What would YOU do?

GridReXX · 2015-10-05T18:41:08+00:00

I stopped reading after you stated where you met.

She views you as a "sugar daddy." Nothing more.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2015-10-05T18:48:10+00:00

She worked as a stripper for 9 months a couple years ago and did a lot of partying during that time.

This is a huge red flag

You are beta bux

TheGreasyPole · 2015-10-05T19:09:16+00:00

Shit dude. It don't look good. I'm definitely betting against you here.

You're definitely swimming against the current here. The age gap is massive. In 10 years it's going to seem wider rather than narrower.

I can't see how she ain't going to start fucking around eventually.... When she's 34 you'll be nearing 60. At some point she's going to fuck a fellow young person, I'm pretty sure.

Not because i think she's a bad person but, fuck. That's a big age gap.

And, let's be honest, the rest of the details ain't all coming back flashing green. There's a couple in there, a couple of ambers, and a lot of red.

I'd say you've got to go in with the idea it may only be temporary... 5-10-15 years... And at some point it's going to come to an end.

You'll have to decide... Can I take the hit of the worst case scenario here, for a fun decade or so.... And anything you can do to mitigate that hit (like an LTR but no marriage) should be done.

Then you'll have to make the call.

Is it worth it, if I assume the worst will happen at some point, and she'll fuck off. If it still is...... Well, sometimes the horse sings

If it's not worth it....... How badly you want to roll the dice ?

Because, Jesus dude, you know it don't look like a good bet.

trp132 · 2015-10-05T19:59:02+00:00

We met on WhatsYourPrice[1] . I offered $25 for a date (my profile says I never offer more). She accepted, we went out, I gave her $25 and that's the last time she expected money from me.

....dude.

I pay for all our dates because she's barely keeping her head above water. She always thanks me.

I mean, this is fine sorta (you absolutely are still paying) but this makes her a plate not a LTR.

We haven't talked about "the future" that much because it's only been a month, but we are exclusive.

eeeeehhhhhh no. Nobody is exclusive after a month. Most people aren't actually exclusive until it's officially confirmed that it's exclusive. The fact that you have even considered this before she brought it up is a flag.

She wants kids someday. FOUR kids! I'm not opposed to that but am wary given my age.

You shouldn't care unless you intend on marrying her and providing those kids, in which case you're an idiot.

Wrap it up.

She's fairly close to her dad.

Well duh, why do you think she's dating you?

She worked as a stripper for 9 months a couple years ago and did a lot of partying during that time.

Fucking sex workers is fine. She sounds fun. Are you invited to these parties or is she bb?

she was not good at hustling guys for money

I beg to differ.

She never dated a customer and refused to provide "extras" beyond a lap dance.

Does she provide YOU with said extras?

She occasionally comments that she "doesn't understand women,""

RED FLAG ABORT ABORT ABORT

She's generally very affectionate with me. We have good sex but not every time we see each other. I'm personally fine with that. She pointed out something I hadn't thought of before: if you don't expect sex every time you see each other, it allows the sexual tension to build up so when you do have sex it's very passionate. That's been my experience so far.

This is right, but the way you describe it leaves me to believe that there's a lot more going on here and makes it really cringy.

should I treat her like a loaded gun? In what ways?

Wrap it up, don't give her any money, don't let her move in with you, don't be exclusive, don't get her pregnant, don't threaten her or raise your voice to her and when you have a fight have cameras everywhere.

Archwinger · 2015-10-05T21:27:01+00:00

Red Pillers and Blue Pillers are both telling you that you are being pegged as a provider.

You're older. You admit you're not "hawt." You met on a website where you buy dates, setting up the initial interaction as a sugar-daddy/escort. She's got money and family troubles, a past as a stripper/party girl, smokes pot (comorbid with a history of alcoholism), mental illness (including genes for more serious mental illness in the family.)

If you were a hot commodity who was worth a shit, you'd have your choice of women, and could plate or ignore this one. But the way you're so strongly advocating for this red-flagged-to-heck woman's good points in your post, it sounds like she's your only decent option and you're hoping to get some validation. But even blue pillers are telling you otherwise. What's that tell you?

goatismycopilot · 2015-10-05T19:33:12+00:00

I think she is temporarily attracted to you because you aren't asking much and since she has other stresses in her life the last thing she wants is a romantic partner/sex partner who creates more demands on her. You don't have much that would keep her interest over the long run.

