02-14T15:31:31+00:00

Child support should be illegal. It forces men to be wage slaves and if they don't abide they are thrown in prison. Absolutely disgusting. If child support were eliminated it would force women to make better choices when it comes to the men they sleep with. But of course we cannot hold women accountable for their actions.

Impressive_256 · 2023-02-23T04:48:33+00:00

The burden of child raising should be on society, not the bio parents. I would be extremely careful who you have sex with, since if they get pregnant, this can totally destroy you if the woman is horrible.

Title	Should child support be illegal?
Author	Impressive_256
Upvotes	95
Comments	189
Date	January 31, 2023 6:13 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/10pqk3x/should_child_support_be_illegal/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/should-child-support-be-illegal.1150599 https://theredarchive.com/post/1150599

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