Does the red pill really teach guys to manipulate women into sex, if they don't want it?

bryansodred · 2023-07-04T03:05:24+00:00

All the red pill teachings ive ever seen or read was boiled down to two things:

a) become the best most successful version of yourself so that ppl chase you, you dont chase ppl

b) understand how female nature works so that women dont use you or you waste your time/money on them and they kick you to the curb in the name of hypergamy

Novadina · 2023-07-04T02:39:09+00:00

Yes, they claim that woman have “last minute resistance” and will pretend they don’t want sex when they really do, in order to not appear slutty, so will say no, and that you will have to push past it to get laid.

totallyworkinghere · 2023-07-04T02:46:01+00:00

"The red pill" is so vague it's impossible to define what teachings are part of it and what aren't because people who claim to follow it will argue that all day.

Bottom line though, yes, there are people who say that this sort of shit is a great idea.

Dom-Francon · 2023-07-04T02:27:31+00:00

There is an article directing guys in how to push past Last Minute Resistance/Anti Slut Defense. Yes.

purplish_possum · 2023-07-04T04:08:46+00:00

If you have to manipulate or trick women into sex you're doing it wrong.

The Red Pill explains what attracts women (i.e what actually works). That information can be used to direct effort.

Manipulation doesn't work well. It's, therefore, both a dick move and an ineffective strategy.

Tricky_Relief_7152 · 2023-07-04T04:42:37+00:00

TRP, in general, is about accepting the truths about dating, women, and interacting with them.

The whole manipulation thing is more PUA nonsense.

Mobrowncheeks · 2023-07-04T02:22:43+00:00

Some red pillers advocate pretending to be someone who is attractive in order to get casual sex even when you aren’t, but I’ve never heard a overall statement to trick women who want serious relationships into casual sex

chocobolamo · 2023-07-04T08:03:57+00:00

No.

The red pill teaches men that early on in a relationship is when the terms are set. To use an analogy its like the rules that the relationship abides by. Kind of like a barter where both parties set their boundaries, set the expectations. This is just basic human nature. If you really think about every relationship you have is a barter. You trade your time and energy and in return set your expectations for what you want out of that relationship.

If a red piller goes through the steps to be high value, he knows he commands a high price.

The red pill also teaches men that women are just as sex driven then men. In fact I recall seeing a study where women had a higher libido then men.

The red pill teaches men that women are in general anxious and afraid of rejection. Its feminine nature. The red pill also teaches men that women want to be taken on a roller coaster. They dont wanna decide where to ogo for dinner, they don't want to decide what to do, they dont wanna pick a movie, they dont want to have to learn how to be romantic. They expect the man to be the romantic and doing the seducing. From the girls I have dated I have heard time after time - "I want to be romanced". Personally opinion here but they've seen too many romance movies, you are expected to be Prince Charming.

The red pill also teaches men what women and men need out of a relationship. It acknowledges what most men feel deep down. In all reality most men want a whore. They just don't want a whore who has shown she has commitment issues because the financial burden of having a child with someone is so great for men. You can lose half your life and a large portion of your future income because a woman got mad at you one day or changed her mind based on her feelings.

The red pill teaches men that being sexually competent is important. Your ability to get her off (looks help, girls get horny for hot guys too shocker...). Being sexually competent (improving yourself every which way, red pill concept) matters. If she doesn't want to have sex with you, and you are very good, well you will just go find someone else who is buying what you are selling (sexual satisfaction). Because you are the romantic one and you are desirable you can just find someone who appreciates your romance and sex positivity with ease.

The red pill also teaches men about what constitutes emotional abuse. It also teaches men how women are more socially adept and leverage social manipulation to not only test men, but take advantage of them. The red pill also teaches men that women are irrational, filled with emotion. They're sometimes a fury of emotion. So due to being irrational, they can lack emotional maturity. These things combined and women will withhold sex to get what they want. Whether they were mad at you for something you personally feel isnt a big deal and are punishing you. Or withhold intimacy in general (silent treatment). This is a form of emotional abuse. Obviously men can manipulate too, but the red pill just teaches men how to deal with emotional abuse and manipulation, from men and women.

