Roe v Wade likely overturned

TracyMorganFreeman · 2022-05-03T02:37:11+00:00

All this means is that it isnt a constitutionally guaranteed right. Nothing is stopping states or the federal legislature from enshrining it into law(or banning it for that matter).

Temporary_Spend_3111 · 2022-05-03T03:17:17+00:00

Ive always been in favor of abortion rights.

That being said financial abortions as well

Women have reproductive rights. Men have reproductive responsibilities only.

If a woman gets raped or reproductivly coerced by a man. She has

Biological options :

morning after pill
abortion pill
surgical abortion

Societal options :

claiming not to know who the father is and giving the child to a family member or putting it up for adoption
safe haven laws
laws that keep rapist fathers from getting custody rights

Let's look at the options a man has in the same situation :

forced labor to pay 5-7 years income to his rapist over 18-21 years
refusing to work (or simply losing his job through no fault of his own) and going to jail repeatedly for contempt of court and losing his drivers license/library card/passport
fleeing the US forever and only entering countries that do not enforce international child support or extradite for contempt of court
ending his life on his own terms

Why not give men the equivalent outs as women's societal outs ... other than sexism? I don't know, but a man's choice not to have sex is irrelevant as far as the courts are concerned.

After Hermesmann v Seyer set the precedent, courts around the country have decided that male victims of women owe the perpetrators child support for decades, while other precedents (Roe v Wade) and laws (safe haven laws) generally allow female victims many options to get rid of the product of their rapes.

Hermesmann successfully argued that a woman is entitled to sue the father of her child for child support even if conception occurred as a result of a criminal act committed by the woman.

E.g.

Alabama man - https://law.justia.com/cases/alabama/court-of-appeals-civil/1996/2950025-0.html

Arizona boy - https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/09/02/statutory-rape-victim-child-support/14953965/

California boy - https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1996-12-22-9612220045-story.html

Others in this paper "Victims with responsibilities" -https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1017&context=cflj

There are many others out there. I do not believe there has yet been a single case where a boy or man has gotten out of paying child support to an adult woman that statutory raped, raped, sperm jacked, etc.

The good news is that in recent years feminist lobbiests have pushed for laws to prevent rapists from getting child custody. Without custody the child wouldn't be raised by a rapist and the victim wouldn't owe child support. So the day that a male doesn't owe his perpetrator may be coming soon. The less good news is that just over half the states that passed these laws passed them as the feminist lobbiests proposed them - only preventing rapist fathers from getting custody. (https://www.ncsl.org/research/human-services/parental-rights-and-sexual-assault.aspx)

Terrell v Torres recently set a precedent and invalidated a signed contract to let a woman use embryos created with her ex and have him owe child support.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2019/03/18/arizona-court-ruling-use-preserved-embryos-without-ex-husbands-consent-ruby-torres/3205867002/

Courts have ruled the same way in Illinois and the US supreme court agreed.

http://www.fathers4equality-australia.org/fathers-rights/woman-wins-custody-of-embryos-after-separation/

Courts have ruled the same way in a very similar situation in Italy.

https://www.ansa.it/canale_saluteebenessere/notizie/lei_lui/vita_di_coppia/2021/02/25/si-allimpianto-dellembrione-dellex-marito-anche-se-lui-dice-no_05230156-95ea-406a-aa7e-4e90cf2d7c93.html

Courts ruled the same way in yet another similar case in Israel.

https://he.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%A4%D7%A8%D7%A9%D7%AA_%D7%A0%D7%97%D7%9E%D7%A0%D7%99

In several other cases women who forged her ex's signature to implant have been awarded child support from the unwilling father. E.G. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5687477/Ex-husband-ordered-pay-child-support-former-wife-forged-signature-undergo-IVF.html

Reproductive coersion of men is also an issue that would be drastically reduced with financial abortion.

approximately 10.4% (or an estimated 11.7 million) of men in the United States reported ever having an intimate partner who tried to get pregnant when they did not want to or tried to stop them from using birth control

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproductive_coercion

American talk shows for women encourage women to stop birth control without telling their partner with the applause of their audiences.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=5CNHwhHWPoQ

What about IVF with sperm taken from a condom without the man's consent?

https://www.mommyish.com/woman-steals-ex-boyfriends-sperm-has-twins-sues-for-child-support-836/

How about when they only engage in oral sex which should have no pregnancy risk?

https://rollingout.com/2014/02/04/woman-uses-sperm-oral-sex-get-pregnant-force-man-pay-child-support/

How about court orders mandating men give their wife sperm so they can impregnate themselves during divorce proceedings?

https://theprint.in/judiciary/court-orders-man-to-donate-sperm-to-estranged-wife-who-says-no-time-for-2nd-marriage/255215/

Financial abortion would solve all the financial issues for victimized males and remove financial incentives for women to do these things, but many pro-choice folks immediately start making pro-life talking points that if he didn't want a kid he should have used a condom or kept it in his pants.

