A large part of the current frustrations of men and women are from the inflated sense of self-worth of women

DerEwigeKatzendame · 2017-06-29T16:49:20+00:00

If Attractive men are 10% of the population according to women and unmarried men who make more than $50k are 25% male population, then women are only really attracted to 2.5% of the male population.

Are you sure that's how the math for that would work?

Mr_Smoogs · 2017-06-29T15:38:21+00:00

Sorry to burst the bubble, but the vast majority of men and women do not have problems finding dates or relationships. It may seem like it, but that's likely because you frequent online forums where people who do have problems congregate.

honeypuppy · 2017-06-29T16:15:49+00:00

if women dropped their expectations back to reality, everyone would be happier.

In the late 40's and 50's in Soviet Russia, there were simply not enough men. Hell, there are even popular songs about that time period that have lines like "He may have one arm, but at least I have a man".

There were literally not enough men to go around. Was everyone happier then? I don't think so.

That kind of deficit of males is what it would take to get women back to reality. Or you know, guys could do the thing they control... and get to work.

madude2016 · 2017-06-29T15:55:42+00:00

They refuse to settle mostly because it's easier for them to have a happy single life than men. Sex drive is a bitch. Most of people have a roughly accurate sense of self-worth, men or women.

BTW, your math is off. The percentage of attractive men making $50k+ is between 0 and 10% based on your assumption, depending on the overlap between the two populations, not 2.5%.

EliteSpartanRanger · 2017-06-29T15:42:08+00:00

Women are not only attracted to 2.5% of the population, otherwise there wouldn't be so many people getting laid.

Women have a lot of options these days, it's true. They have no reason to drop their expectations for now. I think if women were educated differently, some of them would have lower standards.

Electra_Cute · 2017-06-29T15:56:19+00:00

Seems like if women dropped their expectations back to reality, everyone would be happier.

Perhaps you should come back to reality too. The majority of the males who are frustrated with females are the unattractive males. There is no attractive males lamenting on about how "women's expectations are too high". This goes for both genders.

void_magic · 2017-06-29T20:45:23+00:00

Hard to say women have an inflated self worth if most of them find what they are looking for eventually.

sublimemongrel · 2017-06-29T16:29:21+00:00

"Women" are not all requiring these so-called "laundry lists" of requirements. Certain women are, not the majority. Most women seem to just want a dude they are attracted to, they can have fun with, who is "on their level". I don't see "women" behaving the way you are describing except on Reddit subs which highlight them.

And your numbers just plain don't match. If 100% of women were all going after 2.5% of men then how come most men are getting LTRs or are getting married?

Mr_Smoogs · 2017-06-29T16:17:25+00:00

Christ, how could you possibly believe all women compete for 2,5% of men? Most people are out there dating and have no idea about these weird fucking problems.

Reed_4983 · 2017-06-29T17:13:45+00:00

[deleted]

the_calibre_cat · 2017-06-29T19:12:19+00:00

I mean, it'd be nicer for we lonelier men, but it'd be boring and we wouldn't strive for more. If men really wanted to gain some sexual power back, they'd have to consciously be less thirsty. That will never, ever happen.

jackandjill22 · 2017-06-29T19:12:47+00:00

If a woman is supposed to cook, clean, etc. then it makes sense for her to marry a guy who can financially provide for her and makes more money.

AnUndecidedPill · 2017-06-29T15:59:41+00:00

Let's be honest - it is the internet isn't it? The thread the other day got me thinking about it. Even though now it is much easier to get a date, there was a lot more honesty in dating back in the day I think.

In the 90s and early 00s, dating consisted of going out and talking to people whilst drinking. You probably had to have a bit in common to start with to go to the same places. If you were a student you;d meet another student in the student pubs. If you were into rock music youd go to the pub that played rock music and talk to people there. If you were into pills youd go to the dance club and meet other people who liked doing that. From there youd make a circle of friends and start dating in that. Otherwise youd meet friends of friends, people from work, people who lived near to you, that sort of thing.