At some piont there is a good chance your relationship will become more transactional.

CursedLemon · 2015-10-05T18:37:43+00:00

Bro, even with what is a reasonably detailed run-down, we still don't know the particulars of this woman.

The "BP" advice, though, is that ultimately neither do you when you get right down to it, and being in relationships is about trust. If you can't trust the other person, then it's not a relationship, it's a business transaction. So just ask yourself if this person is 1) able to be trusted, and 2) worth the potential risk. You're the only person who can possibly make this call...and you might be wrong.

Odds are TRP is going to come in and say you're the worst case of BB they've seen in months, so...y'know, get ready for that.

rulenumber303 · 2015-10-05T19:14:40+00:00

I would not give you advice on whether she is a good or bad person unless I'd met her personally or you provide a lot more to go on than what you have told us. You seem to like her. She's probably downplaying her party years a little... maybe not lying about her count but definitely you haven't heard it all about the scene around her job and the people who worked there and stuff she may have been on the periphery of.

LiftWellKitty · 2015-10-05T21:06:26+00:00

Positive qualities about her: genuinely loves helping people, even cantankerous old Alzheimers patients. Hard working and would always pay her own way if I let her. Has never asked me for anything. Most of our "dates" are smoking a bowl and watching football games at her place, maybe order takeout. (We live in a state where recreational marijuana is legal.)

Sounds like a lot of fun and reminds me of one of my male friends. Despite her young age, she sounds like a great person to date, if a little unambitious.

She occasionally comments that she "doesn't understand women,"" particularly how they can be passive agressive.

I have mixed feelings on women who don't like other women, and only see the negative stereotypes in them. There could be some self-hate and gender issues there. She may be too starry-eyed around males if she thinks they never get passive-aggressive.

She pointed out something I hadn't thought of before: if you don't expect sex every time you see each other, it allows the sexual tension to build up so when you do have sex it's very passionate.

Yep. That's why people who pester for sex are such a bore and end up seeming clingy.

My final assessment: You're not a cradle-robber. She's an adult woman and can make her own decisions. It's true that women keep maturing into their 20s, but she should be responsible and experienced enough to know what she's getting into. However, the thing with wanting to have a lot of kids does make her sound like she still has some growing up to do, but at least she's on her way to earning enough to pay for a family. She may end up deciding on just one or two kids after experiencing them, though.

The age difference worries me more than anything because of the experience gap, though, but as long as she's not looking at you as a sugar daddy (which it sounds like she's not), it's not necessarily an issue. People can enjoy the different perspectives brought about by age differences, and it sounds like you have enough in common to have fun. Keep getting to know each other.

If you're serious about the relationship, then definitely take it seriously that she's going to want to have at least one kid, and decide if you're ready for that. If not, well, you can still have fun together for a while if that's what she wants.

vincentninja68 · 2015-10-06T00:18:51+00:00

This goes beyond Red/Purple/Blue ideology. Where the fuck is your dignity? This chick a mess. You can do better than this.

RPmatrix · 2015-10-06T00:52:19+00:00

so many good comments ITT, to me there were only two things which are Major Red flags to me ....

she doesn't understand women

There is a chance she's either a High Functioning Austistic and sincerely doesn't 'understand' people (which fits with a few things she has said AND her knowledge of football)

OR she's BPD and lying and as Hyprerreal said " when the honeymoon phase ends in a month or so, it's going to get ugly real quick."

Here's another description of a person with BPD from a psychologists pov

she wants 4 boys -- coz she doesn't understand women?!

How many guys do you know who "don't understand guys"?

Sounds like a line she knows "guys like to hear" as it suggests and implies she's less likely to do some "dippy female shit" coz she's not really "one of them" (girls)

Unless she's HFA then it could "make sense"

Sounds to me like she's setting you up to "set her up" ... which is well within the scope of a High Functioning Sociopath aka BPD! In two years, married or not she'll get half! AND she could be pregnant with another guys kid and it still wouldn't matter ... you'll be the one who's paying!

just a few thoughts as the Devil's Advocate

take care bro

midnightvulpine · 2015-10-06T01:56:23+00:00

The girl sounds like a mixed bag overall. Were it me and I felt like you, I would take it slow. Let her show me who she is. Time reveals. A way to test her resolve is, perhaps, to focus on something positive, like kicking or reducing her pot smoking. Since it's a goal she vaguely sets for herself as well, it's a way to test her under a source of stress. Something that might be revealing if she's liable to crack under pressure.