Financial abortion is about bodily autonomy. No out for child support forces a man to spend years of his life working to pay for a child he does not want. If he loses his job and is unable to pay, he will be locked in a cage.

1 in 8 men in South Carolina jails are there for failure to pay child support. They are not given court appointed lawyers until they are $10k behind and most are arrested and lose their job way before that limit making it extremely difficult to pay.

Src: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/20/us/skip-child-support-go-to-jail-lose-job-repeat.html

In the US,

66 percent of all child support not paid by fathers is due to an inability to come up with the money

Src: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-myth-of-the-deadbeat-_b_4745118

Mothers owing child support are more likely to not pay fathers than visa versa, but women are rarely jailed for it.

we found that 32 percent of custodial fathers didn't receive any of the child support that had been awarded to them compared to 25 percent of custodial moms

Src: https://www.npr.org/2015/03/01/389945311/who-fails-to-pay-child-support-moms-at-a-higher-rate-than-dads

FlatTire2005 · 2022-05-03T10:28:04+00:00

Women are less likely to support abortion than men, so men are “standing up” more than women are.

Warning: Pro-choice people will take this as an attack, whether you support abortion or not. The narrative of men “controlling women” is too important. Men have to be the default bad guy, and pro-choice people don’t want to lose their weapon of declaring men evil for being pro-life.

Edit: Awfully weird how this was upvoted on this sub, even though men supposedly hate abortion. Shouldn’t my fellow men be pissed off and therefore downvote me for showing men in a negative light (as in, supporting abortion)? Hmmmmm…..

heeroena · 2022-05-03T03:12:44+00:00

concerned that this leak happening now two months before becoming official will likely incite riots. Potentially by design

EricAllonde · 2022-05-03T05:40:19+00:00

I'll support reproductive rights for women just as much as women have supported reproductive rights for men.

InAJam_SoS · 2022-05-03T04:28:36+00:00

Um, when is the last time a Supreme Court opinion / ruling was 'leaked'?

As the kids say: "Sus"

Ijatsu · 2022-05-03T10:46:41+00:00

A pick from twoX:

It is gut wrenching to know you are a second class citizen in a your county.

I don't understand how you can legally require a mother to donate her body to house a foetus. If a child has a right to its mother's body, does that continue after birth? Can I legally compel my mother to donate a kidney to me if I need it?

Even if you're pro-choice this misrepresentation is stupid.

This is the reason men's rights don't gain traction, the public opinion is capable to look at the condition of both men and women and will invent stupidities like this to make it look like women are oppressed.

AndyBrown65 · 2022-05-03T05:27:50+00:00

And the Handmaid Maidens memes are here in 1.... 2..... 3......

ignatztempotypo · 2022-05-03T04:33:44+00:00

Lock your windows and bolt the doors gents. I think this will be a "let's hate men because..." rallying cry. Yeesh.

they_be_cray_z · 2022-05-03T05:00:19+00:00

Prepare for hearing many people say the men of the Court are not allowed to have an opinion because they are men and don't have wombs...ignoring of course that Roe v. Wade was decided entirely by men.

HipEvilMidget · 2022-05-03T06:30:57+00:00

Happy Mother's Day

Razorbladekandyfan · 2022-05-03T10:03:33+00:00

NOW the selective service is never getting equalize as they will use this to justify it.

imextremelymoderate · 2022-05-03T04:07:55+00:00

I'm not necessarily against abortion, but making it illegal is technically consistent with feminism, definitionally, since it creates more equality between men and women in terms of reproductive rights

Grand_Ad_864 · 2022-05-03T02:39:20+00:00

TBH, I have a horrible case of not giving a crap. We have all seen how women do everything in their power to prevent men from achieving equality. Seeing things like how women vote to keep male only drafts kinda makes me not care about this.

Less_Atmosphere3931 · 2022-05-03T05:22:26+00:00

Then we must post up more information in high schools, universities and other places of higher learning as well as libraries etc that it’s your responsibility to leave an unwanted infant with the hospital it was born in, your local police station or fire station. Many don’t bother to look into this and they have the child only to wind up neglecting it, or killing it if they don’t really want it.