Clearly what we have now is way more choice and we are dealing with the troubles of that. Women have more choice. So instead of meeting the cute guy who lives down the road with a compatibe lifestyle, they have 5 similar ones within a 5 mile radius. And now, the guys who live further away have a much better chance of meeting her first because she uses the internet to meet people. She has to weigh up her options now instead of settling on the perfectly fine one down the road.

Likewise for guys, if they look reasonable enough they now have way more choice. They dont need to put up with the cute girl nearby as she has another hissy fit or plays hard to get. They too, can look around and find the easier lays quicker. It takes less time and money now, so they can focus on other things and know the next is a few swipes away.

The internet is probably to blame more than anything.

Butt-Factory · 2017-06-29T18:41:08+00:00

Women report enjoying solitude more than men, and women don't enjoy the same benefits of marriage as men. Married men are happier, healthier, wealthier than single men. Single women are happier and wealthier than married women. Now that feminism has allowed women to choose to stay single or delay marriage, it's no surprise that many women make this choice and are statistically happier for it. For many women who are happy single, there's no reason to settle for anything less than the very best. For others, they simply wish to stay as independent as possible.

I'm one of those women. My decision to not marry and stay living alone despite having many men try to convince me to move in with or marry them is often misunderstood as me holding out for something better or waiting for a more worthy man. This is totally untrue. I'm only making decisions based on careful thought and reflection on what I think is best for me and my happiness. It's pragmatism, not narcissism. I could allow myself to get swept up in the romance of a wedding, but in the long run that wouldn't be right for me or my partner. I'm not going to sacrifice my satisfaction and success to make my partner a little happier temporarily.

HugMuffin · 2017-06-29T19:21:14+00:00

First off, it's been proven that men are the more narcissistic gender, so this "inflated sense of self worth" is out. Second, like attracts like. Men and women tend to marry people who are similar to them, in personality, social class, wealth, etc. None of what you're saying is true.

Love8Death · 2017-06-29T16:16:21+00:00

Yes, it's like how all men want a supermodel that can beat him in Chess. Except that's not 2.5%, it's like 0.025%.

orcscorper · 2017-06-29T16:58:00+00:00

But men should not drop their standards, or (God forbid) raise their SMV? Why not?

100% of women are competing for 2.5% of the male population

Oh hello there Hyperbole.

MsVerleihnix · 2017-06-29T15:49:11+00:00

Arrogance is something found most often in men. It is a major turn off and also demonstrates a weak sense of self worth. So it is very unattractive.

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blackedoutfast · 2017-06-29T15:39:55+00:00

Meh, this is basic TRP theory. Women have sex with high value men in their youth and just settle with a lower value man through marriage. So, they can't really lose.

Mr_Smoogs · 2017-06-29T19:59:41+00:00

[deleted]

Hellothere_1 · 2017-06-29T21:51:46+00:00

Well that statistic stuff is pure bullshit. For most people there is a very significant difference between ideal partners and dating pool.

I'm a man. I would love to date a very attractive, smart woman with a perfect personality and high income. Who wouldn't?

The point is that while there are qualities among females which I find attractive and which I look for in potential partners this doesn't mean they are a bullet list I check off and women don't do that either.

If most women were only willing to date 2.5% of men it just doesn't make sense 66% of the American population are currently in a relationship.

Gorgatron1968 · 2017-06-29T22:10:34+00:00

Is that 50k before or after taxes.

eliechallita · 2017-06-29T23:41:55+00:00

I think that you're massively oversimplifying the issue here, because you assume that most women have an inflated sense of self and entitlement.

This paper by the APA has an excellent breakdown on the subject: https://www.apa.org/pubs/journals/releases/psp-pspp0000078.pdf

To quote from its conclusion, men tend to have higher self-esteem than women, especially in Western countries, and self-esteem tends to increase with age for both genders.

If you're trying to correlate an inflated sense of self-worth with higher dating requirement, then the average man should have an even longer laundry list than the average woman: That's not even going into the body image and self-doubt issues that are generally more common in women than in men (or, at least, more readily reported).

