Love and sex is so tied to individuals that you cannot debate it within a societal context

VenusNoire_ · 2026-05-29T17:51:39+00:00

Love and dating is not a meritocracy and it is not meant to be non-discriminatory or fair. You can’t, like, debate your way into convincing people to be with you. I feel like most well adjusted people understand and accept this.

pico-sooooo · 2026-05-29T17:36:24+00:00

I think there is nothing draconian or dystopian about encouraging people to value content of character more highly than big tits or a trust fund.

My pops always said “it’s a tool not a toy” and “think with the right brain”

I never felt oppressed it was just pretty wholesome advice.

70sJungleBush · 2026-05-29T17:24:33+00:00

No. Completely disagree.

You can definitely hold an opinion of what people should be doing without advocating force be used to compel them.

Routine-Present-3676 · 2026-05-30T01:04:59+00:00

I don't know dude. You can debate pretty much anything if you're enough of an asshole to argue a morally reprehensible position.

That being said, I'm of the opinion that anyone arguing against consent and bodily autonomy needs to be put down for the betterment of society. There's not much to discuss past that point and I'll walk away from the conversation hoping they don't cause someone irreparable damage one day.

AutisticRats · 2026-05-30T02:35:13+00:00

Most people I've had sex with were outside the context of a relationship. I am also happy to have a sexless relationship, even a sexless marriage. I don't see how sex and relationships have to be coupled together.

I do agree sex and consent go hand in hand, as do relationships and consent.

Many scientists estimate the ideal population of the Earth is between 2 to 4 billion people. We are well over that already, so there is no reason we should feel a societal need to reproduce. If the world population dipped under 1 billion, then perhaps that may be the case, but until then we are far from having even the slightest societal pressure.

If the total population of humans were 50, there would be tremendous societal pressure to reproduce. People would likely be threatened harm if they didn't reproduce. We are so far from that type of dystopia, and men just use the need to reproduce for the sake of society as an ineffective way to pressure women.

Shenlongeltigre · 2026-05-29T17:28:36+00:00

Is any and every use of incentives iindistinguishable from force?

sincerityappreciator · 2026-05-29T17:20:44+00:00

indeed forcing people to do things is a non starter, but the issues of loneliness and sexual frustration are socially relevant. IMO prostitution as a controlled, well regulated socialised welfare/healthcare service for lonely men would be a nice start. eventually, sex/companion robots could replace these bandaids more effectively.

These-Purpose-7019 · 2026-05-30T02:19:12+00:00

Of course you can debate it, you just cant force people to do anything about it.

I think the problem is, and why I think this is more of an liberal issue, is that implications of why youre attracted to who attracted to. Using your example of women going after the "wrong" men. Feminists here and on social media in general like to moralize dating advice to get men to support feminism, claiming misogyny stops men from getting dates. Women who flock to men like tate, clav, and others in that circle disrupt that narrative.

Social justice has limits that liberals have yet come to accept. Attraction isnt 100 nature, but it also doesnt care about fairness either.

AndyCat9 · 2026-05-29T17:38:07+00:00

I get what you're getting at, but love and sex shape family structures, public health, population dynamics, and cultural norms; I think this makes it so society inherently has a stake in them.

But should people stop judging me for who I sleep with? Yes. Yes they should. 🥲

AutoModerator · 2026-05-29T17:17:15+00:00

Attention!

You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
For "Debate" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
OP you can choose your own flair according to these guidelines., just press Flair under your post!

Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

AutoModerator · 2026-05-29T17:17:15+00:00

Hi OP,

You've chosen to identify your thread as a Debate. As such you are expected to actively engage in your own thread with a mind open to being changed. PPD has guidelines for what that involves.

OPs author must genuinely hold the position and you must be open to having your view challenged.

An unwillingness to debate in good faith may be inferred from one or several of the following:

Ignoring the main point of a comment, especially to point out some minor inconsistency;

Refusing to make concessions that an alternate view has merit;

Focusing only on the weaker arguments;

Only having discussions with users who agree with your position.

Failure to keep to this higher standard (we only apply to Debate OPs) may result in deletion of the whole thread.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

Robot_Alchemist · 2026-05-30T10:12:11+00:00

What are you talking about

BobtheArcher2018 · 2026-05-30T12:36:36+00:00

This is all wrong and not how human societies work. Societies have certain needs from the mating market's aggregate results. These needs must be met. Period. This trumps all other considerations. Rights come from a functional society that can keep up with others. If you want to make absolute reproductive freedom your overriding principal you need to find a way to do that while having a high enough birthrate, stable enough families, not too many people opting out of family formation, etc. No society is going to actively choose societal nihilism when it comes down to it.

El_Tigrex · 2026-05-30T22:30:50+00:00

Great so you’ll remove the tax benefits from marriage and all forms of socialized childcare? Maybe even the laws related to dating and sex. Every woman I’ve talked to on here who claims to be “hyper individualist” is always willing to die on the hill that you’re not allowed to let children starve

Fine-Double6335 · 2026-05-29T17:34:15+00:00

I personally agree but for most of history this has not been the case. Many marriages in the upper class (ie nobility and royalty) had to marry “for the greater good” which is more “for family wealth and prestige”. Royalty had even less choice since it was a matter of national security. No choice was really given, at most you had 3-4 suitors from inbred houses.

Peasants generally had the freedom to marry for love, but they were peasants/serfs. You know not the cream of the crop. The only thing required of them “for the greater good” is to have kids. And lots of them.

If you look at it historically both sexes have it way better

Outside_Memory5703 · 2026-05-29T17:39:14+00:00

Nope. Money talks. As does status

Logos1789 · 2026-05-29T17:43:00+00:00

[DISAGREE]

Even though it makes women uncomfortable to discuss the negative impact on society that some people’s choices have, that doesn’t invalidate those discussions.