FastFourierTerraform · 2022-05-03T03:07:26+00:00

This means that a ban on abortions in Mississippi after 15 weeks is upheld. 105 days, or 3.5 months. If you can't decide whether you want to keep it by then, I don't know what to tell you.

fattrying · 2022-05-03T07:58:02+00:00

Bad day for the Satanic

Usernamestruggle5 · 2022-05-03T04:30:23+00:00

Personally i am enraged that women cant get abortions legally in the US. If my wife got pregnant she would want an abortion as we both dont want children (I wouldn’t mind one or two but she is very serious about not having them). We use condoms but if something did happen I would want her to have access to that option

Abortion is legal where I live thank god

upsidedownbackwards · 2022-05-03T09:32:42+00:00

I'll admit I'm selfish here. But I'm pro choice because the fewer unwanted mouths my taxes pay for the better. Unwanted kids arent going to have the best chance at a good upbringing either so we well end up with more 14 year old kids carjacking people and getting away with a slap on the wrist due to their age. And those unwanted daughters will probably get knocked up early as well.

There's too many awful parents as it is. Rather not add to that pile. Everyones quality of life decreases with unwanted kids to bad parents.

xhouliganx · 2022-05-03T03:37:04+00:00

Good. Now there’s an opportunity to start over and fight for reproductive rights for ALL, not just women. Not looking forward to how much more insufferable Feminists are going to get though.

Obi1classic · 2022-05-03T04:37:01+00:00

I know this is a womens subject, but, I would imagine this should only DISCOURAGE promiscuity and sexual recklessness. In terms of what this means for men, it's a good warning to use caution about hooking up. The responsibility of not getting baby trapped now lies on both men AND women.

jinladen040 · 2022-05-03T12:29:31+00:00

Lib states are still going to do their own thing. We're already increasingly seeing Liberal states pass Legislation not only allowing Abortions right up until the moment of birth but the Legislation also takes away any Human rights of a Baby inside the Womb.

WeEatBabies · 2022-05-03T12:47:40+00:00

We should be standing up in outrage!

But feminist keep denying us the right to refuse consent, so f*ck them!

NextStopMyAss · 2022-05-03T06:50:51+00:00

The MRM should be against this.

Haha! Women got theirs!

No, that's not what the movement is about. Roe vs. Wade being overturned sets a horrible precedent. It's bad for women and it's bad for men too.

TruthIsOutThere3 · 2022-05-03T02:43:35+00:00

Messed up. Women should be able to access abortions if they want one. Abortion rights have nothing to do with mens rights but this is a huge hit to women's rights.

EmiNVS · 2022-05-03T02:23:57+00:00

in support of women's reproductive Rights.

If you're a heterosexual male who don't want kids/is not ready for kids and can't afford a vasectomy, chances are that abortion being outlawed (Dunno what Roe v Wade is, making the assumption due to the comment about women's reproductive rights) will screw you and your partner as much as any woman out there.

macrotransactions · 2022-05-03T05:40:06+00:00

The right thing to do, men can't abort (financially), women shouldn't either. It is one of the biggest inequalities of our time.

Bland-fantasie · 2022-05-03T05:36:17+00:00

California responds by mandating abortions for the first four pregnancies.

YaskyJr · 2022-05-03T11:35:56+00:00

Abortion is murder.

Nerfixion · 2022-05-03T08:59:12+00:00

Abortion shouldn't be illegal. There are circumstances where abortion should be accessible. For example, the unborn has defects or is the product of rape. In terms of female medicine. It really is an overlooked field.

I don't think abortion should be used as a form of birth control but everyone should have a choice if you wish to be free. Just as it's my choice to disagree with those people who do use it in that way.

If you think your 12yo daughter should have to give birth because she was raped by literally anyone, you're on the wrong side. That being said the opposite should also be true, boys raped and forced into child support is equally as wrong. The way the solve the issues aren't clear cut because ultimately men and woman face different challenges.

No-Satisfaction-2320 · 2022-05-03T09:01:37+00:00

Finally equality has been reached!

richasalannister · 2022-05-03T06:11:28+00:00

Do you all really need to be told why you should stand up for women’s rights?

Of all places, I’d expect this sub to be in favor of reproductive rights.

C-Dub178 · 2022-05-03T08:14:31+00:00

When I was in my mother’s womb, I’m sure I would’ve wanted a chance at life.

Perfect_Try7261 · 2022-05-03T06:53:03+00:00

throwaway20210821 · 2022-05-03T02:28:34+00:00

Be prepared to be told why we as men should be standing up outraged and in support of women's reproductive Rights.