That 2.5% claim doesn't hold water either: The percentage of people in a relationship each year is much higher than 2.5%, and that's leaving out the number of people who are casually dating. If you were right, it would mean that the majority of these people are settling for an unattractive partner, which would contradict your statement about women's insanely high requirements: If they're settling, it means that their sense of self-worth isn't as high as you think it is.

Furthermore, you're assuming an entirely free and open dating market, whereas people are generally constrained by who they can date at any given time: The dating pool is usually segregated by geography and different social factors such as income, education, race, etc. At best, you could say that women desire the cream of the crop within their respective dating pools, rather than worldwide.

There are other problems with your statement too: You assume that men have no requirements of their own, and would be happy enough to have any woman simply jump into bed with them. Not only does that ignore the fact that men also have their own set of physical requirements for women, you're also ignoring the criteria that men might use to select a long-term relationship beyond basic physical attraction, or sex.

I think that your main problem is that you're conflating what people fantasize about, with what they actually go after: Men and women always fantasize about the highest value people they can think of (although there are limits to what they think of, in many cases), but both tend to go for a pretty realistic match. You're presuming that women, and only women, are always waiting for an imaginary prince charming and completely ignore everyone else.

[deleted] · 2017-06-30T09:45:04+00:00

"women are to blame for my problems"

rulenumber303 · 2017-06-30T16:47:06+00:00

Women are pretty good at pleasing themselves nowadays. It is reasonable to assume that the average woman's worth to herself is more than it was fifty years ago... and that this is not unwarranted. Women earn more than they used to, have higher educational levels than they used to and just like men they have access to more cultural and recreational options than they used to. This creates a higher floor price. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is not an unreasonable standard to expect of men that they make themselves overall into a better deal (when all costs and benefits are toted up) than six cats and an hitachi wand. The woman with six cats and that hitachi wand may be frustrated but she'd still be worse off if she partnered with a guy who just ain't worth it.

Men vastly underestimate the amount of trouble men are to the women they form relationships with. The majority of several large categories of work always seems to fall to women, and a lot of men have bad habits and a sense of entitlement to unearned power in relationships. Men also vastly overestimate how repulsive unfit and socially inept men are to women... I blame it on porn, tugging their dicks to fat american tech dudes boning asian street meat seems to destroy any instinct they may have had for what is and isn't attractive to women.

Or to sum it up... if you think she's decided you're not worth it then she's probably right.

gopher_glitz · 2017-07-04T07:19:11+00:00

The reason so many men have low SMV is because their moms settled for their dads resulting in a low SMV dud.

The higher everyones standards, the better off the next and subsequent generations will be.

EliteSpartanRanger · 2017-06-29T21:10:15+00:00

You are misunderstanding things.

First of all is there a statistic on the fact that only 25% make more than 50k? Because I highly doubt that. 50k is practically bare minimum to live comfortably. It's not rich.

Most women also date within their range. A single mom might say she wants a billionaire who looks like an actor but she knows it's just a pipe dream. She will probably end up dating someone who has a similar standard of living as herself.

Second of all, not all women find the same 2.5% attractive. I don't find Chris Hemsworth handsome but many people do. I find Tae-Min handsome and other women don't. Some women like 40+ men others like men in their 20s. Tastes exist, and women's tastes vary more than men's.

abicus4343 · 2017-06-29T22:38:31+00:00

I'm thinking that considering the amount of times I've seen men post about this that it is actually the other way around. If men are the ones here bitching about not being able to get the women they want then it looks like its men with the problem of shooting out of their leagues not women.

Title	A large part of the current frustrations of men and women are from the inflated sense of self-worth of women
Author	Mr_Smoogs
Upvotes	38
Comments	250
Date	June 29, 2017 3:34 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/6k941b/a_large_part_of_the_current_frustrations_of_men/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/a-large-part-of-the-current-frustrations-of-men.267282 https://theredarchive.com/post/267282

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