With my current partner I was very open with the fact that sex was important to me and that I wanted to have a lot of hot sex. I brought this up pretty early on. If i am being honest I think this also comes across very confident and assertive which is also attractive. The result is that we have a lot of hot sex and had it pretty early. She is a very conservative girl too.

At the end of the day sex is fun, fulfilling, brings you closer together. Its a beautiful thing. The red pill is just sex positive. We should have more of it.

From a personal standpoint I don't really have an interest in seeking someone who has avoidance in regards to intimacy. Fix your own insecure attachment style. Fear of intimacy is something I got over and I expect the same from my partner. This is where I feel women who hate men get it wrong (like most feminists...). They are damaged and insecure. One of the reasons the red pill teaches men 1) low body count 2) young, both methods of securing a woman who hasn't been through so much baggage which is fucking exhausting ontop of already having to 'be the man' in the relationship. My god is the dating market rough in the 30s. You work on every aspect of your life and just see trainwreck after trainwreck.

Tall-Environment9580 · 2023-07-04T13:13:41+00:00

Redpill isn’t teaching any of this shit, a lot of manipulative men and “reformed” incels go into redpill and those guys cause trouble and blame it on redpill

BackAgain12345678910 · 2023-07-04T03:15:35+00:00

No it doesnt. And if they’re manipulated into wanting it, they want it. It’s no different than when a guy that’s naturally good with women gets them to want it. He’s hitting the same attraction triggers and doing the same things. He’s just doing it unknowingly.

Apprehensive_Net7337 · 2023-07-04T03:53:45+00:00

There's a lot of missing context here.

If 2 people are mutually looking for a relationship, have sex and then fizzle out later, that's still casual sex imo. Then women will shout from the rooftops that they were "used" in this instance.

There's too many details that get muddied, most people can't even agree on what's considered "casual" sex

AstronautLoveShack · 2023-07-04T02:22:50+00:00

It tries to, anyway.

FirmWerewolf1216 · 2023-07-04T03:35:11+00:00

Yes or at least it did back in its early years.

If I’m not mistaken Andrew tate got his start in the “Manosphere” by having an online youtube channel that was on picking and attracting women and yeah just like any book based on the same topic it was definitely manipulation tactics taught.

Tricks that tate showed on his how to be a playboy YouTube channel that are manipulation tactics included negging is actually a form of manipulation because your manipulating with a persons self perception to change to your liking.

Another tactic taught is guilting or coercing the date into sex. Saying “ I paid for the entire date but I can’t get no ___ tonight?” “Wow that’s crazy!”

Another one is gaslighting.

These are just a few tactics that I learned from early manosphere videos and books.

badgersonice · 2023-07-04T02:48:54+00:00

Years back, there was a lot more discussion among red pill types about “pushing through last minute resistance”, and fortunately that seems to have declined quite a lot.

On the downside, it seems to have been replaced with black-pill-ish stuff like “a woman isn’t genuinely attracted to you unless she’s fucking you on the sticky bathroom floor at a bar after meeting you 5 minutes ago— anything else is cucked or beta bucks”..

96tillinfinity_ · 2023-07-04T04:03:29+00:00

The red pill teaches men the truth of female nature that goes against the lies they were told growing up. Full stop

Mentathiel · 2023-07-04T07:03:16+00:00

Imo the whole concept of shit-tests teaches guys to cross boundaries and results in emotionally healthy women getting the fuck out, while women who're good targets for manipulation will tolerate it.

Then you also have all of the discussions around frame, they aren't all as bad as shit-test discussions, but they can be guides for manipulation.

Looking for young women and virgins is also looking for women who're more naive and less experienced by definition, again, better targets for manipulation.

A lot of their beliefs about women would result in gaslighting women around them (awalt, hamstering, women being childlike, afbb, monkey branching, looks matter most, Idk, anything they hold as an universal truth that might not apply to the individual they're talking to). All of these are designed to make a man feel like they're on opposing sides with their partner, and make the woman feel like she's a shitty person, which already sets up an abusive dynamic in which the woman is likely to be self-denying and self-flagellating, and the men is likely to be an ass.