Nobody is saying that to MRAs. Men in general maybe but not MRAs.

Let me suggest that this is an opportunity for men's rights advocates to raise the possibility of fighting for reproductive Rights for all people not just women.

"MRAs are trying to make the abortion ban all about themselves"

There's a mixed view on abortion among men's rights activists so some will oppose this, some will be in favor and some will be apathetic.

Best to stay out of this and leave it to women, after all "no uterus, no opinion". The judges that overruled Roe v Wade aren't MRAs and aren't trying to enact an agenda favorable to men's rights. It literally has nothing to do with the MRM.

TrilIias · 2022-05-03T05:06:17+00:00

I think it would be wise for us to stop bringing up abortion on thus subreddit. Abortion isn't a men's rights issue, and as such e are not united. I am pro-life, and I have gotten into heated arguments here with people who are pro-choice. I don't regret those conversations, but attempting to make abortion a men's rights topic is only going to divide us.

That said, I truly hope the SC will overturn Roe.

LateralThinker13 · 2022-05-03T04:26:44+00:00

Federalism for the win. Roe was a bad precedent.

HUZNAIN · 2022-05-03T06:12:52+00:00

maybe i am the only MRA here who's supportive of pro-life laws, and is against the paper-abortion, and hey, the two main reasons for fatherlessness in the USA are divorce and *out-of-wedlock-births; meaning, it's not just about some children not having the legal access to their fathers, but also alongside of them are fathers who left them. That's why as an MRA, the biggest hypocrisy that i see in the MRM, is how MRAs will be concerned about fatherlessness when it comes to father's rights, when also the other major reason for fatherlessness are dads who intentionally abandoned their children, making it seem that many MRAs will only care about children's fatherlessness as a tool to achieve father's rights; they won't really mind fatherlessness as a whole, rather, just cherry-picking how poor and how it affects children without fathers in a divorce case, while not minding about the other fatherless children through abandonement by their fathers, and these kind of fathers are also supported by the "right" to paper-abortion.

if You think You'll support paper-abortion, then go ahead, if You think You'll support anti-fatherlessness, then go ahead, but i don't think You can be both.

i am Pro-Life, but even if i am Pro-Chouce, my stance on paper-abortion would still be the same. You can just have a conversation with the person (who's able to be pregnant) You'll be having sex with before having sex, about to whether the person (who's able to he pregnant) wants to keep it or not in case of an unintended pregnancy. If they're gonna keep it then You're not, then just leave, if they don't want, then stay, if you both agree to keeping it then stay.

realpitbullslayer · 2022-05-03T04:00:02+00:00

TitanicPat · 2022-05-03T06:40:39+00:00

Stoke the dem outrage ready for the midterms, with a supreme Court "leak"

Feminist feels are as safe as kittens. Nobody's taking anything away from that protected class.

igalaxy7 · 2022-05-03T03:18:00+00:00

if men could have an abortion, there would be a pill for $0.01 in every vending machine and/or a clinic at every gas station.

using this as an opportunity to advance mens rights is about the lamest shit I’ve ever heard.

No-Satisfaction-2320 · 2022-05-03T04:30:41+00:00

I know nothing about this, so what's Roe v Wade?

Copacetic75 · 2022-05-03T10:43:52+00:00

Americans remind me of my back woods hillbilly Uncle. I feel sorry for you.

Legatti · 2022-05-03T12:41:34+00:00

Men don't have reproductive choices because there is literally no way to do so without infringing on a woman's. Your reproductive rights are: wearing a condom, getting a vasectomy, maybe finding birth control made specifically for men?

Removing the financial obligation men face is an idiotic idea, with the exception of cases involving rape. The only thing that'll achieve is creating a lot of fucked up kids and terrified women.

You have reproductive rights. But you also really don't have any reproductive responsibility, either. All you have to do is have sex. They have to carry the child for nine months and then deliver it, OR choose to abort it, both of which aren't easy.

Amnsia · 2022-05-03T12:56:37+00:00

All for mens rights but (without being in this situation) I’m all for women having their right of way on this and have their choice.

Objective_Reindeer42 · 2022-05-03T13:01:18+00:00

america is wild fr

Title	Roe v Wade likely overturned
Author	McFeely_Smackup
Upvotes	243
Comments	242
Date	May 3, 2022 2:18 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/uh5w3e/roe_v_wade_likely_overturned/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/roe-v-wade-likely-overturned.1115794 https://theredarchive.com/post/1115794

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