Yes, men do leave the market

redpilldude · 2014-09-17T21:51:04+00:00

I'm 31, and I can comment a bit about what it's like for a 30-year-old man to date.

A lot of single women who are in their 30s are divorced and have kids. If you want to date a woman who has young kids, by all means, proceed. But, I've done it before, and I won't do it again. There is just too much drama. When kids are involved, it's like dating on hard mode. The women are very upfront about the fact that they are looking to remarry and soon. So, they expect commitment right away.

Then, there are the women who have never married. These are the career-driven work-a-holics who have almost nothing to offer besides their career. They are almost always Type A personalities. They are aggressive in relationships, and not laid back.

Now, there might be a very small percentage of 30-year-old women who don't fit in these 2 groups, but 99% of women will fall into these 2 groups. Neither of them appeal to me.

What does appeal to me is a young, 18-22 year-old who is kinder, carefree, less jaded, and better looking.

Now, am I an asshole for preferring 18-22 year-old women? Probably. Do I care what other people think about my preferences? Absolutely not.

metallica11 · 2014-09-17T19:00:00+00:00

What is so perturbs me the most about the author's experience is the fact that it is so incredibly obvious (after taking the red pill) that these women in these dance classes that supposedly could not find any single men really meant "I cannot find a single guy that is GOOD enough for me", which is usually a guy that is a 2-3 points higher than her. This canned statement is pervasive amongst the women of the 20-30 some hip urban culture and means the same thing - that these women are rejecting a vast majority of men (A lot of them that would be considered equally matched to them or even slightly above) from what they considered to be "single guys". Single guys to them means men of high SMV.

The most eye opening thing you can do is go to a bar with some single girls in their mid to late 20's whose friends are mostly married and listen to them complain incessantly about how "there are no single guys", and then watch them reject 99% of the guys who approach them that night at the bar, some of them creepers, but some of them actually decent looking confident men.

rmwj1956 · 2014-09-17T21:02:02+00:00

When women ask me, "Where are all the men?" I tell them, right where you left them, back in your twenties.

scamper_22 · 2014-09-17T18:25:26+00:00

it does come as a shock to women, but believe it or not, people don't do things with little or no benefit to them.

Women naturally assume men should want them. But it's just not worth it.

Career women = no real benefit. You go to work, then have to work even harder at home, and you both 'feel' entitled to be 'taken care of'.

house wife = not much respect

In both cases, it is expected for you as the man to do all kinds of stuff you don't really like to do be it dance class, playing tag along with her friends...

So why bother, I'd much rather do things I would like to do, and there's always a girl around for sexual things on my own terms.

CornyHoosier · 2014-09-17T22:01:02+00:00

Women at a dance class are asking where the men are? If ladies want to find men, allow me to point them out: Working, bars, sports. These areas are literally overflowing with men.

As we all know here, what these women mean are, "Where are all the good-looking, well-off men?"

kindlebluemoon · 2014-09-17T21:13:21+00:00

The game simply isn't worth playing unless you're in the top 10-20% of guys.

No man wants, or should want, to be "husband material." Do your best to make it into the top tier of men, and if you can't make it, have the self-respect to refuse to settle for being a provider.

Merica911 · 2014-09-17T20:53:00+00:00

That article was from 6 years ago.. And I hate to say in 2014 this couldn't be more true.

Prattler26 · 2014-09-17T22:36:37+00:00

Men desire 16-26 year old women. If they've consistently failed to attract them for their whole life, it's better to MGTOW than settle for a post-wall woman.

Granted, there are unicorns somewhere, but the chances are so low, you'd be better off playing Russian roulette than waste time dating post-walls.

some12talk2 · 2014-09-17T16:36:34+00:00

lots of great stuff in the comments, such as

once I stopped caring about women and started doing things which I actually enjoyed, I ended up meeting women who were a hell of a lot more interesting

4io8 · 2014-09-17T22:18:13+00:00

As I get older i have found this to be so true. Have not dated in ages now and dont feel I am missing anything. Last girl I dated was the most attractive girl I had ever been with. And was outgoing, had lots of good traits.

But the amount of work it required to be with her. And the constant testing. And the games her head would play. Nothing serious or mean. It was just obvious that sub consciously she was trying to find a man to look after her. At some point I just realised that despite how great she was, I just have better things to do with my time than be a hot girl's boyfriend.