I don't think it's conscious for most men in these circles, I think these beliefs just make you act out a script they aren't even aware of. And then survivorship bias, selection bias, confirmation bias, etc. kick in and make them go further into the ideology, while putting themselves into more situations that would confirm the ideology.

TelevisionGloomy5458 · 2023-07-04T14:07:56+00:00

I think women generally want sex, but guys don’t seem to get that women like sex too. Red pill does teach pick up artist tactics and NLP to influence a woman into liking them by trickery and sometimes outright deceit. It’s not that it’s not consensual. But more like a con job. Teaching men to pretend to be a certain way and use psychological tactics to manipulate. Well it all ends when the truth is revealed about the man. So he either ghosts after sex or the mask eventually comes off. Either way the truth always comes out. I’m always curious why men play these games, is a piece of *ss really worth all that?

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YasuotheChosenOne · 2023-07-04T04:44:16+00:00

You are correct. You should not be lying about your intentions for casual (or LTRs). The whole point is to become attractive enough to, you know, attract women. Playing silly games and lying definitely works but it’s a mess and 9/10 blows up in your face big time.

Wattehfok · 2023-07-04T06:23:48+00:00

It’s not across the board, and it’s probably less common than it once was in terp spaces (post MeToo, anyway); but it’s still there.

Ludens0 · 2023-07-04T07:05:05+00:00

What's the difference between "manipulate" and "convince"?

Treacle-Flimsy · 2023-07-04T07:22:28+00:00

Women will have casual sex with more dominant/successful/attractive guys and be in the relationships with less attractive guys, aka Beta Buxx. The idea is that if you're not very attractive, you should appear safe and then pump and dump

Rhinosaur666 · 2023-07-04T11:53:31+00:00

There are so many contradictions on this sub.

Women have lower testosterone so they have little libido and don't care about sex AT THE SAME TIME they are riding the cock carousel and having gang bangs every weekend.

Women are extremely selective with them men they fuck, only willing to go for the top 5% AT THE SAME TIME they are having non stop sexual with a new guy every couple of days (so all of these guys are top 5% hmmm).

Women ONLY lust after men who are tall and extremely good looking AT THE SAME TIME they will make an exception for rich short guys, rock star short and ugly guys, short famous actors, etc, etc.

Women only want to fuck the top 5% AT THE SAME TIME the majority of them date normal, ordinary guys, but that's only because they are settling and really unhappy.

I mean if we all exist in a world where white is black, up is down, left is right, yes is no, then I don't think we exist in a tangible reality whatsoever.

RedBullfrog · 2023-07-04T14:08:50+00:00

Red pill is about men getting their shit together, learn to navigate in a world that is very much working against them, and to make the best out of that situation. Manipulating women into having sexual makes no sense in that context. A RP wouldn’t need to manipulate a woman into having sex with him.

RP is very unpopular in here. The reason is probably that RP teaches that a man is 100% accountable for his life and, as a part of that, his success with women. It’s demanding as fuck but works. For men who are lazy it is much easier to blame biology, women or RP, than getting their fat clubby asses to the gym.

Ordinary_Ad_7742 · 2023-07-04T17:02:20+00:00

I think we need to take the narratives from both side as a grain of salt. Maybe talk to people around you and truly listen to their perspective instead of seeing everything thru the lenses of red or blue pill. You think being blue pill “nice guy” is not manipulative? Pretend to be nice while hiding an agenda (hoping for sexual favor) is text book manipulation.

bobby995557 · 2023-07-04T17:09:19+00:00

No absolutely not. It teaches guys to be rich and fit- so women will want to have sex with them.

django62293 · 2023-07-05T04:18:02+00:00

Even if they did teach guys that, so what? Almost all human interaction involves some degree of manipulation.

Title	Does the red pill really teach guys to manipulate women into sex, if they don't want it?
Author	harmonica2
Upvotes	2
Comments	107
Date	July 4, 2023 2:14 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/14q212l/does_the_red_pill_really_teach_guys_to_manipulate/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/does-the-red-pill-really-teach-guys-to-manipulate.1224261 https://theredarchive.com/post/1224261

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