If she succeeds and hasn't shown you something you find a deal breaker, you'll be in a better place overall.

GynaTynglez · 2015-10-06T03:24:31+00:00

Enjoy football season. Then let her go.

cxj · 2015-10-06T04:07:46+00:00

My advice is to keep banging her as long as you can ride it out because she is probably hot, but don't marry her or knock her up. You're getting laid and not spending too much so cool but dont get invested in this

99_Problem · 2015-10-05T19:13:40+00:00

I don't see you asking/answering the most important question.

What do you want?

hyperrreal · 2015-10-05T18:53:10+00:00

I'm a pretty damaged person myself, so I can relate to what this girl has gone through.

The issue here isn't a lack of attraction on her part. She probably thinks you're handsome, cute, etc. The problem is that girls with the background you described tend to be super neurotic, and when the honeymoon phase ends in a month or so, it's going to get ugly real quick.

Her relationship with her Mom is a HUGE red flag. That is such a tough thing for a child of that age to go through with. And the sex work, that dating site...doesn't add up to an emotionally well-adjusted person.

Date her if you're feeling it, but you both are going to need therapy for the relationship to work long term. Also stop paying for stuff, see how she respond.

Edit: Read this article, Haven't We Met Before, about narcissist/borderline relationships. This is what you're in for.

buartha · 2015-10-05T19:01:37+00:00

Your relationship sounds kind of like mine and my partner's. Big age gap, different socioeconomic backgrounds, I was still in education when we met, and I had a history of depression and other stuff when I met him. From my own experience, I'd say there's nothing wrong with continuing the relationship, but be aware of the extra stress that big cultural and maturity differences can add to a relationship and be prepared to deal with it; one of the big problems I see with relationships with a large age gap is that the older one isn't prepared for the fact that their partner's lack of experience means that they may end up being leant on a lot as their partner grows up, and this is only going to be exacerbated if your partner's depression relapses.

Also, you should be open with her about your expectations for the relationship. While you say that you're open the the possibility of a marriage, you don't seem enthusiastic about it, and if you plan to get more serious at any point it would be best to be honest about that.

In terms of protecting yourself, have a few low cost/ free dates and don't mention or buy anything expensive for a while. If she doesn't get antsy, you're good to go. If she does, it might be worth examining the situation more- it could be that she's just feeling neglected because she thinks it means you don't like her, but it could be a golddigger red flag.

So basically, be honest with her, be realistic about what might be expected of you emotionally and do what you can to make sure she isn't using you for your money.

buttlollipop · 2015-10-05T19:58:04+00:00

I don't think you're doing anything predatory or wrong, but I do think this is a bad idea for several reasons:

Stripper thing is just a red flag, maybe it's unfeminist of me but sorry, it is. It doesn't have to be a total dealbreaker, but given everything else...you know.
While some young women are attracted to older men, it's not a huge percentage, unless we're talking "I'll have sex with this guy because he has money" which isn't really attraction. Since money is clearly involved, I wouldn't be shocked that this is primarily transactional for her. I'm around her age, and it's rare for me to find anyone over early 30s attractive. (Not that every woman is like me, but most of my friends seem to be this way too.)
Building on that, this whole thing started with money. I know all dating is transactional in some way, but if she's on that site to begin with, she is looking for a quasi sugar baby deal. If you're up for that...fine, but I get the sense that's not your objective.
Marriages with age gaps over 9 years have a much higher divorce rate. I know you said you don't necessarily want to get married, but if you do, this one is fairly doomed not only because of age but all the other factors you mentioned.
This could be a lame assumption on my part, but her not wanting to have sex every time she sees you (IN THE BEGINNING) is another red flag that to me, reads "Not that attracted." It almost feels like she's trying to come up with snazzy excuses to get out of doing the dishes or something. I've been with the same guy for many years and I've never considered "Ooh, let's NOT have sex this time to spice things up." If you're starting that way from the get-go, things are only going to get less frequent. This makes me wonder if she actually is as sexually attracted to you as you are to her, which plays into one of my earlier points.