2014-09-17T16:45:17+00:00

Badger Hut: Guys Opting out of the Game

I can only speak for my environment, which is more or less college-educated white-collar urban professionals, but I’m noticing a sort of fatalism among guys my age and below. It’s like they have just taken socializing with women – in a romantic context at least – off the list of things they do.

... The social skills for interacting with the opposite sex in a productive manner are just not being taught to the new generation – it’s been replaced with a lot of “just be yourself” bullshit – and the structures to funnel good dating prospects between the sexes don’t exist – they’ve been replaced with turbo-charged meat markets where sex is on the table from the word go.

Young men today have a tactical problem and a moral problem when it comes to meeting girls. They just flat-out don’t know how to do it, and they don’t know if they should want to.

The skills weren’t being trained when I was young for sure, and we’re seeing the fruits of it. I grew up in the era where the active, forward nature of male sexuality itself was criminalized from youth onward. This caused a great period of questioning for many young men who were not born with the charm that makes it OK to be a sexual man. The sexual marketplace is in the thick of a divergence, with attractive naturals getting the lion’s share of women’s attention from a very young age, and the rest of them falling further and further behind as the old expectations of mutual commitment are torn apart and the scene goes fully feral.

Ryohazukisan · 2014-09-17T21:51:17+00:00

Guys are always at work, or at home, or with friends. Where are men and women supposed to meet? Clubs have their own taboos, and don't count.

The author is right, men will not even try the dance class or social events, because we know how standoffish women act. Women don't look very approachable, and indicators of interest are often VERY subtle.

Men just got tired of going out time after time, and coming back empty handed. So guys stopped going out.

hermit087 · 2014-09-17T22:49:41+00:00

First comment:

"To your otherwise fine analysis I would add only that men also probably derive less utility from a failed attempt at meeting women than women do at a failed attempt at meeting men. Women attempting to meet men are on average probably more likely than men to do something they would otherwise enjoy, i.e. your dance class.

Men attempting to meet women, on the other hand, are expected to do things generally less appealing to them ."

This is good explanation. A woman goes to a social event will enjoy herself whether she gets a guy or not, partially just because of the attention, and partially just because she knows she could hook up if she wanted to.

If a man goes to social events and does not have the requisite SMV, he will eventually realize he is just a piece of furniture, and serves no purpose other than to make the experience better for women without getting anything in return. For men, whether or not they can hook up really does effect how much they enjoy themselves.

DarkSayed · 2014-09-17T22:14:24+00:00

This article absolutely nails it.

Next time someone asks me why I am not interesting in having a relationship, I can show them this.

I'm out of the game I can honestly say I have never been so content.

mainst · 2014-09-17T21:02:12+00:00

"Where are all the guys?"

Is short-form for : "Where are all the guys I deserve because-I-have-so-much-to-offer"

Gami_Lon · 2014-09-17T23:12:54+00:00

"Sarah sometimes has one-night stands with men she meets in bars, but she says sex is not a priority, either. "I often get asked out by married men in the office who want an affair. They assume I'm desperate because I'm single." She grimaces, then shrugs. "Too much trouble."

That's the word I hear both sexes use most often when they talk about their relationship phobia. Romantic commitment seems to represent burden and drudgery, from the exorbitant costs of buying property to the uncertain expectations of a spouse and in-laws."

Okay, I changed the names in that paragraph. That article isn't about America, it's about Japan. It's titled "Why have young people in Japan stopped having sex."

This is basically the path that feminism has put us on. It's programmed our teenage girls that men are racist rapists and are not to be trusted. It's made teenage boys fear women. Relationships are now "too much trouble." We don't normally get into race here on TRP, but there's definitely a racial aspect. Everyone I know who ISN'T privileged and white accepts that feminism is complete silliness. The Hispanic community in particular has clung to what made America great.

neveragoodtime · 2014-09-17T21:49:41+00:00

Women really don't realize how expensive it is for men to remain in the dating scene. Why do I have to buy some girl I barely know dinner, when she will probably even throw it in my face and tell me just because I paid for dinner doesn't mean she'll sleep with me. If a girl bought me dinner no doubt I'd put out. If I didn't want to, then I'd insist on splitting the check. See how easy taking responsibility and treating people fairly is?

$50 for two hours of awkwardness with this girl, or $100 for one hour of sex?