I can absolutely, correctly point out that it’s harmful to society for there to be significant portions of 18-25 men who, at the peak of their ability and willingness to harm society with violence and other crime, are unable to get the women they desire to consent to sex and relationships with them.

Even though there isn’t a solution to this issue which doesn’t violate women’s autonomy and legal rights, it’s still a valid observation to make.

Women don’t get to ignore and erase the dissatisfaction of those men for women’s comfort.

Women need to sit there like the intelligent, educated, informed, knowledgeable people that they are, and accept the cognitive dissonance.

Society owes these men who the implicit social contract has failed, acknowledgment of that reality.

If women fear the consequences of acknowledging and discussing these things, then they should vote to bolster intelligence agencies, law enforcement, and the judicial system to handle the potential fallout.

They don’t get to lie and gaslight their way to the false impression of a safer society for women.

AmicusStyli · 2026-05-29T18:52:29+00:00

We already have a society that ignores individual consent and forces societal norms in the context of dating, that's the whole problem. I'm not free to date who and how I want in a society that indoctrinated me and everyone around me into sexist dating norms from the time we were children.

lesliecarbone · 2026-05-29T17:54:22+00:00

Personal behavior often has societal consequences,
and it's irresponsible not to discuss them.

Barely-moral · 2026-05-29T17:43:16+00:00

Love and sex is so tied to individuals that you cannot debate it within a societal context

We can

Consent is the absolute top of the pyramid as far as sex and relationships and love is concerned.

Sure.

Sex and relationships are two people choosing wilfully to engage in those things.

Sure.

Sex and love is not a resource.

Wrong. It is a resource and more importantly, part of an incentive structure.

There is no “for the greater good” context or “societal” context that you can frame relationship dynamics in.

Yes. There is. I will give a. Example later.

Just because the people involved in relationships and sex live in and are a part of society does not mean that the acts of love and sex are therefore bound to society.

They kinda are. I will give an example later.

If somebody does’t want to have sex with somebody, or love somebody, THAT’S IT. That’s where it ends.

Oh no. That creates an incentive structure and that incentive structure shapes the society. Example later.

There is no “yes an individual should never be forced to, but as a society we really should…”

There is. Example later.

Nope. Unless you can specify to me specifically how you can uncouple sex, relationships and consent, which you can’t, then those things are not to be discussed within a moral, practical framework because it’s impossible to do so without violating the idea of consent. Because EVERY individual has to give consent, therefore it applies to everyone. And if it applies to everyone individually within society, then it applies to societal context as a whole.

I don't need to uncouple sex, relationships and consent. Example later.

Ignoring individual consent is like discussing a societal issue but disregarding the idea that people need to breathe oxygen.

I don't need to ignore individual consent. Example later.

You get people saying “nobody is against consent and nobody thinks people should be forced to sleep with or love people they don’t want to BUT, society is failing because women love the wrong men.”

No. You stop the sentence before the BUT. Regardless of the “issue” because it’s impossible to address what follows without violating consent.

It is not.

Now about the example.

In the following example I am going to focus in a number that speaks about a percentage of the population and in an act that most people would consider evil.

For the sake of argument the percentage will be high and the evil would be ridiculously evil. The principle remains there even if we change the percentage to something more reasonable and the evil to something less extreme and merely questionable.

If you focus in the particular percentage and the particular evil instead of the principle then you missed the point.

Example

In this society 80% of women using their freedom to consent and consent being first and above all other things decide that the only men they will have relationships with, sex with and kids with are men that can prove to them that they went after a homeless person and kicked them as hard as they can. The more times you did that the more chances you have to get consent from them.

You can't prove that? Then there is no consent. No relationship. No sex. No relationships. No kids.

That creates an incentive structure. Men that want to have any of those will have to do that or fake it in a way that is really convincing.

The society that grows from that incentive structure is let's say unkind towards homeless people.

That means that things escalated a lot from merely individual consent.

How can we deal with such situations without decoupling sex and relationships from consent?

Simple, another incentive structure. Let's say 100% of the men and the 20% of the women that don't share that view band together to do everything that is legally possible to make the life of a woman with such standards a living hell.

Now those women have a choice, consent to having relationships with people that don't kick homeless people or live a living hell.

That incentive structure creates a society in which homeless people don't get kicked as much.

If you focus in the particular percentage and the particular evil instead of the principle then you missed the point.

gtbreddit1 · 2026-05-29T19:27:25+00:00

Love and sex have societal consequences whether you like it or not.

Love and sex is so tied to individuals that you cannot debate it within a societal context

Comments

Sex slavery in legalised European countries

THOUSANDS OF WOMEN IN THE NETHERLANDS ARE VICTIMS OF HUMAN TRAFFICKING.

FROM EASTERN EUROPE TO THE RED LIGHT DISTRICT IN AMSTERDAM

HUMAN TRAFFICKING IN AMSTERDAM

SEX SLAVERY IN THE NETHERLANDS

FORCED PROSTITUTION TAKES PLACE THROUGHOUT THE NETHERLANDS

LEGAL PROSTITUTION AND HUMAN TRAFFICKING

MYTH:PROSTITUTION IS A VICTIMLESS CRIME

Research concludes that:

Prostitution is traumatic

MYTHS ABOUT PROSTITUTION

Title	Love and sex is so tied to individuals that you cannot debate it within a societal context
Author	AirportLow6674
Upvotes	28
Comments	178
Date	May 29, 2026 5:17 PM UTC (1 month ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1tr8s5d/love_and_sex_is_so_tied_to_individuals_that_you/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/love-and-sex-is-so-tied-to-individuals-that-you.1581584 https://theredarchive.com/post/1581584