3dbattleship · 2015-10-05T19:17:03+00:00

You're old enough to be her dad. That's red flag enough for me to say bail.

yo_radical_one · 2015-10-05T20:34:08+00:00

TRP would call you beta bux

I do not use their words, but they are right.

I am one of the most hardworking people I know, but this is story is the sort of thing which drives me on socially, to take breaks and meet humans. Don't end up being a rich middle aged guy who is not loved.

winndixie · 2015-10-05T21:41:33+00:00

Have sex with her all you like until you get bored. Do not get into exclusive relationship. Do not buy her a ring. Do not make her exclusive. Do not give her any more money. Also, do not buy her a ring.

SmurfESmurferson · 2015-10-05T23:35:11+00:00

She occasionally comments that she "doesn't understand women,"" particularly how they can be passive agressive. She did kinda sorta shit test me at the very beginning but I haven't seen anything like that since. She also says she wants her children to be boys because she understands them better.

Huge red flag. Run away, run away!

She wants kids someday. FOUR kids! I'm not opposed to that but am wary given my age.

Be careful, she may try to pull the goalie.

Aside from that, there is some evidence that older fathers have an increased likelihood of fathering autistic kids. So, you may want to get your swimmers checked if you go down that route.

mcconnelldemasi · 2015-10-06T02:45:41+00:00

It's a no go. She has been through a lot for a 24 year old and I'm confident that there will be more in the future. Enjoy this LTR while it lasts. Don't have kids. You are too old and too settled for your low stress life.

wombatinaburrow · 2015-10-06T02:54:37+00:00

4 kids? Do you want to be walking the floor with babies, and dealing with toddlers in your fifties? Or dealing with teenagers into your 70s?

betterdeadthanbeta · 2015-10-06T04:44:43+00:00

So RPers, BPers, PPers - what do you think I should do going forward?

Keep fucking but don't expect love/a decent marriage to come out of this. Good chance she's in it for the money, or you're just a filler fuck buddy until someone younger and more gullible comes along.

However, for now enjoy the ride. Sounds like you're getting decent action for minimal investment, nothing to be ashamed of there.

If she's not pressing for exclusivity, I would keep looking for a woman with less red flags (the way you met is a huge one).

Bekazzled · 2015-10-06T05:16:40+00:00

Blue pill opinion - she sounds fine. You're describing her traits, but the interesting thing I noticed is you don't really describe how you feel about her. It sounds like someone ticking off a list, which I guess you have to do to get your point across on reddit. But do you just like her and like hanging out with her, or want to end up with her in the long-term? Either is fine, and I think it'll organically become clear to you which way you want to go.

You're doing fine. Not playing with a loaded gun. Sounds like you're considering the long-game but OK with it just playing out how it goes. That is, you're not "ga-ga" over her. That's fine and it's smart to recognize you're into her but still have your own perspective to consider too.

By the way I think the age difference means nothing, except for the pressure of kids if you want to go that way with her - but yes it's totally possible she's 100% attracted to late-40s you. Indeed it's pretty much fact, since she's dating you. A lot of women like older men.

The only cautious note - having kids changes EVERYTHING. If you're not someone who wants to have a massive brood NOW or later on, you probably won't suddenly fall in love with the idea once the babies come out. Four kids is too much in my opinion. Then again, you don't have to have four kids with this woman...

Just enjoy it.

And PS: haven't read all the certain red pill comments about her being a stripper years ago, but no, that doesn't matter. Consider that every single person putting you or your girlfriend down on this sub is conveniently not highlighting their own personal flaws. As a red piller said to me the other day, "People in real life would have no idea what I'm really like on these boards. They have no idea. They think I'm fun to be around." Everyone has flaws, and anyone telling you that you're doing "everything wrong" isn't a God. They're a human with faults.

So I wouldn't take too much negative advice from people who are pretending to be something they're not (Red Pill) to get sex. You're talking about a relationship, which isn't just about sex. Moreover, some men may be jealous of you - you're getting sex without pretending. So it'll be easy for people to jealously degrade you rather than see it in a clear light.

relationshipdownvote · 2015-10-06T16:16:46+00:00

working her way through nursing school

used to be stripper

Come on OP, that's the oldest one in the book.