RedPillSafe · 2014-09-18T01:52:35+00:00

I like dancing because of the physical contact. You really get a pretty complete feel of a woman when you dance with her. After switching between 5-10 women you will have a favorite too. Some do not follow well. (bad) Some pick up on your moves a little too well then start to lead slightly. (bad) The best follow with just a slight hint of resistance so you feel like you are commanding her to move, but she is not resisting too much or clueless. Given the choice of a girlfriend 7 days a week or 7 women to dance with once a week I'll take the seven. Dance polygamy.

garlicextract · 2014-09-17T17:15:16+00:00

Interesting parallels so the Japanese "Herbivore Men"

Floridaisondrugs · 2014-09-17T23:04:30+00:00

I think what may scare women (if this trend even bothers them) is that if men are just analyzing risk and reward, and coming to the conclusion of dropping out of the market and doing other worthwhile things, then women may have to consider doing the same thing. Especially the ugly ones. Because they're not going to be beating out hotter girls for the alphas they want, and their beta bucks are dropping out of the game. Instead they prefer to hamster themselves into the possibility that someone is out there.

Although I really don't see how this is an acutal problem for men or women. Men get to take the pussy off the pedestal, and find other ways to make themselves happy, and women have less "creeps, loners, virgin neckbeards" trying to hit on them.

HalfAsianBob · 2014-09-18T13:05:31+00:00

When I was younger and thought I was hot shit because I'm tall and look pretty white, I got involved with a bunch of women who came onto me. Combined with the fact that they all bailed almost immediately when i said I wanted to be in a relationship or got cuddly with them, it became clear to me that woman want one thing, they know what the want and nothing can convince them otherwise. They have no problems finding men, but the problem is that the portion of men who fit their physical requirements is very very slim, especially because it's women of color competing with white women for the slim portion of tall handsome white guys.

Anyways, I wonder if Japan is the way it is because the guys look at the yellow cabs and are like, fuck it, why even try if we're not what women want. I looked at my own mother recently and saw how she pretty much wanted a tall white guy, no questions asked. Made me lose steam hard. Working hard, contributing to society is meaningless if life just boils down to women really only wanting the top 10% PHYSICAL characteristics.

It's just not worth even trying. To be honest the only reason im still alive is because I unwittingly used my white privilege to get a Chinese wife (who actually likes Chinese guys too), but as far as a pretty, easily manageable woman goes, she was the first one who actually wanted to have a relationship, and knowing how lonely I was when I met her I just went with it. She treats me great. Short of that I really am two steps away from taking pills and booze and calling it a day. The world doesn't deserve my, or that of other smart men, to contribute to it.

If that's what women want, just give it to them.

Either way it's almost better to be dead than to be a slave to the alphas and their harems, but the only thing better than being dead is to try to enjoy the small things in life on your own terms. My only concern is that once people wake up en masse it will be harder to enjoy shit because men will stop creating in general.

Wargame4life · 2014-09-17T21:50:43+00:00

It doesn't really take a genius to work out that if the genders have approximately the same numbers of men and women over the same age ranges (which they roughly do, excluding old age) for every 50 year old man chasing a 30 year old woman leaves a 50 year old woman without a partner.

The market is such that supply is equal to demand overall (population is 50:50) but actually what happens is women in their prime years are coveted by lots of men and young men tend to lose out to older men who have more capital life experience and value, but out of their prime obviously it has to reverse and men are in demand since the older men who would partner with older women are chasing younger girls.

I.e with equal numbers its unavoidable to have a surplus in one age group and not have a shortfall in another, what you borrow gets repaid.

datass86 · 2014-09-18T00:53:47+00:00

women like "hot" guys, that's all it is. (And that has nothing to do with personality, unless you are a complete creep) Some combination of height, being white, being in shape, nice hair, nice eyes, deep voice, clean tanned skin, etc.

An attractive guy knows he is attractive from a young age and thus grows up confident. Once he hits his 20s, he knows he can easily say any stupid shit to a girl and get her attracted as long as she is sexually available. look at this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAMBeiJGLbA

What am I supposed to learn from this guy? Yeah he gets a ton of ass but can I do what he does? He says those things and he's "funny". I say those things and I'm a creep. Sure I can get in shape but will that change the fact that I'm extremely hairy and bald? I don't buy the whole "women don't care about those things". In a social setting like a bar or club, 100% of the time I will be the hairiest+baldest dude there. I approach a cute girl, there are going to be other men vying for her attention that don't have these genetic flaws that I do. Maybe I get lucky and she's attracted to hairy bald dudes. But am I willing to get rejected for 5 days in a row until I bag that one girl? Or would I rather pay $300 and fuck a 10....or would I rather just jerk off and play my ps4. Each have their own pros and cons. I crave women badly but Sun Tzu taught me never to go into a losing battle.

kingofpoplives · 2014-09-18T00:14:41+00:00

We are now starting to see all the important social roles imposed by the institution of marriage, now that it's been taken away.

Without that contract that turns sexual pairing into a tribal partnership, it's a better deal for men to take the easy sex they can get and MGTOW as they get older.

Men don't intrinsically like being providers, and without social pressure to confine sex to marriage, they will opt out of provisioning, which amounts to the building of society.

the_irish_kid123 · 2014-09-18T05:52:23+00:00

Another post this author has wrote was called "Sinking the Men of the Yamamoto." Worth the read if you're interested.

http://captaincapitalism.blogspot.com/2012/05/sinking-men-of-yamato.html

billsmashole · 2014-09-18T02:17:49+00:00

Wow I love this article. Burned out is exactly how I feel. I just don't feel like dealing with women and I'm not gay, so avoidance is my only option. Until I can muster enough give a shit to want to date, I just stay in.

chillmonkey88 · 2014-09-18T02:31:20+00:00

Speaking as a 27 year old with many many good friends with high smv and mostly single. The census is there's no point to look for a relationship. With the economy the way it is and how risky commitment can be financially for them. They look for sex and that's it. 3 are married to high school sweethearts. They're wives have been apart of our group for a while now as well and actually promote the single ones staying single. Kids cost too much (I'm a single dad and have been told "I couldn't do what you do, it costs too much" many times). Marriage is Russian roulette. And women today 25+ years and older are hard to deal with because they expect commitment upon "hello, I'm chillmonkey would you like to dance?". So we get month-in-month-single relationships. Typically we find really well off women 21-24 yo with a good career ahead of them. Have fun together and break up before it gets stale or too serious. Some longer some shorter obviously.

watersign · 2014-09-18T04:02:53+00:00

So true. I know alot of MGTOWs and married people. I fall somewhere in between. I don't waste time running game on girls but I do manage to bang some, but they aren't relationships at all.

ruskeeblue · 2014-09-18T06:56:28+00:00

Divorce and child support to a non working mom. Whats wrong with sharing expenses? Both made a child but only one gets to keep the child, the other pays through this nose.

clear_lights · 2014-09-18T06:58:25+00:00

This is so true. I've witnessed this firsthand after realizing the type of shit all my friends have dealt with these past years. One has divorced, one is in the process of. The others have had their GFs cheat on them. Another one is currently dating. One common connection? More than half of them are leaving the market for good.

I always thought they were joking back then when they were busting my balls about my fiancée. My friends tell me all the time how I pretty much hit the jackpot with her. And I never realized how lucky I was until we graduated and we moved in together. She is pretty much your bread-and-butter red pill woman.

I think it's safe to say that if you don't find your unicorn within 10 years of you entering, you might as well leave the market.

GiveMeABreak25 · 2014-09-18T02:18:32+00:00

I find it very amusing that anyone thinks this exact process doesn't happen for women. Not every woman is taking dance class hoping to score a man (???!!). We quit too for all the same reasons. This is not gender specific.

TheObelisk · 2014-09-18T02:58:02+00:00

Usually i find a lot of TRP comment sections to be abhorrent and abrasive. But there is wisdom in what i'm reading here and i'm grateful.

ejpusa · 2014-09-18T02:05:06+00:00

Yipes. I may actually agree with something in /redpill.

But in the end, it's also kind of sad too. Like maybe more then a little sad. Hanging out with another person you can usually learn something new, like hey you've been to Bali? Wow, how was that, etc. Here it seems that chance is just gone now. Like maybe life is a little less interesting.

updock · 2014-09-18T00:34:15+00:00

"If you go out, hot as you may be when you're 18, you have little to no control over succeeding in getting a girl's number or a date. And as experience will tell you it's a 1/20 shot you will succeed, and that's assuming you have good game."

That's ludicrous. The other day there was a homeless man on the front page whose hit rate is nearly 100%. Your level of game dictates your success rate, not a random 20 sided die.

Atavisionary · 2014-09-17T15:59:43+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Hathor_ · 2014-09-18T00:56:35+00:00

MRA's getting mad over petty shit. So typical.

Title	Yes, men do leave the market
Author	Atavisionary
Upvotes	330
Comments	233
Date	September 17, 2014 3:53 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2go3s7/yes_men_do_leave_the_market/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/yes-men-do-leave-the-market.228093 https://theredarchive.com/post/228093

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