PemBayliss · 2015-10-05T19:15:39+00:00

You should have fun with her. Do not commit to her at all. Do not offer any sort of commitment. Date other women.

Rule: Never, ever offer commitment to anyone who did any sort of sex work, EVER (stripping, porn, prostitution, nude modeling). EVER.

She has issues and pathologies you can't even DREAM of right now.

gavinok · 2015-10-05T21:09:06+00:00

In my opinion, this girl has the possibility of being good LTR material, given some plus flags showing( Nursing, compassionate to older people). However, I think the BEST way to test if she is possible LTR material is to find answers to these questions:

Does she ever think about, or wish to go back to the party life/stripper life she once had?
Can she feel happy/content doing activities that involve no alcohol/drugs/sex? Such as crafting hobbies, music, watching TV, etc.

Typically, there is a narrative with these types of girls. They have a wild party life while young, usually engaging in stripper/sex work. Then, they enter an LTR later on, and have kids. But when this happens, they start to miss the wild nights they used to have. They can't be satisfied with watching Barney with the kids and a night at home. They don't like having family responsibilities, and they have trouble being happy or content without the use of substances or hooking up. So what happens is one night, these women go back to see their old friends from the party world, take drugs, get drunk, hook up, and end up dead or re-enter that party world.

I think your job with her would be to find the answers to those two questions. You need to test her a little and see if she ever dreams about going back to the party world.

17b29a · 2015-10-05T19:45:00+00:00

I would marry her

InformalCriticism · 2015-10-05T19:30:40+00:00

Keep looking elsewhere, but don't deny yourself the relationship you've built if you don't feel like leaving it - sounds like you've kept an even keel for the most part (in spite of some colored flags). Basically, if you wait too long and this doesn't pan out, you may actually be too old to pull anyone of similar quality.

Just ask yourself some hard-hitting "what if" worst-case scenarios to get yourself in a mental place to move forward.

fruitenvrac · 2015-10-05T19:36:24+00:00

Hmmmm. I'm gonna answer this before reading everyone else's answers.

Two main things stick out for me:

You've only known each other for a month. In no way is this enough time to get a good read on another person (if one is considering this other person for LTR/marriage). I'd say at least six months here and preferably a couple of years. So, given that, I would take all advice with a grain of salt. You still have a lot to learn about this woman.
Mental health issues. That's a big deal. It's not, imo, an automatic dealbreaker, but it's something that you would need to make sure, together, you were prepared to deal with if something flared up for either of you.

As for the rest of it, the tattoos, the stripper for 9 months thing, I (unlike RP) don't think either of these things means she's a bad relationship prospect. Once you get to know her better, you'll have a better handle on who she is, and that info will be more valuable/accurate than the fact of her tattoos/sex work.

I met my ex at her age and he was your age. We were together for 5 years. The age difference wasn't a thing for us and it's not the reason the relationship ended. Not saying age differences never cause problems but it really didn't for us.

wtknight · 2015-10-05T19:38:34+00:00

It sounds to me like she had an adventurous life in the past and she would now like to settle down with someone more stable and older but who is not a complete bore. I don't think it's out of the question she could genuinely be attracted to you as many women do prefer older men despite the fact that younger men look better. She is old enough that I don't think you're a cradle robber, but I'm pretty relaxed when it comes to my perception of age differences in relationships as long as she is older than the age of majority. Other non-Red Pillers may feel differently, though.

Many Red Pillers will probably say she's an alpha widow but I believe NAWALT and there's a decent chance that she's not going to want to go back to her partying lifestyle and that she'll stick with you, but it's something that you might want to look out for as it sounds like she was pretty heavily into it for a while. Unlike TRP, I don't believe being part of that lifestyle hurts your ability to eventually form a pair bond.

The four kids thing is the biggest red flag to me, of course, being as you are middle-aged. I hope that she is joking or willing to compromise when it comes to that if you guys get more serious about a lifelong relationship.

rapunzelly · 2015-10-05T20:44:58+00:00

Hmm, lots of flags of different colors in your post. I would say since you seem to like her to proceed but very slowly and with caution. Since she wants kids, if and when you decide you don't want them with her, then tell her asap so you don't steal years of her life. Otherwise, have fun and don't get your mind get clouded too much by the sex.

AbrasiveAsshole · 2015-10-06T00:07:00+00:00

Sounds like oneitis, to me.

A very, very dangerous oneitis.

Seriously, OP.

bromance946 · 2015-10-05T19:22:48+00:00

Wow, you seem really lucky.

If she went on multiple dates with you without asking for money, I'd say she's genuinely interested in you.

How far have you guys gotten, though? Has she had sex with you?

alreadyredschool · 2015-10-05T19:42:23+00:00

I would start to lift and get more income, I also would find another hot girl that I want to have a relationship with, preferably one who didn't work as a stripper.

wuboo · 2015-10-05T20:08:52+00:00

Red flags everywhere.

ReddishBlack · 2015-10-05T20:23:14+00:00

She's generally very affectionate with me. We have good sex but not every time we see each other. I'm personally fine with that. She pointed out something I hadn't thought of before: if you don't expect sex every time you see each other, it allows the sexual tension to build up so when you do have sex it's very passionate. That's been my experience so far.

H E R P E S

What seems to be the problem?

ThirdEyeSqueegeed · 2015-10-05T21:32:28+00:00

I think you should tread carefully. She sounds like a nice girl to have a short term relationship with but, as others have pointed out, there's a few red flags there.

I really doubt we'll get married and have kids, but I'm still open to the possibility.

By the sounds of it she does want kids, so you'll have to make a decision on that at some point. Do you want to have kids yourself?

theskepticalidealist · 2015-10-05T23:03:59+00:00

We met on WhatsYourPrice[1] .

.... -_-

Also just read your "shit test" comment. Whoooooooooo. From my standpoint you're asking for trouble. And she's already talking about kids? I hope you make sure you're being "safe" as much as possible.

turbosympathique · 2015-10-06T17:44:29+00:00

Just enjoy it while the ride last.

grendalor · 2015-10-07T12:15:09+00:00

Sounds like she's good for fun, but not someone you want to think about marrying, to be honest. Too many red flags for that.

FatGirlsInPartyHats · 2015-10-05T20:21:28+00:00

Stripper, mental health issues, can't identify with people of her own gender, tons of tattoos (yes I believe this is a red flag) and WHERE YOU FUCKING MET are all MASSIVE red flags. A person's past is the ONLY fact-based indicator to predict their future. If you genuinely sat down, drew Pros and Cons with a line down the middle and were honest the cons of this relationship are way outnumbering the pros. It doesn't make her a bad person, it just makes her undateable... or it makes you extremely low value.

Edit: More importantly, would you want your son to date an ex-stripper with substance abuse problems that he had to pay to even meet in the first place?

statsfodder · 2015-10-05T23:37:01+00:00

Have read the OP, read the replies and then OPs replies... wow dude you are delusional and are seeking "permission" from the internet to do what almost 100% of these posts are telling you not to do!.

Drugs... especially something "soft" like weed with the promise of "I'll be clean before i have kids", it won't happen that is a lifelong stoner you got there.

Depression... weed, drugs, alcohol, stripper, fucks for cash. Do i really need to go on?

Look bud, you are a sugar daddy that when the novelty wears off you will be paying more and fucking less... there will be an oops I'm pregnant moment (probably won't even be yours) and then that is it you will be the ATM. You are her ticket to a better life, not the end destination but the transport.

GASTON_TONNERRECOQ · 2015-10-06T00:25:48+00:00

Her birth mother is literally schizophrenic

Many mental health issues don't present themselves until later in life and reproducing with this woman could produce a child with said issues even if she doesn't have/develop them. I don't personally find a family history of mental illness to be a dealbreaker, but if you want LTR and children I would strongly urge you to consider what that may entail for you in the future.

Otherwise, nice plate, sugar daddy.

[deleted] · 2015-10-06T01:20:18+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	What would YOU do?
Author	pickup_sticks
Upvotes	16
Comments	190
Date	October 5, 2015 6:31 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3nlsq9/what_would_you_do/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-would-you-do.279240 https://theredarchive.com/post/279240

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